The front office and Graves, why are they getting a pass.

[Cbus cardsfan]

Can someone please tell me what they did withe 35+ mill that came off the book by not re-signing Dansby and Rolle, Warner retiring, and Chike/Gandy's/ Berry's contract running out? They signed Joey to a ridiculoulsy bad contract and brought in Faneca, Lenon and DA, all guys no one else wanted. That still only uses up about 1/3 to 1/2 of that money.If you want to look at why this teams stinks look no further than the self proclaimed be all/end all when it comes to football decisions, Rod Graves. Factor in the savings of Cutting ML and there's even more money. The talent Graves gave Whiz, and I know Whiz has input, is a 4-6 win team and that's what we're seeing. A strong GM would never have let this happen. It's funny how a strong personnel man, like Bill Polian, finds a way to keep his best players. You don't see Manning,Clark, Freeney, Wayne, or Bob Sanders hitting the open market. The Cards let 4 of their 6 best player from last year walk away for nothing in a NFC that is easily winnable,and the NFC West is ridiculously easy to win.

I find it hard to find any good personnel moves that Graves has made. Other than Fitz, who held him over a barrel by hitting incentives, he hasn't signed a 1st round pick to 2nd contract that I can remember. The guy is Matt Millen bad. Sure he can re-sign lower ournd drafted guys that out-perform their draft status but when has he kept a star. The only reason Warner didn't leave is he also had Grave over the barrel. That fiasco still could have ended up with Warner in SF.

 

[Cheesebeef]

i'm just tired of bashing Graves. Got tired of it 3 years ago. There's no point to it anymore, especially since it looks like there's ZERO chance of it ever changing.

 

[kerouac9]

Coach Whiz has control of the 53-man roster. He's who I blame for the QB problems, which is the heart of this team's issues.

The players came into camp on time. The draft picks have more or less been solid. Can't complain about that.

It's not enough to say, "Why didn't we bring in a better QB?" or "Where is the pass rusher?" Who would you have rather seen? Understanding the Cards' free agency philosophy, I think that this team is better personnel-wise than what we're seeing here.

A four-game losing streak isn't on the front office; a four-game losing streak is on the coaching staff.

 

[Zeno]

Good question.

I've never been a Graves fan but backed off on my criticisms of him but every one of your points is valid.

 

[Duckjake]

Coach Whiz has control of the 53-man roster. He's who I blame for the QB problems, which is the heart of this team's issues.

The players came into camp on time. The draft picks have more or less been solid. Can't complain about that.

It's not enough to say, "Why didn't we bring in a better QB?" or "Where is the pass rusher?" Who would you have rather seen? Understanding the Cards' free agency philosophy, I think that this team is better personnel-wise than what we're seeing here.

A four-game losing streak isn't on the front office; a four-game losing streak is on the coaching staff.

And too many old guys on defense maybe? Does any other team in the NFL start 6 guys over 30?

But when the players are giving a half azz effort it really doesn't matter how old they are or what the coaches are doing. This team was at the Post Office this afternoon buying stamps.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

Coach Whiz has control of the 53-man roster. .

That's not what Graves has said, and if in fact that is the case, what purpose does Graves serve? Do you think Polian is letting JIm Caldwell tell him who is on the roster? He may get his input but he has the final say. Plus, there is no way Whiz is, in any way, in charge of contract negotiations. Whiz is a HC, like all HC's, he thinks he can win with almost any talent. They are egotistical like that.To me that's one main reason they don't get the final say in personnel. A strong GM puts the roster together and the coach coaches them.

 

[Buckybird]

Welcome to Big Red football Cbus!!!

1)We suck at signing FA's from other teams 9 out of 10 times. That falls on the GM.

2)We continue to let many of our best players leave to other teams. That falls on the GM & owner

3)The owner stuffs $ millions $ in his pockets for fear of a lockout. That falls on ownership

Breaston, Branch, THT, Fitz, Lutui, Watson, etc must be licking their chops at the $$$ that lies ahead!!! I wonder how many will be here in just 2 short seasons? Maybe things haven't changed so much from our fathers Cardinals!!!

 

[Chopper0080]

And too many old guys on defense maybe? Does any other team in the NFL start 6 guys over 30?

But when the players are giving a half azz effort it really doesn't matter how old they are or what the coaches are doing. This team was at the Post Office this afternoon buying stamps.

The defense isn't too old, they are just playing bad and being put into bad spots. Over the past two weeks Adrian Wilson has found himself lined up across from Percy Harvin and Mike Williams. This is a problem with the scheme and the coach. In the past two weeks we have seen players on opposing teams make critical catches while covered by multiple Cardinals. This is a case where the players are playing bad.

In the end it comes down to fear, and none of our players are playing with any sort of fear.

 

[Cheesebeef]

and where's all those extensions people were yapping about when defending why we spent zero money in the off-season while saving a ton?

 

[LarryStalling]

might only be one season Bucky

 

[Cheesebeef]

Coach Whiz has control of the 53-man roster. He's who I blame for the QB problems, which is the heart of this team's issues.

The players came into camp on time. The draft picks have more or less been solid. Can't complain about that.

It's not enough to say, "Why didn't we bring in a better QB?" or "Where is the pass rusher?" Who would you have rather seen? Understanding the Cards' free agency philosophy, I think that this team is better personnel-wise than what we're seeing here.

A four-game losing streak isn't on the front office; a four-game losing streak is on the coaching staff.

this is only true if the FO gave Wiz complete autonomy on the QB situation and we've seen it reported that a) they wouldn't let him go after Bulger and B0 would it shock anyone if they didn't go after McNabb because of money and because, well, making a move that big just isn't in our DNA?

 

[LarryStalling]

Do you really want to extend the pile of crap from today?

 

[Snakester]

Graves put this mess on the field and let the other players go. He has to be made accountable for his mistakes. If anyone of us costed our employers millions and put out a mess for a product we would be fired.

 

[Duckjake]

Coach Whiz has control of the 53-man roster. He's who I blame for the QB problems, which is the heart of this team's issues.

The players came into camp on time. The draft picks have more or less been solid. Can't complain about that.

It's not enough to say, "Why didn't we bring in a better QB?" or "Where is the pass rusher?" Who would you have rather seen? Understanding the Cards' free agency philosophy, I think that this team is better personnel-wise than what we're seeing here.

A four-game losing streak isn't on the front office; a four-game losing streak is on the coaching staff.

K9 you are the guy who turned me on to Next Man Up. How can you read that and believe that CKW has control over who is available to put on the 53 man roster? Especially when you are dealing with the Bidwills.

Or are you saying that the Cards haven't made poor personnel choices but instead the talent is being misused or has been "lost" by the coaching staff?

 

[kerouac9]

That's not what Graves has said, and if in fact that is the case, what purpose does Graves serve? Do you think Polian is letting JIm Caldwell tell him who is on the roster? He may get his input but he has the final say. Plus, there is no way Whiz is, in any way, in charge of contract negotiations. Whiz is a HC, like all HC's, he thinks he can win with almost any talent. They are egotistical like that.To me that's one main reason they don't get the final say in personnel. A strong GM puts the roster together and the coach coaches them.

A strong GM (which we don't have) has decisions over the 80 man roster that the team takes to camp. But the head coach almost always has control over the 53-man roster the team takes into the regular season. It was widely reported that Coach Whisenhunt had expanded personnel authority written into his contract extension this winter.

It's rare for a General Manager worth his salt to say, "Let's get older on defense this offseason." Pardon me if I'm fairly sure that spending the bulk of our free agent money on ex-Steelers wasn't Rod Graves' idea.

this is only true if the FO gave Wiz complete autonomy on the QB situation and we've seen it reported that a) they wouldn't let him go after Bulger and B0 would it shock anyone if they didn't go after McNabb because of money and because, well, making a move that big just isn't in our DNA?

They wouldn't let him go after Bulger after the draft, when we'd guaranteed Anderson $7 million and had $10 million invested in #7. We had traded a starting cornerback for a choice used on a third quarterback and signed a UDFA. What teams bring 5 QBs to training camp? Whiz apparently really wanted Charlie Whitehurst, too. Does that give you more faith that he could identify a good player with both hands and a map?

Jurecki has reported that no one in the organization was that hot for McNabb, and certainly weren't going to give up a pick for him.

K9 you are the guy who turned me on to Next Man Up. How can you read that and believe that CKW has control over who is available to put on the 53 man roster? Especially when you are dealing with the Bidwills.

Or are you saying that the Cards haven't made poor personnel choices but instead the talent is being misused or has been "lost" by the coaching staff?

I haven't read Next Man Up, although I just bought it used and am excited for it to arrived based on your recommendation.

I don't believe that Coach has complete control over who is available to put on the 53 man roster, but I do think that he has control over who makes the 53-man roster.

People took choosing Max Hall over #7 as an article of faith in a coaching staff who'd had unprecedented success with this franchise. They took cutting Cody Brown without him playing a single NFL down the same way. They accepted the idea of going into the regular season with only 3 OLBs thinking that this coaching staff knew what it was doing.

Even Mike Singletary has control over who makes his final 53. Some high profile GMs even have control over that, but not many.

There weren't a lot of people here freaking out that the Cards didn't go out and spend $50 million in guaranteed money the first week of free agency. The product on the field is not like the Carolina Panthers or Buffalo Bills. There is a talented enough group here to compete. The coaching staff is at fault for not designing an offense to suit the personnel (who they wanted--from Alan Faneca to Brandon Keith to Levi Brown), and for not putting their defensive personnel in positions to succeed.

 

[conraddobler]

You can't be this far under the cap and put out this dog squeeze and get a free pass.

I don't know exactly who's at fault but it ALWAYS rolls UPHILL in situations like these, because decisions made on high and at the coaching staff level on this team are NFL caliber challenged to say the least.

Everyone gets a flub or two, these guys toss them out by the dozen.

I don't care who's tired of hearing about Rod Graves being the problem, in my book if you aren't part of the solution, you are part of the problem, to me if the shoe fits him he needs to lace it up.

 

[Duckjake]

I haven't read Next Man Up, although I just bought it used and am excited for it to arrived based on your recommendation.

You're kidding? I could have sworn you were the poster who recommended that book. Next Man Up is one of the best football books I've ever read.

Feinstein is one awesome writer; his golf books are a must read for anyone who has ever played the game.

 

[kerouac9]

You're kidding? I could have sworn you were the poster who recommended that book. Next Man Up is one of the best football books I've ever read.

Feinstein is one awesome writer; his golf books are a must read for anyone who has ever played the game.

No. I know I pushed people here to read The Blind Side by Michael Lewis when that came out. I also really want to read A Few Seconds of Panic by Stephen Fatsis, but I never got around to locating it (I gave it to my brother as a Xmas present last year and he never finished it).

 

[Duckjake]

No. I know I pushed people here to read The Blind Side by Michael Lewis when that came out. I also really want to read A Few Seconds of Panic by Stephen Fatsis, but I never got around to locating it (I gave it to my brother as a Xmas present last year and he never finished it).

Yeah ever since then I've been looking for an enormous Tackle that I can adopt and steer to the Longhorns. They sure as heck need it.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

Yeah ever since then I've been looking for an enormous Tackle that I can adopt and steer to the Longhorns. They sure as heck need it.

C'mon Duck, you know you'd pull a Cecil Newton and tell Mack that it's going to take more than scholarship to get him to UT .

 

[BigRedMO]

Can someone please tell me what they did withe 35+ mill that came off the book by not re-signing Dansby and Rolle, Warner retiring, and Chike/Gandy's/ Berry's contract running out? They signed Joey to a ridiculoulsy bad contract and brought in Faneca, Lenon and DA, all guys no one else wanted. That still only uses up about 1/3 to 1/2 of that money.If you want to look at why this teams stinks look no further than the self proclaimed be all/end all when it comes to football decisions, Rod Graves. Factor in the savings of Cutting ML and there's even more money. The talent Graves gave Whiz, and I know Whiz has input, is a 4-6 win team and that's what we're seeing. A strong GM would never have let this happen. It's funny how a strong personnel man, like Bill Polian, finds a way to keep his best players. You don't see Manning,Clark, Freeney, Wayne, or Bob Sanders hitting the open market. The Cards let 4 of their 6 best player from last year walk away for nothing in a NFC that is easily winnable,and the NFC West is ridiculously easy to win.

I find it hard to find any good personnel moves that Graves has made. Other than Fitz, who held him over a barrel by hitting incentives, he hasn't signed a 1st round pick to 2nd contract that I can remember. The guy is Matt Millen bad. Sure he can re-sign lower ournd drafted guys that out-perform their draft status but when has he kept a star. The only reason Warner didn't leave is he also had Grave over the barrel. That fiasco still could have ended up with Warner in SF.

You make the assumption that Bidwill would allow him to spend that money. Bidwill routine is to put together a couple good years and then pull back on salary and just live off the winning years for a couple years and then start to rebuild with cheap rookies. That is his MO. You have to be willing to wait 10 years.

 

[BigRedMO]

Welcome to Big Red football Cbus!!!

1)We suck at signing FA's from other teams 9 out of 10 times. That falls on the GM.

2)We continue to let many of our best players leave to other teams. That falls on the GM & owner

3)The owner stuffs $ millions $ in his pockets for fear of a lockout. That falls on ownership

Breaston, Branch, THT, Fitz, Lutui, Watson, etc must be licking their chops at the $$$ that lies ahead!!! I wonder how many will be here in just 2 short seasons? Maybe things haven't changed so much from our fathers Cardinals!!!

Warner was Bidwill MO (cheap washed up guy like Anderson) Bidwill just hit the lottery with him. No one saw it coming. The Cards made the Super Bowl beause of that jackpot but they wont ever be back as long as Bidwill continues with current MO. Lightning doesnt strike twice in my lifetime.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

Warner was Bidwill MO (cheap washed up guy like Anderson) Bidwill just hit the lottery with him. No one saw it coming. The Cards made the Super Bowl beause of that jackpot but they wont ever be back as long as Bidwill continues with current MO. Lightning doesnt strike twice in my lifetime.

Maybe Bidwill should hire this guy :

http://www.wftv.com/news/24611949/detail.html

 

[Buckybird]

Maybe Bidwill should hire this guy :

http://www.wftv.com/news/24611949/detail.html

Or gives back Pottsville's 1925 title.
I took this pic in the HOF in 2007...very weird we still claim it.

 

[Indiana Hoosier]

Lots and Lots of "EMPTY SEATS NEXT YEAR", HEY DO YOU GET THE MESSAGE, DUMBO!