Sunday Morning Cafe Au Lait: Name Your 2011 Starters With 1 Trade

[Mulli]

Got it. I thought you were saying that the six yard runs would be from DW at WILB.

Maybe they're keeping Daryl Washington there, which means more six-yard runs up the middle.

 

[Crazy Canuck]

SILB (Gerald Hayes's old position). That's (maybe) why Washington went to the bench when Hayes came back. Lenon was playing the WILB position all season long. Wolfley (I think) said on CU that the Cards need a better WILB in free agency.



No. Washington just isn't as good as Karlos Dansby, and probably won't ever be. I'm interested to see him next year and hope he develops into a player we're not going to have to replace with an even higher draft pick. Drafting Daryl Washington in the first round would've been a disaster (not sure anyone would disagree with this); trading up in the first IMO indicates that he was overdrafted because of a self-created need. But he's pretty low on the list of problems on our defense, and he has lots of room to grow.

Leaving Daryl Washington at SILB (should it happen) is an indictment of a coaching staff that does not put players in a position to succeed (on either side of the ball) more than it is of Washington's ability as a player. Washington is an NFL player. He probably wasn't ready to be an NFL starter, but even Krang I think would agree that asking Daryl Washington to take on 320 lbs NFL guards down after down or 260 lbs NFL fullbacks is not the way to make sure that he succeeds. Why you would sacrifice Daryl Washington's assets to showcase Paris Lenon last year is beyond my ken.

second....

 

[cardpa]

SILB (Gerald Hayes's old position). That's (maybe) why Washington went to the bench when Hayes came back. Lenon was playing the WILB position all season long. Wolfley (I think) said on CU that the Cards need a better WILB in free agency.



No. Washington just isn't as good as Karlos Dansby, and probably won't ever be. I'm interested to see him next year and hope he develops into a player we're not going to have to replace with an even higher draft pick. Drafting Daryl Washington in the first round would've been a disaster (not sure anyone would disagree with this); trading up in the first IMO indicates that he was overdrafted because of a self-created need. But he's pretty low on the list of problems on our defense, and he has lots of room to grow.

Leaving Daryl Washington at SILB (should it happen) is an indictment of a coaching staff that does not put players in a position to succeed (on either side of the ball) more than it is of Washington's ability as a player. Washington is an NFL player. He probably wasn't ready to be an NFL starter, but even Krang I think would agree that asking Daryl Washington to take on 320 lbs NFL guards down after down or 260 lbs NFL fullbacks is not the way to make sure that he succeeds. Why you would sacrifice Daryl Washington's assets to showcase Paris Lenon last year is beyond my ken.

This is what I have been harping on for some time now, this coaching staff does not know how to use the talent available to them so each player will be successful. This is true in any sport.

 

[Crazy Canuck]

SILB (Gerald Hayes's old position). That's (maybe) why Washington went to the bench when Hayes came back. Lenon was playing the WILB position all season long. Wolfley (I think) said on CU that the Cards need a better WILB in free agency.



No. Washington just isn't as good as Karlos Dansby, and probably won't ever be. I'm interested to see him next year and hope he develops into a player we're not going to have to replace with an even higher draft pick. Drafting Daryl Washington in the first round would've been a disaster (not sure anyone would disagree with this); trading up in the first IMO indicates that he was overdrafted because of a self-created need. But he's pretty low on the list of problems on our defense, and he has lots of room to grow.

Leaving Daryl Washington at SILB (should it happen) is an indictment of a coaching staff that does not put players in a position to succeed (on either side of the ball) more than it is of Washington's ability as a player. Washington is an NFL player. He probably wasn't ready to be an NFL starter, but even Krang I think would agree that asking Daryl Washington to take on 320 lbs NFL guards down after down or 260 lbs NFL fullbacks is not the way to make sure that he succeeds. Why you would sacrifice Daryl Washington's assets to showcase Paris Lenon last year is beyond my ken.

Do you think that possibly the reason he was in the SILB role last season was that there are fewer reads to be made from there, and that they simply trusted Lenon's experience at that point?

 

[Duckjake]

Wow 7-10 new starters. Isn't that what got us a 5-11 season in 2010?

Or is it normal for NFL teams to turn over half their starting lineup every season?

Well looking back at prior rosters that appears to be normal for Arizona. Of course that could also be why they've averaged 6-10 for the last 30 years.

 

[kerouac9]

Do you think that possibly the reason he was in the SILB role last season was that there are fewer reads to be made from there, and that they simply trusted Lenon's experience at that point?

It's possible. As I said, the jobs of SILB and WILB are very different. If they were just looking for a warm body to fill the hole, they could've fielded more appropriate players. Why not just put him at WOLB and let him get after the QB down after down? I think that the results are clear that whatever they were trying to do personnel-wise at the interior linebacking position wasn't working and didn't prepare Daryl Washington for the job that he would succeed in--using his speed to get around defenders and make plays on the ball.

 

[Mitch]

While the Cardinals call it SILB...it's really LILB...at least it was under Davis...same as with WOLB...it was really ROLB...as they never flipped over to the strong or weak side.

Because the hash marks in the NFL are so close together, the wide side of the field isn't that much wider...so "strong side" in the NFL is usually dictated by which side the TE---or the 2 receiver set is on...but, with the way teams motion, it just wreaks havoc trying to stick with strong side assignments, so many coaches have their players line up to one side and tweak their adjustments depending on formation and motion.

 

[kerouac9]

While the Cardinals call it SILB...it's really LILB...at least it was under Davis...same as with WOLB...it was really ROLB...as they never flipped over to the strong or weak side.

Because the hash marks in the NFL are so close together, the wide side of the field isn't that much wider...so "strong side" in the NFL is usually dictated by which side the TE---or the 2 receiver set is on...but, with the way teams motion, it just wreaks havoc trying to stick with strong side assignments, so many coaches have their players line up to one side and tweak their adjustments depending on formation and motion.

Maybe, but the interior line doesn't change much. The interior RG is usually the bigger run-mauler and the LG is the more mobile "pull" guard in most running plays. The WILB is generally the better coverage guy and the SILB has more responsibilities W/R/T filling and taking on or defeating offensive blockers to allow the playmaking linebacker to fill to the ball.

Either way, the results last season speak for themselves. Whatever they're thinking with having Paris Lenon and Daryl Washington on the field at the same time, and having Washington facing the larger power blockers on the interior line lead to a lot of first down runs on third-and-seven.

 

[joeshmo]

Apparently Washington is going to stay at the SILB position in our defense? That's what they said on the Cards Underground Podcast last week. Odd decision, but they were saying that we needed to find a WILB in free agency. Maybe they're keeping Daryl Washington there, which means more six-yard runs up the middle.

Unless we are listening to different podcasts which we could be, that is not what was said at all. I am listening to the underground podcast from 6/22. They did talk about the ILB position but not a single name was brought up. Wolf specificlly stated that he thinks we need 2 inside linebackers, both WILB and SILB, we may have some young guys there but he wants some grizzlied veterans types. Never said anything about Washington playing SILB.

In fact this very morning on his radio show he mentioned Washington as being our WILB last year and in the future.

So what podcast are you talking about and at what time stamp? Did I miss it?

 

[kerouac9]

Unless we are listening to different podcasts which we could be, that is not what was said at all. I am listening to the underground podcast from 6/22. They did talk about the ILB position but not a single name was brought up. Wolf specificlly stated that he thinks we need 2 inside linebackers, both WILB and SILB, we may have some young guys there but he wants some grizzlied veterans types. Never said anything about Washington playing SILB.

In fact this very morning on his radio show he mentioned Washington as being our WILB last year and in the future.

So what podcast are you talking about and at what time stamp? Did I miss it?

It was the last podcast ("Cardinals Underground Podcast Summer Edition") and the discussion of the ILBs begins at the 18:00 mark...

Wolfley says: "The Cards don't have two guys who can play inside. You have some young guys who are developing, but we need to go get a couple of veterans. You need to get some guys who can play the mike and the will, the weakside linebacker. (18:30)"

Urban has been very high on Paris Lenon all season and offseason. I'm not sure why the Cards need 2 veteran ILBs for depth, or whom they would find on the open market to do so.

Washington played the SILB position last year. So if the Cards are going to need help at the Will position through free agency, apparently Paris Lenon is the annual one-year-free-agent-wonder, or Washington is going to stay at SILB and the Cards are going to look for a starter at Karlos Dansby's old position in free agency.

 

[joeshmo]

It was the last podcast ("Cardinals Underground Podcast Summer Edition") and the discussion of the ILBs begins at the 18:00 mark...

Wolfley says: "The Cards don't have two guys who can play inside. You have some young guys who are developing, but we need to go get a couple of veterans. You need to get some guys who can play the mike and the will, the weakside linebacker. (18:30)"

Urban has been very high on Paris Lenon all season and offseason. I'm not sure why the Cards need 2 veteran ILBs for depth, or whom they would find on the open market to do so.

Washington played the SILB position last year. So if the Cards are going to need help at the Will position through free agency, apparently Paris Lenon is the annual one-year-free-agent-wonder, or Washington is going to stay at SILB and the Cards are going to look for a starter at Karlos Dansby's old position in free agency.

The quote still doesnt say a single thing about Washington or Lenon or where they will play. Not sure how you come to that conclusion. All Wolf said was that we need 2 ILB's, Mike and Will?????

This whole conversation doesnt matter anyways considering as of 6/30 in the AM Wolf specificlly stated Washington was and still is a WILB.

 

[kerouac9]

The quote still doesnt say a single thing about Washington or Lenon or where they will play. Not sure how you come to that conclusion. All Wolf said was that we need 2 ILB's, Mike and Will?????

This whole conversation doesnt matter anyways considering as of 6/30 in the AM Wolf specificlly stated Washington was and still is a WILB.

Well, we have Sturdivant, Lenon, and Washington right now. Plus we have Reggie Walker who got PT last season and costs basically nothing and has two years of development in him. If we sign two veteran free agents, do you really think we're going to take 6 ILBs into the regular season? If Lenon's best position is WILB (and I think we agree on that) then why do we need another veteran FA WILB to be Washington's backup?

As we know, Ron Wolfley is never wrong about anything.

 

[Crazy Canuck]

Well, we have Sturdivant, Lenon, and Washington right now. Plus we have Reggie Walker who got PT last season and costs basically nothing and has two years of development in him. If we sign two veteran free agents, do you really think we're going to take 6 ILBs into the regular season? If Lenon's best position is WILB (and I think we agree on that) then why do we need another veteran FA WILB to be Washington's backup?

As we know, Ron Wolfley is never wrong about anything.

Hayes is still under contract.

 

[kerouac9]

Hayes is still under contract.

That's true, but I don't think that anyone expects Hayes to stay on the roster at the beginning of a new league year now that Sturdivant is in the fold. He's making an insane amount of money for his production, and he doesn't play special teams.

Hayes will likely follow Derek Anderson out the door.

 

[Crazy Canuck]

That's true, but I don't think that anyone expects Hayes to stay on the roster at the beginning of a new league year now that Sturdivant is in the fold. He's making an insane amount of money for his production, and he doesn't play special teams.

Hayes will likely follow Derek Anderson out the door.

And, as the only potential "thumper" on the roster, he may remain. We will see.

 

[Krangodnzr]

SILB (Gerald Hayes's old position). That's (maybe) why Washington went to the bench when Hayes came back. Lenon was playing the WILB position all season long. Wolfley (I think) said on CU that the Cards need a better WILB in free agency.



No. Washington just isn't as good as Karlos Dansby, and probably won't ever be. I'm interested to see him next year and hope he develops into a player we're not going to have to replace with an even higher draft pick. Drafting Daryl Washington in the first round would've been a disaster (not sure anyone would disagree with this); trading up in the first IMO indicates that he was overdrafted because of a self-created need. But he's pretty low on the list of problems on our defense, and he has lots of room to grow.

Leaving Daryl Washington at SILB (should it happen) is an indictment of a coaching staff that does not put players in a position to succeed (on either side of the ball) more than it is of Washington's ability as a player. Washington is an NFL player. He probably wasn't ready to be an NFL starter, but even Krang I think would agree that asking Daryl Washington to take on 320 lbs NFL guards down after down or 260 lbs NFL fullbacks is not the way to make sure that he succeeds. Why you would sacrifice Daryl Washington's assets to showcase Paris Lenon last year is beyond my ken.

D Washington is DEFINITELY a WILB. He just isn't the physical kind of LB to play the SILB position. Totally agree.

Draft Vontaze Burfict in round one next year, and we'll have our Pro Bowl-level ILB for the next ten years.

 

[kerouac9]

D Washington is DEFINITELY a WILB. He just isn't the physical kind of LB to play the SILB position. Totally agree.

Draft Vontaze Burfict in round one next year, and we'll have our Pro Bowl-level ILB for the next ten years.

Hard to imagine the Cards investing a Top 15 choice in a non-impact position like ILB in 2011, unless Schofield suddenly answers the rush OLB question and Levi Brown (in a contract year) turns into a good LT.

I don't imagine that the Cards will draft another Sun Devil while Bill Bidwill is still anywhere close to Hardy Drive, and that Whis is going to invest his future in a guy who has massive on- and off-field problems. Patrick Peterson might have scored a 9 on his Wunderlic, but Burfict couldn't stay eligible at Arizona State and has made multiple stupid on-field decisions.

Not exactly a Whis guy.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

massive on- and off-field problems.

Massive off field problems? I'd love to hear one.

but Burfict couldn't stay eligible

Again, what are you talking about? He's been eligible his entire college career.

 

[Buckybird]

Draft Vontaze Burfict in round one next year, and we'll have our Pro Bowl-level ILB for the next ten years.

I too see him being a Ray Lewis type player...would luv to see him sporting a Redbird on his helmet. He would bring a nastiness at ILB that we haven't seen since the days of Eric Hill.

 

[TJ]

Massive off field problems? I'd love to hear one.




Again, what are you talking about? He's been eligible his entire college career.

Burfict has been a good boy off the field, but he needs to tone it down on the field....a lot. Some of the penalties he creates are just flat out dumb. And if it is because he has anger management issues, what's to say he doesnt eventually get into a fight or domestic dispute off the field when he hits to pros?

As for eligibility, you're right, but Burfict was barely eligible for his freshman season. Allegedly, he was told at USC he would not qualify academically and was "forced" to de-commit.

 

[TJ]

I don't imagine that the Cards will draft another Sun Devil while Bill Bidwill is still anywhere close to Hardy Drive,

I dont see why not. Terrell Smith was on this team not too long ago and he's a Sun Devil.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

Burfict has been a good boy off the field, but he needs to tone it down on the field....a lot. Some of the penalties he creates are just flat out dumb.

Totally agree that he needs to eliminate the personal fouls, but as the year went on, he was much better about it. Vontaze is definitely at his best playing with controlled rage, and seems to be getting much better about it as he gets older. I'll be the first to be pissed off if he gets a lot of personal fouls this year.

And if it is because he has anger management issues, what's to say he doesnt eventually get into a fight or domestic dispute off the field when he hits to pros?

Please...utter speculation on your part. Let's wait for him to have his first major incident before putting one on him.

As for eligibility, you're right, but Burfict was barely eligible for his freshman season. Allegedly, he was told at USC he would not qualify academically and was "forced" to de-commit.

Yawn...allegedly this, speculatively that. Whether or not it was dicey or possibly an issue is irrelevant. All I know is he's played every game, and has never had an issue with eligibility.

You know you'd gladly take him on the Cats in a second...

 

[kerouac9]

I dont see why not. Terrell Smith was on this team not too long ago and he's a Sun Devil.

He wasn't a first-round draft pick--or a draft pick at all. And he was a fullback. I think the scuttlebutt on the real reason we passed on Terrell Suggs was because the family felt painted into a corner following the Jake Plummer experience and didn't want to have another hometown hero on the roster.

Burfict couldn't stay eligible as a high school sophomore. Sorry about that.

And Burfict doesn't speak to the media after games? WTF?

 

[Mulli]

He wasn't a first-round draft pick--or a draft pick at all. And he was a fullback. I think the scuttlebutt on the real reason we passed on Terrell Suggs was because the family felt painted into a corner following the Jake Plummer experience and didn't want to have another hometown hero on the roster.

Burfict couldn't stay eligible as a high school sophomore. Sorry about that.

And Burfict doesn't speak to the media after games? WTF?

It is idiocy like that that pushes me more and more towards dropping this dumb franchise all together in a messy sports divorce.

 

[TJ]

You know you'd gladly take him on the Cats in a second...

Yup. Just as much as you'd take Foles