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We’re tanking right now. If the season ended today we wouldn’t make the play in.
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We’re tanking right now. If the season ended today we wouldn’t make the play in.
Depends on how the games shake out today. I understand your point though. This isn't tanking, it's failing. There's a difference. Throwing in the towel would be a mistake. We need to take our lumps and hope we can improve.
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The idea of trading Durant to Miami for Butler makes too much sense for it to happen.
Both teams would still have the same number of stars.
Then, if the Heat sent Phoenix first round draft picks, the Suns could trade for a center or a 4/5 in a separate trade and conceivably have draft picks left over.
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Miami’s picks are locked up so they can’t trade them. Not really a fan of their young guys besides Jovic.
Miami’s picks are locked up so they can’t trade them. Not really a fan of their young guys besides Jovic.
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I really don't know why they'd send us first round picks? But more importantly, I don't think a swap makes either of us championship contenders. Actually, I'm not sure that just adding KD to the Miami roster puts them in play to win it all and even worse, I'm not at all confident we'd even make the playoffs even if we could just add Butler to our roster. I think our 9-2 start is giving us false hope. IMO our 5-12 record of late is far more reflective of our place in this league given how injury prone our 3 stars are (and Butler for that matter).
somethingshesaid
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I just haven't assumed the Suns have the slightest interest in trading Durant anywhere. Heck, people talk more about trading Booker than trading Durant.
I wouldn't mind it, because I don't love Durant, for the same reason I didn't love Chris Paul: they're ring-chasers who cant make fans believe in the myth of player loyalty.
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The trade is definitely not as attractive without multiple first round picks attached, although the Heat could trade their 2030 or 2031 first round pick along with Butler.
I guess there is a possibility, a third team could be involved, but it's all brainstorming at this point.
I plugged Beal into the trade machine for simplicity but here's a way we could land Butler, Miami fills a couple holes, and Detroit gets who we trade. This is possible because Detroit has cap space. I'd imagine Detroit would request some picks in this deal, especially if Beal was sent out.
What sort of connections does Isiah Thomas have in Detroit? What about Ishbia? What scares me is the idea of Booker going to Detroit. Hometown kid goes home.
Suns get Butler
Miami gets Tobias Harris ($25m this year and next)and Tim Hardaway Jr ($17 million expiring)
Detroit gets one of our Mid 3
What sort of connections does Isiah Thomas have in Detroit? What about Ishbia? What scares me is the idea of Booker going to Detroit. Hometown kid goes home.
Suns get Butler
Miami gets Tobias Harris ($25m this year and next)and Tim Hardaway Jr ($17 million expiring)
Detroit gets one of our Mid 3
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I think Kevin Durant would be an upgrade for the Heat especially with Erik Spoelstra as head coach.
Also, Jimmy Butler wants out before the trade deadline if trade rumors are to be believed. Star players really dictate where they will play. I don't think they want to lose Butler for pocket change and they still want to sell the same dream as the Suns... the ability to win a championship.
Of course, there is no indication the Suns are willing to trade Durant unless there is something going on that we do not know about.
If the Suns could get first round picks out of the hypothetical trade, they could shore up the 4/5 position in another trade and have some hope for the future.
We didn't put the Suns in this situation, only trying to figure a way out that makes some sense for both teams and their fans.
Blowing up the team without the Suns owning their first round picks isn't a great alternative, either.
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I plugged Beal into the trade machine for simplicity but here's a way we could land Butler, Miami fills a couple holes, and Detroit gets who we trade. This is possible because Detroit has cap space. I'd imagine Detroit would request some picks in this deal, especially if Beal was sent out.
What sort of connections does Isiah Thomas have in Detroit? What about Ishbia? What scares me is the idea of Booker going to Detroit. Hometown kid goes home.
Suns get Butler
Miami gets Tobias Harris ($25m this year and next)and Tim Hardaway Jr ($17 million expiring)
Detroit gets one of our Mid 3
I thought about Detroit for Beal but he’s a terrible fit there. Cade and Ivey need the ball.
Portland has a bad contract in Jerami Grant whose deal runs one year longer than Beal but they have so many guards already.
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The Suns can’t get Butler. If the Suns look to trade KD Houston is the obvious fit. To get better assets from the Rockets we’d have to likely take back Jalen Green who just got a new deal but I’d be willing to do it and send more players out this offseason.
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The Suns have not shown any interest in trading Kevin Durant. Actually the opposite. The last I heard, the Suns wanted to extend Durant for two seasons.
This is more of a brainstorming exercise about two teams helping each other out of a tenuous situation.
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There is sure a lot of smoke surrounding the Butler trade rumor. Unless the Suns can find a third team, it's hard to see how a Beal trade gets it done. I was looking for alternative options that might work in a trade with the Heat where both teams can sell the idea to their fans.
Yeah, trading with the Rockets makes more sense if the Suns were inclined to back off their plan to extend Kevin Durant and look towards the future.
Ivey could actually be added to the deal going to Miami and it still work. If Monty was there, I could buy into more since he kept Ivey on the bench. I don't see a reason other than Detroit receiving picks for helping everyone.
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The front office needs to realize we're not even a pretender soon and make the necessary moves. We're a play-in team at best. I'd cash out on KD. We aren't getting anything for Beal until he is expiring.
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Hopefully they would have realized this before they traded Mikal Bridges, Cam Johnson, Jae Crowder, four unprotected first round picks and a swap for Kevin Durant.
Butler for Durant makes zero sense IMO because all indications are the Suns want to go for it this year. That trade gets you further not closer.
Right. That’s like doubling down on Beal and Booker up top while leaving us short another forward still.
Butler has lead more teams to finals appearances than KD. I know KD went with Golden State, which is why I said lead their teams. KD joined an established team who made back to back finals to ride their coattails. When one of Curry, Klay, Green went down, KD did also.
Butler has more drive and is more of a leader than KD is. Durant may score more but Butler is a better centerpiece.
I am not saying Butler doesn’t have good qualities but nobody would pick the Suns as a title contender swapping Butler for KD. Nobody.
Quit trying to speak for everyone. You can only speak for yourself and you may not like our chances but you also said we'd be favorites with KD so yeah, I guess I can see why you're trying to say no one else says we'd be a contender swapping them. I like our chances better, especially since Butler will opt out after this season, which could provide cap/apron relief. One last hail mary before looking to the future.
Main point though, we aren't contenders now. I don't mean because we aren't healthy, I mean as constructed. We'd lose no position. We'd gain a real leader who wants to be here and will be playing for a contract. Plus it should force JJ's hand more to find a real PF or upgrade C. Either is a necessity to be a contender.
Agreed, or KD/Butler/Booker.
I am for trading any of the big wage earners for Butler. Don't include picks or rookies.
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Maybe but all 3 of those players qualify as injury-prone so the "if healthy" part is just a dream. Not saying this is the case but if some of you think we'd be better off simply swapping a 28 year old Booker for a 35 year old Butler, I'd say think again. Not that Miami would but I'd want at least 3 unprotected firsts in a deal like that. And then I'd turn around and move Jimmy for another pick or two.
But if we're simply aiming to move players around so that our new core is equally as good as our old big three, we really need to work on our aim. A Butler, Beal, KD core might be slightly better right now than the Booker group but it would take us nowhere. Granted, Booker, Beal and Durant aren't going to take us anywhere either but Devin has probably 5 or 6more good years - Butler's future is likely measured in months.
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BirdGangThing
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dunn's fly by's are getting better - he's learning the team and players and when they're going to shoot - i know ive mentioned rodman in here and realize dunn isn't at that level - but rodman used to do this ina similar fashion
rodman was crazy tho - he'd cut to the basket like he was getting the alley-oop or something - he'd run around other players like screens to get separation
dunn isn't there yet but we're seeing is the almost ocd like tendencies - even if he isn't coming down with the rebound he's going to touch the ball or really make them work for it
best part and the reason i call it a fly by is when the rebound isn't there he doesn't stop he does a sustained u turn while checking/defending the outlet passing lanes
it all makes harder on the opponent and sets us up for defense on the other end of the court
rodman was crazy tho - he'd cut to the basket like he was getting the alley-oop or something - he'd run around other players like screens to get separation
dunn isn't there yet but we're seeing is the almost ocd like tendencies - even if he isn't coming down with the rebound he's going to touch the ball or really make them work for it
best part and the reason i call it a fly by is when the rebound isn't there he doesn't stop he does a sustained u turn while checking/defending the outlet passing lanes
it all makes harder on the opponent and sets us up for defense on the other end of the court
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