Suns 2024-2025 Season Discussions

[Yuma]

Of course, but I also want to be realistic on what we are actually able to do. If we have any moves left, they are going to be end of the bench ones.

IDK. Probably. We still have Nurkic, Little, 2031 Pick, Allen, and now Oneal. Plus a couple more second rounders. It's not like we have that great of talent from 4 through 15 that a guy could be added to help this roster. I am looking at it objectively. We aren't as deep as teams that went far into the playoffs, and our starting five isn't that great compared to some of the other top teams, too. I think Isbia won't stay pat at what we have. Tinkering will possibly be done. I don't expect this team not to change before the end of the year.

 

[SirStefan32]

They are not getting anyone better than Royce or Greyson for Little and a couple of picks.

 

[Yuma]

They are not getting anyone better than Royce or Greyson for Little and a couple of picks.

Maybe not. But we could trade Nurkic for a couple pieces. I'm not sure HOW we will do it, but that 2031 pick looms large. GMs will want that! If we play the same as last year, Ishbia WILL blow it up. You guys think he will just let it play out?

It doesn't have to be better than them, just not as weak on both sides of the floor. A more well rounded player.

 

[SirStefan32]

It doesn't have anything to do with Ishbia- they just don't have the resources to trade. The second they got the "big three" they said goodbye to any significant improvements barring someone just randomly deciding they want to play for the vet minimum in Phoenix.

 

[Yuma]

It doesn't have anything to do with Ishbia- they just don't have the resources to trade. The second they got the "big three" they said goodbye to any significant improvements barring someone just randomly deciding they want to play for the vet minimum in Phoenix.

I am not that pessimistic. We do have assets. We got Royce for just pieces. Now there's no way we can get anyone better than Royce Oneal? Really?

 

[gimpy]

Who replaces Nurk in the starting five? Someone we already have on the team, or someone in a trade with him?

 

[Chaplin]

IDK. Probably. We still have Nurkic, Little, 2031 Pick, Allen, and now Oneal. Plus a couple more second rounders. It's not like we have that great of talent from 4 through 15 that a guy could be added to help this roster. I am looking at it objectively. We aren't as deep as teams that went far into the playoffs, and our starting five isn't that great compared to some of the other top teams, too. I think Isbia won't stay pat at what we have. Tinkering will possibly be done. I don't expect this team not to change before the end of the year.

Nurk isn't going anywhere. If there was a market for him, we would have already traded him. And we likely weren't going to get a starting center in return anyway.

 

[Yuma]

Who replaces Nurk in the starting five? Someone we already have on the team, or someone in a trade with him?

Possibly both. Not saying we have to only get one guy back in return. Sometimes teams have to open up roster spots, or move a guy so another can get more minutes. I am not proposing a trade for any one guy. Just saying if this team plays like it did last season, no way Ishbia stands pat.

 

[Chaplin]

It doesn't have anything to do with Ishbia- they just don't have the resources to trade. The second they got the "big three" they said goodbye to any significant improvements barring someone just randomly deciding they want to play for the vet minimum in Phoenix.

I don't think it's as hopeless as your post implies, but yes, their hands are tied.

 

[Yuma]

Nurk isn't going anywhere. If there was a market for him, we would have already traded him. And we likely weren't going to get a starting center in return anyway.

Willing to bet an avatar change that we won't trade for anyone from now until the end of the season?

 

[Chaplin]

Possibly both. Not saying we have to only get one guy back in return. Sometimes teams have to open up roster spots, or move a guy so another can get more minutes. I am not proposing a trade for any one guy. Just saying if this team plays like it did last season, no way Ishbia stands pat.

Who? Mason Plumlee? Bol Bol? KD as a center?

 

[Chaplin]

Willing to bet an avatar change that we won't trade for anyone from now until the end of the season?

I never said we won't trade for anyone. You know that. I said we don't have the assets to trade for a fifth starter, as you stated.

And no, I'm not doing such a silly thing as betting an avatar change considering I've had mine here for 25 years.

 

[GatorAZ]

Maybe not. But we could trade Nurkic for a couple pieces. I'm not sure HOW we will do it, but that 2031 pick looms large. GMs will want that! If we play the same as last year, Ishbia WILL blow it up. You guys think he will just let it play out?

It doesn't have to be better than them, just not as weak on both sides of the floor. A more well rounded player.

Nurk has negative trade value. He doesn’t protect the rim or guard switches and he’s a below average finisher at the rim. He’s a decent passer/rebounder for his position but not at that salary. When he’s traded next offseason as an expiring it will be for a worse contract coming back. In other words we’re stuck with him for another year and hope he can hit 3’s at a decent clip to provide some value.

 

[Yuma]

Who? Mason Plumlee? Bol Bol? KD as a center?

I don't know. It doesn't have to be only one for one trade. We could get back a center and another player. We could pick up another guy unrelated to the trade. If you guys are sold this team is good enough as is. I get that.

 

[Chaplin]

I don't know. It doesn't have to be only one for one trade. We could get back a center and another player. We could pick up another guy unrelated to the trade. If you guys are sold this team is good enough as is. I get that.

You are totally misrepresenting everything. You're a good dude, Yuma, but I can't continue this conversation if you're not going to proceed in good faith.

 

[Yuma]

I never said we won't trade for anyone. You know that. I said we don't have the assets to trade for a fifth starter, as you stated.

And no, I'm not doing such a silly thing as betting an avatar change considering I've had mine here for 25 years.

wuss!

 

[Yuma]

You are totally misrepresenting everything. You're a good dude, Yuma, but I can't continue this conversation if you're not going to proceed in good faith.

Maybe you are misreading what I am saying. My main point is we will not stand pat with this team as it is now.

Then I made a point about no one is good enough on this roster they should be considered a lock for that fifth spot.

Then, it doesn't have to be a guy outright better than Allen or Oneal to take over that fifth spot. A guy better rounded on both ends of the court could do it.

Somehow you guys are misrepresenting that there's no way we could get anyone better than Allen or Oneal. I never said better;. I said better rounded for that spot. Not as much weakness on both ends as each guys has.

I think with all due respect, what I have been saying has been misrepresented more.

 

[Yuma]

Happy Fourth of July everyone!

 

[Chaplin]

Maybe you are misreading what I am saying. My main point is we will not stand pat with this team as it is now.

Then I made a point about no one is good enough on this roster they should be considered a lock for that fifth spot.

Then, it doesn't have to be a guy outright better than Allen or Oneal to take over that fifth spot. A guy better rounded on both ends of the court could do it.

Somehow you guys are misrepresenting that there's no way we could get anyone better than Allen or Oneal. I never said better;. I said better rounded for that spot. Not as much weakness on both ends as each guys has.

I think with all due respect, what I have been saying has been misrepresented more.

You said "I am still in on a Little trade if it would get us a fifth starter." I disagreed. And then for some reason you turned this into an argument about whether any move will be made at all.

I stand by my disagreement that no, there is no way we're getting a fifth starter with what we have to offer. The weakest links, if you want to call them that, in our starting lineup is Nurk (who isn't getting traded) and Allen (and maybe Royce depending on the day). You want a "fifth starter" so that means replacing Allen/ONeale or Nurk. Nurk isn't going anywhere so that leaves Allen and Royce. Who is better than them that we can acquire with our meager assets to actually be good enough (better than both of them, at least) to be in the starting lineup?

If you want to change the narrative, and that is what it looks like, then that is perfectly fine. I just wasn't addressing that new narrative.

 

[Suns_fan69]

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Nurk looking slimmer

 

[Yuma]

I stand by my disagreement that no, there is no way we're getting a fifth starter with what we have to offer. The weakest links, if you want to call them that, in our starting lineup is Nurk (who isn't getting traded) and Allen (and maybe Royce depending on the day). You want a "fifth starter" so that means replacing Allen/ONeale or Nurk. Nurk isn't going anywhere so that leaves Allen and Royce. Who is better than them that we can acquire with our meager assets to actually be good enough (better than both of them, at least) to be in the starting lineup?

I don't want to put words in your mouth, but to me this reads as there's no way we get a fifth starter with what we have? Then you say we have Allen and Oneal as assets, which I agree with. Unless I am reading what you are writing wrong? (EDITED THIS PART TO NOT ASSUME WHAT YOU ARE THINKING.)

These are my words: The best three point shooter last season. A bunch of teams would want that. Yes Allen could net a fifth starter, since he's offensive dominant and we could use a taller two way guy.

 

[Yuma]

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Nurk looking slimmer

It's the freaking AZ heat! LOL!

 

[Covert Rain]

I stand by my disagreement that no, there is no way we're getting a fifth starter with what we have to offer. The weakest links, if you want to call them that, in our starting lineup is Nurk (who isn't getting traded) and Allen (and maybe Royce depending on the day). You want a "fifth starter" so that means replacing Allen/ONeale or Nurk. Nurk isn't going anywhere so that leaves Allen and Royce. Who is better than them that we can acquire with our meager assets to actually be good enough (better than both of them, at least) to be in the starting lineup?

I don't want to put words in your mouth, but to me this reads as there's now way we get a fifth starter with what we have? Then you say we have Allen and Oneal as assets, which I agree with. Allen could arguably net us a fifth starter? Unless I am reading what you are writing wrong?

These are my words: The best three point shooter last season. A bunch of teams would want that.

We can’t afford to trade Allen. Period. Not unless by some miracle a couple of our recent additions tear it up. We need Allen.

 

[Hoop Head]

These are my words: The best three point shooter last season. A bunch of teams would want that. Yes Allen could net a fifth starter, since he's offensive dominant and we could use a taller two way guy.

This is such a ridiculous thing I see hyped by a lot of Suns fans, here and elsewhere. Having a good 3pt shooter is great but this constant trumpeting of how he was the best 3pt shooter in the league last year is overblown. It's true but ultimately it's not as coveted as some think. Who led the league 2 years ago? Was he talked about as a desirable asset all year last season, since he led the league in 3pt % the year prior? No, he wasn't. He's an unsigned free agent as of right now.

Answer to the above was Luke Kennard. He's a free agent right now but he's rarely in pundits top free agent lists. It's not like he dropped off in a major way as he still shot 45% on 6 attempts a game, which was #2 in the league last year. He was #1 the year before last and the season before that. So in the last 3 years he's finished #2, #1, and #1 in 3pt %. He's like Grayson though in that he's not a good defender and he's also not capable of creating his own looks regularly. So this idea that Grayson has a lot of value as the top 3pt shooter last year is something only Suns fans are pushing because the national media isn't. I like Grayson, I think he's be a solid 6th man and injury insurance for our starting guards but that doesn't mean he carries a lot of value elsewhere. 3pt shooters are available if a team is looking. Teams are really after guys who do more than just shoot, see Kennard still being unsigned. So can we stop overselling Grayson's shooting? It's nice to have but it didn't help us win when it mattered most.

 

[Suns_fan69]

This is such a ridiculous thing I see hyped by a lot of Suns fans, here and elsewhere. Having a good 3pt shooter is great but this constant trumpeting of how he was the best 3pt shooter in the league last year is overblown. It's true but ultimately it's not as coveted as some think. Who led the league 2 years ago? Was he talked about as a desirable asset all year last season, since he led the league in 3pt % the year prior? No, he wasn't. He's an unsigned free agent as of right now.

Answer to the above was Luke Kennard. He's a free agent right now but he's rarely in pundits top free agent lists. It's not like he dropped off in a major way as he still shot 45% on 6 attempts a game, which was #2 in the league last year. He was #1 the year before last and the season before that. So in the last 3 years he's finished #2, #1, and #1 in 3pt %. He's like Grayson though in that he's not a good defender and he's also not capable of creating his own looks regularly. So this idea that Grayson has a lot of value as the top 3pt shooter last year is something only Suns fans are pushing because the national media isn't. I like Grayson, I think he's be a solid 6th man and injury insurance for our starting guards but that doesn't mean he carries a lot of value elsewhere. 3pt shooters are available if a team is looking. Teams are really after guys who do more than just shoot, see Kennard still being unsigned. So can we stop overselling Grayson's shooting? It's nice to have but it didn't help us win when it mattered most.

That's a pretty damn good comp:https://stathead.com/basketball/ver...ayer_id1=kennalu01&request=1&utm_id=kennalu01

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