What i Think

[JeffGollin]

To me, the most revealing thing about Leinart was that his old college coach (Pete Carroll) whose NFL team (Seattle) has been in need of a starting QB, didn't see fit to bring in Matt and sign him.

 

[daves]

Thanks Dave that's what I was talking about but better to have the exact words than my interpretation.

I had the same reaction you did I was pissed off that Matt didn't work harder here.

Thanks - yep, through all the rumors and hearsay implying that Leinart was lazy, part of me didn't want to believe it. Even Whisenhunt always publicly stood up for Leinart. There must've been something else, something more to the story, i thought! For some reason, despite his decent rookie season and pre-season stats, it seemed the team didn't respect Leinart and didn't want to follow him into battle. Whisenthunt only planned to demote him 2nd string, but Leinart would have none of that, and asked to be released.

To finally hear that Leinart ultimately admitted that he didn't work hard enough - even with Kurt Warner providing the ultimate example of what it takes for UDFA to become a league and Super Bowl MVP! - was simultaneously infuriating, and in a sense, a relief. No longer can the Whisenhunt bashers claim that Whis "ruined" Leinart, or didn't give him a fair chance. Leinart screwed Whis, the Cardinals, every fan who hoped for long-term success with a young talented QB, and himself, by being exactly the entitled, lazy primadonna that so many people perceived him to be.

What a huge, disappointing, cathartic revelation.

...dave

 

[Shane]

Thanks - yep, through all the rumors and hearsay implying that Leinart was lazy, part of me didn't want to believe it. Even Whisenhunt always publicly stood up for Leinart. There must've been something else, something more to the story, i thought! For some reason, despite his decent rookie season and pre-season stats, it seemed the team didn't respect Leinart and didn't want to follow him into battle. Whisenthunt only planned to demote him 2nd string, but Leinart would have none of that, and asked to be released.

To finally hear that Leinart ultimately admitted that he didn't work hard enough - even with Kurt Warner providing the ultimate example of what it takes for UDFA to become a league and Super Bowl MVP! - was simultaneously infuriating, and in a sense, a relief. No longer can the Whisenhunt bashers claim that Whis "ruined" Leinart, or didn't give him a fair chance. Leinart screwed Whis, the Cardinals, every fan who hoped for long-term success with a young talented QB, and himself, by being exactly the entitled, lazy primadonna that so many people perceived him to be.

What a huge, disappointing, cathartic revelation.

...dave

Perfectly stated Dave!

 

[az1965]

I had the same reaction you did I was pissed off that Matt didn't work harder here.

What a loser... I was excited when he dropped into our lap on draft day but has been such a huge disappointment.

 

[az1965]

Thanks - yep, through all the rumors and hearsay implying that Leinart was lazy, part of me didn't want to believe it. Even Whisenhunt always publicly stood up for Leinart. There must've been something else, something more to the story, i thought! For some reason, despite his decent rookie season and pre-season stats, it seemed the team didn't respect Leinart and didn't want to follow him into battle. Whisenthunt only planned to demote him 2nd string, but Leinart would have none of that, and asked to be released.

To finally hear that Leinart ultimately admitted that he didn't work hard enough - even with Kurt Warner providing the ultimate example of what it takes for UDFA to become a league and Super Bowl MVP! - was simultaneously infuriating, and in a sense, a relief. No longer can the Whisenhunt bashers claim that Whis "ruined" Leinart, or didn't give him a fair chance. Leinart screwed Whis, the Cardinals, every fan who hoped for long-term success with a young talented QB, and himself, by being exactly the entitled, lazy primadonna that so many people perceived him to be.

What a huge, disappointing, cathartic revelation.

...dave

 

[Snakester]

Nice post Mitch! I think we found our backup center in Rich Ohrnberger. I love the way this guy plays. He finishes every block and plays with attitude. I would start him over Sendlein. When you get a chance focus in on his play against Oakland at center. He played RG against KC and did a good job, but he will make a very good center.

 

[Mitch]

Nice post Mitch! I think we found our backup center in Rich Ohrnberger. I love the way this guy plays. He finishes every block and plays with attitude. I would start him over Sendlein. When you get a chance focus in on his play against Oakland at center. He played RG against KC and did a good job, but he will make a very good center.

I did notice that the coaches switched Ohrnberger to 2nd team C ahead of Ross Hochstein, whom i thought played well at 2nd team C the week before. That would likely indicate that the coaches are higher on Ohrnberger.

Gary---whom would you play at LT?

I think the Cardinals should see what Batiste could do there---Batiste played well as the 2nd team LT last pre-season.

Do you see upside in D.J. Young?

Like his size---but he seems slow off the ball. And i am surprised that Nate Potter is behind Young on the depth chart.

What would you think about trying to sign Chad Clifton and reuniting him on the left side with Daryn Colledge?

The Pats appear to be interested in Clifton---if his back is ok.

 

[Duckjake]

Nice post Mitch! I think we found our backup center in Rich Ohrnberger. I love the way this guy plays. He finishes every block and plays with attitude. I would start him over Sendlein. When you get a chance focus in on his play against Oakland at center. He played RG against KC and did a good job, but he will make a very good center.

As long as he remembers he's supposed to snap the ball to the QB and not himself.

 

[red desert]

I did notice that the coaches switched Ohrnberger to 2nd team C ahead of Ross Hochstein, whom i thought played well at 2nd team C the week before. That would likely indicate that the coaches are higher on Ohrnberger.

Gary---whom would you play at LT?

I think the Cardinals should see what Batiste could do there---Batiste played well as the 2nd team LT last pre-season.

Do you see upside in D.J. Young?

Like his size---but he seems slow off the ball. And i am surprised that Nate Potter is behind Young on the depth chart.

What would you think about trying to sign Chad Clifton and reuniting him on the left side with Daryn Colledge?

The Pats appear to be interested in Clifton---if his back is ok.

What are your thoughts on Kelemente at LT? Most potential kinda thing. I believe he played LT in college and while i've read he may lack the agility to handle pro speed rushers, why not give that a shot? I would given our options. That's if they decided Bridges isn't the answer.

 

[82CardsGrad]

1. The Cardinals decided they would pay Kolb the $7M even if he was to be the backup to start---figuring they might get lucky at some point.

2. They are NOT going to cut Kolb.

Agree...

3. They are higher on Lindley than they ever have been with Skelton.

Totally agree - which, is why I continue to say that Lindley will be our 2013 starter.

7. William Powell---when he made that classic stop and go move for the TD, just raced up to not only making the roster, but factoring into playing time.

8. Powell---is sneaky tough between the tackles as well and at the goal-line.

Totally agree. I think he's a better RB than LSH actually! Love LSH and he NEEDS to be on this team. But, Powell is a keeper for sure!

9. The Cardinals' designated ST aces ALL stick: Adams, LSH. Sherman, Bethel.

Dude - how do you not have Peterson on this list??

 

[Mitch]

What are your thoughts on Kelemente at LT? Most potential kinda thing. I believe he played LT in college and while i've read he may lack the agility to handle pro speed rushers, why not give that a shot? I would given our options. That's if they decided Bridges isn't the answer.

RD---Kelemete has looked very good at guard. He's more than athletic and strong enough to play LT--- liked the way he played LT last year at UW. But--- don't see the coaches moving him there now.

Chad Clifton is available---he says his back feels good. We made out pretty well with Daryn Colledge. So i would like to see Batiste and Clifton compete for the job---and keep Bridges at RT until Massie is ready. Then Bridges goes back to his swing role.

53 Man Prediction---What The Cardinals Are Thinking (8/20/12)

QB (3): SKELTON, Kolb, Lindley
RB (4): WILLIAMS, Wells, Stephens-Howling, Powell
FB (1): SHERMAN
WR (5): FITZGERALD, ROBERTS, Doucet, Floyd, Byrd
OL (9): BATISTE, COLLEDGE, SENDLEIN, SNYDER, BRIDGES, Massie, Kelemete, Ohrnsberger, Young/Potter winner
TE (3): KING, Heap, Housler
NT (2): WILLIAMS, Eason
DE (4): DOCKETT, CAMPBELL, Carter, Holliday
LB (9): ACHO, WASHINGTON, BRADLEY, HAGGANS, Schofield, Walker, Lenon, Groves, Nash
CB (5): PETERSON, GAY, Fleming, Jefferson, Adams
S (5): WILSON, RHODES, Johnson, Sanders, Bethel
ST (3): FEELY, LEACH, ZASTUDIL
PS (8): RB-Smith (if eligible---if not, WR-TBA); T-Young/Potter loser, C/G-Wedige, TE-Skelton, DE/DT-Cohen (if eligible, if not, Lumpkin), LB-Parker, CB-Parker, S-Gideon.

 

[Mitch]

Agree...



Totally agree - which, is why I continue to say that Lindley will be our 2013 starter.



Totally agree. I think he's a better RB than LSH actually! Love LSH and he NEEDS to be on this team. But, Powell is a keeper for sure!



Dude - how do you not have Peterson on this list??

I was just listing ST aces who might be on the bubble.

 

[82CardsGrad]

RD---Kelemete has looked very good at guard. He's more than athletic and strong enough to play LT--- liked the way he played LT last year at UW. But--- don't see the coaches moving him there now.

Kelemete is not at all ready for LT. He needs to learn a ton and above that, needs to build size, speed and STRENGTH - which has always been questioned with him.

 

[82CardsGrad]

I was just listing ST aces who might be on the bubble.

You really thought LSH and Sherman were on the bubble??

 

[LarryStalling]

Not that I am advocating it, but with Wells supposed lack of toughness, I wonder if he is immune to a visit from the Turk?

 

[john h]

That makes no sense. You don't pay the $7M unless you expect Kolb to play well enough to win the starting job.



On what in the world do you base this?? The Cardinals traded into the 5th round to pick Skelton; they waited for the 6th to draft Lindley. Skelton has proven capable of winning NFL games. So far this preseason, Skelton has a 77 passer rating against mostly first string defenses; Lindley has a 49 rating against 3rd and 4th stringers. In college, Skelton was more accurate (FWIW!) than Lindley.



These two statements certainly seem contradictory.

Whisenhunt may not be good at scouting QBs, but as far as building their confidence... he certainly helped build Warner's, seems to be doing a good job with Skelton and Lindley, and heck even UDFA Max Hall was somehow imbued with enough confidence to win a game.

It was recently confirmed that Leinart, despite all of Whisenhunt's supportive public statements that he was working hard, in fact never bothered to put in the time to reach his potential. Should Whis have babied him to "build his confidence"? Eventually Whis made it clear that he'd have to compete for his job, but that didn't seem to be sufficient to get Leinart's attention. Seems as though it took being cut and seeing how little interest there was in his services for him to realize that he needed to start getting serious about football.

Kolb certainly talks as though he's confident - but Whisenhunt needs to know whether he'll play with confidence when he's put in a difficult situation. He's in his 6th year, he certainly shouldn't need to be given easy plays to run at this stage of his career just to build his confidence.

Heck, even Bartel and St. Pierre seemed to have plenty of confidence and probably reached their maximum potentials.

So exactly whose confidence did Whisenhunt fail to build???



Oh, brother!

...dave

Until you can look into a guys brain you really do not know for sure how much confidence he has. We do know that you can build confidence with some success at your position.

Warner did not need any help from Whiz or anyone else when it came to confidence. He seems to have been born with it. It was in his DNA. From bagging groceries to all pro or hall of fame sort of shows a bit of confidence. Warner was running the offense not whiz.

 

[Mitch]

You really thought LSH and Sherman were on the bubble??

No---although some posters have been questioning LSH now that Powell has emerged. But, Sherman is a lock---you are correct, sir.

 

[joeshmo]

Here is where I think Wiz has messed up in the QB battle. He is way to scared for one of them to get injured. He will not allowed either one of them to play behind anything but the 1st team OL.

How can you find out who your QB starter will be when your 4th stringer has just as many attempts as the two guys fighting for a starting spot. That would be fine if there wasn't a competition going on.

Passing Attempts -
Kolb - 15
Skelton - 15
Lindley - 42
Bartell - 13

How the heck can you know who the starter will be when each one is only getting 5 attempts per game? Peyton Manning coming off of 3 neck surgeries has 30 attempts in only 2 games. There is something wrong when you are giving your 3rd string QB more then double the attempts of the two guys supposedly fighting for the starting job.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Here is where I think Wiz has messed up in the QB battle. He is way to scared for one of them to get injured. He will not allowed either one of them to play behind anything but the 1st team OL.

How can you find out who your QB starter will be when your 4th stringer has just as many attempts as the two guys fighting for a starting spot. That would be fine if there wasn't a competition going on.

Passing Attempts -
Kolb - 15
Skelton - 15
Lindley - 42
Bartell - 13

How the heck can you know who the starter will be when each one is only getting 5 attempts per game? Peyton Manning coming off of 3 neck surgeries has 30 attempts in only 2 games. There is something wrong when you are giving your 3rd string QB more then double the attempts of the two guys supposedly fighting for the starting job.

call me crazy, but I really think he's limiting BOTH of them so that he can start Kolb, basically by saying EXACTLY what he said after the last game, that Skelton wasn't in there long enough to be evaluated... and if need be, Kolb hasn't been in there long enough to have the job taken away from him... even though there's no universe in which the job should be his from the get go.

 

[PJ1]

Here is where I think Wiz has messed up in the QB battle. He is way to scared for one of them to get injured. He will not allowed either one of them to play behind anything but the 1st team OL.

How can you find out who your QB starter will be when your 4th stringer has just as many attempts as the two guys fighting for a starting spot. That would be fine if there wasn't a competition going on.

Passing Attempts -
Kolb - 15
Skelton - 15
Lindley - 42
Bartell - 13

How the heck can you know who the starter will be when each one is only getting 5 attempts per game? Peyton Manning coming off of 3 neck surgeries has 30 attempts in only 2 games. There is something wrong when you are giving your 3rd string QB more then double the attempts of the two guys supposedly fighting for the starting job.

Same question I had about Skelton's limited playing time vs Oakland. Unless of course the decision has been made. But even then Skelton needs work.

 

[PJ1]

call me crazy, but I really think he's limiting BOTH of them so that he can start Kolb, basically by saying EXACTLY what he said after the last game, that Skelton wasn't in there long enough to be evaluated... and if need be, Kolb hasn't been in there long enough to have the job taken away from him... even though there's no universe in which the job should be his from the get go.

Unless Kolb plays lights out Thursday he isn't starting. Whis and the Cards would be mocked endlessly if Kolb starts. Imagine the fans after Mr Chicken without a head throws his first pick or get sacked in the opener.

 

[desertdawg]

Good thread title and comments in here, but yall don't wanna know what I think, Whiz pissed in my Cheerios the day he kept Grimm around. I've wanted the 2 te sets, especially since we had Levi over there. Now a 2 te set is like a piece of bubblegum to fix the dam. Might as well drop the shotgun all together, unless it's 3rd down and 40 yards to go. We need gobs and gobs of 2 TE sets mixed with 2 backs in the back feild, it should literally just be a #s game for us now....how many bodies can we stick back there??? Bread and butter being play action when we do want to pass. We are sooo screwed, it isn't a QB competition anymore, it's more like the show Survivor (I just wonder who will get voted off our island next???), add Whiz to the equation and it's like a twilight zone episode of the Truman Show. Don't tell darkside I am worried about the O-line though, I've been playing it off for days now.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Unless Kolb plays lights out Thursday he isn't starting. Whis and the Cards would be mocked endlessly if Kolb starts. Imagine the fans after Mr Chicken without a head throws his first pick or get sacked in the opener.

dude... we went into a season with DA and Max Hall. I don't think Wiz cares about being mocked endlessly.

 

[Bodha]

I hope we do cut Kolb. Dude sucks.


Badly. I see rookies like Kirk Cousins and Wilson (seahawks) outplaying him. What the heck is the issue here? He is a horrible QB and NFL player. If it werent for the trade and his pay, hed be cut now to make room for a new LT.

 

[PJ1]

dude... we went into a season with DA and Max Hall. I don't think Wiz cares about being mocked endlessly.

Good point but I do believe he paid a price for that with Michael B. Not so sure he gets away unscathed if this QB situation blows up.