The Official QB controversyThread

[Assface]

This is true.
I always felt it was much safer to go with references to dead rock stars

At least you know they're going to stay where they are.

 

[O]

I'm still holding out for a new contract from ASFN. Stingy bastards.

You just got a new contract extension!

 

[Assface]

You just got a new contract extension!

Yeah but I've made some really great posts since then.

 

[Rats]

Matt has had quality starts as an NFL QB. He had a decent game tonight against second stringers. He still is inaccurate on his throws and makes questionable decisions under a heavy rush. Kurt had a bad half of football tonight. He is prone to having those time to time. A healthy Kurt Warner is miles ahead of Matt Leinart at this point in there development. If we have any shot at returning to the Super Bowl this season it will be because Kurt Warner is healthy most of the year and playing lights out to his 2 recievers and the defense shows up. Matt is still several starts away from being a better than avg NFL starter. He could not take this team to a Super Bowl this season by any stretch of the imagination. He is not Kurt Warner and may never be. Anyone calling for him to start after what Warner has done for the last 2 seasons (see Warrior in Dictionary his picture is there)for this football team 1. has a screw loose,2. has always been biased against Kurt or most likely highly inehbreated or on crack. We have a proven decent capable backup QB in Matt Lienart. He may be a decent starter. He is not Kurt Warner at this point in his development. Would love for him to be but he is not. He could lead a great football team (which the Cards are not) to the playoffs. As Q said Kurt is a Keeper and he can and has lifted mediocre teams to great heights. We need him healthy if there is to be a Super Bowl repeat this season.

 

[ajcardfan]

I was guessing there would be this sort of discussion about the QBs when I got back from the game. I mean how could there not be when we had hundreds of posts hysterically arguing about crap QBs like McCown and Blake? I'm looking forward to the regular season. Warner will take the field on 9/13, and I'll be cheering like hell for the TEAM to win.

Enjoy fellas, I'm not getting sucked into the insanity of this argument.

 

[O]

Yeah but I've made some really great posts since then.

I just sent you a bunch of A$FN money. That's about all I can do as far as a contract extension goes.

 

[Evil Ash]

I was guessing there would be this sort of discussion about the QBs when I got back from the game. I mean how could there not be when we had hundreds of posts hysterically arguing about crap QBs like McCown and Blake? I'm looking forward to the regular season. Warner will take the field on 9/13, and I'll be cheering like hell for the TEAM to win.

Enjoy fellas, I'm not getting sucked into the insanity of this argument.

Agreed. I'm wondering if Warner's hip injury is bothering him more than being let on though.

He looks hesitant and his ball seems to be sailing on him when he was off (which was most of tonight)

 

[ajcardfan]

Agreed. I'm wondering if Warner's hip injury is bothering him more than being let on though.

He looks hesitant and his ball seems to be sailing on him when he was off (which was most of tonight)

I thought he looked more accurate than last week, but when he was off it was high. i thought his worst bugaboo, holding onto the ball a bit too long and not securing it when hit, was what reared it's ugly head tonight. the first team O moved the ball decently with Warner, it was the fumbles by Urban and Warner that destroyed them. Not to let the line off the hook, they had a terrible game identifying the correct blitzers.

 

[Cards_Campos]

Leinart didn't lead this team to the Super Bowl last year.

Kurt Warner just signed a 2 year contract for starter money. You don't re-sign Warner and give Leinart the job for no reason. The offense has done pretty well against the 1st team of two of the best defenses in the league. Hightower even ran the ball well against the Chargers (imagine that).
He makes one bad pass and you are calling for Leinart??? WHAT A JOKE!

Couldn't have said it better myself!!! Warner threw for 31 TDs a Cardinal record and led us to the SUPER BOWL...LOL and you guys after playing vanilla offense and 2 starting WR down and its pre season....want Lienart. Wow here we go again. The same reason I left the board....People are so fickle and dont make sense. I was right last year....I said Warner will take us deep into the playoffs....Why cant that happen now since we have a good running game now too??????

 

[moklerman]

Couldn't have said it better myself!!! Warner threw for 31 TDs a Cardinal record and led us to the SUPER BOWL...LOL and you guys after playing vanilla offense and 2 starting WR down and its pre season....want Lienart. Wow here we go again. The same reason I left the board....People are so fickle and dont make sense. I was right last year....I said Warner will take us deep into the playoffs....Why cant that happen now since we have a good running game now too??????

Thanks for saving me the trouble.

 

[D-Dogg]

Couldn't have said it better myself!!! Warner threw for 31 TDs a Cardinal record and led us to the SUPER BOWL...LOL and you guys after playing vanilla offense and 2 starting WR down and its pre season....want Lienart. Wow here we go again. The same reason I left the board....People are so fickle and dont make sense. I was right last year....I said Warner will take us deep into the playoffs....Why cant that happen now since we have a good running game now too??????

Thanks for saving me the trouble.

"Past performance is not necessarily indicative of future results"


The problem in your logic here is basing this year's prognosis on what happened last year with Warner. Where you are off is that last year, Warner looked sharp in preseason, and on fire, cleanly taking the job as QB1. He delivered in the regular season and had a great year. Since then he's aged a year, and has had hip surgery, and this preseason he has NOT looked sharp, and tonight we saw some "bad Warner."

No, I don't think Matt should take his job, but not because he hasn't outplayed Kurt. He has in the preseason. But Kurt earned a bit of leeway with his play last year. Don't be disingenuous by implying that everything is hunky-dory. Clearly, Kurt isn't in the same place he was last pre-season, and neither is Matt. Matt looks to have closed the gap, and that's a GREAT thing because I'm not so sure that Kurt has another full season in him, and I'm not so sure that hip isn't going to cause us problems this year.

Matt looks every bit as sharp this year as Kurt did last year in preseason; if Kurt can recapture his mojo, we are in fantastic shape for a deep playoff run, two deep at the QB spot.

 

[O]

"Past performance is not necessarily indicative of future results"


The problem in your logic here is basing this year's prognosis on what happened last year with Warner. Where you are off is that last year, Warner looked sharp in preseason, and on fire, cleanly taking the job as QB1. He delivered in the regular season and had a great year. Since then he's aged a year, and has had hip surgery, and this preseason he has NOT looked sharp, and tonight we saw some "bad Warner."

No, I don't think Matt should take his job, but not because he hasn't outplayed Kurt. He has in the preseason. But Kurt earned a bit of leeway with his play last year. Don't be disingenuous by implying that everything is hunky-dory. Clearly, Kurt isn't in the same place he was last pre-season, and neither is Matt. Matt looks to have closed the gap, and that's a GREAT thing because I'm not so sure that Kurt has another full season in him, and I'm not so sure that hip isn't going to cause us problems this year.

Matt looks every bit as sharp this year as Kurt did last year in preseason; if Kurt can recapture his mojo, we are in fantastic shape for a deep playoff run, two deep at the QB spot.

 

[Perfectionist]

Matt looks every bit as sharp this year as Kurt did last year in preseason; if Kurt can recapture his mojo, we are in fantastic shape for a deep playoff run, two deep at the QB spot.

This is the one statement in this thread that really makes sense. I don't care who starts, I just want us to win. The really upsetting thing to me, is how this team is still taking games off. Yea, it is only preaseason but our first half performance sure reminded me of our play once we found out we were in the playoffs last year. If I am coach Whis, I am cracking the whip this year before the regular season even begins.

But to Donald's point, we are in great shape for a deep playoff run with two deep at the QB sport, if we can just stayed focused to get there.

 

[moklerman]

Matt looks every bit as sharp this year as Kurt did last year in preseason;

I know you believe you're being analytical about this and I appreciate your civility but this statement really damages your credibility.

Warner threw a grand total of 17 passes last preseason and was only in on 1 drive in each of the games. There's no comparison to how much or in what situation each has played in the last two preseasons.

Warner won a chance at the job by how he played in '07. Leinart ultimately lost the job in the '08 preseason. Warner couldn't actually "win" the job in that preseason. Leinart could only lose it.

This preseason, Warner hasn't been putting up big numbers but it certainly hasn't been because he's out of sync all alone. Urban fumbled to kill the opening drive. There were at least 4 dropped passes. There were penalties. The whole offense was unprepared to function vs. a defense that likely gameplanned for a freakin' preaseason game(according to Whis). Not to mention Urban as the #2 which is a joke. He's acceptable as a #4 vs. a favorable matchup but vs. a starting CB he's pretty overmatched.

I think Warner will look like everyone wants him to look once he starts throwing to his regular stable of targets. I saw at least 2 or 3 really good passes to Fitz tonight. Most of his passes were pretty accurate except the deep one down the middle which was underthrown. I think he forced that play because of the clock ticking down in the first half and one of the many drops on the previous play leading to a long field.

I knew there would be excitement about Leinart but it still surprises me that so many are ready to hit the panic button with Warner. I'm still excited as hell that Beanie looks so good and Hightower continues to look good. There will be a lot more play action this year and the offense is going to be better than it was in '08.

Whis has been testing the RB's, protecting the starting WR's and been running a very vanilla offense. He doesn't want to show anyone anything and he has mentioned more than once that teams are gameplanning vs. the Cardinals this preseason while he is not gameplanning them.

It is not time to worry about the offense because the real offense hasn't been displayed. Jason Wright isn't going to be in the game in the first quarter to miss a blitz pickup of Woodson from the blind side. Urban won't be in the game much, if at all, assuming the running game is as good as it looks like it will be because there won't be as many 3rd and longs. Warner won't be holding the ball, waiting for his receivers who missed on their hot routes because of a blitz.

 

[D-Dogg]

Warner threw a grand total of 17 passes last preseason and was only in on 1 drive in each of the games. There's no comparison to how much or in what situation each has played in the last two preseasons.

Warner won a chance at the job by how he played in '07. Leinart ultimately lost the job in the '08 preseason. Warner couldn't actually "win" the job in that preseason. Leinart could only lose it.

Disagree completely. You are confusing quantity with quality. While Matt looked good last year, Kurt looked great in preseason. When Matt stumbled in the Oakland game, he was done. But Kurt was going 4/4, 4/6 in his duty and what stood out is he was sharp, and making great reads and good decisions. While he was given the shot at the QB1 job because of his good play at the end of '07, what he did the previous year wouldn't have mattered if he had come out and made bad reads, poor decisions and didn't feel the rush. No, Kurt had a very sharp preseason last year, and beat out Leinart who had three solid games and one very bad game.

To put it another way, THIS Warner likely wouldn't have taken the job from THAT Matt in 2008, even with his good 2007. Now, with his amazing 2008 season, THIS Warner would have to have his hands fall off to lose his starting job, even to THIS Matt.

 

[Zeno]

To put it another way, THIS Warner likely wouldn't have taken the job from THAT Matt in 2008, even with his good 2007. Now, with his amazing 2008 season, THIS Warner would have to have his hands fall off to lose his starting job, even to THIS Matt.

Absolutely well put. Leinart is not going to beat out Warner in the preseason no matter what but if something happens and Leinart is to play for an extended period of time I wouldn't be shocked if he never gave up the position as starter.

 

[Stout]

Matt has had quality starts as an NFL QB. He had a decent game tonight against second stringers. He still is inaccurate on his throws and makes questionable decisions under a heavy rush. Kurt had a bad half of football tonight. He is prone to having those time to time. A healthy Kurt Warner is miles ahead of Matt Leinart at this point in there development. If we have any shot at returning to the Super Bowl this season it will be because Kurt Warner is healthy most of the year and playing lights out to his 2 recievers and the defense shows up. Matt is still several starts away from being a better than avg NFL starter. He could not take this team to a Super Bowl this season by any stretch of the imagination. He is not Kurt Warner and may never be. Anyone calling for him to start after what Warner has done for the last 2 seasons (see Warrior in Dictionary his picture is there)for this football team 1. has a screw loose,2. has always been biased against Kurt or most likely highly inehbreated or on crack. We have a proven decent capable backup QB in Matt Lienart. He may be a decent starter. He is not Kurt Warner at this point in his development. Would love for him to be but he is not. He could lead a great football team (which the Cards are not) to the playoffs. As Q said Kurt is a Keeper and he can and has lifted mediocre teams to great heights. We need him healthy if there is to be a Super Bowl repeat this season.

So, I guess you either didn't watch the games, or Leinart has bopped your sister. Leinart looked ALL WORLD tonight against the 2nd stringers, while himself playing with mostly 2nd stringers on offense. He made INCREDIBLE decisions under pressure, including a few clutch completions, and was pretty accurate when he led us on the giant comeback. No, it wasn't against the starters, but the quality of the game he played last night is undeniable. You simply want to downplay it and say he played one way when he clearly played better than you come close to giving him credit for.

You say that a healthy Kurt Warner is miles ahead of Leinart right now. While I would agree with that sentiment in general, it is entirely possible that Kurt is miles from being healthy. I'm extremely concerned about that hip, and if Kurt's inaccuracy is being caused by that injury then we have a major concern.

Look, I don't think anyone here is saying they want to start Leinart over Warner right now. It is still the preseason, after all, and Leinart never had a prayer of winning the job. The problem a lot of people are having is that Warner looks like dog crap right now, and they are worried about it going forward. No, no one wants Leinart to start the season, but if Warner keeps playing at the low level he is so far, people will want Leinart to step in to the starting lineup. I think we're all praying that Kurt shakes this off and gets back to form.

Still and all, your post was pretty inflammatory and, in my opinion, uneducated. To say that Leinart would have absolutely no chance of leading this team to a Super Bowl is simply ignorant. The Rams had absolutely no chance of even making the playoffs when Trent Green got hurt, and yet they won the Super Bowl. Leinart taking over and doing the same would be a far lesser miracle. The problem is, you're trying to post in absolutes, and doing that is probably not a good idea.

 

[Feeble Mcjackson]

regardless of Leinart, Warner has looked like **** all preseason. he has fallen back into bad habits like holding onto the ball too long, throwing high, not tucking the ball, etc. I think not having Haley on his ass every day has made Kurt revert back to 2007 form and thats not gonna cut it.