The Cards' Draft Dilemma

[Mitch]

Which comes first the OLB/DE or the CB?

Which scenario would YOU prefer?

1. CB Dom Rodgers-Cromartie, CB Troy McKelvin, CB Mike Jenkins or CB Aquib Talib (#16) and OLB/DE Cliff Avril, OLB/DE Philip Merling (if he slides or OLB/DE Shawn Crable (#50)

2. OLB/DE Quentin Groves, OLB/DE Derrick Harvey (#16) and CB Tracy Porter, CB Antoine Cason (if he slides), CB Brandon Flowers (if he slides), or CB Reggie Smith (#50).

The combo that excites me the most is OLB/DE Quentin Groves (#16) and CB Antoine Cason (#50)...although, both may be well gone...but...it could, however, work out like a charm.

My rankings for #16:

1. OLB/DE Quentin Groves, Auburn
2. CB Dom Rodgers-Cromartie, Tennessee St.
3. OLB/DE Derrick Harvey, Florida
4. CB Mike Jenkins, South Florida
5. CB Aqib Talib, Kansas.

Thus if Groves is there...I'd take him first...etc.

 

[Heucrazy]

Niether. RB 1st then CB 2nd. Or vice versa.

OLB/DE is far from a glaring need with 4 guys ready for 2 positions.

 

[DKCards]

Bpa

 

[WildBB]

Niether. RB 1st then CB 2nd. Or vice versa.

OLB/DE is far from a glaring need with 4 guys ready for 2 positions.

I'm in that camp. What if Edgerrin goes down? You want JJ or a 3rd rounder in there! They're going to sign Chillar. Then we'll have two incumbents and two solid b/u's third down guys.

 

[joeshmo]

Cards Draft Dilemma - Dont waste a 3rd rounder.

 

[Shane]

Bpa

No such thing

 

[DaisyCutter]

Which comes first the OLB/DE or the CB?

Which scenario would YOU prefer?

1. CB Dom Rodgers-Cromartie, CB Troy McKelvin, CB Mike Jenkins or CB Aquib Talib (#16) and OLB/DE Cliff Avril, OLB/DE Philip Merling (if he slides or OLB/DE Shawn Crable (#50)

2. OLB/DE Quentin Groves, OLB/DE Derrick Harvey (#16) and CB Tracy Porter, CB Antoine Cason (if he slides), CB Brandon Flowers (if he slides), or CB Reggie Smith (#50).

The combo that excites me the most is OLB/DE Quentin Groves (#16) and CB Antoine Cason (#50)...although, both may be well gone...but...it could, however, work out like a charm.

My rankings for #16:

1. OLB/DE Quentin Groves, Auburn
2. CB Dom Rodgers-Cromartie, Tennessee St.
3. OLB/DE Derrick Harvey, Florida
4. CB Mike Jenkins, South Florida
5. CB Aqib Talib, Kansas.

Thus if Groves is there...I'd take him first...etc.

It depends on the player. If a top-shelf pass rusher is available #16 (like Harvey or Gholston), then I'd be all over it. If it's a second-tier DE like Merling, I'd be more inclined to pass. I think that Quentin Groves would be wildly over-drafted at #16.

Basically, if Gholston and Harvey are off the board at #16th overall and one of the top 3 OTs didn't fall (Long, Williams, or Clady), and neither of the Top 3 CBs are available (Rogers-Cromartie, McKelvin, or Jenkins), then I'd look to trade down.

If I couldn't even trade down at a discount (say, a 2009 second rounder and a 2008 3rd along with a 2008 first), then I'd take the best running back available.

I wouldn't go near Merling, Talib or Groves with the #16 overall pick.

Philosophically, I think that when in doubt you take a pass rusher over a cornerback.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

Niether. RB 1st then CB 2nd. Or vice versa.

OLB/DE is far from a glaring need with 4 guys ready for 2 positions.

Agreed...Stewart and Cason please.

 

[WildBB]

Philosophically, I think that when in doubt you take a pass rusher over a cornerback.

Ding-ding-ding, we have a winner. Then why not Groves? He is just as good a rusher as Harvey. Size?

 

[WildBB]

Agreed...Stewart and Cason please.

I'm all over that!

 

[DaisyCutter]

Then why not Groves? He is just as good a rusher as Harvey. Size?

I honestly don't think that Groves is that valuable. I think that, relative to what will be available, if Harvey's there, he's a better value. If Harvey's gone, then there are going to be better players available that went in Harvey's place.

Just as an example, Scouts, Inc. rates Harvey the 15th overall prospect in the draft. It rates Groves 35th. I'm not saying that Scouts, Inc.'s word is gospel, but I think that would be the consensus.

I think that both will be solid players, but I think that Harvey is going to develop more quickly into a contributor than Groves will. Groves also has some injury history that's troubling.

 

[BigShtank]

We need a CB way more than another linebacker, especially since it looks like Chillar will sign once the Fitz deal is finalized. CB and RB in the first two rounds only please.

 

[WildBB]

We need a CB way more than another linebacker, especially since it looks like Chillar will sign once the Fitz deal is finalized. RB and CB in the first two rounds only please.

Fixed that for ya.

 

[Garthshort]

Rb

I thought that Rod Graves said that we'd probably select a RB on Day One.

 

[BigShtank]

Fixed that for ya.

Don't care the order, just that we get the two, although RB first is the better option if Stewart or Mendenhall are there, in that order.

 

[Pariah]

If we're throwing BPA out the window, we need to get a CB this year. If we got a pass rusher in the draft, he likely wouldn't start. I think a 1st rd corner would.

A pass rusher is banking on the future because both Berry and Okeafor are probably gone or relegated to situational roles in the years to come. A CB will help more now.

JMHO

 

[DaisyCutter]

I thought that Rod Graves said that we'd probably select a RB on Day One.

He said that we'd address the RB situation in the draft. People have suggested that it would be Day one, but that hasn't been verified.

Personally, I think they will address it on day one, but who knows?

 

[Duckjake]

I still don't get passing on Adrian Peterson last year only to take a RB in the first round this year. There is no RB as good as all day in this draft. Oh well nothing we can do about it now.

I'm for shoring up the defense asap. The Cards have gone offense in the first round in 4 of the last 5 years. Time to look for some more playmakers for Pendy.

 

[WildBB]

I still don't get passing on Adrian Peterson last year only to take a RB in the first round this year. There is no RB as good as all day in this draft. Oh well nothing we can do about it now.

I'm for shoring up the defense asap. The Cards have gone offense in the first round in 4 of the last 5 years. Time to look for some more playmakers for Pendy.

Yeah , but that doesn't mean much (more 1st rounders on O). Last year our next two picks were on the D.

If we go RB,CB,OL and DL this year, that's still good balance. With the D unit returning more healthy, they'll be fine.

 

[Skkorpion]

Not to kill the thread, I trust Whisenhunt to make the correct call, based on his opinions of our players, not our opinions.

Yes, he is an offensive coach. One who learned and operated in a Cowhur system where defense dominated and defined the Steelers.

I think Whisenhunt will go defense 2 out of our first 3 picks, with a RB the only possible deviation from an all-defense 3 out of 3 picks in rounds 1 through 3.

Not taking a RB in either round 1 or 2 would shock me and would run counter to everything we've been told by Whisenhunt, Graves and Darren Urban.

That's my reading of the indicators.

 

[DaisyCutter]

Yeah , but that doesn't mean much (more 1st rounders on O). Last year our next two picks were on the D.

If we go RB,CB,OL and DL this year, that's still good balance. With the D unit returning more healthy, they'll be fine.

Except one of those picks didn't even make the team in Buster Davis. Alan Branch contributed almost less than nothing (though I have a sincere hope for much, much more this season). It doesn't matter how many later picks you use if the just keep sucking. We used first day picks on Daryl Blackstock, too. That's worked out.

It can't be avoided that as much as we all love the talent we've assembled on defense (Adrian Wilson, Gabe Watson, and Karlos Dansby are my particular faves), they've stunk. Hoping that all 11 men on the defensive unit will be healthy and productive doesn't make sense.

Bertrand Berry's career is over. We can't depend on anything from him. We lost one of our five-best defensive players from last season to free agency in Calvin Pace. Chike Okeafor hopefully can be healthy for 16 games.

The defensive puzzle is nowhere near complete, because they've played terribly. Baltimore put up 26 on our defense. Vinny Testaverde lit us up to the tune of 25 points after signing with the Panthers the previous Wednesday.

Clancy Pendergast isn't going anywhere for a while. The Cards--for whatever reason--believe in him. If it's not the system, then it's the players. Trying the same thing over and over and expecting different results is the definition of insanity.

 

[WildBB]

Not to kill the thread, I trust Whisenhunt to make the correct call, based on his opinions of our players, not our opinions.

Yes, he is an offensive coach. One who learned and operated in a Cowhur system where defense dominated and defined the Steelers.

I think Whisenhunt will go defense 2 out of our first 3 picks, with a RB the only possible deviation from an all-defense 3 out of 3 picks in rounds 1 through 3.

Not taking a RB in either round 1 or 2 would shock me and would run counter to everything we've been told by Whisenhunt, Graves and Darren Urban.

That's my reading of the indicators.

Not necessarily if they want this guy. Whom they interviewed at the combine.

http://pittsburghpanthers.cstv.com/sports/m-footbl/mtt/mcglynn_mike00.html

http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/profile.php?pyid=9328

 

[WildBB]

Except one of those picks didn't even make the team in Buster Davis. Alan Branch contributed almost less than nothing (though I have a sincere hope for much, much more this season). It doesn't matter how many later picks you use if the just keep sucking. We used first day picks on Daryl Blackstock, too. That's worked out.

It can't be avoided that as much as we all love the talent we've assembled on defense (Adrian Wilson, Gabe Watson, and Karlos Dansby are my particular faves), they've stunk. Hoping that all 11 men on the defensive unit will be healthy and productive doesn't make sense.

Bertrand Berry's career is over. We can't depend on anything from him. We lost one of our five-best defensive players from last season to free agency in Calvin Pace. Chike Okeafor hopefully can be healthy for 16 games.

The defensive puzzle is nowhere near complete, because they've played terribly. Baltimore put up 26 on our defense. Vinny Testaverde lit us up to the tune of 25 points after signing with the Panthers the previous Wednesday.

Clancy Pendergast isn't going anywhere for a while. The Cards--for whatever reason--believe in him. If it's not the system, then it's the players. Trying the same thing over and over and expecting different results is the definition of insanity.

They we're 9th in total defense before Wilson,Berry and Green went down. And Chike Okeafor didn['t play one down. I disagree that they sucked. They were ravaged.

Disagree that Berry and Okeafor are washed up too.

 

[DaisyCutter]

Not necessarily if they want this guy. Whom they interviewed at the combine.

http://pittsburghpanthers.cstv.com/sports/m-footbl/mtt/mcglynn_mike00.html

http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/profile.php?pyid=9328

We already have a young right guard in Deuce Lutui. That's the position that McGlynn played. We never talked to Levi Brown at all through the draft process. Maybe we talked extensively with Buster Davis. That didn't work out well.

They we're 9th in total defense before Wilson,Berry and Green went down. And Chike Okeafor didn['t play one down. I disagree that they sucked. They were ravaged.

Disagree that Berry and Okeafor are washed up too.

Well, it must have been because the defense was so good that they allowed 26 points to the Baltimore Ravens (their second-highest scoring total on the season), 25 points to the Carolina Panthers (9 points over their average PPG last year), and 20 points to a San Francisco offense that wouldn't score 20 points again until November--when they scored 37 against--wait for it--the Arizona Cardinals.

I never said that Okeafor was washed up. I said you didn't know what to expect from him this season. You can assert that Berry's not washed up, but there's a reason he reduced his base salary 75% and hasn't completed a 16 game schedule in two years.

The last two seasons, the Cards have been in the Bottom 10 in the NFL in scoring defense. Hoping that the entire defensive unit can stay healthy (and that Antrel Rolle or Aaron Francisco are improvements at FS) is not a plan to improve a defense that--whether you like it or not--hasn't been able to stop opposing teams when they needed to.

 

[HookemCards]

We already have a young right guard in Deuce Lutui. That's the position that McGlynn played. We never talked to Levi Brown at all through the draft process. Maybe we talked extensively with Buster Davis. That didn't work out well.



Well, it must have been because the defense was so good that they allowed 26 points to the Baltimore Ravens (their second-highest scoring total on the season), 25 points to the Carolina Panthers (9 points over their average PPG last year), and 20 points to a San Francisco offense that wouldn't score 20 points again until November--when they scored 37 against--wait for it--the Arizona Cardinals.

I never said that Okeafor was washed up. I said you didn't know what to expect from him this season. You can assert that Berry's not washed up, but there's a reason he reduced his base salary 75% and hasn't completed a 16 game schedule in two years.

The last two seasons, the Cards have been in the Bottom 10 in the NFL in scoring defense. Hoping that the entire defensive unit can stay healthy (and that Antrel Rolle or Aaron Francisco are improvements at FS) is not a plan to improve a defense that--whether you like it or not--hasn't been able to stop opposing teams when they needed to.

Yeah, I agree. Its why the inactivity in FA on the defensive side is so frustrating. We need at least 5 new players, some starters, some key reserves. Depending on getting that from the draft is ludicrous. Get a DE, OLB, and CB in FA before you close up shop for the year. Smith and Dockett will wear down as the game and season wears on. Our current nickle back is Adams. Berry may be able to provide a little of pass rush but if he is pushed into starting duty he'll be injured quickly. We don't know how well Okeafor will play since he missed the entire year.

There are still a few depth, and possibly starting players left, but as far as I can tell we haven't even talked to them about coming to visit.