What pick would you need to get to trade Josh Rosen or is he completely off the table?

[PACardsFan]

Trust me I do have skepticism on Rosen. However, I do have a problem with scrapping a 1st round pick when he was thrown to the wolves with a terrible coaching staff and supporting cast. Good lord aikman, manning and others had terrible first years only to greatly improve as their supporting cast improved.

You can not compare the Aikman/Manning era of the NFL to the game today. On the offensive side of the ball, it’s entirely different. I was happy that we moved up & drafted Rosen. We needed to do that. Now, there’s an opportunity to upgrade the QB position again. That position is so critical, that you pull the trigger again. It’s that easy. If that kid from Clemson continues to improve & we can draft him in 2 years, then you consider taking him. Unless of course, Murray wins a a SB for us & is considered of to the top 3 QB’s in the NFL.

 

[oaken1]

We’ll wait and see if Rosen has a better career than Murray. You’re going to be disappointed. That’s not saying that Rosen can’t play in the NFL. It’s just that Murray will be a superstar.

look back at last years draft threads. I was not a rosen fan...Darnold and Mayfield were my guys. I didnt like rosen and I only support him because he is on the cards
but he is a better prospect than kyler murray even now.

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

Based on obvious talent, you have to be able to project how successful a player may be. There’s no guarantees in sports or life for that matter. But, when you take a player, who then is the BEST player on the field, from the time he’s a youngster, through HS (never lost a game), then through college, then it’s not a reach to say he’ll be a superstar at the next level. We’ll wait and see. I’ll gladly eat crow if we stay put and Rosen wins a SB for us. Or multiple SB’s for us. I want nothing more than to see that. I just think we have a better chance of seeing that with Murray than with Rosen. I’ve said it a million times, that I hope & pray that I’m wrong! If Rosen takes us to the promised land, I’ll have no shame in conceding that I was wrong.

Imo, the only thing Murray has on rosen right now QB wise is the fact he can scramble & is fast. I don't think he's any more accurate passing the ball than Rosen. Best defense Oklahoma played all yr in Murray's 1 yr as the starter was Alabama, in that game Murray made some good-great throws yes but he also could've & should've been picked off on several ones. Basically same as rosen good & bad. Murray seems to struggle with the shorter to intermediate throws. Rosen has a yr under his belt already, why start over when rosen was in a no win situation? The Cardinals did think enough of him to make a trade & move to #10 for him. No one to blame but themselves for putting that kind of team around him & throwing him into the fire after paying another QB 20 million & shutting him down comepletely after 3 games. The Cardinals need too many players to draft another QB.

 

[b8rtm8nn]

Like Krang, I am supportive if they move on from Rosen to Murray. I haven’t seen the hype yet, so if anyone can post videos of his games (his every snap, not just highlights) that show his ceiling (the Alabama game showed the same issues Rosen has), I would be appreciative.

Right now, I wouldn’t make the trade of Rosen, even if we took Murray. I would hold both of them until one made the decision for me.

 

[Jetstream Green]

Based on obvious talent, you have to be able to project how successful a player may be. There’s no guarantees in sports or life for that matter. But, when you take a player, who then is the BEST player on the field, from the time he’s a youngster, through HS (never lost a game), then through college, then it’s not a reach to say he’ll be a superstar at the next level. We’ll wait and see. I’ll gladly eat crow if we stay put and Rosen wins a SB for us. Or multiple SB’s for us. I want nothing more than to see that. I just think we have a better chance of seeing that with Murray than with Rosen. I’ve said it a million times, that I hope & pray that I’m wrong! If Rosen takes us to the promised land, I’ll have no shame in conceding that I was wrong.

Actually, it appears you're citing athletic speed and quickness (traits also found in WRs) if your definition of talent means Murray is more talented as a QB. As far as footwork, release, and passing in general, Rosen is one of the most polished and form accurate QBs to come out in sometime and why he was highly acknowledge from a very early age. Not saying Murray cannot sling it or he's not actually a pocket passer (simply, is very mobile which is something which benefits him) but he does not have Rosen's throwing traits

 

[PACardsFan]

Actually, it appears you're citing athletic speed and quickness (traits also found in WRs) if your definition of talent means Murray is more talented as a QB. As far as footwork, release, and passing in general, Rosen is one of the most polished and form accurate QBs to come out in sometime and why he was highly acknowledge from a very early age. Not saying Murray cannot sling it or he's not actually a pocket passer (simply, is very mobile which is something which benefits him) but he does not have Rosen's throwing traits

A QB’s release can sometimes be equated with a Pro golfer’s swing. Some are mechanically perfect, and others are simply repeatable. I’ve seen so many beautiful golf swings that don’t result in winning. The same can be said for some QB’s who had perfect mechanics. If Rosen’s footwork & mechanics are so perfect, then why isn’t his accuracy better. He never had jaw dropping accuracy at any level. He drove me crazy while at UCLA. He would throw a beautiful seam route & then overthrow a wide open receiver on the very next throw. I completely understand that he was under duress last year, but even with an open pocket, his misses were routinely high. Show me a QB who misses high & I’ll show you a turnover machine. Murray can do pretty much everything. What he does best is WIN. I haven’t seen that with Rosen. I couldn’t tell you about his HS team, but he certainly didn’t show me he was a winner at UCLA. I won’t hold him accountable for last year, but I didn’t see anything that would make me trust that his leadership skills would make those around him better. I don’t care if he’s only been here 1 year. If KK thinks Murray can run his offense better than Rosen, then he should force the Cardinals to draft him. Plain & simple. QB’s win championships in the NFL.

 

[UK Cardinal]

And Kyler routinely under threw passes what is the difference, why bet the franchise on a second questionable QB in 2 years?

We just want a sensible decision one time, take an edge rusher to help Jones and make the secondary's life a bit easier

2 risks don't make a sure thing, boom or bust is not a good business model

 

[Jetstream Green]

A QB’s release can sometimes be equated with a Pro golfer’s swing. Some are mechanically perfect, and others are simply repeatable. I’ve seen so many beautiful golf swings that don’t result in winning. The same can be said for some QB’s who had perfect mechanics. If Rosen’s footwork & mechanics are so perfect, then why isn’t his accuracy better. He never had jaw dropping accuracy at any level. He drove me crazy while at UCLA. He would throw a beautiful seam route & then overthrow a wide open receiver on the very next throw. I completely understand that he was under duress last year, but even with an open pocket, his misses were routinely high. Show me a QB who misses high & I’ll show you a turnover machine. Murray can do pretty much everything. What he does best is WIN. I haven’t seen that with Rosen. I couldn’t tell you about his HS team, but he certainly didn’t show me he was a winner at UCLA. I won’t hold him accountable for last year, but I didn’t see anything that would make me trust that his leadership skills would make those around him better. I don’t care if he’s only been here 1 year. If KK thinks Murray can run his offense better than Rosen, then he should force the Cardinals to draft him. Plain & simple. QB’s win championships in the NFL.

You did not see 'anything' regarding his leadership skills, not even that one game in the huddle where he said we are going to win this '#$%^' and they did win on that drive

 

[Crimson Warrior]

How can you say that? He hasn’t taken a snap from under center, thrown into one nfl coverage, faced one nfl defense or exotic blitz or has had to get after two or three hits from a real nfl pro player.

Slanidrac16, I share PACards's confidence in Murray's pro future. And here's why:

I watched every snap Murray took this past season. Watched every game. Most of the time, I watched each game twice. Lots of the plays in slow-mo.

What I saw was a guy making play after play after play after play. With his arm, and with his legs.

From the pocket, and in the broken field.

At the beginning of games, and in crunch time.

Look at his stat line against ISU, the 33rd ranked defense in the country:

2018-09-15 Oklahoma @ Iowa State 21/29 (72.4 %) for 348. 3 TDs 0 Int Rating 207. + 77 yards rushing


or vs TCU, the 24th ranked defense in country:

2018-10-20 Oklahoma @ Texas Christian 19/24 (79.2 %) for 213 4 TDs 0 Int Rating 208.7 + 51 yards rushing.

Murray was absolutely unstoppable. All season, every game (save one quarter vs the 16th ranked defense). People say he had a great supporting cast, but I'm telling you that without a doubt Slaindrac, without a doubt, he meant more to the OU offense than Mayfield did in 2017. He carried the offense more than Mayfield did in 2017.

One last thing. Murray is seriously clutch. Because of it's horrific defense, OU was in a lot of close games this past year. Murray made a lot of plays late in games with all the pressure in the world firmly on his shoulders. Didn't bother him sir. Not one bit. In the 4th quarter, he was money.

So. In conclusion, I'm a believer because I watched the greatest season ever by a QB unfold right in front of my eyes Slaindrac16. Watched the whole thing in HD man. And If you did the same, I think you would have the same confidence in Murray's future that I have.

 

[The Kraken]

Crimson,

Are you really comparing Iowa St and TCU to NFL defenses?

REALLY?

 

[Crimson Warrior]

Crimson,

Are you really comparing Iowa St and TCU to NFL defenses?

REALLY?

Where did I say that Kraken? Where did I even try to imply that? Come on man, be fair.

No. What I am saying is that after watching him annihilate opposing defenses all year long, I'm confident that he has the talent, and the innate ability, to be very successful in the NFL.

 

[slanidrac16]

Slanidrac16, I share PACards's confidence in Murray's pro future. And here's why:

I watched every snap Murray took this past season. Watched every game. Most of the time, I watched each game twice. Lots of the plays in slow-mo.

What I saw was a guy making play after play after play after play. With his arm, and with his legs.

From the pocket, and in the broken field.

At the beginning of games, and in crunch time.

Look at his stat line against ISU, the 33rd ranked defense in the country:

2018-09-15 Oklahoma @ Iowa State 21/29 (72.4 %) for 348. 3 TDs 0 Int Rating 207. + 77 yards rushing


or vs TCU, the 24th ranked defense in country:

2018-10-20 Oklahoma @ Texas Christian 19/24 (79.2 %) for 213 4 TDs 0 Int Rating 208.7 + 51 yards rushing.

Murray was absolutely unstoppable. All season, every game (save one quarter vs the 16th ranked defense). People say he had a great supporting cast, but I'm telling you that without a doubt Slaindrac, without a doubt, he meant more to the OU offense than Mayfield did in 2017. He carried the offense more than Mayfield did in 2017.

One last thing. Murray is seriously clutch. Because of it's horrific defense, OU was in a lot of close games this past year. Murray made a lot of plays late in games with all the pressure in the world firmly on his shoulders. Didn't bother him sir. Not one bit. In the 4th quarter, he was money.

So. In conclusion, I'm a believer because I watched the greatest season ever by a QB unfold right in front of my eyes Slaindrac16. Watched the whole thing in HD man. And If you did the same, I think you would have the same confidence in Murray's future that I have.

I get your passion. But it’s hard to believe he will do that against bigger faster nfl defenses with complex blitzing packages, tighter coverages with faster db’s. He seems to have never really been hit . How will that affect him? Bottom line is this . I believe kingsbury is going to really rejuvenate this offense. I want him to have every tool he needs to light up the scoreboard. If he convinced Kiem and the cardinals that Murray would be a game changer then I will back him all the way and be excited about it.

 

[The Kraken]

CW,

I am fair, but you are comparing apples and oranges...

Minshew looked unstoppable for WASH ST, that dude will be an UDFA

He is a supremely talented college player, who played on a powerhouse team, OU is a juggernaut, you guys have done a terrific job building that program and it shows...he will not be on a team the overmatches its opponents like OU did.

 

[Crimson Warrior]

I get your passion. But it’s hard to believe he will do that against bigger faster nfl defenses with complex blitzing packages, tighter coverages with faster db’s. He seems to have never really been hit . How will that affect him? Bottom line is this . I believe kingsbury is going to really rejuvenate this offense. I want him to have every tool he needs to light up the scoreboard. If he convinced Kiem and the cardinals that Murray would be a game changer then I will back him all the way and be excited about it.

Very fair and reasonable sir. You're a credit to our fan base.

I will follow your example, and pledge my undivided support for Rosen, if SK and KK decide that he's our best option.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Slanidrac16, I share PACards's confidence in Murray's pro future. And here's why:

I watched every snap Murray took this past season. Watched every game. Most of the time, I watched each game twice. Lots of the plays in slow-mo.

What I saw was a guy making play after play after play after play. With his arm, and with his legs.

From the pocket, and in the broken field.

At the beginning of games, and in crunch time.

Look at his stat line against ISU, the 33rd ranked defense in the country:

2018-09-15 Oklahoma @ Iowa State 21/29 (72.4 %) for 348. 3 TDs 0 Int Rating 207. + 77 yards rushing


or vs TCU, the 24th ranked defense in country:

2018-10-20 Oklahoma @ Texas Christian 19/24 (79.2 %) for 213 4 TDs 0 Int Rating 208.7 + 51 yards rushing.

Murray was absolutely unstoppable. All season, every game (save one quarter vs the 16th ranked defense). People say he had a great supporting cast, but I'm telling you that without a doubt Slaindrac, without a doubt, he meant more to the OU offense than Mayfield did in 2017. He carried the offense more than Mayfield did in 2017.

One last thing. Murray is seriously clutch. Because of it's horrific defense, OU was in a lot of close games this past year. Murray made a lot of plays late in games with all the pressure in the world firmly on his shoulders. Didn't bother him sir. Not one bit. In the 4th quarter, he was money.

So. In conclusion, I'm a believer because I watched the greatest season ever by a QB unfold right in front of my eyes Slaindrac16. Watched the whole thing in HD man. And If you did the same, I think you would have the same confidence in Murray's future that I have.

I am a Rosen guy. Heck I have his jersey. I believe he will be a very good QB.

After watching a ton of film I believe Murray will be a star. Rosen could be too but it will be harder for him

 

[Crimson Warrior]

CW,

I am fair, but you are comparing apples and oranges...

Minshew looked unstoppable for WASH ST, that dude will be an UDFA

He is a supremely talented college player, who played on a powerhouse team, OU is a juggernaut, you guys have done a terrific job building that program and it shows...he will not be on a team the overmatches its opponents like OU did.

Again, I'm not comparing anything. I'm not saying there's a strong correlation between college success and pro success. What i am saying is that I, like you, believe Murray is supremely talented.

Arm strength, accuracy, vision, intelligence, work ethic, mobility. He has it all, and his college performance merely supports this conclusion.

I'm not saying he'll be successful in the NFL because he torched Baylor. But I am saying that he'll be successful because he has all the physical and mental qualities you would want an NFL QB to have, and then some. I'm confident his talent and innate ability will translate to success at the next level. If you're not, okay, I accept that.

 

[The Kraken]

CW,

Time will tell...time will tell...

 

[Crimson Warrior]

I am a Rosen guy. Heck I have his jersey. I believe he will be a very good QB.

After watching a ton of film I believe Murray will be a star. Rosen could be too but it will be harder for him

Very gracious post sir. It speaks well of you.

If Rosen is our starter for 2019, in my humble opinion, I believe he will eventually prosper in KK's offense. I agree with those who say that if you put the correct pieces around JR, that he can perform at a high level. Perhaps a very high level.

 

[slanidrac16]

One thing you can bank on. No matter what Kiem does with this qb decision he is going to get absolutely ROASTED here on the board and on national tv. And it won’t end until his decision proves to be the correct one. If we trade Rosen and he blossoms, he gets roasted. If he keeps Rosen and he fails, he gets roasted. If he keeps Rosen and Murray takes the nfl by storm , he gets roasted. If he takes Murray and he bombs , he gets roasted. This is going to be a crazy month and a half.

 

[Shane]

I am a Rosen guy. Heck I have his jersey. I believe he will be a very good QB.

After watching a ton of film I believe Murray will be a star. Rosen could be too but it will be harder for him

OMG they sucked you in hook line and sinker..lol

 

[Chris_Sanders]

OMG they sucked you in hook line and sinker..lol

It's not they. I was so against drafting him that I watched all this film ready to be like F Murray.


I wanted to find reasons to not like him but the tape is phenomenal.

I mean it beats you down.

I still believe Rosen will be excellent but I understand why there is a Murray hype train now

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Also internet finally changes a man's opinion. Film at 11

 

[b8rtm8nn]

It's not they. I was so against drafting him that I watched all this film ready to be like F Murray.


I wanted to find reasons to not like him but the tape is phenomenal.

I mean it beats you down.

I still believe Rosen will be excellent but I understand why there is a Murray hype train now

Can you link the games here? I only saw the Alabama game and saw potential, but not as great as some have claimed.

 

[Shane]

It's not they. I was so against drafting him that I watched all this film ready to be like F Murray.


I wanted to find reasons to not like him but the tape is phenomenal.

I mean it beats you down.

I still believe Rosen will be excellent but I understand why there is a Murray hype train now

I get it. But 5'10" and the shortest arms in NFL history doesn't bode well for his future in the NFL.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Can you link the games here? I only saw the Alabama game and saw potential, but not as great as some have claimed.

Watch the West Virginia game. At the time they were a top 15 team.

He just wrecks them solo . At one point he outruns their whole team on a scramble

I won't be surprised if he runs a 4.4 as a QB while being hyper accurate

I honestly have never seen a speedy to accuracy combo like Murray. So again I love Rosen. Rosen is a fantastic pocket QB

Murray is something I have never seen before.