The Knights of Nee

[cardfaninfl]

Now that our 3rd round pick hasn’t made the active roster; for anyone to say that this is a huge failure for the front office, or the fault of Rod Graves in particular, is TOTALLY RIDICULOUS.

Come on Knights of Nee (you know who you are!), take the blinders off! Crap happens, deal with it, move on.


My first reactions to the news Buster Davis was released: shame on the player for not taking advantage of an opportunity, concern that the coaches were unable to motivate the player and good for the organization for cutting their losses.

Past my initial emotions, I considered the news unimportant compared to the excitement of a new season.

But then I read this post.........

My anger comes from the assumption this person is someone in the FO. If this is true, it confirms my fears. The people in charge of this organization don't get it!

Instead of attempting to find a solution to a (continuing) problem, lets try to sweep it under the rug and in the process lets deflect the real issue by insulting people who care enough to question us and then explain everything by using the intelligent answer of "Stuff Happens".

To not question the FO for obvious defecientcies and to attempt to discredit fans who live and breathe this team, is more than TOTALLY RIDICULOUS.

A Front Office that "gets it" would be questioning:

How did WE miss a serious flaw in a player we drafted on the first day?
Why couldn't OUR coaching staff light a fire under this guy?
What can WE do to make sure this embarrassment never happens again?

And for the record, I am now the Knight who says..."Ekki-Ekki-Ekki-Ekki-PTANG. Zoom-Boing. Z'nourrwringmm.

 

[az1965]

I agree with Garth.

Everyone has the right to their opinion, but the heat-level of the rage toward the front office concerns me. Why so much venom? There is coaching to be done and games to be played, yet there seems to be this compulsion to launch grenades at management. (It makes me wonder what other individual personal issues are being played out here)

To paraphrase Bill Parcells - "the grocery shopping has been done. It's time to cook the meal." It doesn't matter "who did what" or "who said what to whom." There are brats to cook up on the tailgate grill and games to be won.

What's wrong with you? How can there be individual personal issues here???? Go ahead keep supporting suckiness...

 

[RedLine]

No, I do not work for the Cardinals, never have, and probably never will. And I didn’t stay at HIE either. I’ve been a Cards fan since they moved here. It’s good to have a home team to support. Best thing to happen to Arizona football fans ever.

I read the local media, listen to the local radio jocks, monitor this forum and the Cards site, and go to games. After a while, it’s not too hard to learn to separate the BS and opinions from some semblances of truth.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Please, please, please.. if you are going to start banning people for calling others out do so. The flaming is getting crazy.

Sorry I have been busy watching the Suns and P&R. I heavily enforce the debate the topic not the poster. If you see flaming then shoot me a PM and I will deal with it.

Thanks,
Chris

 

[RedLine]

It's rare I am tempted to ban someone on their first post but you win the big prize.

We do NOT call out other posters here. Period. Your allusion to Monty Python wasn't funny and it isn't welcome.

Who did I call out? Did you see any posters names mentioned in my post?
If you took my post personally and felt offended, then I apologize.

To me, this is an example of an inappropriate attack on a poster:

More like the Knights of the Knee High Men. Graves is the founding member. He decided to pick Buster in the third round due to his stature. He had spent a whole bunch of time under B.Bidwills desk to get this pick. It was a Graves pick from the get go. He was hoping it would pan out but it did not.

BTW nidan and 40 year are also founding members of the knights of the knee high men. Thats why they show so much love to their leader Sir. Roderick Graves.


Is there selective judgment goin’ on?

 

[RedLine]

Dont just paint a portion of the picture then leave it be. Ozzy is also a very savvy free agent participant, trades, 2nd round to 7th round, and has more pro bowlers to his name then any other active GM currently working.

Joe, do you suppose that when the Ravens blow a pick, the local fan board erupts with calling for Newsome’s head?

To everyone:
Some people like to tell us that Graves has been in charge for some years now. It’s not true; he was just given that title this year, and no one outside the team knows exactly what his responsibilities are.

His history with the team is as follows:
Hired as Assistant to the President (Bill Sr.) to administer player contracts.
Later was given cap management responsibility.
Still later was put in charge of the scout team and made a VP (not GM)
Denny was in charge of players, but of course Graves had to make the cap work.
(I could look up the years each of these things happened, but I’ll have to leave it for later, or for others.)

I don’t think that Graves claim to fame has ever been “talent evaluator”. In fact, I don’t believe he has picked players at all. I believe the coaches pick the players, and Graves gives the coaches the cap slotting available. Prove me wrong.

Funny how some people think that a pick that’s looking good is due to Denny, but a bum pick is due to Graves. Which one is it? It ain’t both.

 

[RedLine]

Now we see the "same 'ol, same 'ol" results of retaining Graves. I'm just surprised that some fans were surprised by this admission of failure.

Jeff, how do you know it’s Graves?

Nobody here knows how much power Graves wielded each year, or what limitations he has had to work under. I just don’t believe it’s right to attack a man for things that you don’t actually know are under his control. If you work for me and you screw up, I will call you out. But if you work for someone else, I will let your boss know, it’s not for me to decide if you did your job.

I am not a Graves apologist. But I do believe he has been instrumental in helping to bring the Bidwill’s and Cards into the modern era of professional NFL teams that we all want to see. Michael took care of getting the stadium done, Graves took an ever increasing role in managing the team, we have what looks to be an excellent new coach, and now they are working together. I think we will start seeing the results of that this year. Go Cards!

 

[RedLine]

In my company that produces computer chips, one of the group failed to bring the chip out in the market on time and in fact badly missed the market window. There were 300+ employees, mostly engineers, working world wide on the product. When the failure happenned, the VP of the group was fired even though he was not directly working on the chip.

So, you are saying that the Cards blew a product launch and missed a market window due to a 3rd round pick washing out? Cripes!!! There might be 66,000 empty seats at the home opener! You’re right!! Heads should roll!! This is a blunder of staggering proportions!! Never ever happened before in the history of the NFL!! Not even to Ozzie Newsome!!

 

[kerouac9]

RedLine, you're acting like the release happened in a vacuum. Newsome gets the benefit of the doubt because he built a Super Bowl champion and his team was in the playoffs last season. BTW: he did all that not as "General Manager", but as VP Football Operations, which was the same title that Rod Graves held the past 5 years.

We'd all be wearied by the long list of the crimes that Rod Graves has committed against the Arizona Cardinals and their fan base. I won't repeat it here. For all of that, the Cards have performed one game better than the Millen-lead Detroit Lions franchise. You act like the Cards are the only old-school franchise in the NFL, but the Bills, Steelers, and Bengals have all managed to maintain their traditions while not putting an embarrassing product on the field. Why do you think that is?

 

[jefftheshark]

.

Jeff, how do you know it’s Graves?

Because in the press conference that announced Denny's firing, Mike Bidwill said so.

The Owners were trying to reassure us that there would not be a drop off on the improved drafting that we saw under Denny's watch. (Please note: I said improved, not perfect) Mike Bidwill said to the effect, (I'm paraphrasing) "Rod Graves input in the selection process has always been underplayed, but he was an instrumental part of the team that controlled the last 3 drafts."

If you want to look up the notes from the press conference, feel free.

JTS

 

[joeshmo]

Joe, do you suppose that when the Ravens blow a pick, the local fan board erupts with calling for Newsome’s head

I don’t think that Graves claim to fame has ever been “talent evaluator”. In fact, I don’t believe he has picked players at all. I believe the coaches pick the players, and Graves gives the coaches the cap slotting available. Prove me wrong.

No they dont call for his head becuase he has drafted plenty of other pro bowl caliber players to make it a wash.

As for the last point, to Prove you wrong. You are the one who came up with the idea that Graves doesnt make any picks so the burden of proof is in your head my man.

But I will do it anyways. How about Graves at his press confrence when given his new contract and Mikey B telling us that Graves is in charge and saying Graves was a big part of these drafts, and so on. If he isnt making the choices why the heck does he have the GM title for and why the heck did he get a 300% raise if he isnt make player personel decisions. If he is letting the coach make all of those decisions once again it is on his head becuase he is the one that hired the HC and he is the one letting the HC make these choices.

 

[joeshmo]

[ It’s not true; he was just given that title this year, and no one outside the team knows exactly what his responsibilities are

Wrong. He has played the role of GM since 2003 season. Who cares what his title said he was it was just another name for GM.

In the presser when Graves was given the new title as well as new titles for others in the organization the owners said themselves that these titles were a long time coming becuase they have already been in those rolls for some time now.

 

[Scott MS]

This is an interesting discussion. I try not to sound negative in my posts, but I try to be a realist. I have reached the point where I set low expectations for my Cardinals team hoping they will surprise me. Denny Green's first season here was the most positive I've seen in a decade. Denny talked about making the playoffs, and the team went 6-10 with two overtime losses to San Francisco and two more losses by 3 points (Atlanta and Seattle). The best part of that year (2004) is that most of the games were relatively close.

The facts surrounding this franchise since their move to Arizona are staggering. 18 seasons below .500, 1 season above .500. The last time the Cardinals had a record BETTER than 9-7 was in 1976 when they were 10-4. That's 30 years ago. For those predicting 10-6, I hope you're right, but you have to go back 30 years to see a similar performance on the field.

I am very much looking forward to each and every game this year, and I'm hoping this team will surprise me.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

www.youtube.com/watch?v=JWeqlt2KFkw&mode=related&search=


Like it says at the end, the KNights of Nee are just and fair.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

I can't believe there is even a sentence comparing Graves with Newsome. That's like comparing my golf game to Tiger Woods'. All you need to do is go back about 6 weeks and see that Newsome got an OT capable of starting from day 1 with a 5th round supp. pick(Gaither) while Rod Graves never scouted the guy. How come whenever i see George Costanza as Yankees executive on Seinfeld that it brings to mind Rod Graves as a Cards exec.?

 

[PJ1]

I can't believe there is even a sentence comparing Graves with Newsome. That's like comparing my golf game to Tiger Woods'. All you need to do is go back about 6 weeks and see that Newsome got an OT capable of starting from day 1 with a 5th round supp. pick(Gaither) while Rod Graves never scouted the guy. How come whenever i see George Costanza as Yankees executive on Seinfeld that it brings to mind Rod Graves as a Cards exec.?

The George Costanza comparison is hysterical. Was it all cotton uniforms?

 

[CtCardinals78]

I can't believe there is even a sentence comparing Graves with Newsome. That's like comparing my golf game to Tiger Woods'. All you need to do is go back about 6 weeks and see that Newsome got an OT capable of starting from day 1 with a 5th round supp. pick(Gaither) while Rod Graves never scouted the guy. How come whenever i see George Costanza as Yankees executive on Seinfeld that it brings to mind Rod Graves as a Cards exec.?

That is awesome. 5/5

 

[Goodyear Card]

So, when crap happens, the top guy pays the price. Simple.

Was he fired with a large severance package? It is my dream to be fired and given 3 or 4 years salary.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Who did I call out? Did you see any posters names mentioned in my post?

You specifically called out approximately a third of the board with your first post and did so in an agressive and arguementative way. You certainly could have put the general content of your post without the Knights of Nee thing. Of course you engendered a like response from those who felt targeted. That's why I had to step in.

All in all, I agreed with your general message, but your presentation needs to be toned down. This isn't Jim Rhomes jungle here and we try to maintain an environment that encourages discussion on all sides of a topic.

 

[jefftheshark]

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In an effort to be completely accurate, it's the "Knights Who Say Ni!"

JTS

 

[40yearfan]

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In an effort to be completely accurate, it's the "Knights Who Say Ni!"

JTS

Ni!!!!

 

[Stout]

Ni!!!!

Are you saying 'ni!' to that Rod Graves? O what times these are when passing ruffians can say 'ni!' to a Rod Graves!

 

[40yearfan]

Are you saying 'ni!' to that Rod Graves? O what times these are when passing ruffians can say 'ni!' to a Rod Graves!

ni??

 

[Gee!]

Can we just take a Ni and call this thread done already?

 

[Stout]

ni??

Are you a shrubber?