Suns' Hill now a 3-point threat

[azirish]

http://www.azcentral.com/sports/suns/articles/1012sunsnb1013.html

Suns' Hill now a 3-point threat

Paul Coro
The Arizona Republic
Oct. 12, 2007 07:40 PM
When fans get their first US Airways Center glimpse of Grant Hill in a Suns uniform for tonight's preseason home opener, they might see more than they expected.

Hill is thriving, enjoying his best health - and teammates - in years. He also is fitting in with a new weapon, a three-point shot. Hill took more three-pointers (three) in Thursday's preseason opener than he had taken in any game since April 2000.

Hill won't be the only one shooting it more. Amaré Stoudemire launched about 200 threes after Friday's practice and Boris Diaw may take more, but coach Mike D'Antoni expects Hill to take 150 threes this season. Hill was 9 for 40 from three-point range in the past seven injury-riddled seasons.

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Hill worked on the shot in 1999 and went 34 for 98 from long distance the next season. His ensuing summers were spent on rehabilitation until this year.

"It's just as much mental as anything, getting comfortable taking that shot and having the freedom to do it," Hill said. "At the same time, I've still got to play my game."

Stoudemire's shooting form has become picturesque. It shows in an annually improving free-throw percentage and a reliable midrange shot. The three was nearly ready before his 2005 microfracture, but he was to the point of shooting it in the flow of transition this summer.

"I feel great about it," Stoudemire said. "I'm very confident. I've been putting in the time and the work to shoot it. The coaches have confidence in it and my teammates have confidence in it.

"That'll open up my total offense, not just my three-pointer but my mid-jumper as well. My ball handling skills have increased tremendously as well, so I'm definitely going for that Most Improved Player."

Stoudemire is 6 for 35 on threes in his career. D'Antoni said Stoudemire must overcome the newness of the shot and have quick-fire confidence to avoid the "Pat Burke syndrome."

"Once it becomes a normal thing, he'll shoot 35 to 40 percent," D'Antoni said. "He can't abuse it, like anything, but it will be an added weapon." Stoudemire on court

Ten days after arthroscopic surgery, Stoudemire worked on the court Friday with his first agility exercises, individual offense (shooting off screens, etc.), shooting and a dunk.

"I did a lot more stuff today, a little physical," Stoudemire said. "I feel fantastic. I want to still take my time with it. The training staff is doing a great job to make sure I maintain my strength. That's what counts." Thursday's best

Marcus Banks' play was "probably the best thing that came out of " Thursday's game vs. the Kings, D'Antoni said.

Banks harassed Mike Bibby defensively in the first half and put the win away when he hit two three-pointers in a two-minute stretch of the fourth.

"I worked really hard all summer on my shot," Banks said. "It does feel a lot better. It just feels natural."

Sean Marks also played well but fouled out in 22 minutes (he played 17 minutes all of last season). He had 13 points and nine rebounds.

"There are five or six of us who are fighting for time," Marks said. "Every time, you've got to make the most of the minutes. My role has been just to be a practice player for so long but I want to be able to help the team. If that's on the court, I've got to be ready."

Fellow backup big man Brian Skinner could play tonight after returning to practice Friday from a knee bruise.

This is from Coro's Thur Blog

Preseason opener highlights


Some other things of note from Thursday's game at Sacramento:

* When Steve Nash and Shawn Marion left the game with the Suns ahead 78-62, the lead was evaporating quickly with a lineup of Marcus Banks, Leandro Barbosa, D.J. Strawberry, Alando Tucker and Boris Diaw to start the fourth (LB, DJ and Marcus rotated at point). Then, two things happened. Sean Marks re-entered the game and Banks re-energized the team. This group played well defensively but was pretty much all Barbosa offensively (turnovers or shots) until Marks came back for a bigger look and Banks got hot with a string of three three-pointers in a two-minute stretch. But this was the end of the Kings' bench they were playing and Sacramento used 16 players Thursday. But Banks was impressive early too, rattling Mike Bibby a couple times.

* D.J. Strawberry remains well ahead of Alando Tucker. Strawberry got a look in the second quarter. Tucker watched until the third quarter. Tucker does not have a niche at this point. He does a lot of things decently but not one thing as well as Strawberry defends (Straw was on Ron Artest initially). Strawberry moves the ball quickly on offense and that will win over D'Antoni, along with working on his shot.

*.The officials were putting an emphasis on traveling (got Hill and Marion) and palming (got Strawberry and Banks).

* Mike Bibby with his hair grown out -- cool look. Brad Miller with cornrows -- not so cool.

* Grant Hill has a different game speed. You could see it in transition. You could see it in a half-court set when he blew by Artest along the baseline and kicked it out to Steve Nash at the three-point line (that's fitting into the offense pretty quickly, isn't it?).

* The Suns' transition game is just sick sometimes. Phoenix somehow even had a 3-on-2 off a missed Kings free throw.

* Shawn Marion passed the ball really well. He still had some ball-handling butterfingers but for him to get assists and make other well-placed or well-timed passes shows is a bonus to the things he already brings. The man looked motivated but insists he's not in shape.

 

[Stargazer]

This all sounds good, but why is Amare working on the three? Fine with me and all, but don't turn into Nowitzski on us! In transition, I would think he wants to fill the lane, not post at the three line. In the flow of the offense, I suppose he could force defenders to leave the paint to cover him at the line, which would open up room for drives by other players, but that isn't really the Suns game, is it?

 

[playstation]

i have a hard time thinking of when would be a good time to have a top 3 inside player in the game stand at the 3 line. perhaps inbounds plays...perhaps last-second plays... that's it.

for a guy to provide equal value from the 3 line that he does from 57% shooting inside the 3 line, he'd have to shoot 40+% (if you think of the lack of rebounding that also comes when amare is on the outside). so unless he can shoot it as well as nash, it doesn't make sense in normal offensive flow.

 

[azirish]

Last year Amare score 67.9% of his shots from in close (716 of his 1053 total shots) and hit 64.6% of them. He shot only 14.5 shots from mid range (153 attempts) where he hit 69 for 45%. That's not bad, but given a choice opponents are going to be lot more concerned about him going to the basket than his mid range shot.

But what happens if he pulls back a few feet? It would mean every "make" would be worth 1.5 what a mid range shot is worth. This COULD turn his mid range shot into the equivalent of 67.5% of two point shots if he shot at the same rate.

Obviously it won't work that way and it discounts Amare's ability to get to the line. But it could be enough to force opponents to come out and guard him, which will open everyone else to get the basket. They can afford to ignore his mid range, but if he can consistently hit threes, they can't pack the paint.

Will he abandon the basket and become another Dirk. No. Amare's dunks are valuable from an intimidation factor beyond the fact that he's really, really good at it. Other bigs like Sheed Wallace are nothing close to Amare at the basket.

IMHO, Sheed is a bad role model. First, he shoots from the outside too much: For example, 35.5% of his shots were for three (296 of 843 total shots), but only 201 shots were in close. His three point shooting was a medicocre 33.7%. BTW, mid range shot is no better, hitting 39 of 117 for 33.3%. In short, Sheed shoots too much from the outside and is not all that accurate

For Amare to take threes, he needs to be selective and only shoot when teams leave him totally wide open. If he can get someone to run at him, he can then put the ball on the floor and get to the basket against fewer defenders.

What he can't afford to do is become like Sheed or Antoine Walker and harm his overall game. Knowing how much Amare loves humiliating opponents, I don't see that a serious risk.

 

[The Man In Black]

Grant Hill does provide PHX with yet another added dimension. I'm curious to see if the Spurs change it up to match or do they just turn it up, to force PHX to keep pace?

 

[devilalum]

This all sounds good, but why is Amare working on the three? Fine with me and all, but don't turn into Nowitzski on us! In transition, I would think he wants to fill the lane, not post at the three line. In the flow of the offense, I suppose he could force defenders to leave the paint to cover him at the line, which would open up room for drives by other players, but that isn't really the Suns game, is it?

Imagine Duncan having to guard Amare at the 3 point line.

If Duncan guards him out there it opens up the lane, if they switch Amare abuses some smaller player on a drive. Amare is not a great offensive rebounder anyway. My only concern would be if his fee throw attempts started to drop a lot.

Either way its just one more look to throw at teams.

 

[arwillan]

Grant Hill does provide PHX with yet another added dimension. I'm curious to see if the Spurs change it up to match or do they just turn it up, to force PHX to keep pace?

i think it would be a mistake to try and force phoenix to play like they like to play. turning up the tempo is an advantage to the suns because they have steve nash and he makes it all run 1000x better. parker is nowhere near the passer nash is, so it makes no sense for the spurs to try and compete.
the spurs are kind of like the navy, for example. they can fight in the air, on land, and at sea. the suns are more like the army, primarily land fighters. though the spurs have the ability to fight on land, it is much to their advantage to stay at sea where the suns have more trouble competing

 

[YouJustGotSUNSD]

did we just compare basketball teams to military branches?

 

[arwillan]

did we just compare basketball teams to military branches?

for sake of the argument, yes. and for sake of being drunk =/

 

[playstation]

even if amare can shoot the 3, i don't think its makes his game much better. if you go out to guard him, what's he going to do? beat you 22 feet to the rim?

i don't see 6'10'' guys do that much. your dribbling skills also need to be amazing because your center of gravity is so high (remember how amare is most prone to turnovers when he tries to drive?)

KG has the 3 in his arsenal (although he doesn't shoot it at a high %), but he takes less than 1 a game...

 

[arwillan]

mispost, sorry

 

[PetryJr]

even if amare can shoot the 3, i don't think its makes his game much better. if you go out to guard him, what's he going to do? beat you 22 feet to the rim?

i don't see 6'10'' guys do that much. your dribbling skills also need to be amazing because your center of gravity is so high (remember how amare is most prone to turnovers when he tries to drive?)

KG has the 3 in his arsenal (although he doesn't shoot it at a high %), but he takes less than 1 a game...

It might not be useful in some situations, but I can definitely see how it can help sometimes. Against a team like the Spurs, that takes away the Suns' 3-pointers and at the same time manages to guard the basket very well, Amaré (if he can hit the shot at a 35%+ clip) would force the Spurs to make a decision. Do they put a big on him that far from the basket or not? If they leave him open, he'll make them pay. If they put Oberto, Elson or some other big guarding him, it's going to increase opportunities for LB, Hill and Nash to drive to the basket.

Also, if Amaré can hit the three well, that might help Diaw when they're playing together. Every once in a while, Diaw will have the opportunity to work in the paint more, like he did two years ago.

As long as he doesn't fall in love with the shot, I definitely welcome this new weapon.

 

[mribnik]

Amare is not the type of player that is going to give up his game completely and start taking a ton of threes. It's just an added dimension to his game. I saw him use it effectively for team USA. The defender allowed him to take a three thinking he couldn't make it, but Amare swished it. A few plays later the defender guarded Amare out to the 3-point line, Amare pump-faked and drove by his man and kicked it out for a wide-open shot. Having Amare on the perimeter a few times a game will add a new look and make spacing much better. It might even help get Diaw to work with Amare better.

Amare is not going to abandon his inside game and start jacking up five threes a game. Amare loves contact and he loves punishing the other team inside. I believe Amare has worked on his dribbling a lot as well.

 

[The Man In Black]

Just remember that the FIBA arc is 20' 6 inches. The NBA 3 point line is further back.

 

[PetryJr]

Just remember that the FIBA arc is 20' 6 inches. The NBA 3 point line is further back.

Yeah, but the corner three is not very different, and the difference probably isn't enough to turn an effective shot into an ineffective one. Plus, Amaré's been practicing NBA threes, not FIBA threes.

 

[mribnik]

Just remember that the FIBA arc is 20' 6 inches. The NBA 3 point line is further back.

Both threes he made in the tournament were long range threes, not corner threes. His form is almost perfect and he's been practicing it quite a bit. D'Antoni thinks he can shoot it between 35% and 40% so I'm not really worried about his range.

 

[PetryJr]

Both threes he made in the tournament were long range threes, not corner threes. His form is almost perfect and he's been practicing it quite a bit. D'Antoni thinks he can shoot it between 35% and 40% so I'm not really worried about his range.

I'm pretty sure that one of the threes was from the corner.

 

[mribnik]

I'm pretty sure that one of the threes was from the corner.

Yeah, I actually realized that after my post. The other was a buzzer beater I believe from extended range. He clearly has the range on his shot to shoot it from anywhere.

 

[azirish]

IMHO, if Amare hits above 40% of his threes, he'll start taking more threes and fewer mid range shots. If he is in the 35% range, I'd say he'll take only a few.

 

[PetryJr]

Well, if Amaré hits more than 40% of his threes, then he'd become one of the elite shooters in the league. That, coupled with his fantastic ability to finish inside, would make him a totally unique player.

 

[azirish]

Well, if Amaré hits more than 40% of his threes, then he'd become one of the elite shooters in the league. That, coupled with his fantastic ability to finish inside, would make him a totally unique player.

He is an unique player.

In any case, it is hard to imagine anyone contesting his threes, at least for a while. Few three point shooters are left wide open, so they may not be as hard as taking his mid range shots assuming his stroke is consistent.

 

[YouJustGotSUNSD]

If he can get his quickness/explosion back to pre-micro days, having a 6'10 beast that can shoot the 3 or blow by you and finish inside would be freakin insane.

 

[dodie53]

amare at the 3pt line will benefit diaw who plays at the post..

 

[overseascardfan]

Imagine Duncan having to guard Amare at the 3 point line.

If Duncan guards him out there it opens up the lane, if they switch Amare abuses some smaller player on a drive. Amare is not a great offensive rebounder anyway. My only concern would be if his fee throw attempts started to drop a lot.

Either way its just one more look to throw at teams.

Unless they put Elson or Oberto on him and keep Duncan in the paint. Amare shooting 3's doesn't help it just makes our #1 ranked C a PF. People are saying criticizing Jermaine O'Neal for becoming a jump shooter and soft while Amare is going to start doing the same. This will also have a negative impact on our offensive rebounding with Amare on the perimeter instead of the paint. I am all for Diaw and Marion becoming 3 pt shooters because they are natural SF's.

 

[mribnik]

Unless they put Elson or Oberto on him and keep Duncan in the paint. Amare shooting 3's doesn't help it just makes our #1 ranked C a PF. People are saying criticizing Jermaine O'Neal for becoming a jump shooter and soft while Amare is going to start doing the same. This will also have a negative impact on our offensive rebounding with Amare on the perimeter instead of the paint. I am all for Diaw and Marion becoming 3 pt shooters because they are natural SF's.

You are assuming that Amare is going to turn into Jermaine O'Neal. He is not. It's not like Amare is down in the paint on EVERY possession anyways. I mean, how many times did people on this board complain that Amare didn't get enough touches last year. It's just one more thing another team has to gameplan against, assuming Amare continues to shoot it well.