Suns trade for Elfrid Payton

[Mainstreet]

I have hope in Knight--he is the veteran PG we're looking for. He was terrible last year, but he's a real NBA player, unlike many of the guys have shown this year. If his job is secure as the starting PG, I think that would do wonders for his confidence and performance. I think a healthy Ulis is an adequate backup. I'd also like Doncic but think Knight would still be getting solid minutes if the Suns grabbed Doncic if they are truly trying to compete.

Knight would have to earn the starting PG position. I worry if Knight begins the season as the starting PG (because he is a veteran) he might have mixed feelings giving the job up later. I do not want him to have a sense of entitlement. It's not good for him and it's not good for the Suns. If he beats out the competition to be the starter so be it.

He seems to be in a good place right now. I saw him smiling and genuinely happy during the last game. I haven't seen this in a long time. It made me feel good... like he really wants to be a part of the team going forward. I want it to remain this way... a sense of team over role.

In regard to Payton, I do not have confidence he should be the starting PG next season. As JC says, I would prefer Knight over Payton. However, if the Suns draft a quality PG and he is ready to start, I do not want another player standing in front of him. If the Suns ask Knight to be the backup, I want him to accept this role.

 

[Raze]

I was all for taking a shot at Payton. He was cheap and why not?

After our trial run, I'd say no thanks.

First of all, he seems to care as much about playing as he does cutting his hair. Both are unacceptable.

Second, and I don't have the stats on this, I would suspect that the team passes per possession is down since we got him. Going off of memory I remember the ball traveling more fluidly through our offensive possessions. I think at one point we were top 10. Now, the ball seems to stop in Payton's hands. I actually have more confidence when Josh or Davon are bringing the ball up in full court than I do Payton.

I know he hasn't had a full team to work with, but I just don't see a solid reason to keep him hear. I'm more comfortable with Ulis at back up than Elfrid.

 

[JCSunsfan]

I was all for taking a shot at Payton. He was cheap and why not?

After our trial run, I'd say no thanks.

First of all, he seems to care as much about playing as he does cutting his hair. Both are unacceptable.

Second, and I don't have the stats on this, I would suspect that the team passes per possession is down since we got him. Going off of memory I remember the ball traveling more fluidly through our offensive possessions. I think at one point we were top 10. Now, the ball seems to stop in Payton's hands. I actually have more confidence when Josh or Davon are bringing the ball up in full court than I do Payton.

I know he hasn't had a full team to work with, but I just don't see a solid reason to keep him hear. I'm more comfortable with Ulis at back up than Elfrid.

He started out well, and then just quit. I don't know what the issue was. But whatever. He had a chance. This is a contract year. If he cannot find the motivation to compete now, I don't know why he should later. If he is just trying to get out of Phoenix, with poor play so the Suns won't extend him a QO offer and make him a FA. Well goodbye to that too. Maybe he thinks he will make more if he just becomes a FA.

 

[BC867]

He started out well, and then just quit. I don't know what the issue was. But whatever. He had a chance. This is a contract year. If he cannot find the motivation to compete now, I don't know why he should later. If he is just trying to get out of Phoenix, with poor play so the Suns won't extend him a QO offer and make him a FA. Well goodbye to that too. Maybe he thinks he will make more if he just becomes a FA.

I agree that Payton has disappointed since his triple-double. But, in all fairness, the issue is that he is playing on a team that is trying to lose as many games as possible. The worst player you can do that to is your Point Guard, whose success is based on the players around him. That is the issue! The consequence of tanking. The draft will reveal if it was worth it.

 

[JCSunsfan]

I agree that Payton has disappointed since his triple-double. But, in all fairness, the issue is that he is playing on a team that is trying to lose as many games as possible. The worst player you can do that to is your Point Guard, whose success is based on the players around him. That is the issue! The consequence of tanking. The draft will reveal if it was worth it.

Honestly. I do not think they are TRYING to lose those games and Payton could be dominanting in this moment if he wanted to. Its pretty clear he is not even trying. I, like you, really wanted to give him the benefit of the doubt when he got here. But his play has been horrible. And the team has much worse with him on the floor than when he is not. There is no way that is a good sign, and I cannot see any logical reasons for it except his poor play. If anything, Payton has been our best tanking strategy.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I agree that Payton has disappointed since his triple-double. But, in all fairness, the issue is that he is playing on a team that is trying to lose as many games as possible. The worst player you can do that to is your Point Guard, whose success is based on the players around him. That is the issue! The consequence of tanking. The draft will reveal if it was worth it.

Let’s look at the evidence:

1. Payton’s numbers for Orlando were mediocre for his entire career

2. Orlando, an awful team starving for talent gave him up for a mid (not even our top) 2nd round pick

3. He had a VERY brief spurt of production for the suns

4. He has played for the suns for what, 20 games?

5. He sucks again

6. He is in a contract year so he has the highest personal motivation possible to play his very best - his livelihood.

Seems a LOT more likely a reversion to form than any result of tanking. When you have two answers to a question the more obvious one is typically the right one. Here the two options are:

1. Payton is not very good

2. Payton decided to stop playing because of the apparently all-consuming tank

#1 has a lot of evidence based in the facts

#2 is pure conjecture and speculation

I’m guessing the VAST majority of people will lean #1. And they are probably right.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Let’s look at the evidence:

1. Payton’s numbers for Orlando were mediocre for his entire career

2. Orlando, an awful team starving for talent gave him up for a mid (not even our top) 2nd round pick

3. He had a VERY brief spurt of production for the suns

4. He has played for the suns for what, 20 games?

5. He sucks again

6. He is in a contract year so he has the highest personal motivation possible to play his very best - his livelihood.

Seems a LOT more likely a reversion to form than any result of tanking. When you have two answers to a question the more obvious one is typically the right one. Here the two options are:

1. Payton is not very good

2. Payton decided to stop playing because of the apparently all-consuming tank

#1 has a lot of evidence based in the facts

#2 is pure conjecture and speculation

I’m guessing the VAST majority of people will lean #1. And they are probably right.

I think it's safe to say at this point with that trade, we got what we paid for.

doubling down and giving him a long-term deal will just show the team has learned nothing from the Brandon Knight situation.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

Let’s look at the evidence:

1. Payton’s numbers for Orlando were mediocre for his entire career

2. Orlando, an awful team starving for talent gave him up for a mid (not even our top) 2nd round pick

3. He had a VERY brief spurt of production for the suns

4. He has played for the suns for what, 20 games?

5. He sucks again

6. He is in a contract year so he has the highest personal motivation possible to play his very best - his livelihood.

Seems a LOT more likely a reversion to form than any result of tanking. When you have two answers to a question the more obvious one is typically the right one. Here the two options are:

1. Payton is not very good

2. Payton decided to stop playing because of the apparently all-consuming tank

#1 has a lot of evidence based in the facts

#2 is pure conjecture and speculation

I’m guessing the VAST majority of people will lean #1. And they are probably right.

While agree that the first 5 games or so were a flash in the pan. I don’t agree that his play of late is a reversion to form. He has been well below his career numbers for 10 games now averaging just 7/4. That goes beyond reversion and is closer to shut down. It simply seems like he lost motivation and that is indeed weird and concerning considering the contract year and all.

 

[JCSunsfan]

While agree that the first 5 games or so were a flash in the pan. I don’t agree that his play of late is a reversion to form. He has been well below his career numbers for 10 games now averaging just 7/4. That goes beyond reversion and is closer to shut down. It simply seems like he lost motivation and that is indeed weird and concerning considering the contract year and all.

That is fair.

 

[Hoop Head]

I'm disappointed that Payton has me hoping that Knight can revert back to the player he was in Milwaukee. I didn't think I'd look forward to seeing Knight play for the Suns again but perhaps he can be effective next year. Certainly can't get worse than what we've seen at PG this season. As a Suns fan we've been spoiled by seeing All-Star level PG play for almost the last 30 years, from KJ to Kidd to Marbury to Nash to Dragic and Bledsoe and now we're stuck with G-League talent.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

I'm disappointed that Payton has me hoping that Knight can revert back to the player he was in Milwaukee. I didn't think I'd look forward to seeing Knight play for the Suns again but perhaps he can be effective next year. Certainly can't get worse than what we've seen at PG this season. As a Suns fan we've been spoiled by seeing All-Star level PG play for almost the last 30 years, from KJ to Kidd to Marbury to Nash to Dragic and Bledsoe and now we're stuck with G-League talent.

I am willing to give Knoght one more chance for only three reasons. First because he costs a lot of money and will almost certainly be on the roster next year. Second is because I am curious to see how he performs under the new coach. Lastly is simply because we just don't have a better option than him right now unless we draft a PG high in the draft (Doncic or Young probably being the only ones that could possibly outperform Knight next season).

 

[JCSunsfan]

I am almost wishing we end up with Trae in this draft because of the pg situation on the team. He can shoot, he can distribute. He would provide gravity. But then we need a big.

I think we are pretty much guaranteed the opportunity to get Trae. Certainly one of Ayton, Trae, or Bagley will be available when we pick.

 

[pokerface]

I am almost wishing we end up with Trae in this draft because of the pg situation on the team. He can shoot, he can distribute. He would provide gravity. But then we need a big.

I think we are pretty much guaranteed the opportunity to get Trae. Certainly one of Ayton, Trae, or Bagley will be available when we pick.

I'd hope we'd get Doncic before Young.

 

[Errntknght]

And here I was worried that Payton might ruin our tank! I'm inclined to just forget him and let Harrison and Ulis run the point the rest of the year. Ulis has had one good game in row now, so I have slight hopes for him again. I'm more hopeful for Harrison who looks good on defense and doesn't turn the ball over much. Canaan is a free agent but it appears he wants to have another shot and he looked good enough to warrant it. Let the three of them duke it out for the back up slot next year - but forget Ulis if he doesn't show strong the rest of the year.
I haven't been happy with Triano's use of Reed this year, nor of Peters. He's had the perfect opportunity to give them all the PT they can handle but he's been miserly with it. Granted I'm dealing with scanty information but it's hard to imagine what he might be thinking.
I do think that the Suns should make an effort to get a PG in the draft as long as it is not at the expense of one of the good bigs - I put Bamba in that category, FWIW.

 

[JCSunsfan]

I'd hope we'd get Doncic before Young.

Yeah. Well. I have already said my bit on Doncic.

 

[Mainstreet]

I'd hope we'd get Doncic before Young.

According to the mocks but otherwise I'm not so sure.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Um. Has anyone else seen this?

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[Mainstreet]

Are we sure it is Payton's hair?

Why not get the haircut during the season when he could show what he could do.

I do think Payton has the talent to be a starting PG minus that hairdo.

 

[JCSunsfan]

BTW. This might be legit. This guy is in Orlando and Elfrid has been there before. He is supposedly friends with these guys.

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[Mainstreet]

BTW. This might be legit. This guy is in Orlando and Elfrid has been there before. He is supposedly friends with these guys.

Some of the comments on instagram seem to indicate it is Payton... for what is is worth.