The Simmons Flaw or Is It?

[Harry]

I was curious how it happened that Simmons slid to the Cards. Some of the teams made obvious choices, QBs and the best edge rusher in the draft. Then there’s Detroit, NYG and Carolina. Any of them could have used Simmons but all went elsewhere. The question is why. The answer is truly odd IMO. There apparently were 2 concerns. First, they weren’t sure where they’d play him. My thought is play him everywhere. Their thinking was wherever you played him you had to have a starting caliber player at the position he vacated. Simply put Simmons was viewed as more of a role player than a consistent asset. The NFL has a long history of inflexibility. If things don’t match the way they’ve always been done, they are often reflected out of hand. I know a few teams have changed but these 3 are not major innovators. Second they saw him as only being a safety. They didn’t believe he was physically strong enough to play close to the line as an LB would do. Oddly that’s where the Cards will play him. There’s no question he will be tested quickly. He’s shed blocks previously by using his agility. NFL blockers are faster and more agile than what he’s faced in college. He will have to build strength and hand technique. Plus the NFL typically believes you run at defensive speed, not around it. So he’ll see plenty of action and it won’t take long to find out if the Cards are correct. However, if it turns out he can’t play LB, the Cards will find themselves with Simmons & Baker both best suited for the same spot.

I’m guessing the Cards are right. He could handle the TE & RB coverage as a walk up safety, but as a blitzer, he’ll be far more likely to get home from a traditional LB spot. I think as the years go by, teams will regret passing on Simmons. He may not be a unicorn, but he will be a game changing player.

 

[BigRedRage]

yeah it seems worst case scenario, he competes with Budda for his job but the likely scenario is he plays as a faster dansby.

 

[overseascardfan]

I've also read that teams were afraid that he would never be able to master a particular skill set if he couldn't develop at one set position and some coordinators may not be up for that kind of challenge. My thinking is this, if Joseph can't get the defense fixed with the pieces we added, particularly Simmons then go out and get (not attempt to get) Brent Venables. Make him lead assistance HC or whatever and pay him.

NFL people feel he could be a Derwin James type player, not sure I completely agree with that as James never played 6 positions at FSU like Simmons did at CLEM. I think the adding of Fotu & Phillips should free him up from the focus of OL and allow him to use his speed to make plays.

 

[TheCardFan]

I disagree to an extent...sorry.

Detroit picked arguably the best cover CB to come out in a while and its a big need. I don't think that is on Simmons.
NYG - clearly they needed a LT to protect their franchise QB and help their franchise RB. I don't think that is on Simmons.

Carolina - this one is interesting.

• If they are running a 4-3, then Simmons may not have been an ideal fit
• They lost 2 starters at DT, so maybe they prioritized Brown over Simmons for need
• Maybe they thought getting Brown and Chinn was a better value than getting Simmons and a 3rd round DT

As you said, it won't take long to find out.

 

[tnmike]

Don't you just love it when some people have idle time on their hands and want to overthink things? Just let the guy play and judge him then. Like Mike Damone said in Fast Times at Ridgemont High, " You won't regret it"

 

[GuernseyCard]

I was curious how it happened that Simmons slid to the Cards. Some of the teams made obvious choices, QBs and the best edge rusher in the draft. Then there’s Detroit, NYG and Carolina. Any of them could have used Simmons but all went elsewhere. The question is why. The answer is truly odd IMO. There apparently were 2 concerns. First, they weren’t sure where they’d play him. My thought is play him everywhere. Their thinking was wherever you played him you had to have a starting caliber player at the position he vacated. Simply put Simmons was viewed as more of a role player than a consistent asset. The NFL has a long history of inflexibility. If things don’t match the way they’ve always been done, they are often reflected out of hand. I know a few teams have changed but these 3 are not major innovators. Second they saw him as only being a safety. They didn’t believe he was physically strong enough to play close to the line as an LB would do. Oddly that’s where the Cards will play him. There’s no question he will be tested quickly. He’s shed blocks previously by using his agility. NFL blockers are faster and more agile than what he’s faced in college. He will have to build strength and hand technique. Plus the NFL typically believes you run at defensive speed, not around it. So he’ll see plenty of action and it won’t take long to find out if the Cards are correct. However, if it turns out he can’t play LB, the Cards will find themselves with Simmons & Baker both best suited for the same spot.

I’m guessing the Cards are right. He could handle the TE & RB coverage as a walk up safety, but as a blitzer, he’ll be far more likely to get home from a traditional LB spot. I think as the years go by, teams will regret passing on Simmons. He may not be a unicorn, but he will be a game changing player.

Odd?

Detroit had lost Slay and there was a high-quality CB sitting there; NY O-line was abysmal last season, starting with an overpriced FA LT. They needed to protect their young, franchise QB. Carolina's run "D" was pathetic and they lost two of their starters in FA.

Nothing odd about their business decisions - IMO.

 

[THESMEL]

Well I said KK and KM were unicorns last year, seems they still fit that title better than ISM, against all forms of traditionalism!

seems 3 down eraser is his position, wonder if he will call defenses at some point? I mean reddick was a first rounder too.

I think he will defend the run Adequately , and be the best at handling play action, rpo trickery - I mean that’s what he’s built for right? He can cover as safety and slot receivers. So to me it’s pretty simple - he plays lb on run downs - safety on pass downs - erases trickery!

cardinal up and take it like a fan!

 

[SissyBoyFloyd]

My only question was who would have drooled over thought of getting Simmons? Raiders? I would have been on phone to Maylock and asked if they wanted him for their 12 & 19 which might have worked. With that we could of had Kinlaw or Lamb, and then Chaisson, Murray, Jefferson, Ruiz, or a top CB.

So my thought was did Keim even try.

 

[Dr. Jones]

It was simple to me:

1 - Easy
2 - Best positional player in the draft - At a premium position
3 - 2nd Best positional player in the draft - At a premium position
4 - Idiot old school GM going after the top LT instead of looking at how football is changing.
5 - QB
6 - QB - Many teams make picks like this when they are between 7 and 15.
7 - Only odd one. And my guess is we got lucky with a new HC taking an old school mindset instead of, again, looking at the changing landscape. Hurney should have freaking known better. But..... THANKS!

 

[dscher]

Just for the simple fact he takes care of the never ending te debacle, he will be more than worth it imo.

 

[Jetstream Green]

There are no flaws with him or Jones... everyone chill

 

[cardncubfan]

I disagree to an extent...sorry.

Detroit picked arguably the best cover CB to come out in a while and its a big need. I don't think that is on Simmons.
NYG - clearly they needed a LT to protect their franchise QB and help their franchise RB. I don't think that is on Simmons.

Carolina - this one is interesting.

• If they are running a 4-3, then Simmons may not have been an ideal fit
• They lost 2 starters at DT, so maybe they prioritized Brown over Simmons for need
• Maybe they thought getting Brown and Chinn was a better value than getting Simmons and a 3rd round DT

As you said, it won't take long to find out.

What did Snow run at Baylor? They have a completely new staff there so who knows what they value more. I agree with you. They could have needed a DL way more & Brown was definitely the best available.

 

[cardncubfan]

My only question was who would have drooled over thought of getting Simmons? Raiders? I would have been on phone to Maylock and asked if they wanted him for their 12 & 19 which might have worked. With that we could of had Kinlaw or Lamb, and then Chaisson, Murray, Jefferson, Ruiz, or a top CB.

So my thought was did Keim even try.

Once Simmons was there for our pick Keim wasn't accepting any calls.

 

[Hypothesis]

I was curious how it happened that Simmons slid to the Cards. Some of the teams made obvious choices, QBs and the best edge rusher in the draft. Then there’s Detroit, NYG and Carolina. Any of them could have used Simmons but all went elsewhere. The question is why. The answer is truly odd IMO. There apparently were 2 concerns. First, they weren’t sure where they’d play him. My thought is play him everywhere. Their thinking was wherever you played him you had to have a starting caliber player at the position he vacated. Simply put Simmons was viewed as more of a role player than a consistent asset. The NFL has a long history of inflexibility. If things don’t match the way they’ve always been done, they are often reflected out of hand. I know a few teams have changed but these 3 are not major innovators. Second they saw him as only being a safety. They didn’t believe he was physically strong enough to play close to the line as an LB would do. Oddly that’s where the Cards will play him. There’s no question he will be tested quickly. He’s shed blocks previously by using his agility. NFL blockers are faster and more agile than what he’s faced in college. He will have to build strength and hand technique. Plus the NFL typically believes you run at defensive speed, not around it. So he’ll see plenty of action and it won’t take long to find out if the Cards are correct. However, if it turns out he can’t play LB, the Cards will find themselves with Simmons & Baker both best suited for the same spot.

I’m guessing the Cards are right. He could handle the TE & RB coverage as a walk up safety, but as a blitzer, he’ll be far more likely to get home from a traditional LB spot. I think as the years go by, teams will regret passing on Simmons. He may not be a unicorn, but he will be a game changing player.

I think Simmons landed in a great spot to learn hand technique. Chandler Jones is arguably one of if not the best in this area.

 

[gimpy]

It's the old "NFL players are better, faster, stronger argument".

Let's pick someone less than the best. Maybe they will be able to do better against the better, stronger, faster NFL.

 

[Goldfield]

I can see how teams are unsure about Simmons, to be honest so am I. But he is a freakazoid of an athlete, that produced everywhere on the field. He is a luxury at this point with all four LBs have solid starters. We can figure out what he does best and figure it out.

The two DLmen we took in the draft and Jordan Phillips will keep Simmons clean at LB IMO

 

[football karma]

i dont get the concern on Simmons:

nearly 75% of defensive snaps are played in nickel or dime defenses.

Simmons is either:

a safety with size so you dont give up much in run D, or
a LB with speed so you dont give up much in pass D

does it matter where you pencil him in on the depth chart?

 

[football karma]

and BTW: Didnt Corey Littleton just prove the value of this kind of player.

 

[JeffGollin]

I disagree to an extent...sorry.

Detroit picked arguably the best cover CB to come out in a while and its a big need. I don't think that is on Simmons.
NYG - clearly they needed a LT to protect their franchise QB and help their franchise RB. I don't think that is on Simmons.

Carolina - this one is interesting.

• If they are running a 4-3, then Simmons may not have been an ideal fit
• They lost 2 starters at DT, so maybe they prioritized Brown over Simmons for need
• Maybe they thought getting Brown and Chinn was a better value than getting Simmons and a 3rd round DT

As you said, it won't take long to find out.

I agree. The case could be made for there being 2QBs, 4 OLs, 2 WRs, Okudah, Young, Brown and Simmons (with Kinlaw an outside possibility) who were all top 8 material & closely rated. Unlike, the Cards, many nfl teams draft for need and they evidently felt other players were a greater fit than Simmons.

That said - I grew increasingly certain that at #8, it would all come down to either Brown or Simmons. The Eraser made it down to where we could grab him at #8.

 

[Finito]

I was curious how it happened that Simmons slid to the Cards. Some of the teams made obvious choices, QBs and the best edge rusher in the draft. Then there’s Detroit, NYG and Carolina. Any of them could have used Simmons but all went elsewhere. The question is why. The answer is truly odd IMO. There apparently were 2 concerns. First, they weren’t sure where they’d play him. My thought is play him everywhere. Their thinking was wherever you played him you had to have a starting caliber player at the position he vacated. Simply put Simmons was viewed as more of a role player than a consistent asset. The NFL has a long history of inflexibility. If things don’t match the way they’ve always been done, they are often reflected out of hand. I know a few teams have changed but these 3 are not major innovators. Second they saw him as only being a safety. They didn’t believe he was physically strong enough to play close to the line as an LB would do. Oddly that’s where the Cards will play him. There’s no question he will be tested quickly. He’s shed blocks previously by using his agility. NFL blockers are faster and more agile than what he’s faced in college. He will have to build strength and hand technique. Plus the NFL typically believes you run at defensive speed, not around it. So he’ll see plenty of action and it won’t take long to find out if the Cards are correct. However, if it turns out he can’t play LB, the Cards will find themselves with Simmons & Baker both best suited for the same spot.

I’m guessing the Cards are right. He could handle the TE & RB coverage as a walk up safety, but as a blitzer, he’ll be far more likely to get home from a traditional LB spot. I think as the years go by, teams will regret passing on Simmons. He may not be a unicorn, but he will be a game changing player.

Not odd at all really.

NYG I get why they took an offensive lineman. The last two years seen them take a RB and QB high and they have a horrible line they have to protect those guys eventually. It’s a need pick

Okudah? No problem here

Brown you could debate but again I see what there doing. Panthers the only team in the history of the draft to go all defense. They clearly had a plan and it starts up front

 

[az jam]

I disagree to an extent...sorry.

Detroit picked arguably the best cover CB to come out in a while and its a big need. I don't think that is on Simmons.
NYG - clearly they needed a LT to protect their franchise QB and help their franchise RB. I don't think that is on Simmons.

Carolina - this one is interesting.

• If they are running a 4-3, then Simmons may not have been an ideal fit
• They lost 2 starters at DT, so maybe they prioritized Brown over Simmons for need
• Maybe they thought getting Brown and Chinn was a better value than getting Simmons and a 3rd round DT

As you said, it won't take long to find out.

I agree with you on the picks taken by the Lion and Giants. I felt Carolina could have gone with either Brown or Simmons but interestingly I recall on draft night that when the Panthers were on the clock I heard one of the Sports talk guys I was listening to said they would go Brown and Cards would get Simmons. Damn, I can't remember who that was.

 

[AZCrazy]

I have a question for defensive X's and O's guys:
Simmons has been talked about as a weak side ILB as his natural position. If his primary defensive directive though will be to negate the opposing tight end, wouldn't he be better positioned on the strong side, to grab control of the TE from the proper side? The other ILB can be the tacking machine, leaving Simmons free to cover TE's, rush the passer as needed, go deep as needed, or crash the line.

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

I was curious how it happened that Simmons slid to the Cards. Some of the teams made obvious choices, QBs and the best edge rusher in the draft. Then there’s Detroit, NYG and Carolina. Any of them could have used Simmons but all went elsewhere. The question is why. The answer is truly odd IMO. There apparently were 2 concerns. First, they weren’t sure where they’d play him. My thought is play him everywhere. Their thinking was wherever you played him you had to have a starting caliber player at the position he vacated. Simply put Simmons was viewed as more of a role player than a consistent asset. The NFL has a long history of inflexibility. If things don’t match the way they’ve always been done, they are often reflected out of hand. I know a few teams have changed but these 3 are not major innovators. Second they saw him as only being a safety. They didn’t believe he was physically strong enough to play close to the line as an LB would do. Oddly that’s where the Cards will play him. There’s no question he will be tested quickly. He’s shed blocks previously by using his agility. NFL blockers are faster and more agile than what he’s faced in college. He will have to build strength and hand technique. Plus the NFL typically believes you run at defensive speed, not around it. So he’ll see plenty of action and it won’t take long to find out if the Cards are correct. However, if it turns out he can’t play LB, the Cards will find themselves with Simmons & Baker both best suited for the same spot.

I’m guessing the Cards are right. He could handle the TE & RB coverage as a walk up safety, but as a blitzer, he’ll be far more likely to get home from a traditional LB spot. I think as the years go by, teams will regret passing on Simmons. He may not be a unicorn, but he will be a game changing player.

I just listened to the press conference of VJ, he said a lot of good things, especially about Simmons. He was told by Brent Venables (DC at Clemson) that on every saturday, he had the game plan down pat from multiple positions. Knew exactly where he was supposed to be on every play & every call. That to me shows his football IQ is very high, then you consider his athletic ability combined with that & we have one hell of a football player. I've watched the kid closely for the last 2 yrs, especially playing against Louisville & hearing the Louisville fans complain about how good he is. He was a spy against Lamar Jackson & kept him in check for the most part. He's not gonna make bone crushing hits but he hardly ever misses tackles. I'm as excited now about drafting him as I was when the pick came in. He can do so many things & I have absolutely no doubt he will make the transition to the NFL with ease.

 

[AZ Native]

I get it. I had a girlfriend who knew too many positions. I told her she should stick to one and as I never knew what was coming next.

 

[Card'em]

I think Simmons and Brown are both blue chip players with each of them having the potential to be future all-pros. I don't understand why anybody would question Carolina picking Brown over Simmons. I loved them both going into the draft and personally couldn't decide which one I wanted more if both were available. I'm glad the Cardinals have Simmons, but wouldn't have been disappointed if Carolina picked Simmons and we ended up with Brown.