State Of The Team

[BritCard]

I'd say that is true IF Trey Lance is VG. And any objective appraisal would conclude is that we just don't know.

Again, he's not talking about last years Niners and Rams. He's saying the 2015 Niners and Rams sucked. Which helped the Cards.

 

[BritCard]

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Wow....

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This is a great metric for how good a team is. If you look at the list if pretty much aligns with how most people would rate these teams over the last 3 years.

Just looking at the 2015 Cardinals (as were on that topic) and they had 11 wins by more than 3 points. In fact many of them were more than a TD.

I'm going to start looking at that more as a sign of progress. Last year we had 6.

 

[football karma]

This is a great metric for how good a team is. If you look at the list if pretty much aligns with how most people would rate these teams over the last 3 years.

Just looking at the 2015 Cardinals (as were on that topic) and they had 11 wins by more than 3 points. In fact many of them were more than a TD.

I'm going to start looking at that more as a sign of progress. Last year we had 6.

i like 2+ score wins vs 2+ score losses as well -- do you really beat people vs really getting beat. Cards were 4-3 last year in those games, +51 point diff

 

[Cheesebeef]

Nah B. That line wasn't great. Center, RG, and RT were all average players to fringe players

The difference is talent at QB, WR, and RB, nothing more. Palmer was in an offense that suited his strengths and he was playing in that offense for multiple years. You had three receivers hovering around 1000 yards.

Ted Larson was around Justin Murrays level.

you don’t have three 1000 yard WR if a QB doesn’t have time to throw... especially with a DEEP passing attack that takes time to develop. Chris Johnson hadn’t done squat in two years previous to coming to AZ. He doesn’t lead the league in rushing before his injury without a very good line.

Number 1 in yards, Number 2 in points... and the o-line as a unit wasnt that great? And you accuse me of never being wrong. Okay dude.

And Bobbie Massie was an average to fringe player? Yeah, no. Bobbie Massie was a solid RT who went on to be a solid RT for the Bears for years. At the very worst, he was better than the mediocrity we have at RT now.

again, as a unit, that line gave Palmer plenty of time on deep drops and opened holes for whoever was running. Try and deny that all you want, but it’s the truth.

 

[DVontel]

This years front 7 has the potential to rival 2013’s front 7. I’ll say that.

 

[Nate]

The individual talent at wr in 2015 was better, and the strengths of that group complimented each other very well and the coaches put them in gameplans which highlighted their strengths. Just a well constructed team.

The constant deep threat of Brown, Nelson and Floyd opened up the room underneath, pushing opposing LBs and Safeties deep.

Additionally, both TEs were good pass catchers and sending DJ out on wheel routes or lining him up outside cleared the middle as well.

Thats why our running backs both had great rushing seasons and not because we had a superior Oline. The opponent was just kept guessing and we used that to our advantage.

Just the exact opposite to last year where we the opposing D always knew what to expect.

 

[BritCard]

you don’t have three 1000 yard WR if a QB doesn’t have time to throw... especially with a DEEP passing attack that takes time to develop. Chris Johnson hadn’t done squat in two years previous to coming to AZ. He doesn’t lead the league in rushing before his injury without a very good line.

Number 1 in yards, Number 2 in points... and the o-line as a unit wasnt that great? And you accuse me of never being wrong. Okay dude.

And Bobbie Massie was an average to fringe player? Yeah, no. Bobbie Massie was a solid RT who went on to be a solid RT for the Bears for years. At the very worst, he was better than the mediocrity we have at RT now.

again, as a unit, that line gave Palmer plenty of time on deep drops and opened holes for whoever was running. Try and deny that all you want, but it’s the truth.

Bobby Massie had a 66.1 grade and 7 sacks allowed in 2015 with 6 penalties.

Beachum had a 69 grade with 3 sacks allowed and 5 penalties last year.

Massie was OK but he was far from good.

 

[BritCard]

The individual talent at wr in 2015 was better, and the strengths of that group complimented each other very well and the coaches put them in gameplans which highlighted their strengths. Just a well constructed team.

The constant deep threat of Brown, Nelson and Floyd opened up the room underneath, pushing opposing LBs and Safeties deep.

Additionally, both TEs were good pass catchers and sending DJ out on wheel routes or lining him up outside cleared the middle as well.

Thats why our running backs both had great rushing seasons and not because we had a superior Oline. The opponent was just kept guessing and we used that to our advantage.

Just the exact opposite to last year where we the opposing D always knew what to expect.

You put Nuk, Green and Kirk in that scheme and I'd put money on them at least matching their stats.

But as your 2nd half of the post covers our issue is there's no complimentary football. There's no scheme cohesion and we don't game plan for other teams at all well.

 

[Nate]

You put Nuk, Green and Kirk in that scheme and I'd put money on them at least matching their stats.

But as your 2nd half of the post covers our issue is there's no complimentary football. There's no scheme cohesion and we don't game plan for other teams at all well.

I dont necessarily believe in Green as a player at this point in his career but you still have to respect him as a physical threat going along the line.

Thats why I think that he will help the team. He is, opposed to Kirk and Isabella, at least a physical threat one on one. He will help clear space for our smaller and faster players. He does not need to put up gaudy stats for that.

Lets wait and see whether KK will adept his playcalls accordingly.

 

[Covert Rain]

I just found this. Not sure how accurate but the disparity between some teams is crazy.

You must be registered for see images

 

[Krangodnzr]

you don’t have three 1000 yard WR if a QB doesn’t have time to throw... especially with a DEEP passing attack that takes time to develop. Chris Johnson hadn’t done squat in two years previous to coming to AZ. He doesn’t lead the league in rushing before his injury without a very good line.

Number 1 in yards, Number 2 in points... and the o-line as a unit wasnt that great? And you accuse me of never being wrong. Okay dude.

And Bobbie Massie was an average to fringe player? Yeah, no. Bobbie Massie was a solid RT who went on to be a solid RT for the Bears for years. At the very worst, he was better than the mediocrity we have at RT now.

again, as a unit, that line gave Palmer plenty of time on deep drops and opened holes for whoever was running. Try and deny that all you want, but it’s the truth.

Bobby Massie had a 66.1 grade and 7 sacks allowed in 2015 with 6 penalties.

Beachum had a 69 grade with 3 sacks allowed and 5 penalties last year.

Massie was OK but he was far from good.

See BritCard's post. Massie was an AVERAGE player. The Center and guard were both fringe players.

The difference in last year's team and the 2015 was more WR than anything else, but for some reason, you ignored that comment.

Running is a combo of line play AND RBs. Defenses absolutely had to account for the WRs on the team and couldn't just tee off on the run. Last year, teams STACKED the box and played zones to clog the middle since they knew Murray couldn't beat them on intermediate routes. Murray HAS TO get better on intermediate throws. If he can do that, this offense will smoke fools.

 

[Krangodnzr]

This years front 7 has the potential to rival 2013’s front 7. I’ll say that.

OH NO @DVontel Watt is terrible and he hasn't stayed healthy IN YEARS! How dare you point that out!

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

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Wow....

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That’s not great company.

 

[GatorAZ]

I just found this. Not sure how accurate but the disparity between some teams is crazy.

You must be registered for see images

Thats not including Jones, Butler, Green, Kirk.

Easy cuts: Kennard, Phillips, Hicks

It would really be nice if one of the rookie corners panned out right away. Butler is probably one and done plus Murphy is up after next season.

 

[Garthshort]

I'd like to have a dollar for every post I read that worried about after this season or after next season. If so, I'd be less poor.
Suggest we follow the sign on the wall of the Mayflower Donut Shop.
"As you travel on through life brother, no matter what your goal, keep your eye upon the donut and not upon the hole."

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

That’s not great company.

TBF they were absolutely atrocious in 2018, starting a rebuild in 2019 and finally starting to break out in 2020. In other words the Cards appear moving in the right direction unlike the Jets and Bengals.

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

Why?

Because we have no idea how much he can contribute at this point.

What did Kennard give us in 2020? He was basically non existent & once Golden was resigned he didn't play much so as to your question "Why"? Why pay him 6 million for that?

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

What is the point of saving 6 mil when you don't need it?

It could be used to sign a veteran CB for one. Kennard gave us nothing in 2020 & I was very disappointed. I thought it was a damn good signing at that time.

 

[Cheesebeef]

It could be used to sign a veteran CB for one. Kennard gave us nothing in 2020 & I was very disappointed. I thought it was a damn good signing at that time.

the weird thing is they already have room to sign a veteran CB... and have for a while.

I really don’t get what they’re doing there. You CANT depend on Alford going into a season after being totally wiped out with injuries for two seasons, and being awful three years ago when he played hurt.

 

[Krangodnzr]

the weird thing is they already have room to sign a veteran CB... and have for a while.

I really don’t get what they’re doing there. You CANT depend on Alford going into a season after being totally wiped out with injuries for two seasons, and being awful three years ago when he played hurt.

I think they probably play a lot more zone coverages and rely more on Byron Murphy.

It's definitely not ideal, and I would sign a veteran if I were Keim.

 

[Solar7]

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PFF grades are overrated. No experts would rank DJ in the top 5, much less top 10. He's not bad, but it's just an overreaction to one site's grades.

No matter what...Solar just sticks with the "Cardinals suck" party line even if it isn't true.

That 2015 line was decent, but didn't have a single player as good as Humphries OR Hudson. Maybe Iupati, but that dude was always getting hurt and was making Pro Bowls at that point based purely on reputation.

When the Cardinals are tied for the longest playoff drought in the league, how is it invalid to stick to the "Cardinals suck" party line? Prove me wrong, Cardinals. Then I'll have reason to feel good.

And they (the Rams) lost their starting center who was a competent center, which isn't really an easy position to replace. And Andrew Whitworth is THIRTY NINE...AND Stafford really isnt worth what they threw at him....he's the older Jared Goff.

John Johnson was probably their third best defender. You don't get better by constantly letting good players get away.

No granted, they do have Jordan Fuller on the roster and he looked good at times, but Johnson is a Pro Bowl caliber player.

You and I can agree that the Rams are a bit shakier and have some upcoming issues, but their coaching, and average talent/youth are much better than ours here in the moment. We don't particularly have a brighter future. About even for different reasons.

Really? I mean, obviously the Rams thought so to give up so much to get Stafford, but... Stafford has a career 89.9 passer rating (96.3 last year), while Goff has a career 91.5 rating (90.0 last year). McVay obviously thinks Stafford is a better fit for his system, and i've always liked Stafford, but he's never been a winner in big games or prime time games. I'm in the "wait and see" camp regarding whether he'll be "enormously" or just marginally better.

...dave

McVay consistently put Goff into positions to succeed that Stafford has more or less never had, including taking care of his pre-snap reads. Stafford has rarely had advantageous coaching, talent, or defensive help.

 

[football karma]

PFF grades are overrated. No experts would rank DJ in the top 5, much less top 10. He's not bad, but it's just an overreaction to one site's grades.

pff isnt everything, but, they are something. "experts" - link or it doesnt count.

NFL teams do pay for their data, unlike your (or my) opinion.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

TBF they were absolutely atrocious in 2018, starting a rebuild in 2019 and finally starting to break out in 2020. In other words the Cards appear moving in the right direction unlike the Jets and Bengals.

I’m a fan of trends.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

PFF grades are overrated. No experts would rank DJ in the top 5, much less top 10. He's not bad, but it's just an overreaction to one site's grades.


When the Cardinals are tied for the longest playoff drought in the league, how is it invalid to stick to the "Cardinals suck" party line? Prove me wrong, Cardinals. Then I'll have reason to feel good.


You and I can agree that the Rams are a bit shakier and have some upcoming issues, but their coaching, and average talent/youth are much better than ours here in the moment. We don't particularly have a brighter future. About even for different reasons.


McVay consistently put Goff into positions to succeed that Stafford has more or less never had, including taking care of his pre-snap reads. Stafford has rarely had advantageous coaching, talent, or defensive help.

When a franchise has a top tier coach and has adapted from year to year to make the playoffs they’ve earned the benefit of the doubt in comparison to an organization that’s got the second longest drought.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I’m a fan of trends.

unfortunately we looked like we were breaking out the first half of the season and then broke down the second half of the season.

The trend just looked stalled considered how awful we looked down the stretch.