Trade down scenarios with the #1 pick

[Mainstreet]

You know... if he had said "we'll listen if other teams come calling, but it will take heaven and earth to move this pick" i totally get it. But the Suns reaching out to others, while saying that we think we can get just a good a guy lower DEVALUES the 1st pick if you're really thinking about dealing. I don't care if he's serious or not, that's just an idiotic statement to make because it makes it look like we're the ones without leverage when we have ALL the leverage.

I just always get the feeling dude thinks he's Danny Ainge... when he's just CLEARLY not.

Don't screw this up idiot.

I'm hoping McDonough has learned something from Ainge.

One of the reasons McDonough is reaching out to other teams (for better or worse) he plans to make a decision in the coming week on the #1 pick so he can concentrate on the possibility of moving up from #16.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I'm banking on McDonough to make the right moves in the draft and this summer. I think he is a GM on an upward growth pattern. If he blows it, I will be devastated along with everyone else.

I like Koko, but truth is he's a GM who from all reports got turned down by three HCs this summer and just came out with a statement devaluing his draft position.

He's proven literally NOTHING yet to give me confidence he can make the simplest of decisions and it boggles the mind that people can still talk about him on an upward growth pattern.

Again, the EASIEST thing to say about the pick is "we'll listen to offers, but need to be blown away to move a highly coveted pick." To say that WE will make calls around the league while devaluing the first pick in the process is just an idiotic thing to say, even if he doesn't mean it.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I'm hoping McDonough has learned something from Ainge.

have you ever seen Ainge devalue his own draft position? How about swing and miss on three HCs in a summer?

One of the reasons McDonough is reaching out to other teams (for better or worse) he plans to make a decision in the coming week on the #1 pick so he can concentrate on the possibility of moving up from #16.

the idea that he needs to reach out to ANYONE so he can focus on his decision on 16 is sad to me. If that really is what's going on, he should be keeping his indecision to himself, not alerting everyone to it. And even beyond that, it's called freaking multi-tasking. He's known he was going to have these picks for a MONTH. The idea that he needs to be reaching out to people at this point to help make his mind up sounds like someone who has no clue what he's doing.

Or, par for the course for McD.

Honestly, what reason is there for McD to broadcast to the world that he doesn't think the 1st pick is the end all be all or that he needs to reach out to others at this point? Do you understand how weak that makes the hand that he might dealing look?

 

[AzStevenCal]

His shooting percentages aren't bad. He can shoot the three. His defense would at least be solid. Yeah he needs to gain some weight but so what...not a big deal.

If SGA has trouble guarding men then Young will be a disaster on the defensive end.

This is one of those comments that I don't believe would be made if you were actually watching him play. Sure, stats look good and he's a good free throw shooter but most of his attempts came while he was in motion. He can't shoot even the college 3 from a dead stop, he needs the momentum to push the ball that far. Maybe he can add the strength necessary but right now, we really don't know what he is as an outside shooter.

And yes, Young will likely be a disaster on the defensive end. They say he's adding muscle and working on this aspect of the game but I don't see him ever being better than an average team defender. But he's worlds better than Shai as a shooter and at running an offense. If he's out of our reach, Shai would be a nice project for us. He has a lot of highly positive intangibles but he needs a lot of work too.

 

[Mainstreet]

I like Koko, but truth is he's a GM who from all reports got turned down by three HCs this summer and just came out with a statement devaluing his draft position.

He's proven literally NOTHING yet to give me confidence he can make the simplest of decisions and it boggles the mind that people can still talk about him on an upward growth pattern.

Again, the EASIEST thing to say about the pick is "we'll listen to offers, but need to be blown away to move a highly coveted pick." To say that WE will make calls around the league while devaluing the first pick in the process is just an idiotic thing to say, even if he doesn't mean it.

I agree with your thought process but I don't think McDonough can devalue the first pick in this draft with Ayton likely to go #1.

Booker, Jackson and the #1 pick tells me he has learned.

 

[pokerface]

This is one of those comments that I don't believe would be made if you were actually watching him play. Sure, stats look good and he's a good free throw shooter but most of his attempts came while he was in motion. He can't shoot even the college 3 from a dead stop, he needs the momentum to push the ball that far. Maybe he can add the strength necessary but right now, we really don't know what he is as an outside shooter.

And yes, Young will likely be a disaster on the defensive end. They say he's adding muscle and working on this aspect of the game but I don't see him ever being better than an average team defender. But he's worlds better than Shai as a shooter and at running an offense. If he's out of our reach, Shai would be a nice project for us. He has a lot of highly positive intangibles but he needs a lot of work too.

Well you're right...I havnt watched him.

 

[Mainstreet]

have you ever seen Ainge devalue his own draft position? How about swing and miss on three HCs in a summer?



the idea that he needs to reach out to ANYONE so he can focus on his decision on 16 is sad to me. If that really is what's going on, he should be keeping his indecision to himself, not alerting everyone to it. And even beyond that, it's called freaking multi-tasking. He's known he was going to have these picks for a MONTH. The idea that he needs to be reaching out to people at this point to help make his mind up sounds like someone who has no clue what he's doing.

Or, par for the course for McD.

Honestly, what reason is there for McD to broadcast to the world that he doesn't think the 1st pick is the end all be all or that he needs to reach out to others at this point? Do you understand how weak that makes the hand that he might dealing look?

I'm guessing Ainge let it be known he would trade down from #1 in the 2017 draft... certainly more quietly but it was out there.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I like Koko, but truth is he's a GM who from all reports got turned down by three HCs this summer and just came out with a statement devaluing his draft position.

That's misleading and not entirely accurate. Majerle didn't turn him down, he simply declined an opportunity to interview. But even if you count that one, we don't have a clue what happened with the other two. From our perspective, it seems Bud turned us down and maybe he did but there is no substance to the rumor that Fizdale did. It's been denied by our front office and there's been nothing from Fizdale to say otherwise. And I tend to believe our guys because I can't believe we'd be stupid enough to hire that guy.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Well you're right...I havnt watched him.

Understood. There's a lot of players in this class that I haven't watched and I've formed my opinions about them through stats and clips. But I've watched Shai a handful of times and I have some concerns. Yet I still have interest in him. I just think he's more like an Elfrid Payton gamble than an almost guaranteed star.

As I said before, his length and intangibles make him a very nice prospect but straight out the college door, he's no Trae Young. If we can get him for the 16 and the Milwaukee pick, I'd be all for it.

 

[Mainstreet]

Understood. There's a lot of players in this class that I haven't watched and I've formed my opinions about them through stats and clips. But I've watched Shai a handful of times and I have some concerns. Yet I still have interest in him. I just think he's more like an Elfrid Payton gamble than an almost guaranteed star.

As I said before, his length and intangibles make him a very nice prospect but straight out the college door, he's no Trae Young. If we can get him for the 16 and the Milwaukee pick, I'd be all for it.

I watched Shai a bit. My primary concern is him putting the ball out there on the dribble (probably because of his height) where it can be taken away. However, I think this is an issue that can be resolved with coaching. I'd be very happy if the Suns could move up to draft him as well.

 

[Cheesebeef]

That's misleading and not entirely accurate. Majerle didn't turn him down, he simply declined an opportunity to interview. But even if you count that one, we don't have a clue what happened with the other two. From our perspective, it seems Bud turned us down and maybe he did but there is no substance to the rumor that Fizdale did. It's been denied by our front office and there's been nothing from Fizdale to say otherwise. And I tend to believe our guys because I can't believe we'd be stupid enough to hire that guy.

I actually wasn't even counting Majerle, but my bad... so it wasn't three who flat out rejected the job (even though Majerle not even wanting an interview doesn't say much for McD either.

But it was STILL a swing on miss on TWO from all reports, including Fizdale.

https://theundefeated.com/features/knicks-coach-david-fizdale-rolls-the-dice-and-wins/

https://www.brightsideofthesun.com/...kokoskov-hired-new-york-knicks-nba-basketball

http://arizonasports.com/story/1518283/report-new-knicks-coach-david-fizdale-turned-down-suns/

And I never saw that denied by our FO and to be honest, even if I did and you did (and if you could lead me to the denials I'd like to read them because I never saw it), WHY would you believe them after they already got egg on their face with Bud? You believe that wouldn't be stupid enough to hire that guy... even though they interviewed him twice and the same GM hired Earl Watson without even interviewing anyone? Surely they could have and have been that stupid.

The idea that there's "no substance" to the rumor that Fizzle turned us down when it was covered by multiple media outlets seems misleading on your part, IMO.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I'm guessing Ainge let it be known he would trade down from #1 in the 2017 draft... certainly more quietly but it was out there.

right... quietly. NOT showing his hand. That's what a good GM does. McD's statement sounded like a rookie. Much like A LOT of his statements over the course of FIVE years.

 

[JerkFace]

right... quietly. NOT showing his hand. That's what a good GM does. McD's statement sounded like a rookie. Much like A LOT of his statements over the course of FIVE years.

“Now we have the No. 1 pick and we will explore the value of it.”
- Danny Ainge in the weeks before the draft

https://www.boston.com/sports/bosto...y-ainge-has-said-about-the-upcoming-nba-draft

 

[Mainstreet]

“Now we have the No. 1 pick and we will explore the value of it.”
- Danny Ainge in the weeks before the draft

https://www.boston.com/sports/bosto...y-ainge-has-said-about-the-upcoming-nba-draft

It is a nice find. Certainly McDonough is having fun with it.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I actually wasn't even counting Majerle, but my bad... so it wasn't three who flat out rejected the job (even though Majerle not even wanting an interview doesn't say much for McD either.

But it was STILL a swing on miss on TWO from all reports, including Fizdale.

https://theundefeated.com/features/knicks-coach-david-fizdale-rolls-the-dice-and-wins/

https://www.brightsideofthesun.com/...kokoskov-hired-new-york-knicks-nba-basketball

And I never saw that denied by our FO and to be honest, even if I did and you did (and if you could lead me to the denials I'd like to read them because I never saw it), WHY would you believe them after they already got egg on their face with Bud? You believe that wouldn't be stupid enough to hire that guy... even though they interviewed him twice and the same GM hired Earl Watson without even interviewing anyone? Surely they could have and have been that stupid.

The idea that there's "no substance" to the rumor that Fizzle turned us down when it was covered by multiple media outlets seems misleading on your part, IMO.

Why do they have egg on their face? They (apparently) had no intention of offering the job to anyone until they finished interviewing all their candidates. We still don't know why Bud decided he wasn't interested. Maybe it was on us, maybe it wasn't and maybe he always had another target in mind?

As for Fizdale, somewhere around the nets is an interview with Ryan (I believe) who states that it didn't go down the way it was reported. Granted, he didn't elaborate so I don't know to what degree he was denying the Fizdale story. As for all those multiple media outlets, isn't that what happens when one outlet (reliable or not) reports something. They all jump on it.

 

[AzStevenCal]

And I never saw that denied by our FO and to be honest, even if I did and you did (and if you could lead me to the denials I'd like to read them because I never saw it)

I don't have time right now to do a thorough search but here's a twitter comment from Bordow that says something similar to what I heard Ryan say:

Spoiler

Got off the phone a few minutes ago with Suns' GM Ryan McDonough: He said report Phoenix offered 4-year contract to David Fizdale was "inaccurate." Didn't want to get into specifics.

 

[Folster]

right... quietly. NOT showing his hand. That's what a good GM does. McD's statement sounded like a rookie. Much like A LOT of his statements over the course of FIVE years.

I think you are making a mountain out of a molehill. He's already told us the league asked him not to disclose who we are picking and I think he is just overselling. The pick is already in.

 

[Krangodnzr]

SGA...I say it and will keep saying it. He wouldn't cost us max to re-sign and his defense and solid shooting would blend well...plus his assist rate is solid. It wouldn't cost us a fortune to get him!

I think I would advocate the Suns just going BPA. Don't focus on a PG just to get a PG. If a highly rated wing is available, would your rather the team draft a PG that has a ceiling of a competent backup?

I would shoot for Van Vleet, Avery Bradley, or resign Payton and use all the draft capital over the next few years to fill in the backup/rotation positions behind the big three. I really like Young, but I'm also concerned about how he would mesh with a high volume guy like Booker and how bad those two would be defensively. I think with a lineup of Booker and Jackson, the PG doesn't have to be a super ball handler.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I think you are making a mountain out of a molehill. He's already told us the league asked him not to disclose who we are picking and I think he is just overselling. The pick is already in.

I hope you're right.

 

[JCSunsfan]

I think you are making a mountain out of a molehill. He's already told us the league asked him not to disclose who we are picking and I think he is just overselling. The pick is already in.

Exactly. Who cares whether he calls someone else or they call him. There is no way to devalue this pick. He is just trying to stir up interest and see what comes of it. He is taking Ayton unless something unimaginable happens (KAT and picks for #1 or something outlandish).

 

[Hoop Head]

I don't see an issue with saying he'll call other teams vs accepting calls. He said they'll reach out and see if teams will blow them away, which to me says he'll call on a few players he's been interested in to see if a deal can be made but it's unlikely to happen. I don't see anything wrong with McD throwing that out there. It sort of sends word that we'll deal, for the right package, and could get someone to call us who thought there was no way we were willing to move that pick. Saying he'll make calls doesn't necessarily mean they will. Maybe it causes another team to wonder why they haven't gotten a call from us so they reach out with a crazy off, who knows.

This is an odd time right now because the top of the West belongs to the Warriors, anyone other than the Rockets are fooling themselves if they think they can knock them out. Teams are willing to rebuild now in an attempt to compete later and we're in prime position to do that also but adding a young PG could help us start trending upwards. We need playoff experience before we can start thinking about knocking anyone out. The Sixers learned that this year. So it's best to see what's out there. Doesn't hurt to look. It's not a player being shopped right now by us either, which can cause them to become disgruntled, it's just a pick, better to gauge interest before it becomes a player and emotions and personalities come into play.

 

[sunsfan88]

Teams are going to be making the Suns trade offers for the #1 pick. It's gonna happen. This does not mean the Suns are going to accept any of these trade offers. It is highly unlikely.

However, it should be interesting to keep track of these rumors and ideas.

So Ayton supporters, please do not get upset. If nothing else, it's a way to pass time until the draft.

Let's keep it fun.

Trading down for Bamba and Doncic (if they can net another top 6 pick so two top 6 picks in total) would not be such a bad idea.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Trading down for Bamba and Doncic (if they can net another top 6 pick so two top 6 picks in total) would not be such a bad idea.

Honestly I don't know if I would do it for any player combo in the draft. I think Bamba is much more of a risk and what happens if you only end up with two really good role players and miss out on a superstar?

I don't even think I would trade the #1 for KAT straight up. I like KAT but I think Ayton might be even better in a few years and plus he's even younger.

I'm more interested in a trade up to get Young/Doncic. Walking away from the draft with Ayton and Young/Doncic makes this team a real contender 3 years from now. A core of Doncic/Young, Booker, Jackson, Bender/Chriss, Ayton is a stronger core than nearly every team in the league not named GSW.

 

[devilalum]

This is crazy. The Suns have the number one pick and one of these guys is going to be a SUPERSTAR. McDonough better pick the right one.

I am however all for trading up a few places from #16 to get the right guy. The Suns can afford to give up some of their assets if it means landing the final piece of the puzzle.

 

[SirStefan32]

I said this before, but please don't get cute. You have a number one pick, draft the guy you want. I am not as high on Ayton as most people, but there isn't a team in the NBA that wouldn't take him number one. Just draft Ayton, and then worry about moving up. Thios trade-down think is silly and foolish.