The Ayton Plan

[Bufalay]

It’s lesser Kobe and Bynum. Despite what anyone here says, Booker just isn’t close to the player Kobe was. Kobe’s considered one of the top 10-15 players of all time. Booker is considered in and out of the top 10-15 players in the league right now.

Bynum is a good comp for Ayton though.

Bynum was an all-star with better stats than ayton when he was 24. His career was over shortly after that though.

 

[Muggz]

lol DA when he gets the ball under the rim.

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[Treesquid PhD]

Yeah… I kinda just made the same point in the game thread.

That said, Payne MIGHT be okay as a starting PG. Book and KD are going to be the primary playmakers and Payne does seem to play better as a starter for some bizarre reason. That said, the sample size isn’t huge there so I can see being dubious at that idea.

Agree 99% with you and E. As a season ticket holder, I usually show up 90 mins before the game. Payne works very hard, I really enjoy watching him work, he is amazing to watch uncontested. He is too sporadic in his decision making in games to be a one. However, I do appreciate his work ethic, DA's on the other hand is the exact opposite, he reminds me of a boss girl who sucks at their job and blames the system, he takes about 15 dribbles turn arounds, while dropping any pass tossed harder than 8 mph, Mark Bryant (I think that's the big coach) is trash he needs to go, I don't care how much you loved him back in the day, he basically never challenges his hands, he floats every pass to him like a grandfather to a small child, they might as well pull out a Tball Tee. Then Ayton proceeds to go to half court and lob granny style half court shots for 10 minuets.

So, all this BS about Ayton being motivated or soon to be a hard dunker is folly or you are a University of Robert Sarver graduate and have a bias. It is never going to happen. I am not saying he is a bad player because he isn't, but he isn't about ball. My comp. is not Bynum, it is Robert Nkemdiche. Robert is really smart and a nice guy, I met him while rehabbing at the Fischer institute, cool dude, smart, and the eye test is amazing he has muscles from his neck to ankles, but he doesn't take sports seriously at all, and the other NFL players bully him, I watched Peat from NOLA bully him. That is DA, he is learning how to say the right things but he will never do them.

I agree with the trade option, with KD and Book, you need a PG replacement for Paul, there is some team willing to part with a good point, there always are teams willing to do that.

 

[Treesquid PhD]

This belongs in the Ayton thread. Tells you everything you need to know about him.

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Good lord did he just watch a bunch of Jim Morrison interview's from the 1960's?

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[clyde2tw]

In the offseason, maybe we can trade DA to Pacers for Turner and some of their young assets + picks

 

[Finito]

Agree 99% with you and E. As a season ticket holder, I usually show up 90 mins before the game. Payne works very hard, I really enjoy watching him work, he is amazing to watch uncontested. He is too sporadic in his decision making in games to be a one. However, I do appreciate his work ethic, DA's on the other hand is the exact opposite, he reminds me of a boss girl who sucks at their job and blames the system, he takes about 15 dribbles turn arounds, while dropping any pass tossed harder than 8 mph, Mark Bryant (I think that's the big coach) is trash he needs to go, I don't care how much you loved him back in the day, he basically never challenges his hands, he floats every pass to him like a grandfather to a small child, they might as well pull out a Tball Tee. Then Ayton proceeds to go to half court and lob granny style half court shots for 10 minuets.

So, all this BS about Ayton being motivated or soon to be a hard dunker is folly or you are a University of Robert Sarver graduate and have a bias. It is never going to happen. I am not saying he is a bad player because he isn't, but he isn't about ball. My comp. is not Bynum, it is Robert Nkemdiche. Robert is really smart and a nice guy, I met him while rehabbing at the Fischer institute, cool dude, smart, and the eye test is amazing he has muscles from his neck to ankles, but he doesn't take sports seriously at all, and the other NFL players bully him, I watched Peat from NOLA bully him. That is DA, he is learning how to say the right things but he will never do them.

I agree with the trade option, with KD and Book, you need a PG replacement for Paul, there is some team willing to part with a good point, there always are teams willing to do that.

21/9
10/9
28/17
23/8
19/9
22/7

Yeah what a bum against the Pelicans . Bottom line we don’t win that series without Ayton

Robert Nkmdiche are you F’ing serious? That dude was absolute train wreck of a bust.

I can’t wait till Ayton leaves and gets with actual coaches who can develop talent.

 

[Hoop Head]

21/9
10/9
28/17
23/8
19/9
22/7

Yeah what a bum against the Pelicans . Bottom line we don’t win that series without Ayton

Robert Nkmdiche are you F’ing serious? That dude was absolute train wreck of a bust.

I can’t wait till Ayton leaves and gets with actual coaches who can develop talent.

While allowing Jonas to put up...

18/25 (not mistyped either 25 rebounds)
10/13
6/11
26/15
17/14
10/8

Don't blame the coaches for Ayton's poor play. Those coaches also helped develop Anthony Davis. You're literally blaming someone who won Coach of the Year and finished second place another year for Ayton's lack of development though, which is hilarious.

I can't wait until Ayton fails elsewhere and maybe then you'll admit you overrated him.

 

[sdscard4]

234 pages on this guy. My god

 

[sdscard4]

I think just seeing that I've realized ...he is what he is...never gonna get over that hump

 

[Hoop Head]

I think just seeing that I've realized ...he is what he is...never gonna get over that hump

Which would be fine if he didn't think he was a max player and get it.

 

[Carolinacacti]

At least he stays in shape, it could be worse way worse.....

 

[Cheesebeef]

While allowing Jonas to put up...

18/25 (not mistyped either 25 rebounds)
10/13
6/11
26/15
17/14
10/8

Don't blame the coaches for Ayton's poor play. Those coaches also helped develop Anthony Davis. You're literally blaming someone who won Coach of the Year and finished second place another year for Ayton's lack of development though, which is hilarious.

I can't wait until Ayton fails elsewhere and maybe then you'll admit you overrated him.

Monty also helped develop Joel Embiid.

No one can teach fire and desire. Ayton just doesn’t have those things burning inside him the way NBA greats do. How anyone can argue that at this point is bizarre.

 

[BirdGangThing]

Monty also helped develop Joel Embiid.

No one can teach fire and desire. Ayton just doesn’t have those things burning inside him the way NBA greats do. How anyone can argue that at this point is bizarre.

I have to agree. Ayton has the pure physical talent to murder others on the court but couldn't dominate a daffodil

 

[Carolinacacti]

If Monty is the same person in games and practices, I doubt he develop anyone.

 

[Phrazbit]

If Monty is the same person in games and practices, I doubt he develop anyone.

I wish he had more fire but he gets way too bad a rap here.

We've got guys succeeding here in larger roles than they failed in other places. We've had guys like Booker, Bridges and Johnson grow substantially with each season.
Craig, Payne, Okogie... 3 guys who were barely able to stay on a roster before Monty started coaching them.

IMO, he's been pretty good at putting players in spots to succeed.

Ayton's so mercurial that it is only in his direction that we've seen Monty express some real rage.

Monty might prove not be the Xs and Os guy that we need in big moments but he sure has done a helluva lot to shape the players into pros who work together.

 

[Sparky16]

Agree 99% with you and E. As a season ticket holder, I usually show up 90 mins before the game. Payne works very hard, I really enjoy watching him work, he is amazing to watch uncontested. He is too sporadic in his decision making in games to be a one. However, I do appreciate his work ethic, DA's on the other hand is the exact opposite, he reminds me of a boss girl who sucks at their job and blames the system, he takes about 15 dribbles turn arounds, while dropping any pass tossed harder than 8 mph, Mark Bryant (I think that's the big coach) is trash he needs to go, I don't care how much you loved him back in the day, he basically never challenges his hands, he floats every pass to him like a grandfather to a small child, they might as well pull out a Tball Tee. Then Ayton proceeds to go to half court and lob granny style half court shots for 10 minuets.

So, all this BS about Ayton being motivated or soon to be a hard dunker is folly or you are a University of Robert Sarver graduate and have a bias. It is never going to happen. I am not saying he is a bad player because he isn't, but he isn't about ball. My comp. is not Bynum, it is Robert Nkemdiche. Robert is really smart and a nice guy, I met him while rehabbing at the Fischer institute, cool dude, smart, and the eye test is amazing he has muscles from his neck to ankles, but he doesn't take sports seriously at all, and the other NFL players bully him, I watched Peat from NOLA bully him. That is DA, he is learning how to say the right things but he will never do them.

I agree with the trade option, with KD and Book, you need a PG replacement for Paul, there is some team willing to part with a good point, there always are teams willing to do that.

DA passes the eye test, until you actually see him play. He dont give a S. He has zero fight in him. He play BB because he is 7tf and thats it

 

[Finito]

Monty also helped develop Joel Embiid.

No one can teach fire and desire. Ayton just doesn’t have those things burning inside him the way NBA greats do. How anyone can argue that at this point is bizarre.

Who’s arguing that Ayton can be an all time great? Oh that’s right nobody

Matter fact who’s even arguing Ayton is ultra competitive? Oh that’s right nobody

This is one of the reasons I just laugh at this point. The fact you can’t see anywhere in between all time great and Robert Nkmdiche

Embiid was already all NBA and an All star before Monty spent his 1 year in Philly that was an embarrassing reach even for you

Feel free to go play the victim now. Can’t wait to read your script lol

 

[AZ Native]

DA passes the eye test, until you actually see him play. He dont give a S. He has zero fight in him. He play BB because he is 7tf and thats it

Well, got what he wanted. A 2nd contract.

 

[Finito]

I wish he had more fire but he gets way too bad a rap here.

We've got guys succeeding here in larger roles than they failed in other places. We've had guys like Booker, Bridges and Johnson grow substantially with each season.
Craig, Payne, Okogie... 3 guys who were barely able to stay on a roster before Monty started coaching them.

IMO, he's been pretty good at putting players in spots to succeed.

Ayton's so mercurial that it is only in his direction that we've seen Monty express some real rage.

Monty might prove not be the Xs and Os guy that we need in big moments but he sure has done a helluva lot to shape the players into pros who work together.

This post is just wrong.

Bridges and Cam really plateaued here. Honestly I thought well that’s just who Bridges is. He was really inconsistent here on offense and even his defense took a huge step back this year. His defensive rating fell off a cliff this year

And then he got traded and has freaking sky rocketed doing things and playing like I never even imagined he could. I thought ok he’s gonna come back down to earth but he hasn’t.

Cam Payne had 1 good year 3 years ago and has been the definition of inconsistent ever since. He’s regressed since our finals run. I have no idea what to expect from him when he checks in at this point.

Craig is who he is. A quality role player he hasn’t developed into anything. He’s always been that guy.

I really like Okogie but he’s far from a finished product. I think he has great potential

Let’s not forget guys like Stix and Holiday who Monty wouldn’t invest in cause he fell in love with Nadar and Shamet.

Monty hasn’t shown the ability to develop talent at all

 

[Cheesebeef]

Who’s arguing that Ayton can be an all time great? Oh that’s right nobody

I was stating my opinion on what keeps him from being great. Never intimated anyone here said he was great.

Matter fact who’s even arguing Ayton is ultra competitive? Oh that’s right nobody

See above.

This is one of the reasons I just laugh at this point. The fact you can’t see anywhere in between all time great and Robert Nkmdiche

Huh? I never mentioned anything about Nkmdiche. Are you okay?

Embiid was already all NBA and an All star before Monty spent his 1 year in Philly that was an embarrassing reach even for you

If you say so.

Feel free to go play the victim now. Can’t wait to read your script lol

Lol… you’re unhinged about Ayton dude.

 

[Mainstreet]

This post is just wrong.

Bridges and Cam really plateaued here. Honestly I thought well that’s just who Bridges is. He was really inconsistent here on offense and even his defense took a huge step back this year. His defensive rating fell off a cliff this year

And then he got traded and has freaking sky rocketed doing things and playing like I never even imagined he could. I thought ok he’s gonna come back down to earth but he hasn’t.

Cam Payne had 1 good year 3 years ago and has been the definition of inconsistent ever since. He’s regressed since our finals run. I have no idea what to expect from him when he checks in at this point.

Craig is who he is. A quality role player he hasn’t developed into anything. He’s always been that guy.

I really like Okogie but he’s far from a finished product. I think he has great potential

Let’s not forget guys like Stix and Holiday who Monty wouldn’t invest in cause he fell in love with Nadar and Shamet.

Monty hasn’t shown the ability to develop talent at all

As you previously noted, there is room for some middle ground. Ayton is still a top ten center.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

This post is just wrong.

Bridges and Cam really plateaued here. Honestly I thought well that’s just who Bridges is. He was really inconsistent here on offense and even his defense took a huge step back this year. His defensive rating fell off a cliff this year

And then he got traded and has freaking sky rocketed doing things and playing like I never even imagined he could. I thought ok he’s gonna come back down to earth but he hasn’t.

Cam Payne had 1 good year 3 years ago and has been the definition of inconsistent ever since. He’s regressed since our finals run. I have no idea what to expect from him when he checks in at this point.

Craig is who he is. A quality role player he hasn’t developed into anything. He’s always been that guy.

I really like Okogie but he’s far from a finished product. I think he has great potential

Let’s not forget guys like Stix and Holiday who Monty wouldn’t invest in cause he fell in love with Nadar and Shamet.

Monty hasn’t shown the ability to develop talent at all

Agree with all this. Monty was good for a bunch of young guys. Getting them focused and playing at maturity levels befitting older draftees (other than Ayton, in age and maturity). But he hasn’t really ascended any players imo.

 

[Treesquid PhD]

21/9
10/9
28/17
23/8
19/9
22/7

Yeah what a bum against the Pelicans . Bottom line we don’t win that series without Ayton

Robert Nkmdiche are you F’ing serious? That dude was absolute train wreck of a bust.

I can’t wait till Ayton leaves and gets with actual coaches who can develop talent.

1. "Yeah what a bum against the Pelicans.": This statement seems to express a negative opinion about a player's performance against the New Orleans Pelicans. This is a subjective judgment, and others might not share the same view.
2. "Bottom line we don’t win that series without Ayton.": This statement assumes that the player Ayton was essential for winning a particular series. It is a claim that may or may not be true, but it is difficult to prove or disprove without more context and analysis.
3. "Robert Nkmdiche are you F’ing serious? That dude was an absolute train wreck of a bust.": This statement expresses a strong negative opinion about Robert Nkemdiche. It is subjective, and others might not share the same view. The language used is also informal and emotional, which might make the statement seem less rational.
4. "I can’t wait till Ayton leaves and gets with actual coaches who can develop talent.": This statement assumes that the current coaching staff is incapable of developing talent, which is a subjective judgment. It also assumes that Ayton's performance would improve under different coaching, which may or may not be true.

Overall, the text contains subjective opinions and assumptions, and the language used is informal and emotional. While it may not necessarily contain logical fallacies, it might not be considered entirely rational due to the subjective nature of the claims and the lack of supporting evidence. - GPT4

 

[Superbone]

As you previously noted, there is room for some middle ground. Ayton is still a top ten center.

You have to admit though that there's a huge drop off after the top 2 or 3 with Embiid and Jokic being clearly a head above the rest.

 

[Cheesebeef]

You have to admit though that there's a huge drop off after the top 2 or 3 with Embiid and Jokic being clearly a head above the rest.

And that there’s guys like Giannis who are also big men but don’t play Center that also dwarf Ayton.