Spurs@Suns game thread

[Chaplin]

TNT is saying that James Jones is starting with Bell at the PG position.

AZCentral says that Barbosa went to the emergency room tonight with his groin injury. That does not sound good...

 

[elindholm]

Andre Barrett will almost certainly be signed to a 2nd 10-day contract tomorrow. I liked what I saw from him.

Yes. I think Barrett is a good example of why young players should not fear the developmental league. He looked pretty smooth and confident, which is more than can usually be said for end-of-the-bench guys who never play. He has benefited from the experience of playing in real games, and it shows.

I like how Burke took Duncan one-on-one and scored on him twice. That was hilarious.

I don't care how many people were injured -- this team's defense is atrocious, and has been for weeks.

 

[Evil Ash]

This loss is no big deal really but it did prove 3 things:

1) We can't win with 2 MVP candidates missing against one of the best teams in the league (yeah I know shocker there)

2) Steve Kerr is a complete moron. Was he seriously talking about how great the Spurs' D was to win the game?

3) NBA officiating blows. Remember at the beginning of the season how they weren't going to call fouls when players flopped? Well that lasted long

We are locked into the #2 position and the key is getting healthy

 

[kaesile]

2) Steve Kerr is a complete moron. Was he seriously talking about how great the Spurs' D was to win the game?

Agreed - for a while the Suns were shooting almost as well as the Spurs.

And am I confused, or did Tskitishvili actually play some minutes? What's the status on his injury? We need all the live bodies we can get at this point.

Boris Diaw was one rebound and one assist away from another triple double. That makes it three in a row now (two near misses and one actual against Dallas). I can't remember the last time that's happened to a Sun - didn't Jason Kidd have a couple back-to-back a few years ago?

Marion had a gutsy game. To be able to get a double-double and play 40+ minutes with the flu is pretty impressive.

There's nothing else really to say about this game - we just gotta put it behind us and recover from the injuries. I really hope Barbosa is all right.

 

[elindholm]

Tskitishvili did indeed play. He looked about the same to me, so if he's still feeling the effects of his injury, it wasn't obvious. As usual, he couldn't do anything while the ball was in play, but he did look very good on two made free throws.

 

[jbeecham]

3) NBA officiating blows. Remember at the beginning of the season how they weren't going to call fouls when players flopped? Well that lasted long

It's always horrible when we play SA. The three plays that stood out the most for me were:

1) Bell gets tripped by Parker, falls to the ground and loses the ball, Duncan dives on his chest pinning him to the ground so he can't get to the ball and while Bell is squirming around trying to get Duncan off of him his foot hits the ball and he's called for a kicking violation.

2) Diaw places his hand on Horry and Horry jumps 10ft away to the ground like he was shoved by Shaq with all of his might and Horry gets the call.

3) Suns on the fast break with House bringing the ball up the court and Bowen is riding House the entire way (bumping him and hanging on him). House gets to the 3 pt line and bowens got both his hands on him, grabs his dribbling arm, House maintains control and passes the ball with the other arm and Bowen continues to hold him and house shoves his hand off and gets called for an offensive foul.

I know there were a lot more....

I didn't expect us to win this game and even if the refs called it fairly we probably wouldn't have, but were playing extremely short handed, down 20pts and still can't get a call??? If we were up by 20pts against anyone it seems like the other team always gets the calls like the refs are trying to make the game closer for ratings, but we couldn't get anything.... I think we shot 3 fts in the 2nd half.

 

[golfcardfan]

Agreed beecham the officiating was atrocious! It was like the SA did what ever they want & the calls only go against us. Dantoni you could tell he was bitchin' all night with all the horrible calls just bad. Why the Spurs get such an edge against pretty much anybody is one of the reasons they are hard to beat. The NBA needs to review this game and fine these horrible officials or at the very least make sure they are not working playoff games.

 

[Treesquid PhD]

Agreed beecham the officiating was atrocious! It was like the SA did what ever they want & the calls only go against us. Dantoni you could tell he was bitchin' all night with all the horrible calls just bad. Why the Spurs get such an edge against pretty much anybody is one of the reasons they are hard to beat. The NBA needs to review this game and fine these horrible officials or at the very least make sure they are not working playoff games.

Unfortunately usually these are the same guys who do end up in the playoffs, while it sucks in the NBA playoffs officiating and who gets to the line is a huge factor, that's why we aboslutley need to take the risk is Amare and his 10+ freethrows per game is healthy and get him ready for the playoffs where flopping and favoritism rule.

 

[jibikao]

I am in Vancouver now!

Anyway, we lost.. big deal. lol

How's Barbosa? He's been playing so great and hope that injury doesn't affect him.

Andre Barrett any good? His first game against Spurs? darn.

I am not worried about this game.

 

[myrondizzo]

the funny thing is that all the headlines only mention nash being out when we only dressed 9 players. our 10 contract played 19 min. i thought that burke played pretty good i'm surprised they didnt give him more min.

 

[zett]

well we can't forget Duncan shoving marion in to parker as he went in for a 3 point play. they pretty much allowed Duncan to shove his defender away every time he was on the block! ( ok enough whining about the officials)

Why is Thompson even on the team and not in the D league if he can't get in a game where we lose by 24?

We need to guard Duncan straight up for at least the first 3 qtrs to see how we compete, giving there shooters or non shooters for that matter wide open looks all game long killed us. parker is not a great shooter but if you give hime 10 feet to shoot he can take his time and be better the great. we also don't understand the importance of fitting over the picks, I saw at least 3 or 4 times when the ball handler was 5 ft away and shawn was hugging the screener and going underneath, he preety much was taking himself out of the play all together.

on the bright side I thought Barret showed to be very adequate at handling the ball and capable of making solid decisions and nash and Amare are a day closer to being healthy again

 

[myrondizzo]

Why is Thompson even on the team and not in the D league if he can't get in a game where we lose by 24?

he is injured

 

[Chaplin]

As a side note, Dijon dressed, but I believe he might still be injured as well.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

It's always horrible when we play SA. The three plays that stood out the most for me were:

1) Bell gets tripped by Parker, falls to the ground and loses the ball, Duncan dives on his chest pinning him to the ground so he can't get to the ball and while Bell is squirming around trying to get Duncan off of him his foot hits the ball and he's called for a kicking violation.

2) Diaw places his hand on Horry and Horry jumps 10ft away to the ground like he was shoved by Shaq with all of his might and Horry gets the call.

3) Suns on the fast break with House bringing the ball up the court and Bowen is riding House the entire way (bumping him and hanging on him). House gets to the 3 pt line and bowens got both his hands on him, grabs his dribbling arm, House maintains control and passes the ball with the other arm and Bowen continues to hold him and house shoves his hand off and gets called for an offensive foul.

I know there were a lot more....

I didn't expect us to win this game and even if the refs called it fairly we probably wouldn't have, but were playing extremely short handed, down 20pts and still can't get a call??? If we were up by 20pts against anyone it seems like the other team always gets the calls like the refs are trying to make the game closer for ratings, but we couldn't get anything.... I think we shot 3 fts in the 2nd half.

okay, first, bell WAS tripped, but it was difficult to see and inadvertent. and he PURPOSEFULLY kicked the ball. that was obvious. don't blame that one on anyone.

the other two calls pissed me off. particularly when the announcers, even Steve Spurs, called them out as bad calls.

i hate playing the spurs 'cuz the flops get me so riled. like i said in the other thread, it's not PLAYING the game, it's TAKING ADVANTAGE of the game. and i think it's bunk hoops. i so wish the league could review the tape afterward and fine floppers 'cuz they muddy the purity of the sport.

 

[nowagimp]

well we can't forget Duncan shoving marion in to parker as he went in for a 3 point play. they pretty much allowed Duncan to shove his defender away every time he was on the block! ( ok enough whining about the officials)

Why is Thompson even on the team and not in the D league if he can't get in a game where we lose by 24?

We need to guard Duncan straight up for at least the first 3 qtrs to see how we compete, giving there shooters or non shooters for that matter wide open looks all game long killed us. parker is not a great shooter but if you give hime 10 feet to shoot he can take his time and be better the great. we also don't understand the importance of fitting over the picks, I saw at least 3 or 4 times when the ball handler was 5 ft away and shawn was hugging the screener and going underneath, he preety much was taking himself out of the play all together.

on the bright side I thought Barret showed to be very adequate at handling the ball and capable of making solid decisions and nash and Amare are a day closer to being healthy again

I dont think that anything strategy wise can be taken from this game. WHen the suns play shorthanded and run, they cant play D(theyre exhausted). They were bent over grabbing for their shorts in the 2nd quarter. It only got worse as the game progressed. Because of their running style, the suns must play deep into the bench to play any D. With no bench, the D evaporates. Remember earlier in the season how the loss of Barbs or JR used to really cause a dropoff, the loss of 2 bench players really hurts. And the loss of Nash makes everyone work harder on offense. I think D'Antoni decided to back off parker totally, even giving 16' open shots because of the loss of Nash and Barbs(defenders of parker).

The most positive thing I saw, was another level of athleticism and dribble penetration moves from Diaw. I have been watching Boris almost every game, and I thought that his speed off the dribble looked really good last night. He even had a nice dribble penetration spin move on Bowen that was really impressive. He made moves to his right and his left. He also seemed to have a nice touch on his shot in the first half. I think next time he sees the spurs, he could be very effective with Nash and Barbs back to take some of the load off. Clearly all the substitution patterns that D'Antoni used during the winning streak were destroyed, leaving exhausted players on the floor in the second half.

 

[Folster]

A few things I saw:

1. The Sun's game plan was to let Parker shoot. When Parker was hitting his shot the Suns failed to adjust. It was painful to watch.

2. What happend to playing man to man defense. I guess the success we have had playing man to man goes out the window when we play the Spurs. Come to think of it, the suns defense has been horrible as of late. Coincidently they have been double-teaming and scrambling a lot. How many times can you get burned by the open man before you figure it out.

3. The Spurs flopping is out of control. Horry's flop when Diaw touched his shoulder was ridiculous. Taking a charge is one thing, but getting touched and falling down is just stupid. The NBA needs to do something about excessive flopping. It cheapens the game. I was glad to see the refs not fall for a few of Ginoblis flop though. Both Parker and Ginobli fall after every drive to the basket and expect a foul to be called just because they fell.

 

[Chaplin]

2. What happend to playing man to man defense. I guess the success we have had playing man to man goes out the window when we play the Spurs. Come to think of it, the suns defense has been horrible as of late. Coincidently they have been double-teaming and scrambling a lot. How many times can you get burned by the open man before you figure it out.

Against the Spurs, playing zone is the way to go. They played the zone to not let the ball get down low, and that is exactly what happened. Unfortunately, that backfired because all the Spurs were hitting their jumpers--and even after last night, that's what you want to continue to do--make the Spurs hit their jumpshots.

 

[nowagimp]

A few things I saw:

1. The Sun's game plan was to let Parker shoot. When Parker was hitting his shot the Suns failed to adjust. It was painful to watch.

2. What happend to playing man to man defense. I guess the success we have had playing man to man goes out the window when we play the Spurs. Come to think of it, the suns defense has been horrible as of late. Coincidently they have been double-teaming and scrambling a lot. How many times can you get burned by the open man before you figure it out.

3. The Spurs flopping is out of control. Horry's flop when Diaw touched his shoulder was ridiculous. Taking a charge is one thing, but getting touched and falling down is just stupid. The NBA needs to do something about excessive flopping. It cheapens the game. I was glad to see the refs not fall for a few of Ginoblis flop though. Both Parker and Ginobli fall after every drive to the basket and expect a foul to be called just because they fell.

Playing Man to man requires more energy, and I think D'Antoni knew the suns being so shorthanded, would run out of gas with no bench. I expect we will still play a zone, until at least KT gets back to guard TD one-on-one, but the suns will extend the zone more against the spurs when they get Nash, Barbs back.

 

[Folster]

I respectfully diagree with you guys. What kind of strategy is it to hope the other team misses open shots. That may work with lesser teams, but not the best team in the NBA. If that is the Suns strategy they use against the Spurs in the playoff (if they meet). I guarantee the Suns will lose! With or without Amare.

Ex. Last year the Mav's strategy was to make Nash beat them. They let Nash get what ever he wanted and he torched them.

My point is that lesser teams hope you miss and try to stop just one point of your offense. That may work for one game, but not a seven game series.

 

[elindholm]

The strategy is to force the other team into low-percentage shots. If one of the Spurs' weaknesses is that their point guard isn't a good outside shooter, then it makes perfect sense to try to exploit that weakness. We should all know that very well from having watched Kidd's struggles over the years.

It's the same idea as fouling Shaquille O'Neal instead of letting him dunk -- you play the percentages that he'll miss his free throws. If O'Neal goes 17-20 from the line one game, does that mean it was a bad strategy? (Answer: No.)

I haven't seen enough of Parker to know whether he's a weak outside shooter or not. Sometimes a player picks up a label that isn't deserved. He looked pretty confident with his shot last night, but maybe it was a fluke.

 

[myrondizzo]

statisticly parker is alot worse outside shooter than he is in the paint. so to let him shoot the outside jumper is a good game plan he was just on last night so it really hurt us. then he started to kill us because shawn started to come out on him and he would drive to the hoop.

 

[mribnik]

What was the first game that Kurt Thomas missed? Does this directly coincide with the string of games where we gave up 60%+ shooting in the first half of each? We really need him defensively down low.

 

[playstation]

if the spurs had the same types of injuries we had, their situation would be roughly equivalent to this:

parker out (nash out)
duncan out (amare out)
rasho out (KT out)
udrih out (barbosa out)
sean marks out (brian grant out)

michael finley hobbled (james jones hobbled)
ginobili with flu (marion with flu)
horry with flu (tim thomas with flu)

this would give them a lineup of

van exel
ginobili
bowen
horry
nazr

with barry, finley, and oberto off the bench.

we DESTROY that team...they DESTROYED us. big deal.

more importantly, we played selfishly last night. the offense should have constantly flowed through Diaw. too many times i saw 1on1 play and forced shots when it didn't go through Boris. it was a sad exhibition.

in one week, we will have tim T, shawn, and james jones back at full strength. barbosa, nash, and grant should be back. maybe amare will be only a couple days away. that's a lot of people to get back/healthy so quickly.

 

[Folster]

Tony Parker is shooting just over 55 percent from the field this year. Comparitively, Nash is shooting over 47 percent from the field. Maybe we should do some research before we institue a game plan. Any team would be stupid to let Nash shoot open jumpers. So why is it accpetable for us to let Parker have shooting practice all game long when he shoots better than Nash this season.

And, I don't want to hear that Parker has a higher percentage because he drives to the hoop more for lay-ups. If that was true than why did his percentage rise so much this year from previous years. He's not getting anymore lay-ups this year than before. The fact is, he can flat out shoot this year.

I'm not mad that we lost. I expected it. I'm upset with the coaching.

 

[jbeecham]

Tony Parker is shooting just over 55 percent from the field this year. Comparitively, Nash is shooting over 47 percent from the field. Maybe we should do some research before we institue a game plan. Any team would be stupid to let Nash shoot open jumpers. So why is it accpetable for us to let Parker have shooting practice all game long when he shoots better than Nash this season.

And, I don't want to hear that Parker has a higher percentage because he drives to the hoop more for lay-ups. If that was true than why did his percentage rise so much this year from previous years. He's not getting anymore lay-ups this year than before. The fact is, he can flat out shoot this year.

I'm not mad that we lost. I expected it. I'm upset with the coaching.

Parker is getting most of his points on layups every single night, which has caused the rise in his fg%. In fact, Parker is 5th in the league in "points in the paint" and that's 5th overall over centers, pf's, everyone.....His outside shooting % is much lower than his inside shooting % because he gets to the basket uncontested most of the time (thanks to illegal screens, carrying the ball on his crossover moves and his overall speed and talent).