USC/UCLA leaving Pac12 for Big10?

[Folster]

Gawd no.

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That wouldn't be horrible, but it would be the Pac backfilling not the Mountain West adding. And that isn't even that bad for ASU. The only losses as far as competition and brands goes is Oregon and Washington with USC and UCLA already gone. ASU would still get a non-conference rivalry game with UofA. ASU and Utah would have a chance to rule that conference while UofA would flounder in the Big 12 football and not be able to dominate hoops like they did in the PAC.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

That wouldn't be horrible, but it would be the Pac backfilling not the Mountain West adding. And that isn't even that bad for ASU. The only losses as far as competition and brads goes is Oregon and Washington with USC and UCLA already gone. ASU would still get a non-conference rivalry game with UofA. ASU and Utah would have a chance to rule that conference while UofA would flounder in the Big 12 football and not be able to dominate hoops like they did in the PAC.

See here for if University of New Mexico message boards existed in 1978…

 

[Folster]

You are 100% wrong here. They actually do want/need those schools. Nobody likes 6-4 Ohio State vs 5-5 Oklahoma even if they are two of the top 10 teams in the country.

The networks ideal situation is a 16 team playoff with a couple random schools and fourteen 12-1 and 11-2 blue bloods from a few different parts of the country.

How many Harlem Globetrotters vs Washington Generals games do fans have to sit through before they get to watch the "blue bloods" play each other? Parity is healthy for long term growth and success. The NFL has known this and the NBA has learned this as well which is why they have been implementing rules to achieve it.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

How many Harlem Globetrotters vs Washington Generals games do fans have to sit through before they get to watch the "blue bloods" play each other? Parity is healthy for long term growth and success. The NFL has known this and the NBA has learned this as well which is why been implementing rules to achieve it.

Even the blue bloods get caught in down cycles and middling programs catch lightning in a bottle for 5-10 year runs. You’re making it sound like every week would be Alabama vs Abilene Christian.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

I do hope for your sake though Robbins tries to force the Big 12 to take you with us. Not that Michael Crow deserves it after enabling Larry Scott to destroy the conference for so many years.

 

[Folster]

I do hope for your sake though Robbins tries to force the Big 12 to take you with us. Not that Michael Crow deserves it after enabling Larry Scott to destroy the conference for so many years.

I don't care. Id rather ASU play in a conference that makes geographic sense and develop regional rivalries that allow fans and parents of athletes to travel to and watch the games. Playing UCF, Kansas State, and Houston doesn't appeal to me.

Nothing I do, say, or hope for will change what's ultimately is going to happen. A move to the BiG 12 is not going make any PAC program more relevant nationally. The only conference change worth the hassel would be BIG 10 and SEC and that's not going to happen.

 

[Folster]

The only way I'd support an ASU move to the Big 12 is if all of the 4 corner schools are also coming, and preferably, I'd want SDSU as well to preserve a connection to CA.

 

[Lefty]

That wouldn't be horrible, but it would be the Pac backfilling not the Mountain West adding. And that isn't even that bad for ASU. The only losses as far as competition and brands goes is Oregon and Washington with USC and UCLA already gone. ASU would still get a non-conference rivalry game with UofA. ASU and Utah would have a chance to rule that conference while UofA would flounder in the Big 12 football and not be able to dominate hoops like they did in the PAC.

If ASU stays in the Pac-12, their recruiting would suffer since the games would be played on a streaming channel. Recruits are not gonna want to play in an inferior conference that shows their games on a streaming channel most don't use. Also, getting less in tv money will also hurt ASU financially.

 

[Raindog]

I’m curious where you would think schools like Houston, NC State, Kansas, Minnesota, SDSU, Bay Area schools, Pitt as a few examples end up in your hypothetical scenario.

Some will end up in the 100 or so team super conferences. Minnesota is already part of the B10, which will undoubtedly be one of the surviving entities. The bay schools are wealthy and influential, and they will end up there, too. Kansas has it's hoops legacy to keep them afloat. Houston, SD State, and Pitt are all in large enough urban areas that they will probably be okay, too. NC State is a big state school, so probably along for the ride, too.

The trouble will be for smaller private schools like Wake Forest or Vanderbilt, that aren't in larger urban areas and/or don't have longstanding athletic reputations. And then the smaller public institutions in small cities or college towns, like your old Midwest conference schools (Akron, N. Illinois, Ball State, etc.) and the others that make up the bulk of the AAC and WAC and those types of conferences. They are essentially doomed unless they are comfortable with dropping down to a lower tier.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

The trouble will be for smaller private schools like Wake Forest or Vanderbilt, that aren't in larger urban areas and/or don't have longstanding athletic reputations. And then the smaller public institutions in small cities or college towns, like your old Midwest conference schools (Akron, N. Illinois, Ball State, etc.) and the others that make up the bulk of the AAC and WAC and those types of conferences. They are essentially doomed unless they are comfortable with dropping down to a lower tier.

Vanderbilt isn’t in a large urban area?

 

[Raindog]

Vanderbilt isn’t in a large urban area?

It is... sort of. Nashville isnt a huge media market, but not insignificant (28th or so). But Vandy is a small school with no national following. I expect most who live in Nashville are followers of UTenn.

 

[SeattleCardinal]

I don't care. Id rather ASU play in a conference that makes geographic sense and develop regional rivalries that allow fans and parents of athletes to travel to and watch the games. Playing UCF, Kansas State, and Houston doesn't appeal to me.

If the remaining three “corner” schools were to join CU, the Big 12 would actually make quite a bit of geographic sense. BYU and Texas Tech are logical (and historically frequent) opponents, and the other Texas schools probably make just as much sense as Wazzu. And I say that with regret, as I have enjoyed watching the Sun Devils when they visited Seattle, Corvallis or Pullman.

 

[AZCB34]

It is... sort of. Nashville isnt a huge media market, but not insignificant (28th or so). But Vandy is a small school with no national following. I expect most who live in Nashville are followers of UTenn.

In the new world order, media market size doesn’t matter. Neither does the quality of education a school provides. This is strictly about football. The B1G might still want to adhere to their archaic academic standards but don’t be shocked when that goes away.

Vanderbilt is safe because these super conferences need trans like Vandy.

I think your beeped that ASU fits into the top 50 (assuming that is the amount the two major conferences decide on) is misguided.

 

[Raindog]

In the new world order, media market size doesn’t matter. Neither does the quality of education a school provides. This is strictly about football. The B1G might still want to adhere to their archaic academic standards but don’t be shocked when that goes away.

Vanderbilt is safe because these super conferences need trans like Vandy.

I think your beeped that ASU fits into the top 50 (assuming that is the amount the two major conferences decide on) is misguided.

If it's "strictly about football" as you say, why does the B12 want Arizona and Connecticut? Why would Vandy still be safe in a realigned super conference? Why would the B10 ever take Rutgers and Maryland in the first place? All of those schools absolutely suck at football.

If the quality of a football program is the first and foremost criterion, ASU is going to be fine. They are historically a good to decent upper middle tier program, even up to as recently as a couple years ago. They won't be shut out of any realignment scenario. The only reason they are having any momentary uncertainty is because their administration stupidly supported an incompetent ex-commish and stubbornly refuses to admit their mistake and read the writing on the wall.

 

[Lefty]

I wonder what this post means?

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[Lefty]

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[Folster]

If ASU stays in the Pac-12, their recruiting would suffer since the games would be played on a streaming channel. Recruits are not gonna want to play in an inferior conference that shows their games on a streaming channel most don't use. Also, getting less in tv money will also hurt ASU financially.

Everything will be streaming soon enough. Disney is already making plans to bring ESPN channels direct to consumer. It would be preferable to have all of ASU games on one channel/app IMO. Bouncing around week to week from ESPN 2 to FS1 to PACN is annoying. Also a good amount of BIG 12 games, especially basketball will be on ESPN+.

So to watch the Wildcats in the BIG 12, you'll need a cable/satellite/live streaming service, and ESPN+. We'll see what the PAC comes up with if anything.

 

[Lefty]

Everything will be streaming soon enough. Disney is already making plans to bring ESPN channels direct to consumer. It would be preferable to have all of ASU games on one channel/app IMO. Bouncing around week to week from ESPN 2 to FS1 to PACN is annoying. Also a good amount of BIG 12 games, especially basketball will be on ESPN+.

So to watch the Wildcats in the BIG 12, you'll need a cable/satellite/live streaming service, and ESPN+. We'll see what the PACN comes up with if anything.

I have ESPN+, so that will not be a problem. I will be very glad if the UofA goes to the Big-12 because the Pac-12 conference will no longer be a top-5 conference after this year. If you are happy for ASU to be in an inferior conference, getting less money and having a hard time recruiting good athletes, that's fine with me. I would believe the majority of ASU fans would not be happy if ASU stays in the Pac-12 after this year.

 

[Folster]

I have ESPN+, so that will not be a problem. I will be very glad if the UofA goes to the Big-12 because the Pac-12 conference will no longer be a top-5 conference after this year. If you are happy for ASU to be in an inferior conference, getting less money and having a hard time recruiting good athletes, that's fine with me. I would believe the majority of ASU fans would not be happy if ASU stays in the Pac-12 after this year.

When it comes to football, UofA has been one of the worst programs in the Pac 12 in recent history. Going to the Big 12 and often playing 2-3 time zones away will likely stifle any potential renaissance the program may be experiencing. More money won't change the outcome as everybody in the Big 12 with better historical programs will have the same amount.

For basketball I see why it is appealing, but I also see downsides of no longer being the premier program in the conference. Losing a direct recruiting connection to CA could also present challenges.

Finally, money isn't everything. Nebraska has a lot more money now in the B1G than they ever did in Big 12.

 

[GatorAZ]

I hope Lil’ Bro follows us to the B12 so the rivalry continues however I think they’d have some animosity for UA by thinking they bolted and wouldn’t want a part of that. They could always do the Iowa/Iowa st thing where they play every year despite being in different conferences. It’s the P12 that ended the rivalry not Arizona, should it break the way it’s trending.

 

[Folster]

If the remaining three “corner” schools were to join CU, the Big 12 would actually make quite a bit of geographic sense. BYU and Texas Tech are logical (and historically frequent) opponents, and the other Texas schools probably make just as much sense as Wazzu. And I say that with regret, as I have enjoyed watching the Sun Devils when they visited Seattle, Corvallis or Pullman.

Having BYU and the other 4 corner schools in the Big 12 would satisfy me. Reuniting with Texas Tech from Border Conference days would also be cool. I'd really want SDSU to come along to keep a connection to CA, and I'd hope they would split the conference up into east and west divisions to foster regional rivalries.

 

[Absolute Zero]

More U of A posts here the last few days than in the last few months in the U of A football thread. Amazing. So much excitement.

 

[WiscoBird]

A lot of noise that Florida St and the ACC are negotiating a buyout. Just throwing stuff at the wall to see if it sticks so hear me out.......

The ACC knows Florida St, Clemson and Miami are going to leave eventually. Could the ACC give them a small break in exit fees so they can add teams and try to survive? The ACC has to be watching the PAC right now and saying to themselves if we don't do something now.......we are next.

 

[Folster]

A lot of noise that Florida St and the ACC are negotiating a buyout. Just throwing stuff at the wall to see if it sticks so hear me out.......

The ACC knows Florida St, Clemson and Miami are going to leave eventually. Could the ACC give them a small break in exit fees so they can add teams and try to survive? The ACC has to be watching the PAC right now and saying to themselves if we don't do something now.......we are next.

I'm not sure why the ACC would give FSU a break. By all accounts their GOR is rock solid until 2036. Maybe if we were in the same decade that their current deal expired, it could be possible. Also you'd think ESPN would have some incentive in keeping the ACC happy. Do they really want them in the SEC at $70 million a pop or losing teams to the B1G and Fox?

 

[Raindog]

When it comes to football, UofA has been one of the worst programs in the Pac 12 in recent history. Going to the Big 12 and often playing 2-3 time zones away will likely stifle any potential renaissance the program may be experiencing. More money won't change the outcome as everybody in the Big 12 with better historical programs will have the same amount.

For basketball I see why it is appealing, but I also see downsides of no longer being the premier program in the conference. Losing a direct recruiting connection to CA could also present challenges.

Finally, money isn't everything. Nebraska has a lot more money now in the B1G than they ever did in Big 12.

The "Nebraska effect" is coming for a lot of these schools changing to "bigger/better" conferences. USC/UCLA will begging the B10 to add more west coast schools after they watch their playoff hopes go up in smoke having to play December road games at Iowa, Wisconsin, Michigan, etc. And Texas/Oklahoma are going to both be even worse having to add more SEC powers to their regular schedule every year.

And Arizona is getting the worst of the deal. They move into conference where their football team won't be any better, and the their basketball dominance is going to be far less in a much better hoops conference.

Yes, they are all getting more money, but they are all also likely to slide in terms of national relevance... just like good ole Nebraska. The school can count its greenbacks, but I guarantee that a day doesn't go by where the Husker fanbase doesn't regret not staying in its old comfy conference where it ruled the roost.