The Cardinals and a FRANCHISE QB

[desertdawg]

OT It is too bad Shanahan never taught Cutler to not throw picks in the red zone.

For real. I can't believe they have the record they do this year.

 

[BigRedMO]

Didn't Haynesworth just lay down on a play live on Monday Night Football? While the other team scored a TD because of no pass rush by the Skins?
That is unmanageable. He humiliates himself.

He was a stud in TN so if Shanahan decided he wasnt going to work in DC why not try to trade him and convince people he is the TN Haynesworth? You only hurt his trade value if you publicly humiliate him the way they did in preseason saying he couldnt walk across the street without passing out. Why would you want to show case him that way by turning it into a national issue if you would like to trade him? Maybe they couldnt trade him but that treatment doesnt help his value any.

 

[Divide Et Impera]

1) Kolb - I have stated on here that we need to find our Schaub/Cassel type QB and here he is
2) Palmer - Kurt was resurrected here, Palmer would be too and he's both younger and better than Kurt was at the time that Kurt came here
3) Rookie - If this is our route, I'm in the "Trade Fitz camp" and this would be a sayanora to the NFC West Champion annual contendership, but I'm fine with that

 

[desertdawg]

He was a stud in TN so if Shanahan decided he wasnt going to work in DC why not try to trade him and convince people he is the TN Haynesworth? You only hurt his trade value if you publicly humiliate him the way they did in preseason saying he couldnt walk across the street without passing out. Why would you want to show case him that way by turning it into a national issue if you would like to trade him? Maybe they couldnt trade him but that treatment doesnt help his value any.

If your point is Shanny should have traded him from the get I am with you.

To me he is and acts like a Randy Moss but at his own position. Can make big plays and big contracts, but its never a bad time to trade him.

 

[Russ Smith]

OT It is too bad Shanahan never taught Cutler to not throw picks in the red zone.

Yeah Cutler reminds me more and more of Jake every season. He's got a much better arm but the same issue he never seems to learn from mistakes. he doesn't get that throwing the ball away is the right play sometimes.

 

[Russ Smith]

My point was meant to be about the pattern with Shanahan. I am so beyond discussing Plummer. We have disagreed on this before and we just have to agree to disagree about Plummer.

Sure and I get that I'm just pointing out that story can be taken both ways. It can be taken as a pattern with shanahan (Plummer, McNabb) or it can be taken as a pattern with Jake(Shanahan, Trestman).

Haynesworth do people not remember this is the same guy who intentionally stomped on the face of an opponent a few years ago? Shanahan isn't the first coach to have issues with him. I think he handled it poorly, but he was just reminding the player look I'm the coach, you're the player, I'm not going to change my defense because you don't like playing NT.

He doesn't have a lot of tact(Shanahan) he never has, but he's always been a good coach. Terrible GM, not good at hiring DC's, but a very good coach.

 

[john h]

I just saw the particulars on McNabbs new deal (Urbans Blog).

came out today with the crucial piece of info that the Redskins owe McNabb only a $3.5 million bonus this year and then another option bonus next offseason. It means the Redskins, if they don’t like how McNabb plays the rest of the year, can cut him after the season with no problem.

Yes Bulger only signed a one year contract with the Ravens.

You still haven't name what other big time winning QB will be a FA next year. I wasn't thrilled with how the Cards handled Warners contract but in the end they paid him.

Just listening to Chris Mortensen. He was explaining how the McNabb deal made sense for both McNabb and the Redskins. If there is a lockout then Donivan is covered. Washington on there part can trade him or just pay 3.5 mil. Surely they would get much more value than the 3.5 mil on a trade.

One guy that has jumped out of the woodwork who looks very good is Colt McCoy. I watched him play this week and he sure looked like an NFL QB to me. Other NFL coaches are saying the same thing. He is only 6' tall but very quick. Sort of a poor mans Vick. He may end up holding on to that spot in the lineup. Bradford is living up to his expectations as the best QB in the draft. We will get a dose of him soon enough. The Cowboys seemed to have got their magic back but much to late.

 

[The Commish]

Of the teams currently in the cellar, only three would take a QB that high (AZ, SF and BUF). Buffalo appears to have the #1 wrapped up and would most likely take Luck if he comes out. I'm not a Mallett or Locker fan at this point.

The guy I would definitely target is Palmer. I think he's on his way out in CIN, along with Marvin Lewis, and after watching him for a few games I believe he's finally starting to get healthy again. He'd bring leadership and stability to the position, plus he seems like a Whiz guy.

 

[conraddobler]

Does anybody have ANY faith that we will ever draft a QB worth a crap?

I mean if we drafted Peyton Manning he'd convert religions and leave on a personal journey of discovery before camp, that's how our luck goes in terms of drafting QB's.

The last QB we drafted that was any good was Neil Lomax.

We drafted Lomax and Hart, other than that, it's a wilderness out there as to QB's this team has drafted.

So I say we need to look at trades here.

Either that or we're due for a combination of Elway, Montana and Unitas all rolled into one.

The best QB we ever drafted refused to sign with us, guess who that was?

 

[az jam]

Of the teams currently in the cellar, only three would take a QB that high (AZ, SF and BUF). Buffalo appears to have the #1 wrapped up and would most likely take Luck if he comes out. I'm not a Mallett or Locker fan at this point.

The guy I would definitely target is Palmer. I think he's on his way out in CIN, along with Marvin Lewis, and after watching him for a few games I believe he's finally starting to get healthy again. He'd bring leadership and stability to the position, plus he seems like a Whiz guy.

I like Palmer but why would the Bengals trade him since they have no one waiting in the wings to take his place. His backup is his brother Jodan and the 3rd string qb is rookie Dan LeFevour who was cut by the Bears and picked up by the Bengals.

 

[The Commish]

I like Palmer but why would the Bengals trade him since they have no one waiting in the wings to take his place. His backup is his brother Jodan and the 3rd string qb is rookie Dan LeFevour who was cut by the Bears and picked up by the Bengals.

Just reading things out of Cincy that he may be the odd man out even if they don't have a replacement. Purely speculation by media and fans that he would be available for the right price.

 

[kerouac9]

It's amusing to read all these comments about how the Cards should just pick up a veteran QB and win NOW. Look, I get it. Anyone would be a little weary after the Leinart situation didn't pan out for what could be a myriad of reasons. Heck even I thought he was going to be the Cards savior back in 06.

For all you gun-shy little buckaroos out there that don't want to pick a QB again in the first round I'd like to share this info regarding just this past decade: The Jets picked Pennington in the 1st in 2000. He was good but didn't pan out due to injuries so they picked up Sanchez 9 years later...check. Atlanta picked Vick and he killed dogs so they went out and got Matt Ryan...check. Detroit picked Harrington and when he bombed they got Stafford...check. Baltimore swung and missed on Boller but that didn't stop them from taking a shot with Flaco...check.

What if all those teams had said?: (In a whining voice) I'm too scared to take a QB with a high pick again.

As far as Kolb goes I just want to ask?: How long have many of you been Cards fans to actually think they will do what is necessary, including giving up a HIGH 1st rounder and a 3rd, to get him? I wouldn't mind that scenario but the Bidwills will never allow that to happen.

The way to go about this off-season IMHO is to dump DA. Move Hall to the practice squad (so what if someone else gets him) and keep Skelton. Next, go out and sign a veteran like Bulger for insurance and then with your very high 1st round pick: GET A FRANCHISE QB!

1) Pennington was good for the Jets. He won a passing title one year and I think he took them to the playoffs twice. It's that his arm is/was made of overcooked spaghetti.

2) You can't just take a QB and say, "Yeah, that's my guy for the next 10 years." You have to find the right fit. There wasn't a huge consensus that Kyle Boller was going to be a great QB; turns out he failed at the NFL level.

3) Do you really want to point the finger at Stafford being the solution to the Lions' ills? He's going on injured reserve after his third separated shoulder in two years. It seems that the team leading Detroit to success is Shaun Hill, who was... wait for it... it's going to be delicious... a VETERAN FREE AGENT PICKUP.

 

[kerouac9]

I'll add that I don't really like Kolb. I think he's a system quarterback and I don't think we want to run the WCO that Philly does. He's certainly not like Big Ben or Derrick Anderson.

 

[BigRedMO]

Does anybody have ANY faith that we will ever draft a QB worth a crap?

I mean if we drafted Peyton Manning he'd convert religions and leave on a personal journey of discovery before camp, that's how our luck goes in terms of drafting QB's.

The last QB we drafted that was any good was Neil Lomax.

We drafted Lomax and Hart, other than that, it's a wilderness out there as to QB's this team has drafted.

So I say we need to look at trades here.

Either that or we're due for a combination of Elway, Montana and Unitas all rolled into one.

The best QB we ever drafted refused to sign with us, guess who that was?

Hart was a FA walk on from Southern Illinois. He solved QB for near to 20 years. What a deal there.

 

[Mulli]

Does anybody have ANY faith that we will ever draft a QB worth a crap?

I mean if we drafted Peyton Manning he'd convert religions and leave on a personal journey of discovery before camp, that's how our luck goes in terms of drafting QB's.

The last QB we drafted that was any good was Neil Lomax.

We drafted Lomax and Hart, other than that, it's a wilderness out there as to QB's this team has drafted.

So I say we need to look at trades here.

Either that or we're due for a combination of Elway, Montana and Unitas all rolled into one.

The best QB we ever drafted refused to sign with us, guess who that was?

Joe Namath.

 

[Pariah]

Jake retired because the Broncos traded him to Tampa,......cant blame him, at the time Tampa was really bad....not sure I would want to relocate there either.

IIRC, Jake announced his intention to retire at least a couple of weeks before his rights were traded to Tampa. There was a thought around the league that he may actually "unretire" if he wasn't going to play for Shannahan.

 

[ajcardfan]

Out of the rookies, I like Luck the best but he would scare the hell out me if we took him top 5 or 10. Locker or Mallet? NO THANKS! Jake Locker is outrageously overrated IMO. I've seen less of Mallet, but I don't think much of his long term potential either.

 

[conraddobler]

I would try and get Chase Daniel from New Orleans, he would be cheap and he's light years better than what we have, he'd work.

 

[The Commish]

Out of the rookies, I like Luck the best but he would scare the hell out me if we took him top 5 or 10. Locker or Mallet? NO THANKS! Jake Locker is outrageously overrated IMO. I've seen less of Mallet, but I don't think much of his long term potential either.

Luck is the real deal. I would trade the farm to get him.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

3) Do you really want to point the finger at Stafford being the solution to the Lions' ills? He's going on injured reserve after his third separated shoulder in two years. It seems that the team leading Detroit to success is Shaun Hill, who was... wait for it... it's going to be delicious... a VETERAN FREE AGENT PICKUP.

I don't really want that kind of "success" Shaun Hill is leading Detroit to. He stinks and they stink.

 

[Seandonic]

1) Pennington was good for the Jets. He won a passing title one year and I think he took them to the playoffs twice. It's that his arm is/was made of overcooked spaghetti.

2) You can't just take a QB and say, "Yeah, that's my guy for the next 10 years." You have to find the right fit. There wasn't a huge consensus that Kyle Boller was going to be a great QB; turns out he failed at the NFL level.

3) Do you really want to point the finger at Stafford being the solution to the Lions' ills? He's going on injured reserve after his third separated shoulder in two years. It seems that the team leading Detroit to success is Shaun Hill, who was... wait for it... it's going to be delicious... a VETERAN FREE AGENT PICKUP.

1) How is what you said any different than what I said? I said, "Pennington was good but didn't pan out due to injuries." You said, "He was good but didn't pan out due to a weak arm. The point is he didn't pan out so the Jets moved on and picked another franchise QB when they got the chance. If you were just trying to expound on what I said then, good job.

2) I never said you should just blindly grab a QB just because he is a high pick. I assumed a logical person would read what I said and realize that OF COURSE the team that chooses him will pick a guy they feel has the talent to not only fit their current system but maybe even lead the team to a new way of doing things. Those types of transcendent QB's are usually found at the top of round one. By the way, let me restate that over the past decade there were seven K. Boller like busts taken in the 1st round compared to 15 good to great ones. I don't know about you but I like those odds.

3) I never said Stafford was the solution to the lions ills. I said he was a talented QB taken with a high pick. One of the many reasons for the Lions ills though is that their putrid offensive line can't keep their very talented QB upright.
And furthermore, if you think that S. Hill is a "delicious" veteran free agent pickup, then all I can assume is that you've gotten used to the taste of garbage that the Cards have been feeding you and the rest of us loyal fans for the past...wait for it...40 years.

Look, we all want the same thing. For the Cards to be a consistently successful organization. I guess your way and my way might differ, but I sure hope one of us is right.

 

[cardpa]

Seems our HC has a lot of personality conflicts with NFL QB's........... just saying.

Boy that thought has gone through my head more than once. One could say Whiz is not the type of coach to develop QBs even though he may think he is.

 

[moklerman]

Don't want to start a new thread but I'm curious if anyone considered my suggestion of Sage Rosenfels?

Maybe he's just a journeyman but I think he's got the potential to be like Gannon in that he just needs a chance to be in the right system as the #1 guy. Sage's got prototypical size, good arm, above average mobility...I think he would be a good chance to take with upside.

 

[Garthshort]

mokelman's description of Sage Rosenfels, sounds an awful lot like Derek Anderson.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

Don't want to start a new thread but I'm curious if anyone considered my suggestion of Sage Rosenfels?

Maybe he's just a journeyman but I think he's got the potential to be like Gannon in that he just needs a chance to be in the right system as the #1 guy. Sage's got prototypical size, good arm, above average mobility...I think he would be a good chance to take with upside.

He is what he is, a decent backup QB. Of course that's better than what we have right now but to think he's all of a sudden going to come in alight things up is being overly optimistic.