Suns at Timberwolves 1-7-2015

[AzStevenCal]

Its not really the pts, its the fact that technical fouls can have huge momentum shifts in games.

You're right, they can shift momentum and they can cost you more than just one point if you lose possession also. Sometimes they change momentum for the better too although I think that's much more likely in the college game. In the pros I think they are almost always a bad thing when it comes from a player.

I really do believe that the refs hear a Morris yak and they put an imaginary mark next to the Morris name without really distinguishing which one made the comment. Eventually the referees Morris cup runs over and whichever one is yakking at the time draws the T. These guys need to learn how to make their displeasure known without pissing off the refs as they've come awfully close in costing us the game a few times now. If I were Jeff I'd also put an end to the "AND ONE" calls by the players or the bench. It clearly angers the refs.

Steve

 

[BC867]

I got into quite an argument about this in a game thread here in 2012. I've never seen an energy guy play as dumb as Tucker does sometimes. He does some great things for us but I just don't understand his unwillingness to put the ball in the hands of the ball handlers.

Steve

PJ does it. Green does it. Three lead Point Guards and the Wings want to be Point Guards, too. Why?

Why? Because Jeff has set a team mentality of pitting the Point Guards against each other. The inevitable result is insecurity and selfishness throughout most of the roster, rather than cohesion and teamwork.

 

[AzStevenCal]

PJ does it. Green does it. Three lead Point Guards and the Wings want to be Point Guards, too. Why?

Why? Because Jeff has set a team mentality of pitting the Point Guards against each other. The inevitable result is insecurity and selfishness throughout most of the roster, rather than cohesion and teamwork.

Tucker has been doing this since we signed him. My first complaint about it came almost a year before Jeff was hired, I don't think we can blame him for this. Green does it too but Green is a scorer with the ultimate scorer's mentality. This just isn't PJ's job and he's not good at it either. In fact he's quite bad at it.

And I don't see the insecurity that you're talking about and I certainly don't buy the argument that Jeff is pitting them against each other. I'm sure there's some competition amongst them but that's natural. According to Goran though this turn around happened because of chemistry. Things started coming together on the court when they started spending more time together off the court (paraphrased). He certainly sounded happy to me, something that hasn't always been the case.

Steve

 

[sunsfan88]

Tucker and Green are both guys who have terrible ball handling skills. They have also been playing basketball forever now so its not like its gonna magically improve, they need to just let one of the point guards dribble the ball. We have plenty of them....

 

[sunsfan88]

Thus far this season, does anyone seriously believe that Bledsoe has played anywhere close to the level of a Max player?? Geeeerz....

Hell no. In terms of players actually to the level of their paycheck, I don't think Bledsoe is even top 5 on the Suns.

 

[Ronin]

Good win. Suns are 11-2 in the past 13 games? nice!

 

[JCSunsfan]

Good win. Suns are 11-2 in the past 13 games? nice!

Pretty good for a bunch of selfish, ball-hogs who are being sabatoged by their coach (for some unknown reason) into competing with and hating each other.

 

[Mainstreet]

Good win. Suns are 11-2 in the past 13 games? nice!

Jeff Hornacek has done a good job of getting the Suns to play after that six game losing streak. It really looked bleak at that point, almost like he could lose control of the team. Although the Suns are still plagued by a lot of individual play, somehow he has pulled it together in some fashion. For better or worse, that 3 PG lineup has had a lot to do with the Suns winning and lessening any potential conflict with egos.

The Suns being 11-2 over the past 13 games is quite a feat.

 

[Ronin]

Pretty good for a bunch of selfish, ball-hogs who are being sabatoged by their coach (for some unknown reason) into competing with and hating each other.

I'm going to jump in the wagon with AzstevenCal and the rest of the crew that don't want this team blown up. I'm starting to appreciate this team and coach.

Jeff Hornacek has done a good job of getting the Suns to play after that six game losing streak. It really looked bleak at that point, almost like he could lose control of the team. Although the Suns are still plagued by a lot of individual play, somehow he has pulled it together in some fashion. For better or worse, that 3 PG lineup has had a lot to do with the Suns winning and lessening any potential conflict with egos.

The Suns being 11-2 over the past 13 games is quite a feat.

 

[sunsfan88]

Good win. Suns are 11-2 in the past 13 games? nice!

Only 3 wins against good teams.

They lost both games against teams that are competing with them for the #8 spot (Pelicans & Spurs).

Let's see if they can continue when the schedule toughens up which it now will. Check out the remaining schedule here

http://m.espn.go.com/nba/teamschedule?teamId=21&season=2015&month=1

 

[82CardsGrad]

Only 3 wins against winning teams.

They lost both games against teams that are competing with them for the #8 spot (Pelicans & Spurs).

Let's see if they can continue when the schedule toughens up which it now will. Check out the remaining schedule here

http://m.espn.go.com/nba/teamschedule?teamId=21&season=2015&month=1

Next 2 games are huge...

And, I'm so ok with them beating up on teams with a losing record!

 

[sunsfan88]

Next 2 games are huge...

And, I'm so ok with them beating up on teams with a losing record!

I'm ok with it too (though I question if 2 pt wins count as "beating up") but they have to be ready to play against the big boys soon.

 

[BC867]

I'm ok with it too (though I question if 2 pt wins count as "beating up") but they have to be ready to play against the big boys soon.

Honestly, I have been hoping for that for 40 years.

Sadly, dominating is just not in their DNA.

They had two chances. During the few Maurice Lucas/Dennis Johnson years (before JC let John MacLeod break up that team) and during the few Barkley years.

If anything, the PG3 experiment takes them even farther away from ever dominating. And they are still haunted by their lack of killer instinct against weaker teams.

But especially, we'll see how it unfolds when we meet a series of stronger teams.

 

[Ronin]

If I heard correctly.
Lon Babby says Marcus Morris won't be disciplined/suspended for his blow up.
Suns are 19-9 when all three guards are healthy.
Suns have played the most road games of any NBA team.
https://soundcloud.com/suns-rise-podcast-network/on-arizona-sports-babby-on-recent-success

 

[AzStevenCal]

Only 3 wins against good teams.

They lost both games against teams that are competing with them for the #8 spot (Pelicans & Spurs).

Let's see if they can continue when the schedule toughens up which it now will. Check out the remaining schedule here

http://m.espn.go.com/nba/teamschedule?teamId=21&season=2015&month=1

Why not just save yourself some typing and add a signature that makes your point for you. Something along the lines of "our wins don't matter and our losses are embarrassing" could reduce your Carpal Tunnel risks considerably.

Steve

 

[SirStefan32]

Why not just save yourself some typing and add a signature that makes your point for you. Something along the lines of "our wins don't matter and our losses are embarrassing" could reduce your Carpal Tunnel risks considerably.

Steve

Come on, Steve- you HAVE to look at the quality of teams. Beating Philly, Milwaukee, and Minni is different from beating Memphis, San Antonio, and the Clippers.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Honestly, I have been hoping for that for 40 years.

Sadly, dominating is just not in their DNA.

They had two chances. During the few Maurice Lucas/Dennis Johnson years (before JC let John MacLeod break up that team) and during the few Barkley years.

If anything, the PG3 experiment takes them even farther away from ever dominating. And they are still haunted by their lack of killer instinct against weaker teams.

But especially, we'll see how it unfolds when we meet a series of stronger teams.

We will? It there much doubt about how we'll do against the good teams? We're a borderline playoff caliber team and I'm pretty sure we'll play that way. We might upset a really good team occasionally but I think most of us realize we aren't there yet and won't be anytime soon. I don't see how playing 3 guards now keeps us from being a good team 3 years down the road.

Steve

 

[SirStefan32]

We will? It there much doubt about how we'll do against the good teams? We're a borderline playoff caliber team and I'm pretty sure we'll play that way. We might upset a really good team occasionally but I think most of us realize we aren't there yet and won't be anytime soon. I don't see how playing 3 guards now keeps us from being a good team 3 years down the road.

Steve

Culture and reputation. Might as well ask how being a crappy employee right now has anything to do with where you are in your career in three years.

 

[sunsfan88]

Why not just save yourself some typing and add a signature that makes your point for you. Something along the lines of "our wins don't matter and our losses are embarrassing" could reduce your Carpal Tunnel risks considerably.

Steve

I take more pride in wins against quality teams. Let's see how they do good in the upcoming schedule Steve. Suns had one of the easiest stretches during this winning streak. As I said before only three good teams. Out of those 3 good teams, Toronto was also slumping without DeRozan when we played them. Out of the bad teams, we played against Sacramento without Cousins who always does major damage against us.

I love a homer as much as the next person but easy there. Let's see them vs good teams. These 2 pt wins against teams like Minnesota doesn't bode well for them against actual playoff teams.

 

[sunsfan88]

Come on, Steve- you HAVE to look at the quality of teams. Beating Philly, Milwaukee, and Minni is different from beating Memphis, San Antonio, and the Clippers.

Exactly. Not just that, we didn't beat any of these teams in blow out fashion despite their awful records. Toronto was pretty much our only blowout win.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Come on, Steve- you HAVE to look at the quality of teams. Beating Philly, Milwaukee, and Minni is different from beating Memphis, San Antonio, and the Clippers.

I don't disagree with it, it's the tone and the fact he does it routinely. Look through the game threads and you'll see something like that at least 20 times this season. He either does it before the game with a "this is a horrible team and our franchise should fold if we don't win by 20 points" or after the game with a "it's no big deal because their trainer was sneezing earlier in the day". It gets tiring. It's tough to win on the road in this league. We aren't Portland or Atlanta. We're fighting to hang onto the bottom rung of the playoff picture, every win matters to us. And we simply aren't good enough to marginalize a victory at Milwaukee.

Steve

 

[BC867]

Culture and reputation.

Well said! While coming back from mediocrity, all we can build for the future with an entertaining 3-ring circus (PG3), which bumps players out of position and to the bench, is an entertaining 3-ring circus.

That gimmick will have a short shelf life in the NBA.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Culture and reputation. Might as well ask how being a crappy employee right now has anything to do with where you are in your career in three years.

I surrender.

 

[Phrazbit]

Come on, Steve- you HAVE to look at the quality of teams. Beating Philly, Milwaukee, and Minni is different from beating Memphis, San Antonio, and the Clippers.

We also beat Dallas, played the healthy Thunder to an OT heart breaker on the road, lost to the Clippers in OT at the buzzer on the road.

You're kidding yourself if you think this team has not been playing very good basketball of late.

And as for the culture thing, thats ridiculous. Just two years ago our "culture" was as bad as could be imagined, two years before that our "culture" was amazing, and just last season we were viewed as a team that showed how much chemistry and hustle can lift a team viewed as having little talent. You compare it to being a crappy employee, playing small ball is nothing like being a crappy employee. The guys who play well are earning the PT regardless of position, if anything that promotes good culture as compared to playing garbage players just because they fit the physical aspects of a position.

 

[BC867]

I surrender.

Don't surrender, Steve. 'Chest out and join the club. One day the Suns will be a dominant team.

Unfortunatly, at my age and your age, we may not be able to see it.