Suns @ Clippers

[AzStevenCal]

YES! MVP coming for Bledsoe! Thank you, Steve!

Two in a row even!!! But if you decide to bet on it, make sure you use your own money. I want to hang on to my own.

Steve

 

[sunsfan88]

I agree. I exaggerated a bit- it's one of my bad habits.

The main reason Bledsoe may still have value (aside from the future cap increase) is that the teams might understand that it is not Bledsoe that is a bad player, just like it's not Dragic that's a bad player. It's the fact that they are an extremely poor fit together.

That's actually what a lot of people failed (and some still fail) to understand- I am not a "Bledsoe hater" or whatever other ridiculous thing they call it- it's just that you can't play two players who need to run the show and have the ball in their hands on the same team in the same starting lineup.
Adding IT further complicates that because now there is no time for each one of the big two to run the show.

Well put.

 

[BC867]

Well put.

And a lot more logical than emotional posts about "hating" Bledsoe.

 

[Mainstreet]

Len was a bright spot with 17 points and 11 boards

Bledsoe has been putting up 17 or so shots a game when he gets the minutes. I didn't see the game, something seems off as he only had 6 shots last night. 10 assists, but obviously a bad shooting night on the shots that he did get off.

IT was 4-12, but at least he got to the foul line, and put up 7 assists.

Hopefully, the rest of the road trip will go better

Although I missed the game, Len getting 17 points and 11 rebounds under almost any condition is huge. This bodes well for the Suns future when they get the right players together.

As I see it, one of the PGs need to go and I'm not talking about Dragic.

 

[Chaz]

Fans are fickle.

All the talk of breaking up the team after 10 games is ludicrous.
Bledsoe isn't going anywhere any time soon.

Nice to see that despite some projections we can see that yes Alex Len is an NBA player.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Nice to see that despite some projections we can see that yes Alex Len is an NBA player.

as one of those projectors, I couldn't agree with you more. kid's showing flashes.

 

[BC867]

Fans are fickle.

All the talk of breaking up the team after 10 games is ludicrous.
Bledsoe isn't going anywhere any time soon.

Your comment is inaccurate.

There is nothing fickle about those of us who posted at the time that we should not re-sign Bledsoe and be overloaded with Point Guards. The drawback of which is now coming to fruition.

And you are not in the position to declare whether he is or is not going anywhere any time soon.

I respect your opinion, or wish. But, just as the rest of us, that is all it is.

 

[Phrazbit]

And a lot more logical than emotional posts about "hating" Bledsoe.

When someone puts out an argument with merit and logic, then it won't be responded to with the ol "hate" line. I might not agree with Stephan, because Bledsoe and Dragic absolutely killed it together last season, but his argument has its reasons.

However, when you make posts like you did 2 games back, ripping Bledsoe for having a great game in a loss (when the other guards played like garbage but were immune to your critiques), then its not logic. Its just biased garbage.

The Suns rotations right now clearly are not working, and it goes beyond the guards. Thomas has been the most consistent weapon (but still has had some stinkers), everyone else on the entire roster has been bi-polar. We are terrible in the front court, we do not have any spot up shooters. It's a difficult environment for the guards to play in and they're struggling mightily.

The guards are supposed to be the strongest part of the team, and despite their overall dissapointments they still are the strongest part so far this season. The Morrii are sub-par starters that should be solid reserves, the centers have on the whole been the very bad, Tolliver is completely worthless.

Its a deep team but the only legit starting quality players so far are the guards. Something has to give, guys need to improve or trades are going to go down.

I do find it funny to see our resident chicken little already screaming for us to throw all our completely unready young guys into the fire. Because yeah, that'll be great 10 games into the season, we're .500 but lets be the Sixers and get destroyed by 30 every night.

 

[Chaz]

Your comment is inaccurate.

There is nothing fickle about those of us who posted at the time that we should not re-sign Bledsoe and be overloaded with Point Guards. The drawback of which is now coming to fruition.

And you are not in the position to declare whether he is or is not going anywhere any time soon.

I respect your opinion, or wish. But, just as the rest of us, that is all it is.

I think by rule he can't be traded for another month.

Impossible to make long term conclusions about this years team on 10 games.

 

[95pro]

like i said elsewhere, we need to have Bledsoe and Dragic start. Then have both of them come out at the same time and substitute in IT. IT dominates the ball so much more than either Bledsoe or Dragic.

pretty much like the 09-10 Suns. where we almost had a true first team and then a group of reserves who'd come in for the starters. instead right now we are mixing and mashing minutes for everyone.

this is the best solution I see right now without losing anyone.

 

[Chaplin]

My problem is that Bledsoe is now in a position to fail. He's a guy who can't really run a team, but is great at scoring and the other things not usually associated with a PG (like defending and rebounding). Dragic, by contrast, is almost the exact opposite.

So my question is why Hornacek seems pretty set on letting Eric Bledsoe be the #1 option when it comes to running the team on the floor. He seems much more suited to be the #2 guy getting set up by a facilitator, which, coincidentally, is where Dragic excels.

Nobody is really asking the question, maybe because the standard answer will always involve height.

 

[Chaz]

like i said elsewhere, we need to have Bledsoe and Dragic start. Then have both of them come out at the same time and substitute in IT. IT dominates the ball so much more than either Bledsoe or Dragic.

pretty much like the 09-10 Suns. where we almost had a true first team and then a group of reserves who'd come in for the starters. instead right now we are mixing and mashing minutes for everyone.

this is the best solution I see right now without losing anyone.

I think coach will figure it out.

Doesn't help 3/5 of the starters have had a rough start to the season.

Over/Under on Len starting: 15 games from now.

 

[BC867]

When someone puts out an argument with merit and logic, then it won't be responded to with the ol "hate" line. I might not agree with Stephan, because Bledsoe and Dragic absolutely killed it together last season, but his argument has its reasons.

Perhaps I am not stating my opinion accurately. I disagree with the concept of a team whose best three players share one position (especially the Point), regardless of who they are. It doesn't take the next 10 games to believe as I do.

As far as Bledsoe and Dragic "killing it together" last season, that wasn't the case when it mattered most. Toward the end of the season when the Suns were in playoff contention with Eric and Goran were sharing the Point, they dropped out.

However, when you make posts like you did 2 games back, ripping Bledsoe for having a great game in a loss (when the other guards played like garbage but were immune to your critiques), then its not logic. Its just biased garbage.

A Point Guard doesn't just put up stats, he leads his team to winning games, especially those they should win. He is the captain on the court.

Why were the other Guards playing like garbage, as you said? Because Bledsoe was doing it all in this confusion of who is running the offense? What is the offense?

You can go with the hot Wings (hmmm, 'makes me hungry ) whose 3-point shots are falling. Or a Center who is dominating the post. But that concept doesn't work with a Point Guard, whose job it is to involve the rest of the team.

It doesn't work if he has all the leading offensive stats in a game we should have won. And it didn't! He is not LeBron James or Michael Jordan or Magic Johnson. They are few and far between

I do not "hate" Eric Bledsoe. Although I don't think he is the best lead Point Guard for the Suns style of play.

If you must make it personal and use the work "hate", I hate the concept of our three best players sharing the same position, especially at the Point Guard position, which feeds the rest of the team.

The concept of each day being a new beginning -- nobody is sure of their role from game to game -- is the same that I questioned about Kirk Gibson and the D-backs. Except for Paul Goldschmidt, every position player came to the game not knowing if he would be starting and, if so, where he would be in the batting order.

After two .500 seasons, he was fired. And I applauded it. As a Suns fan, I would hate to see Jeff fired over an unbalanced roster which he didn't set up.

 

[AzStevenCal]

My problem is that Bledsoe is now in a position to fail. He's a guy who can't really run a team, but is great at scoring and the other things not usually associated with a PG (like defending and rebounding). Dragic, by contrast, is almost the exact opposite.

So my question is why Hornacek seems pretty set on letting Eric Bledsoe be the #1 option when it comes to running the team on the floor. He seems much more suited to be the #2 guy getting set up by a facilitator, which, coincidentally, is where Dragic excels.

Nobody is really asking the question, maybe because the standard answer will always involve height.

I don't think he has. Some games it's been Bledsoe and some games it's been Goran. But Goran's passivity in several of the games made it look like Bledsoe was running the team more so than he really was IMO. As far as touches, there's not much difference between the two the last I looked. As for being set up by a facilitator, I don't think either of these guards excels at that unless they have room to drive.

Steve

 

[BC867]

I don't think he has. Some games it's been Bledsoe and some games it's been Goran. But Goran's passivity in several of the games made it look like Bledsoe was running the team more so than he really was IMO. As far as touches, there's not much difference between the two the last I looked. As for being set up by a facilitator, I don't think either of these guards excels at that unless they have room to drive.

Steve

Goran's passivity has been matched by Eric's passivity. As you said, some games it's been Bledsoe and some games it's been Goran.

That is the problem with this 2- or 3-lead Point Guard team philosophy. It hasn't resulted in a dual threat. It has been an either/or.

And that is why it has led to mediocrity, even as we embark on a long road trip.

And if we don't have a Frye to give them room to drive (even though Channing was inconsitent -- cold as often as was hot), it is up to the coaches to come up with a plan for the unusual roster we have.

If they can't, it is going to be a long season. Watching the Suns live or die by the 3-point shot is nerve-wracking. It must be even moreso for Suns players.

 

[Sci Fi]

If they can't, it is going to be a long season. Watching the Suns live or die by the 3-point shot is nerve-wracking. It must be even moreso for Suns players.

As far as I'm concerned this season is already over unless the ball is taken out of Bledsoe's hands. And I don't see that happening. By his comments, Hornacek doesn't think it's a problem. So, unless Bledose goes down with an injury long enough to show Hornacek how wrong he is, say goodbye to Dragic Suns fans.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Goran's passivity has been matched by Eric's passivity. As you said, some games it's been Bledsoe and some games it's been Goran.

That is the problem with this 2- or 3-lead Point Guard team philosophy. It hasn't resulted in a dual threat. It has been an either/or.

And that is why it has led to mediocrity, even as we embark on a long road trip.

And if we don't have a Frye to give them room to drive (even though Channing was inconsitent -- cold as often as was hot), it is up to the coaches to come up with a plan for the unusual roster we have.

If they can't, it is going to be a long season. Watching the Suns live or die by the 3-point shot is nerve-wracking. It must be even moreso for Suns players.

Not even. I'd say Goran's passivity has been matched or perhaps exceeded by Eric's stupidity. He keeps driving into the teeth of the defense without any real options. He's cut down his turnovers but I'd suggest that's more a result of the defense than anything he's doing. You can't dribble like he does through a crowd and expect good things to happen. But he's been nowhere near as consistently passive as Dragic. They've both had their moments where they've played well but the trick is figuring out how to make it happen in the same game.

Channing was inconsistent but the defense played him like he was a star whether he was hot or not (with few exceptions). Although I wish we still had him at times I really do suspect much of what's happened would have eventually happened even with him. I think the best way to guard our team is to zone us and dare us to get hot from distance, with or without Channing. Unless Bledsoe or Goran become more comfortable playing off the ball, we're going to have to move one of them.

Steve

 

[BC867]

 

[Mainstreet]

Maybe I'm missing it, but Tolliver is not getting the open 3 point shot at the top of the key that Frye used to get. So I'm wondering if Frye would have helped the current Suns. It's not like Frye was going to drive the ball to the basket from there. It seems opponents are extending their defense without fear of it costing them easy baskets.

 

[Phrazbit]

Perhaps I am not stating my opinion accurately. I disagree with the concept of a team whose best three players share one position (especially the Point), regardless of who they are. It doesn't take the next 10 games to believe as I do.

As far as Bledsoe and Dragic "killing it together" last season, that wasn't the case when it mattered most. Toward the end of the season when the Suns were in playoff contention with Eric and Goran were sharing the Point, they dropped out.

You keep saying this... and its patently false. Bledsoe and Dragic had them in the playoffs when Bledsoe got hurt, while he was OUT the Suns fell out of a playoff seed, they actually got CLOSER after Bledsoe came back, only missing the playoffs by a game.

You've been corrected on this fact repeatedly, yet you keep asserting it. When you make up this kind of garbage its hard to take your opinion as anything but bias.

A Point Guard doesn't just put up stats, he leads his team to winning games, especially those they should win. He is the captain on the court.

Why were the other Guards playing like garbage, as you said? Because Bledsoe was doing it all in this confusion of who is running the offense? What is the offense?

You can go with the hot Wings (hmmm, 'makes me hungry ) whose 3-point shots are falling. Or a Center who is dominating the post. But that concept doesn't work with a Point Guard, whose job it is to involve the rest of the team.

It doesn't work if he has all the leading offensive stats in a game we should have won. And it didn't! He is not LeBron James or Michael Jordan or Magic Johnson. They are few and far between

When Bledsoe was in the game "leading" the team that game we outscored the opposition. Our failings came with him on the bench. So, again, you are placing blame on his shoulders for absolutely no reason other than that it fits your narrative.

There are plenty of legitmate critiques of Bledsoe and the rest of the roster, but when you continuously come up with gripes are flat out false specifically against one guy. I do not think you "hate" Bledsoe the person, but your bias is obvious.

 

[JustWinBaby]

I keep reading about one of either Dragic or Bledsoe needs to go. As I remember they worked pretty well together last year. We do not need to break those guys up we need to have pieces that work well with them while letting them be the leaders of this team.

The guy that needs to go is the midget. IMO, he is the cause of most of our problems. I really do not care about his stats. His presence has really screwed up the rotations that were our biggest strength last year. It seems everyone is in love with him. I see him as our biggest problem. He has had his nights and scored a lot of points. A lot of his success can be attributed to his time on the court with Green.

Last year Goran and Green together was lethal at times. Green has improved his handle and deserves minutes. What has happened is that we have changed the role for our best 3 players from last years roster and given some of their minutes to Thomas, just brilliant. Sacramento is happy that he is in Phoenix.

I expect that if we had a three guard rotation of Goran, Bledsoe and Green we would be far better off and the roles for each would be much more defined. Ennis would be a fine back up for Goran or Bledsoe.

I also think that we have to get Warren minutes sooner than later. He appears to be the only guy that is not just a designated 3 point shooter and is willing to mix it up in the paint.

I think we are stuck with the Morris Twins, thanks Lon. I have no idea why we just didn't wait to see how they did this year prior to committing to them long term, just dumb. We also are stuck with Tucker and his contract.

What was supposed to be a great off season is turning into a nightmare, thanks Lon. Yeah you are the guy that either initiated or signed off on everything. You are the problem.

You are the first guy I would rid of. The number of management, coaching and player mistakes we have made on your watch is just unbelievable.

 

[BC867]

There are plenty of legitmate critiques of Bledsoe and the rest of the roster, but when you continuously come up with gripes are flat out false specifically against one guy. I do not think you "hate" Bledsoe the person, but your bias is obvious.

As you know, my gripe is with the Suns gimmick of a 3-lead Point Guard roster. Not with the players who have to deal with it.

I am talking about the Suns performance. You are talking about me.

Y'know, that is not going to solve their problems.

The elections are over. It is not about discrediting your opponent. Besides, I am a registered Independent. I decide each issue based on its merits, whether politics or this ASFN site. And I study and appreciate the opinions of my fellow posters, whether I wind up agreeing with each of them or not.

 

[Mainstreet]

Can anyone who saw the game give me an idea how Len scored 17 points and grabbed 11 rebounds in the Clippers game? Generally if Len scores 4 or 5 points in a game I get excited.

 

[Chaz]

Can anyone who saw the game give me an idea how Len scored 17 points and grabbed 11 rebounds in the Clippers game? Generally if Len scores 4 or 5 points in a game I get excited.

Guys were spoon feeding him at the rim for dunks. Looked good from the ft line.

He did have one really nice step back 16ft jumper though.

 

[Mainstreet]

Guys were spoon feeding him at the rim for dunks. Looked good from the ft line.

He did have one really nice step back 16ft jumper though.

Sounds like a good first step for Len. In the past Len had trouble catching and finishing these type passes near the rim. His jump shot and FT shooting has looked smooth in the past when he is relaxed. He might be a bright spot this season.

Thanks for the rundown.