Suns changes to Scouting and Player Programming

[Mainstreet]

The Suns made a dramatic change to scouting and basketball operations in 2024 and it looks like it is paying dividends. I would think this was an ongoing process even before the draft.

We know the Suns hired Matt Tellem as assistant general manager and Brian Gregory as vice president of player programming, announced in June.

Then they hired Oronde Taliaferro as their Director of Scouting announced in August and let some scouts go.

Could the result be draft picks like Kris Dunn, Oso Ighodaro and adding free agent Collin Gillespie?

Sort of an outlier is Toumani Camara in the 2023 draft who looks to be a good pick.

I'm deliberately sticking to the last two drafts because going back further opens a Pandora's box.

It's fantastic to have a G-League team to help develop young talent.

SUNS ADD MATT TELLEM AND BRIAN GREGORY TO BASKETBALL OPERATIONS STAFF

www.nba.com

Oronde Taliaferro Hired By Suns As Director Of Scouting

Oronde Taliaferro Hired By Suns As Director Of Scouting - RealGM Wiretap

basketball.realgm.com

 

[Raindog]

My guess is less James Jones = better personnel results.

 

[Mainstreet]

My guess is less James Jones = better personnel results.

I want to give credit where is do, but I don't know how much is James Jones and how much is Mat Ishbia among others.

One thing we know, James Jones turned the franchise around when he was hired. I'm forever grateful for that.

I do think Mat Ishbia is intent on taking the Suns to a higher level and he has demonstrated such.

 

[Phrazbit]

My guess is less James Jones = better personnel results.

Hard to make this argument, IMO, given how rapidly the roster evolved and competed as soon as he got the reigns.

He has been saddled by Sarver's cheapness and Ishbia's impatience, two very "hands on" owners, in very different ways.

 

[Raindog]

I want to give credit where is do, but I don't know how much is James Jones and how much is Mat Ishbia among others.

One thing we know, James Jones turned the franchise around when he was hired. I'm forever grateful for that.

I do think Mat Ishbia is intent on taking the Suns to a higher level and he has demonstrated such.

Honestly, I think the turnaround was more coincidence than cause and effect. Maybe give Jones credit for bringing in Monty, which led to Chris Paul wanting to come here. Other than that, most everything else in terms of key personnel that led to their ascent was either McDonough (Booker, Ayton, Bridges) or someone else (Cam Johnson was Jeff Bower's pet project).

Jones biffed most of his initial moves as GM (Ryan Anderson, Trevor Ariza). That they were able to turn Ariza into Kelly Oubre was also flukey given that Jones bungled the original trade of Ariza and then got lucky to find a fallback deal for Oubre. That's not mentioning his mishandling of drafts and many other personnel decisions when the Suns needed midseason help the last few years.

It seems to me that Jones has been more lucky than good in his job, and I will stick by the belief that if the Suns are turning the corner at all, it's more likely due to the contribution of other front office hires that Ishbia has brought in.

 

[Mainstreet]

Honestly, I think the turnaround was more coincidence than cause and effect. Maybe give Jones credit for bringing in Monty, which led to Chris Paul wanting to come here. Other than that, most everything else in terms of key personnel that led to their ascent was either McDonough (Booker, Ayton, Bridges) or someone else (Cam Johnson was Jeff Bower's pet project).

Jones biffed most of his initial moves as GM (Ryan Anderson, Trevor Ariza). That they were able to turn Ariza into Kelly Oubre was also flukey given that Jones bungled the original trade of Ariza and then got lucky to find a fallback deal for Oubre. That's not mentioning his mishandling of drafts and many other personnel decisions when the Suns needed midseason help the last few years.

It seems to me that Jones has been more lucky than good in his job, and I will stick by the belief that if the Suns are turning the corner at all, it's more likely due to the contribution of other front office hires that Ishbia has brought in.

The bubble is where the Suns started to turn it around. James Jones did bring in Cam Payne.

I can easily point out his mistakes but also want to give him credit, whether serendipity or not.

 

[Raindog]

The bubble is where the Suns started to turn it around. James Jones did bring in Cam Payne.

I can easily point out his mistakes but also want to give him credit, whether serendipity or not.

Fair enough, but I will always still maintain he got far too much credit for it... and deserves a lot of blame for the Suns faltering since.

Honestly, If he didn't come across as arrogant as he does every time he's questioned about the Suns failures, I would be far more inclined to overlook his mistakes.

 

[Mainstreet]

Fair enough, but I will always still maintain he got far too much credit for it... and deserves a lot of blame for the Suns faltering since.

Honestly, If he didn't come across as arrogant as he does every time he's questioned about the Suns failures, I would be far more inclined to overlook his mistakes.

Agreed, James Jones needs to recognize past mistakes in regard to player personnel.

When the Suns made their Finals run, I was pleading they add another big man. Sadly, when Dario Saric went down, they had no answer for the Bucks although in retrospect, Frank Kaminsky should have received more playing time.

 

[CardNots]

Underestimated is the fact we actually have a coach willing to play players who need a chance to show what they can do when the bullets are real.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Honestly, I think the turnaround was more coincidence than cause and effect. Maybe give Jones credit for bringing in Monty, which led to Chris Paul wanting to come here. Other than that, most everything else in terms of key personnel that led to their ascent was either McDonough (Booker, Ayton, Bridges) or someone else (Cam Johnson was Jeff Bower's pet project).

Jones biffed most of his initial moves as GM (Ryan Anderson, Trevor Ariza). That they were able to turn Ariza into Kelly Oubre was also flukey given that Jones bungled the original trade of Ariza and then got lucky to find a fallback deal for Oubre. That's not mentioning his mishandling of drafts and many other personnel decisions when the Suns needed midseason help the last few years.

It seems to me that Jones has been more lucky than good in his job, and I will stick by the belief that if the Suns are turning the corner at all, it's more likely due to the contribution of other front office hires that Ishbia has brought in.

You can’t blame Jones for all the bad stuff and then not give him credit for the good stuff. You could say just as easily that he is more unlucky than bad. The truth probably lies somewhere between. Like any job there is a learning curve and you are only as good as the people you hire. Jones looks like he finally has a team that is working for him and he seems to be thriving under Ishbia. We have no idea what kind of moves were encouraged or nixed under Sarver.

 

[Hoop Head]

The bubble is where the Suns started to turn it around. James Jones did bring in Cam Payne.

I can easily point out his mistakes but also want to give him credit, whether serendipity or not.

Cam Payne was a Monty call. Monty had worked with Payne in OKC and was an advocate for him. So I wouldn't give Jones credit other than he helped bring in Monty initially, which was a big move.

I'd agree with almost everything that @Raindog has said about Jones. JJ is quick to act cocky and arrogant while stepping in to receive credit for other's moves that improved the team when there's visible improvements made but he's also smug and condescending when things don't work and shuffles blame around. We've seen that time and time again by him.


JJ is a politician and his role as an elected official in the players union makes a lot more sense now that we've seen him in the public eye more as a GM. I think the best thing Ishbia has done as owner is add people to take things off JJ's plate or at least add people to work side by side with him because JJ can't do anything on his own. He's not proactive in the slightest, by his own admission. He doesn't properly value the draft and he also convinces himself he's the smartest guy around while bragging about working 9-5 when I can't imagine another GM would ever say their job is a 9-5. He seems well liked amongst players and knows how things work around the league to a certain extent but it seems he needs a babysitter. I'm grateful we have an active owner who knows basketball as a Collegiate player. We saw how bad things could get under Sarver and it seems we have the polar opposite type of owner now. Maybe Ishbia's ADHD sort of tinkering works with James Jones relaxed style to create a normal functioning team.


We have brought in some good scouts regarding amateur players. There's no denying that so I guess Jones deserves credit for that if only because I don't know who else made those hires but we still have some roster holes I'd like to see filled but won't hold my breathe waiting to see.

 

[Mainstreet]

Cam Payne was a Monty call. Monty had worked with Payne in OKC and was an advocate for him. So I wouldn't give Jones credit other than he helped bring in Monty initially, which was a big move.

I'd agree with almost everything that @Raindog has said about Jones. JJ is quick to act cocky and arrogant while stepping in to receive credit for other's moves that improved the team when there's visible improvements made but he's also smug and condescending when things don't work and shuffles blame around. We've seen that time and time again by him.


JJ is a politician and his role as an elected official in the players union makes a lot more sense now that we've seen him in the public eye more as a GM. I think the best thing Ishbia has done as owner is add people to take things off JJ's plate or at least add people to work side by side with him because JJ can't do anything on his own. He's not proactive in the slightest, by his own admission. He doesn't properly value the draft and he also convinces himself he's the smartest guy around while bragging about working 9-5 when I can't imagine another GM would ever say their job is a 9-5. He seems well liked amongst players and knows how things work around the league to a certain extent but it seems he needs a babysitter. I'm grateful we have an active owner who knows basketball as a Collegiate player. We saw how bad things could get under Sarver and it seems we have the polar opposite type of owner now. Maybe Ishbia's ADHD sort of tinkering works with James Jones relaxed style to create a normal functioning team.


We have brought in some good scouts regarding amateur players. There's no denying that so I guess Jones deserves credit for that if only because I don't know who else made those hires but we still have some roster holes I'd like to see filled but won't hold my breathe waiting to see.

I'm definitely not a James Jones advocate.

The Suns could have been an even better team today, but I realize if Robert Sarver had hired the wrong GM, they could have been much worse. The Suns turnaround began under Sarver, so I have to give Jones credit for creating a contender on a budget.

I can't help but wonder if there is now a new influencer making moves behind the scene like drafting Toumani Camara, Ryan Dunn and Oso Ighodaro.

Certainly, I would have built the Suns differently, but I am not going to argue with success.

 

[Hoop Head]

I'm definitely not a James Jones advocate.

The Suns could have been an even better team today, but I realize if Robert Sarver had hired the wrong GM, they could have been much worse. The Suns turnaround began under Sarver, so I have to give Jones credit for creating a contender on a budget.

I can't help but wonder if there is now a new influencer making moves behind the scene like drafting Toumani Camara, Ryan Dunn and Oso Ighodaro.

Certainly, I would have built the Suns differently, but I am not going to argue with success.

My theory is the scouts started focusing on guys who are undeniable talents while meeting JJ's criteria as far as what a draftee should be. Everyone needs to start somewhere and JJ seems unwilling to give an opportunity based on athletics vs actual resume. JJ minimizes risk because he doesn't want to look dumb. It's easier to draft an older player like Camara who is a 4 year college player with measurable accomplishments. Camara may not get better but if he can be what he was in college in the pros then that's a W. If he doesn't then you can downplay it as not being a chance you took when there's quantifiable evidence he was worth the risk.

That's part of why I wonder who is in charge or who is helping because Bol² is the opposite of a JJ player but here he is in season 2 on the Suns.

 

[Mainstreet]

My theory is the scouts started focusing on guys who are undeniable talents while meeting JJ's criteria as far as what a draftee should be. Everyone needs to start somewhere and JJ seems unwilling to give an opportunity based on athletics vs actual resume. JJ minimizes risk because he doesn't want to look dumb. It's easier to draft an older player like Camara who is a 4 year college player with measurable accomplishments. Camara may not get better but if he can be what he was in college in the pros then that's a W. If he doesn't then you can downplay it as not being a chance you took when there's quantifiable evidence he was worth the risk.

That's part of why I wonder who is in charge or who is helping because Bol² is the opposite of a JJ player but here he is in season 2 on the Suns.

I must admit, I'm not a huge fan of Bol Bol, but he might be worth the chance.

If he could play center, I could better see it.

IMO, the Suns need more size inside and it probably won't come short of a trade.

Adding Frank Kaminsky would help, at least temporarily. I'm still liking Collin Gillespie, so I hope the Suns can keep him beyond the two-way contract.