Sunday Morning Coffee

JeffGollin

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I'm with Beerz, Stout and others on this board who singled out Keim and Sully as having the most influence in drafting Boldin.

I also believe that Graves played the greatest role in passing on an excellent player at a position of need (Suggs) in favor of two somewhat less talented prospects at positions of need (BJ and Pace). I was really upset about that move at the time and, on hindsight, still think it was an unwise move.

That said, I am not in favor of "the death penalty" when it comes to neophyte managers or players who make mistakes. What you hope (and look for) is that those individuals are bright enough, open minded enough and flexible enough to learn from mistakes - and this should make them stronger later on.

The risk here of course (and my wife Mrs/Dr. Gollin will be quick to point this out) is that it is very hard to change character (i.e. the leopard and his spots; the old dog with new tricks).

What we don't therefore know yet is: "Will Rod concede the lack of wisdom of that move and not make the same mistake again? Or will he revert to his original ways and be tempted to bipass a franchise-changer in favor of a couple of pretty good players?"

I think Mitch makes a good point when he says he "admires" Rod's aggressiveness" in making that trade a few years ago. I agree. He shouldn't be afraid to make a move. The only thing is that, next time, he should exercise better judgment (i.e. don't trade down out of the talent pool).
 

BullheadCardFan

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What we don't therefore know yet is: "Will Rod concede the lack of wisdom of that move and not make the same mistake again? Or will he revert to his original ways and be tempted to bipass a franchise-changer in favor of a couple of pretty good players?"
Hopefully he listens more to the people with knowledge around him like the scouts and coaches ... and not on who BB and MB seem to like ...

And if he learns from his mistakes and has a strong draft it will benefit the entire organization ... I have been all over RG for his mistakes and its time for him to show us something or he will known as a weak GM who can't recognize talent ...
 

Crazy Canuck

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Q: Is Suggs a UFA after this season?

If the answer is "yes", then we can go for him in the off season. Given his role in the Raven's 3-4 D, he'd be an ideal pickup. We get an experienced player still in his prime, as oppossed to having drafted a player whose talents would have been largely diminished as a 4-3 end.

If he's available and the Cards sign him can we have a truce on this issue?
 

joeshmo

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Q: Is Suggs a UFA after this season?

If the answer is "yes", then we can go for him in the off season. Given his role in the Raven's 3-4 D, he'd be an ideal pickup. We get an experienced player still in his prime, as oppossed to having drafted a player whose talents would have been largely diminished as a 4-3 end.

If he's available and the Cards sign him can we have a truce on this issue?

Ravens are already negotiating an extension with Suggs as we speak.
 

TheCardFan

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The fact is: Rod Graves drafted one of the top three players in the 2003 Draft, without a top three pick.

But he could have and should have stayed put and drafted Suggs and Boldin...that would have been significant.
 

Stins

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Sunday Morning Coffee on Monday

Taking your trade down, your number 1 and 2 picks are fine with my thinking, but I have other thoughts for th rest of the draft. My draft would be as follows:

#1. Levi Brown
#2 David Harris - a great match to team with Hayes in the 3/4 and has the speed ( 4.59 ) and size to play the outside in the 4/3. This can keep Dansby on the outside in the 3/4 where he create havoc.
OR
Justin Harrell, DE/DT, 6' 5" 300lbs - A perfect DE for the 3/4. He might be gone in the 1st round but he might fall because of an injury.

#3a (#69) Fred Bennett, CB - 6' 1" 195lbs 4.47 40, - His stock has slide but I believehe is still an elite corner and in the 3rd round, he's a bargin.He has great instincts and always seem to be around the ball. Very good size to speed ratio and flexible hips to turn and run with any reciever. Would intially be a great nickle or dime back or rotate in the 3 safety sets.

#3b (#72) Doug Free, OT 6' 6" 320lbs 5.19 40, - Complete the rebuilding of the offensive line. Free could also be a blocking tight end, since he is very athletic and mobil. he will be couched up and become the a starter at tackle in 2008 giving the Cardinals bookend tackles for several years.

#4 (#105) Brian Robison, DE/OLB - 6' 3" 260lbs 4.59, 40 - a very versatile player, who can rotate as a DE in the 4/3 and has experience as a LB in the 3/4. Excellent speed/strength to size ratio. Also was one of the best special team performers in the country the last two years.

#5 (#142) Walter Thomas, DT 6' 4 1/2" 370lbs 5.15 40, - A massive and imposing DT with unusual quickness for a man that size. I know this is a gamble, but I think of Eric Swann who also did not play big college football. He intially went to OK State as a highly recruited player. I believe this would be a reasonable gamble in the 5th round.

#6 (#?180) Dallas Sartz, - 6' 5" 240lbs 4.71 40, - Very impressive athlete with great size to speed and very well couched. A project but has very good upside. Must get tougher.

#7 (#215) David Lofton 6' 4" 212lbs, 4.48 40, - One of the best pure athletes in the country. Has played QB, LB & WR. Could be a &th round surprise. Son of James Lofton
 

crisper57

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Taking your trade down, your number 1 and 2 picks are fine with my thinking, but I have other thoughts for th rest of the draft. My draft would be as follows:

#1. Levi Brown
#2 David Harris - a great match to team with Hayes in the 3/4 and has the speed ( 4.59 ) and size to play the outside in the 4/3. This can keep Dansby on the outside in the 3/4 where he create havoc.
OR
Justin Harrell, DE/DT, 6' 5" 300lbs - A perfect DE for the 3/4. He might be gone in the 1st round but he might fall because of an injury.

#3a (#69) Fred Bennett, CB - 6' 1" 195lbs 4.47 40, - His stock has slide but I believehe is still an elite corner and in the 3rd round, he's a bargin.He has great instincts and always seem to be around the ball. Very good size to speed ratio and flexible hips to turn and run with any reciever. Would intially be a great nickle or dime back or rotate in the 3 safety sets.

#3b (#72) Doug Free, OT 6' 6" 320lbs 5.19 40, - Complete the rebuilding of the offensive line. Free could also be a blocking tight end, since he is very athletic and mobil. he will be couched up and become the a starter at tackle in 2008 giving the Cardinals bookend tackles for several years.

#4 (#105) Brian Robison, DE/OLB - 6' 3" 260lbs 4.59, 40 - a very versatile player, who can rotate as a DE in the 4/3 and has experience as a LB in the 3/4. Excellent speed/strength to size ratio. Also was one of the best special team performers in the country the last two years.

#5 (#142) Walter Thomas, DT 6' 4 1/2" 370lbs 5.15 40, - A massive and imposing DT with unusual quickness for a man that size. I know this is a gamble, but I think of Eric Swann who also did not play big college football. He intially went to OK State as a highly recruited player. I believe this would be a reasonable gamble in the 5th round.

#6 (#?180) Dallas Sartz, - 6' 5" 240lbs 4.71 40, - Very impressive athlete with great size to speed and very well couched. A project but has very good upside. Must get tougher.

#7 (#215) David Lofton 6' 4" 212lbs, 4.48 40, - One of the best pure athletes in the country. Has played QB, LB & WR. Could be a &th round surprise. Son of James Lofton

I really like Free and I hope the Cards draft him.
 
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