Rams continue to grow money: sign Bobby Wagner

[CardsFan88]

Don't worry guys, our Superhuman GM is on it

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Dont worry yall our friend kiem at bar somewhere now talkin bout his new small school secret weapon lol /facepalm

 

[mjb21aztd]

Don't worry guys, our Superhuman GM is on it

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Haha awesom new marvel sidekick guard the liquor!

 

[Cheesebeef]

Don't worry guys, our Superhuman GM is on it

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Lol

 

[Stout]

Lets not turn a non-Kyler or even non-Cardinal thread to something else….again.

Agreed!

 

[BritCard]

2018 called… they want it’s bad take back.

It's a fan fantasy that the "cap isn't real".

You can borrow from future cap in the way you structure the deal or with void years etc but the cap is still there and eventually it going to catch up with teams that abuse it. As it has the Saints.

The Ram's had $8m in cap space before signing Wagner. They have no RG, no OLB opposite Floyd and no CB opposite Ramsey and several depth positions to fill.

The time will come when they have to pay the piper. The Cardinals trying to catch them up by blowing fortunes in FA would do us nothing but harm. We still wouldn't catch them, would still be fighting for 2nd place in the division and would just have less money to spend in the future.

 

[Realist Cards Fan]

The trophy is all that matters. We keep trying to not get ourselves into cap trouble and yet its never worked for us. I am sure this fan base would much rather FINALLY win a superbowl then to be good 3 years in a row. Must be nice to have "first world problems" like the steelers, cowboys, 49ers, patriots, and rams and get multiple superbowl wins but worry about sucking for a couple years and then be good again. I wish the cardinals could ever have that problem lol

 

[BritCard]

The trophy is all that matters. We keep trying to not get ourselves into cap trouble and yet its never worked for us. I am sure this fan base would much rather FINALLY win a superbowl then to be good 3 years in a row. Must be nice to have "first world problems" like the steelers, cowboys, 49ers, patriots, and rams and get multiple superbowl wins but worry about sucking for a couple years and then be good again. I wish the cardinals could ever have that problem lol

To do that we need a core of good young players on rookie contracts. Then we can build around them and fill gaps with FA vets or trades.

It looks like we are finally trying to do that by giving young players that do have talent the chance to start. Something we haven't done for too long.

The mistake was not doing it 2-3 years ago.

 

[Stout]

To do that we need a core of good young players on rookie contracts. Then we can build around them and fill gaps with FA vets or trades.

It looks like we are finally trying to do that by giving young players that do have talent the chance to start. Something we haven't done for too long.

The mistake was not doing it 2-3 years ago.

So you ARE basically punting on the season. All you have to do is say so. If that's your position, I have no arguments with how you view our approach to this season's roster building. I 100 percent disagree with the position, but that's okay.

 

[Chopper0080]

To do that we need a core of good young players on rookie contracts. Then we can build around them and fill gaps with FA vets or trades.

It looks like we are finally trying to do that by giving young players that do have talent the chance to start. Something we haven't done for too long.

The mistake was not doing it 2-3 years ago.

I am glad you have the "we'll get'em next year" mindset before this season even begins.

 

[BritCard]

So you ARE basically punting on the season. All you have to do is say so. If that's your position, I have no arguments with how you view our approach to this season's roster building. I 100 percent disagree with the position, but that's okay.

No. I don't believe we are at all punting on the season.

I don't believe spending huge money on players on the downslope is the right strategy and not doing that isn't "punting on the season". It's ok if you think you are a guy or two away from a superbowl and there is a guy that can fill a hole.

The Rams have been going "all in" for 3 or 4 years and just got over the line, and only then because it was the Bengals with a young QB.

The Pats never had the best rosters many times they won the super bowl. The Eagles didn't. The Falcons didn't when they got there. The Bengals certainly didn't. If winning the Super bowl was just down to blowing money on putting the best free agents together everyone would be doing it. Thankfully it isn't.

There's far more goes into winning that just stacking the roster with as much talent as possible.

 

[BritCard]

I am glad you have the "we'll get'em next year" mindset before this season even begins.

I don't. I'm surprised anyone here thinks splashing the cash in FA is the way to win this year. It clearly has never worked before.

 

[slanidrac16]

It's a fan fantasy that the "cap isn't real".

You can borrow from future cap in the way you structure the deal or with void years etc but the cap is still there and eventually it going to catch up with teams that abuse it. As it has the Saints.

The Ram's had $8m in cap space before signing Wagner. They have no RG, no OLB opposite Floyd and no CB opposite Ramsey and several depth positions to fill.

The time will come when they have to pay the piper. The Cardinals trying to catch them up by blowing fortunes in FA would do us nothing but harm. We still wouldn't catch them, would still be fighting for 2nd place in the division and would just have less money to spend in the future.

Well for once I agree with you in part. One or two free agents aren’t going to bring us up to par with the Rams. We’re way worse than that. If fact the gap between us and the Rams has widened.
We’ve done NOTHING to even keep it even. Remember this when we are watching the Rams compete for a second Super Bowl. Don’t worry, this will catch up on them someday???? That’s funny. I guess that “ someday” we’ll compete with them.
So you have conceded we are now fighting for second place. Interesting. We are also competing for 3rd and 4th in this division.

 

[Dayman]

I don't believe spending huge money on players on the downslope is the right strategy and not doing that isn't "punting on the season". It's ok if you think you are a guy or two away from a superbowl and there is a guy that can fill a hole..

Then why did Keim pay top 10 TE money for Ertz, who is on the downslope, himself? The same goes for Conner and his top 10 RB money. And Gardeck for top 10 ST player money. I have a hard time believing any of those guys have their best years ahead of them.

Let's not pretend that Keim isn't overspending. He is just doing it in odd places. It's not like he is locking up Jalen Thompson or Murphy on solid contracts, which would make way more sense.

 

[Krangodnzr]

You miss the point entirely of why people are upset here.

People here didn’t want to sign Wagner. It’s the fact that the Rams consistently find ways to not only win big, but figure out a way to keep adding big pieces to their team despite always being in “cap hell.” Meanwhile, the Cardinals have done nothing this off-season to add to last year’s team, while losing big pieces of what made the team successful for the first 3/4s of the season before their epic collapse.

Not really that hard to understand.

The context matters though. The Rams are in "win now" mode because they have a QB approaching retirement years, a defensive centerpiece that is likely to start to slow down in the next few seasons, and a coach who's longevity is questioned.

Like it or not (I don't), the Cardinals view the roster as one that can win with what they've got and can get out of cap hell after this season.

 

[Krangodnzr]

I don't. I'm surprised anyone here thinks splashing the cash in FA is the way to win this year. It clearly has never worked before.

It's hilarious.

The hit rate on these free agents is like less than 25%. Most will never approach the production they had with their prior team.

Does anyone think signing Christian Kirk to a contract approaching $20 million? It's insanity.

If I were a GM, I'd sign one targeted impact free agent or so every offseason, and then I would bargain shop.

If I'm a betting man, I think that the Cardinals think that Rondale Moore is going to do big things starting this year. That Hopkins, Moore, Ertz, and Conner will get the lion's share of targets. That a combo of Eno, Ward, and probably a draft pick or UDFA will make up for Chase Edmonds production.

I don't agree with their approach, but the problem they are likely is seeing is that with available cap space this year, they would have to severely leverage future cap space. I also think that cash flow might also be an issue for the Cardinals that it isn't for other franchises What some fans don't understand is that while there is a salary cap, bonuses and such are paid with cash at hand. You can't dole out a ton of bonuses when you don't have the cash.

 

[BritCard]

Then why did Keim pay top 10 TE money for Ertz, who is on the downslope, himself? The same goes for Conner and his top 10 RB money. And Gardeck for top 10 ST player money. I have a hard time believing any of those guys have their best years ahead of them.

Let's not pretend that Keim isn't overspending. He is just doing it in odd places. It's not like he is locking up Jalen Thompson or Murphy on solid contracts, which would make way more sense.

I'm obviously talking about outside free agents.

We probably signed Ertz to TE10 money because, and this is crucial, he was TE9. In fact would have been more so had he been in our system longer.

Conner is RB11 along with Fournette. A perfectly reasonable contract considering his usage and TDs. Gardeck is earning exactly the same as he did last year.

 

[BritCard]

Well for once I agree with you in part. One or two free agents aren’t going to bring us up to par with the Rams. We’re way worse than that. If fact the gap between us and the Rams has widened.
We’ve done NOTHING to even keep it even. Remember this when we are watching the Rams compete for a second Super Bowl. Don’t worry, this will catch up on them someday???? That’s funny. I guess that “ someday” we’ll compete with them.
So you have conceded we are now fighting for second place. Interesting. We are also competing for 3rd and 4th in this division.

We were always fighting for 2nd place. Why would anyone thing otherwise?

 

[BritCard]

It's hilarious.

The hit rate on these free agents is like less than 25%. Most will never approach the production they had with their prior team.

Does anyone think signing Christian Kirk to a contract approaching $20 million? It's insanity.

If I were a GM, I'd sign one targeted impact free agent or so every offseason, and then I would bargain shop.

If I'm a betting man, I think that the Cardinals think that Rondale Moore is going to do big things starting this year. That Hopkins, Moore, Ertz, and Conner will get the lion's share of targets. That a combo of Eno, Ward, and probably a draft pick or UDFA will make up for Chase Edmonds production.

I don't agree with their approach, but the problem they are likely is seeing is that with available cap space this year, they would have to severely leverage future cap space. I also think that cash flow might also be an issue for the Cardinals that it isn't for other franchises What some fans don't understand is that while there is a salary cap, bonuses and such are paid with cash at hand. You can't dole out a ton of bonuses when you don't have the cash.

With the roster we have (or I expect us to have come September) get 9-10 wins, make the playoffs and then who knows from there?

We could completely leverage next years cap space, go and blow $30m+ on overpriced FA's and probably add a single win to that total at best.

Still a way to go yet. I'm not totally happy with the current roster but I also don't think it's the distance away that many here think.

The problem is fans have come to believe you need a super stacked roster like the Bucs or Rams. You don't. NFL history is littered with teams that have failed with stacked rosters or done well with rosters people thought average.

 

[slanidrac16]

We were always fighting for 2nd place. Why would anyone thing otherwise?

We were? That’s a awesome goal….

 

[Krangodnzr]

With the roster we have (or I expect us to have come September) get 9-10 wins, make the playoffs and then who knows from there?

We could completely leverage next years cap space, go and blow $30m+ on overpriced FA's and probably add a single win to that total at best.

Still a way to go yet. I'm not totally happy with the current roster but I also don't think it's the distance away that many here think.

The problem is fans have come to believe you need a super stacked roster like the Bucs or Rams. You don't. NFL history is littered with teams that have failed with stacked rosters or done well with rosters people thought average.

I think we have close to the same view. I don't view this team as a good football team right now. They still need to add some players to even approach a winning season.

But adding some of these free agents wouldn't add too many wins and would hurt long term cap flexibility. The Saints are the poster child for this approach. They will have a reckoning and it's coming soon. All of these contracts they keep kicking down the road AREN'T helping them win many more games over the past few years. It would be much better to lose a game or two more, so that you could win three more games a year from now.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

It's a fan fantasy that the "cap isn't real".

You can borrow from future cap in the way you structure the deal or with void years etc but the cap is still there and eventually it going to catch up with teams that abuse it. As it has the Saints.

The Ram's had $8m in cap space before signing Wagner. They have no RG, no OLB opposite Floyd and no CB opposite Ramsey and several depth positions to fill.

The time will come when they have to pay the piper. The Cardinals trying to catch them up by blowing fortunes in FA would do us nothing but harm. We still wouldn't catch them, would still be fighting for 2nd place in the division and would just have less money to spend in the future.

You do realize that most of us would sell our soul for even one SuperBowl. Do you think anyone that supports the D-Backs really care that their team hasn't been able to accomplish what they did in 2000? Nope.

I'd easily rather have 20 years of suck to have one SB.

 

[Krangodnzr]

You do realize that most of us would sell our soul for even one SuperBowl. Do you think anyone that supports the D-Backs really care that their team hasn't been able to accomplish what they did in 2000? Nope.

I'd easily rather have 20 years of suck to have one SB.

I think you make a move when the signs of a championship are there. The Rams were smart last year; they saw that adding Beckham and Miller could propel them to a championship.

 

[BurqueCardFan]

I think you make a move when the signs of a championship are there. The Rams were smart last year; they saw that adding Beckham and Miller could propel them to a championship.

We were the best team in the league for 3/4 of the season. No reason to believe we couldn’t have been that team. Maybe if we had made those moves last year, we would have been in the same boat as the Rams.

 

[wa52lz]

You do realize that most of us would sell our soul for even one SuperBowl. Do you think anyone that supports the D-Backs really care that their team hasn't been able to accomplish what they did in 2000? Nope.

I'd easily rather have 20 years of suck to have one SB.

I think I'm at this point if I'm selling my soul it will be for Will Hernandez to be an All-Pro guard this year!!! Oh the entertainment value of that after the 17+ pages of this....

G Will Hernandez visiting - now SIGNED

Except it's not based off hope. Almost the entire opinion of Hernandez is based off PFF stats. Or the opinions of Giants blogs who gained that opinion from looking at PFF stats. Hernandez's biggest problem is picking up stunts and if he's uncovered and goes looking for work he forgets he's...

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[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

It's a fan fantasy that the "cap isn't real".

You can borrow from future cap in the way you structure the deal or with void years etc but the cap is still there and eventually it going to catch up with teams that abuse it. As it has the Saints.

The Ram's had $8m in cap space before signing Wagner. They have no RG, no OLB opposite Floyd and no CB opposite Ramsey and several depth positions to fill.

The time will come when they have to pay the piper. The Cardinals trying to catch them up by blowing fortunes in FA would do us nothing but harm. We still wouldn't catch them, would still be fighting for 2nd place in the division and would just have less money to spend in the future.

But you can plan for when it will catch up to you by continually kicking it down the road. Like the saints did. Franchise QB and franchise coach retire. Great time to take the hit bc you already know you’re going to suck. So restart at that point. In other words they gamed the cap well. We don’t.