Vick Struggling

[Duckjake]

Funny that you guys would use Brees as a comparison when San Diego used the #1 pick in the draft to take a QB just two years ago.

 

[Stout]

Funny that you guys would use Brees as a comparison when San Diego used the #1 pick in the draft to take a QB just two years ago.

Funny how that QB has yet to sniff the starting job. Funny how QBs take time to develop.

 

[AzWins23]

Vick also sucked in the Pro Bowl!

 

[FlagstaffDave]

Funny how that QB has yet to sniff the starting job. Funny how QBs take time to develop.

Funny how the Chargers seem very reluctant to part ways with Philip Rivers, or to give Brees that long term contract.

On the flip side I couldn't care less what Vick or Brees do, I'm interested in the Cardinals.

 

[Stout]

Funny how the Chargers seem very reluctant to part ways with Philip Rivers, or to give Brees that long term contract.

On the flip side I couldn't care less what Vick or Brees do, I'm interested in the Cardinals.

Hmm...Brees just had a major shoulder injury. That MIGHT play into it just a wee bit, don't you think? Jeez, come a little stronger with the logic, guys. Shane and I haven't even been challenged on this yet.

 

[SuperSpck]

Of course there is. But overall Atlantas running game is nothing to snivel at.

#1 in the NFL in Rushing Offense/Rushing Yards per game.

To which, as you can see above, Micheal Vick added some yardage worth mentioning of his own. Denver and Seattle were right behind the Falcons.

If Vick can cut down on his mistakes, then he becomes the most dangerous man at his position, as of right now, he's not.
Over the last 2 years Brees has looked like the better QB.

Pigmentation does not make or break a qb, nor does it define a roll or what type of qb that person has to be. The anti-Vick? Peyton Manning, the runner up? Byron Leftwich. Micheal Vick trivia: Which QB does Vick claim to most pattern himself after? Steve Young, greatest scrambling qb of all time (and multiple super bowl winner and record holder).
If you have to, check the skin color. Seems pretty balanced.

 

[BigDavis75]

Vick also sucked in the Pro Bowl!

This matters in what way?

 

[BigDavis75]

You have a complete and utter lack of shame, propriety, and sense of common decency. Label me a racist and I refuse to hold a discussion with you. Retract that immediately.

I reread my post and no where did I label you a racist. It is pretty much ignorant to say that Brees has a better shot at winning the SB when Vick has a better winning %, better playoff winning %, and has gotten farther in the playoffs.

 

[BigDavis75]

#1 in the NFL in Rushing Offense/Rushing Yards per game.

To which, as you can see above, Micheal Vick added some yardage worth mentioning of his own. Denver and Seattle were right behind the Falcons.

If Vick can cut down on his mistakes, then he becomes the most dangerous man at his position, as of right now, he's not.
Over the last 2 years Brees has looked like the better QB.

Pigmentation does not make or break a qb, nor does it define a roll or what type of qb that person has to be. The anti-Vick? Peyton Manning, the runner up? Byron Leftwich. Micheal Vick trivia: Which QB does Vick claim to most pattern himself after? Steve Young, greatest scrambling qb of all time (and multiple super bowl winner and record holder).
If you have to, check the skin color. Seems pretty balanced.

The threat of Vick also adds a lot, if he hands off and then bootlegs he draws at least one defender. Also, he is spyed a lot and Brees is almost never spyed on. Lets look at their playmakers vs. eachother. Brees has the better WRs, TE, and RB.... there is no contest there and yet Vick has won more than Brees and proved himself in the playoffs, it should be pretty obvious who the better player is.

 

[AzWins23]

Talk to me when Vick can play a full healthy season!

 

[Shane]

I reread my post and no where did I label you a racist. It is pretty much ignorant to say that Brees has a better shot at winning the SB when Vick has a better winning %, better playoff winning %, and has gotten farther in the playoffs.

No its not. Who cares what Vicks team has done in the past. It has no bearing on who has a better shot at the SB at this point in time. Brees is clearly the better QB he produces more points as a field general then Vick has or likely ever will.

 

[Shane]

The threat of Vick also adds a lot, if he hands off and then bootlegs he draws at least one defender. Also, he is spyed a lot and Brees is almost never spyed on. Lets look at their playmakers vs. eachother. Brees has the better WRs, TE, and RB.... there is no contest there and yet Vick has won more than Brees and proved himself in the playoffs, it should be pretty obvious who the better player is.

The threat of Vick adds nothing apparently. He has produced 15 less offensive TD's in the same 5 year career. Doesnt sound like that threat is turning into as many points as Drew Brees produces without that threat. So that blows that argument completely out of the water.

Yes Brees has a better individual RB. But the Falcons have the #1 rushing O in football. So sounds like pretty much a wash to me. You could argue that Crumpler is every bit as good as Gates. Especially if he had a QB that could get him the ball more regularly unlike Vick. Crumpler is an absolute stud at TE. Its definitely debatable on the WR's both teams have pretty much sucked at that position for years now.

Your right though it is very obvious that Brees is the better QB.

 

[Stout]

I reread my post and no where did I label you a racist. It is pretty much ignorant to say that Brees has a better shot at winning the SB when Vick has a better winning %, better playoff winning %, and has gotten farther in the playoffs.

Then what in the hell is this supposed to imply? Why would Brees be better? Is it just because he fills that white-guy precision passer mold?
If that's not what you meant to infer, then you need to refrain from making such sweeping and disgusting statements. Nobody, but nobody brought up race in this thread. You had no need to do so, and your reverting to that card is sad.

Vick has a better winning percentage? Hmm...the Falcons often have a high-ranked defense and, until this year, the Bolts did not. No, I've NEVER seen the Falcons D carry the team

 

[fball13]

I agree, Brees is a better passing quarterback than Vick... but with that said, who would you rather have on the Cards, Vick or Brees? I'd take Vick any day of the week. The reason is that although Brees is a good passing QB, he's nowhere near the best. He's not a gamebreaker. I'd take a below average passer who is a gamebreaker any day over an average passer.

 

[conraddobler]

Vick is a bit of an enigma.

The problem with him is that in order to use him correctly you are going to have to just give up on any form of traditional pocket passing offense.

He's probably the best athlete to ever play QB, but as a QB in a traditional sense he's not very good. A traditonal QB stays in the pocket and only runs when absolutely necessary for good reason, to avoid injury.

Vick isn't accuarte enough from the pocket to make teams pay tremendously for taking away his running. If he was he'd be all world but he's not.

Now if you were willing to accept the risk of letting him run at will and basically turning the offense upside down and pass from the pocket less than he runs then it would be almost unstoppable until of course he gets hurt then your whole offense is going to have to switch back to the more traditional type because the new QB isn't going to be anywhere near as good at running as he is.

Vick is just the latest example of how in today's NFL as in the past, passing from the pocket as a QB is a must because you already have RB's that handle the running and they are the weapon of choice if the Defense sells out to stop the pass.

Ideally what happens is that in a very balanced attack the Defense has to chose a way to die, if you can both run and pass then they can't take everything away and are basically at the offenses mercy. Teams that play him, play him like we did, drop a bunch of coverage back and avoid blitzing him other than to contain him, they avoid creating running lanes and just box him in and let him try to beat you with his arm, he can't do that and if he can't run he's not very effective.

I think what people envison is someone with Marino's arm and passing ability coupled with Vick's running ability, that's the Holy Grail, trouble is Vick isn't anywhere near Marino in passing the ball. If you ever got a player that could do both they'd be frightening and people know this and assume he's that guy.

He's not he can't pass well enough to be even close to that guy, passing to me is defined as hitting your target, not heaving the ball which Vick can do.

 

[Stout]

I agree, Brees is a better passing quarterback than Vick... but with that said, who would you rather have on the Cards, Vick or Brees? I'd take Vick any day of the week. The reason is that although Brees is a good passing QB, he's nowhere near the best. He's not a gamebreaker. I'd take a below average passer who is a gamebreaker any day over an average passer.

Disagree vehemently. At this point, if he's going to be healthy, I'd take Brees in a minute.

 

[Duckjake]

Funny how that QB has yet to sniff the starting job. Funny how QBs take time to develop.

That's irrelevant.

But anyway I just thought it odd that of all the guys you could have used to compare to Vick you picked a QB whose own team thought so little of him just two years ago that they used the #1 overall selection in the draft to acquire another QB.

 

[FlagstaffDave]

Disagree vehemently. At this point, if he's going to be healthy, I'd take Brees in a minute.

And you've made your point like a dozen times in this thread. We all get that you prefer Drew Brees, move on.

 

[spanky1]

I agree, Brees is a better passing quarterback than Vick... but with that said, who would you rather have on the Cards, Vick or Brees? I'd take Vick any day of the week. The reason is that although Brees is a good passing QB, he's nowhere near the best. He's not a gamebreaker. I'd take a below average passer who is a gamebreaker any day over an average passer.

WHAT.... Vick over Brees with the existing make up of our offense. Poor Fitz and Boldin will grow old before Vick knows they are even on the field.

 

[Shane]

And you've made your point like a dozen times in this thread. We all get that you prefer Drew Brees, move on.

You do realize what a message board is for right? Its called debate. You know point, counterpoint. Now that we got that straight have a nice day

 

[Shane]

I agree, Brees is a better passing quarterback than Vick... but with that said, who would you rather have on the Cards, Vick or Brees? I'd take Vick any day of the week. The reason is that although Brees is a good passing QB, he's nowhere near the best. He's not a gamebreaker. I'd take a below average passer who is a gamebreaker any day over an average passer.

Where is this Vick is a gamebreaker talk coming from? WHy the heck does is he responsible for 15 less offensive TD's if hes such a gamebreaker? Seems to me the guy that score more is more of a gamebreaker. Call me crazy.

 

[kerouac9]

Where is this Vick is a gamebreaker talk coming from? WHy the heck does is he responsible for 15 less offensive TD's if hes such a gamebreaker? Seems to me the guy that score more is more of a gamebreaker. Call me crazy.

I don't know. I'd call the guy that wins more games and leads his team to the playoffs and keeps his team from owning the #1 overall draft pick is more of the gamebreaker.

But that's just me. I mean, it's not like the Falcons are going to draft Michael Vick's replacement. Or that Drew Brees has gone to the Pro Bowl three times. Or won in the playoffs. If you really believed that it was about scoring TDs, you'd be championing Trent Green. Seriously: Drew Brees? The guy had one good season in a contract year. What a surprise. The Chargers asked more from him this year after LT got banged up and he fell back down to earth. I bet it's a little easier playing QB for a team when you're not among the top 2 players that the DC is concerned about.

Take Brees off the Chargers, and they're an 8-10 win team still. Take Vick off the Falcons, and they don't win 5 games. Who's better?

 

[FlagstaffDave]

You do realize what a message board is for right? Its called debate. You know point, counterpoint. Now that we got that straight have a nice day

No really? I didn't know this was a message board at all. Thanks for making things clear for me.

Just as he's welcome to his point I'm welcome to my point. And my point is he's made it known a dozen times that he favors Brees. Move on already. Who says that you need to share your theory over and over again just cause it's a message board?

Now that we got that straight have a nice day

 

[SuperSpck]

Everybody have a great day!!!

... except my boss at work. F him. Everyone else HAPPY!!!!!

 

[BigDavis75]

No its not. Who cares what Vicks team has done in the past. It has no bearing on who has a better shot at the SB at this point in time. Brees is clearly the better QB he produces more points as a field general then Vick has or likely ever will.

Wow.... can I completely discredit this post because you put these two statements together?

Whu cares what Vick...............in the past. That is simply stupid to say since all we can compare them on is past performances and Vick has been a better winner which is more important than any stat.

Are you always wrong?