Suns @ Cavaliers 2-21-19

[Mainstreet]

I don't think it matters whether Kokoskov says it or not, our record says it and so does our 16 game losing streak. Our loss tonight helped emphasize it.

I don't think we disagree the Suns are this bad. That is a fact based on record and their poor play.

My perspective is the Suns should be better than last season.

Looking at last season's roster, it's hard to believe they are not.

 

[95pro]

I don't think we disagree the Suns are this bad. That is a fact based on record and their poor play.

My perspective is the Suns should be better than last season.

Looking at last season's roster, it's hard to believe they are not.

Look at who we got rid of and where those former players are right now in their careers. They aren't signed in the NBA or even playing significant minutes or any at all.

Ayton and Bridges are rookies. Booker has been injured (if that's still an excuse, if it is then Booker isn't reliable). Warren, Oubre and Jackson have been backups for most of their careers. The only positive this year was Holmes.

Other than those right there, who can say that the other teammates even belong in the league.



Maybe Igor is even more cerebral than we thought and he's show casing what a dysfunctional roster we have.

 

[Mainstreet]

Look at who we got rid of and where those former players are right now in their careers. They aren't signed in the NBA or even playing significant minutes or any at all.

Ayton and Bridges are rookies. Booker has been injured (if that's still an excuse, if it is then Booker isn't reliable). Warren, Oubre and Jackson have been backups for most of their careers. The only positive this year was Holmes.

Other than those right there, who can say that the other teammates even belong in the league.



Maybe Igor is even more cerebral than we thought and he's show casing what a dysfunctional roster we have.

If Igor is that cerebral he should never have taken the job.

I think the Suns have the talent to play better than they have although there is enough blame to thread throughout the organization not to mention the players. It's hard to believe the Suns have not added a starting caliber point guard the past two seasons.

 

[95pro]

If Igor is that cerebral he should never have taken the job.

I think the Suns have the talent to play better than they have although there is enough blame to thread throughout the organization not to mention the players. It's hard to believe the Suns have not added a starting caliber point guard the past two seasons.

Just being sarcastic, makes you wonder what he's really doing with the players. This brings up another question, what about the rest of the coaching staff? Idk this whole organization is a mess. We don't have a GM, scouting, coaching, ...

 

[leclerc]

This is getting too depressive for me. I'll just check the results and watch the games we win (if any). Don't care about the draft.

EJs words spoke true, saying what Cotton used to say when they were bad. Just play hard, give effort, get better as an individual and as a team.

Also we need to get the defensive unit out there and focus on stops. Melton, Jackson, Bridges, Oubre and Holmes.

 

[Mainstreet]

Just being sarcastic, makes you wonder what he's really doing with the players. This brings up another question, what about the rest of the coaching staff? Idk this whole organization is a mess. We don't have a GM, scouting, coaching, ...

The thought of the Suns putting the franchise on the shoulders of interim GM James Jones is not encouraging. It's hard to have confidence in a rookie GM especially one who traded for Tyler Johnson. In fairness to Jones, there is not much downside.

In regard to the players, I can't help but wonder if Igor has lost the ear of the players. Additionally team meetings didn't help much.

It's hard to find a bright spot in a team that fired a good portion of their scouts.

 

[Finito]

Bottom line talent no talent bad system whatever this team just doesn’t play hard and hustle. It’s obvious at this point. No way you can look at this team play and say they are giving it everything they got

Booker, Ayton everybody is going through the motions.

 

[Chaplin]

I’m going to go out on a limb and say I don’t give a crap about any of this. I don’t care about Tyler Johnson, let alone what he said.

Until this team figures it out, it’s all just a bunch if talking head nonsense.

All that’s left now for me is future development of Ayton and Bridges, and Booker improvement. Maybe a small interest in Oubre beyond this season, but outside of that, they can get rid of all these clowns and start over.

 

[1tinsoldier]

It's hard to have confidence in a rookie GM especially one who traded for Tyler Johnson

i don't know which is worse -- trading for Tyler or starting Tyler every game,
but it's indicative of the Suns predicament

 

[Mainstreet]

i don't know which is worse -- trading for Tyler or starting Tyler every game,
but it's indicative of the Suns predicament

The Suns do not have an answer at point guard. It's to the point I'm anxiously awaiting Melton's return.

I've been sort of rooting for Tyler because he is in an underdog role. He plays hard but that's about all that can be expected. It's not his fault the Suns traded for him and the team is such a mess.

 

[AzStevenCal]

In regard to the players, I can't help but wonder if Igor has lost the ear of the players. Additionally team meetings didn't help much.

It's hard to find a bright spot in a team that fired a good portion of their scouts.

The bright spot is I don't believe they actually did this. From what I've read they fired their Director of Scouting and the International Director and both have major failures on their resume IMO. They filled these positions from within the organization and hired at least one more scout (Ronnie Price). So, at the most, we are down one scout and that's for an organization that has decided to pay more attention to veterans than draft picks. Right now, it's hard to argue against that decision.

 

[taz02]

Tyler Johnson is 5th on the team in minutes, playing 1 minute less per game than Ayton and shooting .206 from the field.

 

[Mainstreet]

The bright spot is I don't believe they actually did this. From what I've read they fired their Director of Scouting and the International Director and both have major failures on their resume IMO. They filled these positions from within the organization and hired at least one more scout (Ronnie Price). So, at the most, we are down one scout and that's for an organization that has decided to pay more attention to veterans than draft picks. Right now, it's hard to argue against that decision.

I counted the above as part of their scouts.

John Shumate is a scout as well from what I have heard.

I'm not sure hiring scouts within the Suns organization is particularly a great idea.

 

[1tinsoldier]

Tyler Johnson is 5th on the team in minutes, playing 1 minute less per game than Ayton and shooting .206 from the field.

and only 3.5 assists. he was only averaging 2.5 on his prior bad team in 26 minutes so i don't know who thought he had value as a point guard. i'd rather have Anderson warming the bench for 4 mil less

in Melton's absence, Okobo should have continued to start and be developed, and Tyler should be proving himself off the bench.

 

[taz02]

Johnson is second on the team in assists with 3.5. Man we are in bad shape.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I counted the above as part of their scouts.

John Shumate is a scout as well from what I have heard.

I'm not sure hiring scouts within the Suns organization is particularly a great idea.

Why not? They got rid of the decision makers, that says nothing about the information they were provided. Well, it might speak volumes but we have no idea.

The best I can tell is that most teams have somewhere around 10 scouts (including advance scouts) plus others in the organization that are involved in scouting and scouting decisions to some degree. From what I can find, we maybe let go of 3 people involved in scouting (all from the player eval side) and like I said, we added Price and promoted a couple of people. IMO, had we ignored the in-house personnel and filled all the openings from the outside that would suggest we are an even worse organization than we appear to be.

I do wish we had more reason to believe in our scouting but Marty Blake isn't walking through the door anytime soon so it's all a roll of the dice.

 

[Ronin]

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[AZCrazy]

In regards to the hustle factor, it's hard to get angry with these kids. They're all 20, 21 year old guys who haven't yet figured the NBA out.
They're all superstars in high school and college who are getting their buttocks handed to them every night, for the first time in their lives. It's hard to muster a lot of rah-rah after four months of this misery. The only remaining question is do they keep Igor? A pro coach won't come here after dumping the last guy after one season, with no real GM on the team either. They'll have to pull of Kingsbury, and pull a college coach looking for his first run into the pro's.

 

[cwamjn]

they'll have to pull of Kingsbury, and pull a college coach looking for his first run into the pro's.

We'll hire a coach that got fired after posting a losingrecord? Oh joy the future looks bright got the purple and orange gang.

My guess is we should hire Herb Sendek.

 

[sunsfan88]

Ryan Anderson on the bench providing “veteran leadership” was far better than anything Tyler Johnson brings to the table.

 

[Mainstreet]

Why not? They got rid of the decision makers, that says nothing about the information they were provided. Well, it might speak volumes but we have no idea.

The best I can tell is that most teams have somewhere around 10 scouts (including advance scouts) plus others in the organization that are involved in scouting and scouting decisions to some degree. From what I can find, we maybe let go of 3 people involved in scouting (all from the player eval side) and like I said, we added Price and promoted a couple of people. IMO, had we ignored the in-house personnel and filled all the openings from the outside that would suggest we are an even worse organization than we appear to be.

I do wish we had more reason to believe in our scouting but Marty Blake isn't walking through the door anytime soon so it's all a roll of the dice.

Looking at the Suns staff directory it lists three persons with scout after their name.

• Jason Hervey: Advance Scout
• John Shumate: Scout
• Ronnie Price: Scout

https://www.nba.com/suns/directory/staff

There may be some others with a different title.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

We get it you don’t like him.

No it’s not that I don’t like him. I think he’s just not exhibiting the personality necessary for this team to galvanize around him. And I know that’s asking a lot from a rookie, but he’s the first pick in the draft with physical attributes and skills that should enable him to dominate and he just doesn’t seem to have the desire to do so. Other rookies have come in and dominated their teams. And those teams also likely weren’t nearly as young as this team which should only make it easier for him to do so and he doesn’t.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

It’s always a good strategy to attack fans of the same team simply because you’re angry. Aren’t we all upset about this situation? Why make it more than it is with the “I told you so” attack?

Apologies.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

He also has a coach who just has no interest in using him. Hell this whole team doesn’t make an impact

I’m certainly skeptical of Igor’s usage of Ayton, but let’s not fool ourselves. Ayton has the ability to go beast mode and collect 17 rebounds and pound the offensive glass and get putbacks. But that requires aggression and a big energy expenditure that I just don’t think cares to spend night in and night out.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Ryan Anderson on the bench providing “veteran leadership” was far better than anything Tyler Johnson brings to the table.

And you know this how? I know that we've heard a few positives about Ryan's contributions away from the game but they really don't mean much and even if there were meaningful we have no way of knowing if Tyler is filling a similar role. Regardless, I've been very unimpressed by Tyler's play so far but there's a reason Anderson has only logged 2 minutes since that trade, he apparently can't play the game anymore.