The wishbone formation?

[FlMike1969]

Curious if anyone thinks the wishbone could ever really make it in the NFL as a consistent offense? Seems to me if you can get a couple of big ol bruiser running backs with a speed guy, with a mobile QB you could do some damage. That is an offense that should wear down a defense to setup a couple of speedy receivers. I would like to see something like that in the league. If planned right stack the line all you want there is potential for big plays down field. Seems to me it would protect the QB a lot more also. Just a thought.

 

[Russ Smith]

Curious if anyone thinks the wishbone could ever really make it in the NFL as a consistent offense? Seems to me if you can get a couple of big ol bruiser running backs with a speed guy, with a mobile QB you could do some damage. That is an offense that should wear down a defense to setup a couple of speedy receivers. I would like to see something like that in the league. If planned right stack the line all you want there is potential for big plays down field. Seems to me it would protect the QB a lot more also. Just a thought.

You do realize Bidwill Sr actually hired a Wishbone coach in the St Louis days who tried to put in the wishbone? I don't remember the year but he hired Bud wilkinson, did not go well.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Too much speed in nfl.

Though I’m proud of my 10 year old’s flag football team who ran it to perfection. The other team was stunned when we pulled that out.

 

[HairZach]

I've seen an idea that a team could basically play moneyball doing this. The players needed to build an ideal wishbone offense are around but their traits are undervalued in today's game and they can be had for cheap. An UDFA in todays offenses might be the perfect player for a wishbone.

You can get QBs that can run the wishbone (while still having SOME passing threat) for extremely cheap/extremely late in the draft (Think Sam Ehlinger round 6). Same with big blocking TEs and running backs. You would want to carry a ton of runningbacks on the finals roster. Instead of spending all your cap space paying $40+ mil on QB and $20-30+ mil on WR you could pour almost all of it into the best defensive free agents. All your top draft picks could be on defense.

The offense wouldn't light up the world, but it might be more effective than you think. Right now teams rosters are built to defend against speed. Linebackers have almost universally gotten smaller and a lot of defenses are used to playing more nickel looks and in general are carrying lighter, faster players. Constantly stacking the box might be more painful for the defense than it is for the offense. In the short term teams might have some difficulties defending something they never see. Remember the option requires a lot of discipline to defend. It does have some wrinkles and more wrinkles could easily be added while maintaining the core identity of the offense.

The big thing gained from this is you would ideally have the most expensive defense in football and it would be STACKED. Not only that but they would be playing with offense that is designed to protect them.

It's definitely crazy and no GM would ever do it. But I think it would be interesting. I wouldn't dismiss just because penny pinching Bidwill Sr. tried it with a coach who had been retired for 15 years.

 

[FlMike1969]

I've seen an idea that a team could basically play moneyball doing this. The players needed to build an ideal wishbone offense are around but their traits are undervalued in today's game and they can be had for cheap. An UDFA in todays offenses might be the perfect player for a wishbone.

You can get QBs that can run the wishbone (while still having SOME passing threat) for extremely cheap/extremely late in the draft (Think Sam Ehlinger round 6). Same with big blocking TEs and running backs. You would want to carry a ton of runningbacks on the finals roster. Instead of spending all your cap space paying $40+ mil on QB and $20-30+ mil on WR you could pour almost all of it into the best defensive free agents. All your top draft picks could be on defense.

The offense wouldn't light up the world, but it might be more effective than you think. Right now teams rosters are built to defend against speed. Linebackers have almost universally gotten smaller and a lot of defenses are used to playing more nickel looks and in general are carrying lighter, faster players. Constantly stacking the box might be more painful for the defense than it is for the offense. In the short term teams might have some difficulties defending something they never see. Remember the option requires a lot of discipline to defend. It does have some wrinkles and more wrinkles could easily be added while maintaining the core identity of the offense.

The big thing gained from this is you would ideally have the most expensive defense in football and it would be STACKED. Not only that but they would be playing with offense that is designed to protect them.

It's definitely crazy and no GM would ever do it. But I think it would be interesting. I wouldn't dismiss just because penny pinching Bidwill Sr. tried it with a coach who had been retired for 15 years.

I like the analysis. This is what I was thinking also. I think it would have potential simply because the other 90% of the league would still be drafting and planning against air raid teams and big plays. I would not discount also that with the right backs this offense could break off 10 and 20 yard runs in a hurry. That is a lot of abuse the defense would be taking that they normally don't take. Later in the game big plays are easily made with crossing routes and sweeps, with the occasional shot down the sidelines. The QB is much more energetic late in the game also allowing for heightened awareness. Just seems logical to me. Would also be crazy fun to watch if done right. I remember the old Nebraska days where they steam rolled teams using the wishbone.

 

[cardpa]

You need a QB that can take and absorb a lot of hits. Your QB is going to take hits quite often if he runs the wishbone correctly because a large part of the success of the wishbone is the QB getting defenders to commit to either him or the pitch option and then making the correct decision based on what the defender decides to do which means a lot of hits on the QB either way if he decides to keep the ball or pitch it to the RB.

 

[JeffGollin]

I still want them to bring back the Single Wing

 

[cardsfanmd]

I’m still waiting on the Annexation of Puerto Rico or Flying V.

 

[TRW]

Is Bobby Douglas or Mark Malone available?

Seriously though, I agree with Ouchie, too much speed in the NFL today to run it. It would be a gimmick, like the wildcat that would diagnosed and destroyed almost immediately by defensive coordinators, except Vance Joseph of course.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Is Bobby Douglas or Mark Malone available?

Seriously though, I agree with Ouchie, too much speed in the NFL today to run it. It would be a gimmick, like the wildcat that would diagnosed and destroyed almost immediately by defensive coordinators, except Vance Joseph of course.

Exactly. The wildcat surprised everyone. Everyone copycatted. It died. You could surprise a few teams with it now and again, but the speed the defenders bear down on ball carriers gives less time to actually execute an effective fake dice, pull out and pitch. Not to mention, the hashes are much closer in the nfl. There’s no gaping side of the field spreading the defense out like exists in college ball.

Look, I LOVE the wishbone (as I said, I got 10 year olds to run it playing FLAG football)! Jamelle Holloway will forever be one of my favorite football players. But it couldn’t survive beyond a gimmick play here and there in the nfl.

 

[Harry]

Curious if anyone thinks the wishbone could ever really make it in the NFL as a consistent offense? Seems to me if you can get a couple of big ol bruiser running backs with a speed guy, with a mobile QB you could do some damage. That is an offense that should wear down a defense to setup a couple of speedy receivers. I would like to see something like that in the league. If planned right stack the line all you want there is potential for big plays down field. Seems to me it would protect the QB a lot more also. Just a thought.

Back when the Cards had Jim Otis they used it in short yardage at the goal line.

 

[Harry]

You do realize Bidwill Sr actually hired a Wishbone coach in the St Louis days who tried to put in the wishbone? I don't remember the year but he hired Bud wilkinson, did not go well.

Good old Bud. Nice guy but his concepts were so out of touch he was a disaster. He retired from college coaching in 1963. Incredibly Dollar Bill hired him away from ESPN in 1978. He lasted a year and a half, being fired in mid-season. He couldn’t relate to players at all. Several players openly criticized the hire even before he arrived, among other things calling it “insanity.” Bidwill & Coryell had been feuding. Refusing to pay Metcalf, he went to Canada where US player rights weren’t recognized. Dobler & others were given away in trades to save money. Bud never really had a chance, though some players came to admire his effort. The Cards lost their first 8 games under Wilkenson. Finally in Wilkenson’s final year, JV Cain died of a heart attack in training camp. It was a perfect storm of misfortune. Bud was just another Dollar Bill scapegoat.