What Will It Take to Beat the Spurs Next Season?

[azirish]

ok..

so just dump the ball to amare in the post.

Amare does not set up in the post like he did early in his career. Since he was not able to really practice until after the season started, it is not clear how much he's worked on his low post moves and passing out of the double team. For that reason, I don't think they ever developd a classic two man game like the stuff the Spurs go to get the ball to Duncan in the low post.

BTW, Boris is probably the better low post player though he's not aggressive enough. He's got great moves and passes out of the double team better than anyone.[/quote]

btw,
did marion and diaw did they lob play this season?

Yes. Actually several guys did lob passes to Marion including Amare. Teams began to really concentrate on watching for the backdoor lob no matter who had the ball because it was such a huge threat.

 

[dodie53]

someone should bring boris to a UFC fight or something..
for him to be aggressive and tough..

=)

 

[Covert Rain]

Amare does not set up in the post like he did early in his career. Since he was not able to really practice until after the season started, it is not clear how much he's worked on his low post moves and passing out of the double team. For that reason, I don't think they ever developd a classic two man game like the stuff the Spurs go to get the ball to Duncan in the low post.

BTW, Boris is probably the better low post player though he's not aggressive enough. He's got great moves and passes out of the double team better than anyone.

Yes. Actually several guys did lob passes to Marion including Amare. Teams began to really concentrate on watching for the backdoor lob no matter who had the ball because it was such a huge threat.[/quote]

If you listened to D'Antoni he also said that he stayed away from Amare doing very many back to the back plays because of his knees. I would guess that if Amare's knees hold up we might see more of that next season.

 

[azirish]

If you listened to D'Antoni he also said that he stayed away from Amare doing very many back to the back plays because of his knees. I would guess that if Amare's knees hold up we might see more of that next season.

I hadn't heard that, but it makes sense. It is the same problem Amare has in defending the post.

 

[cly2tw]

Ugggggghhhh at the idea of taking on Pietrus. The guy is the poor man's version of the poor man's version of Marion.

It be no problem if Marion is paid how he should be paid, and a poor man's version of him paid like a poor man's version. Nobody says Marion is a bad player. The point against him is for the cap space he occupies, we could do better.

 

[cly2tw]

I'm not a fan of getting Pietrus either.

For some reason there is a belief that the Suns need more guys who do best when running. Right now the Suns problem is not running, it's when they can't run.

Pietrus has been shooting much better this year than in past years (46.8% and 38.8% for three), but his stats were pretty bad before in the half court oriented game they played.

GS don't have good half court game to start with. And you certainly don't expect a poor man's Marion to do well there. Pietrus is a good perimeter defender, actually slightly better than Marion there, and has a better shot than Marion. Put him to an offense around Amare, Nash, and Diaw in half court, he'd be a better fit than Marion for much much less money.

 

[az1965]

Q: What Will It Take to Beat the Spurs Next Season?

A: Keep the team intact. Get couple of solid bench players. Hit D'Antoni on head hard to make him use his bench.

 

[Folster]

Plantar fasciitis.

 

[Cheesebeef]

1) a complete bill of health

2) and increased level of maturity from coaches and players

3) better depth

in other words, a miracle.

 

[elindholm]

There's a reason the Spurs haven't won two straight titles yet: Their hunger is inconsistent. I wouldn't go engraving their names on the 2008 trophy just yet. I don't know whether the Suns will have what it takes to knock them off, but probably someone will.

 

[SO91]

I'm probably in the minority, but I don't think it's going to take a major deal to beat the Spurs. There's no doubt they're a great team, but so are we. It's not like they killed us, the entire series was very competitive and either team could have won any of the games. I think fans are overreacting just a bit. There should be changes, but minor ones in personnel. I hope another year of experience at the highest level will help D'Antoni and he learns to adapt and make slight changes to his already very good offense.

 

[cly2tw]

If you listened to D'Antoni he also said that he stayed away from Amare doing very many back to the back plays because of his knees. I would guess that if Amare's knees hold up we might see more of that next season.

I hope DA meant it. This might explain why the coaches felt frustrated with Amare. They thought they were thinking in Amare's best interest but Amare wanted to play a more dominant role sooner, and felt a little jealous of Nash's fame with him being a sidekick.

Well, at least later in the regular season, we should have started to work on Amare's and Diaw's low post games more, in preparation for Nash being neutralized in the playoffs. Games vs. Spurs, Jazzs, Pistons and Mavs already revealed to the world to see how to stop Nash.

 

[azirish]

Putting Amare at the low block would help toward developing a high post offense with Boris. It doesn't work with Amare hanging round the same spot, but it makes a lot of sense with Amare at the low post.

Setting up a high post offense creates an alternative to the pick and roll when the opposition focuses on getting the ball out of the PG's hands. It permits several different kinds of plays to be run including the give and go, drive and kick, back door, pull up jumper, and creates a different angle for getting the ball into the low post.

We saw a little bit of this offense when McDyess was played with Amare, even though McDyess is harldy the ideal high post guy. During that period, (late 2003-04) the Suns won 7 of their last 13 game. Amare put up very good numbers at the low post when teamed with McDyess. http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/PHO/2004_games.html

 

[dodie53]

can boris and amare play the pick and roll?
do you think it will work?

 

[azirish]

can boris and amare play the pick and roll?
do you think it will work?

It seems unlikely.

The classic pick and roll involves forcing a switch. A small guy is guarding Nash and a big guy is guarding Stoudemire. After the switch, the big guy has to deal with Nash and the little guy with Amare.

There are a variety of ways to defense the pick and roll, but usually it requires double teaming the PG before he gets to the pick or help defenders coming over to get into the lane.

Running the pick and roll with Nash and Boris is different than with Amare, because Boris doesn't finish like Amare. On the other hand, Boris is more likely to find the open man when the help defender comes over.

Setting Amare at the low post with Boris as the pick man would create a real problem for defenders. If you help on Boris, it means leaving Amare wide open and makes it hard to block Amare out when going for the offensive rebound.

If Amare's defender has to stay put, then the help comes from either Marion's defender, opening up the back door, or from Bell's defender thus leaving him open for a three.

By using Amare as the pick man some of the time and Boris other times, it would create a lot more for the opponent's defense to prepare for.

 

[sharkman]

I'm probably in the minority, but I don't think it's going to take a major deal to beat the Spurs.

There should be changes, but minor ones in personnel. I hope another year of experience at the highest level will help D'Antoni and he learns to adapt and make slight changes to his already very good offense.

I agree. We don't need new or different stars...our 3 "stars" matched up favorably with theirs:
(Playoff stats)

Duncan: .541%-11.7 reb-23.3pts-3.53blk-0.53stls
Amare: .523%-12.1 reb-25.3pts-1.9blk-1.9stls

Parker: .452%-2.8reb-19.7pts-0.0blks-1.27stls-6.5 assists
Nash: .463%-3.2reb-18.9pts-.09blk-.36stls-13.3 assists

Ginobili: .405%-5.4reb-16.7pts-.27blk-1.87stls
Marion: .500%-10.4reb-16.9pts-1.73blk-1.45stls

...and I'd take Bell over Finley.

What we lack are the role players (or role players that can produce in the playoffs). Barbosa goes 2-17 from 3 point range...that killed us...if he makes them at his usual .400%+...we win the series. He improves every year...he'll do better next year.

They have tough scrubs that play specific defensive roles like Oberto, Horry, Bowen (yes he's a 37 year old scrub who plays a lot of minutes because his cheap shots win games).

Keep Nash, Bell, Marion, KT, Amare, and Barbosa...
...use Diaw, Banks, James Jones, #24, #29, 2008 #1, ATL #1...to get 3 guys in here that can perform their backup roles.

 

[Matt L]

I really think that it comes down to coaching. The fact is that DA gets outcoached. We could have won game five but our offense scored about 2 points in the final 3 minutes. The team was physically exhausted and this was because 6 players had played the entire game.

Another thing that I don't like about DA: He doesn't have one go to play. We all know that Amare and Steve are tremendous talents with the ball. When the other team goes on a run he should call a timeout and call a play that is gauranteed to stop the run and get the Suns back in the game. It seems that every other team we have met in the playoffs can do this but we don't even call timeouts when the other team goes on a run.

Finally, I know that alot of people don't like the "thug" element of Ron Artest and he may rub some people the wrong way but if we could get him at a discounted price, I say take him and have him crush Ginobili. When Duncan leaves the floor, the Spurs offense goes through Ginobili. There is no doubt in my mind that Artest can give Ginobili fits, the other strength of Artest is that he is just crazy enough to work as an enforcer when Bowen is cheap shotting Amare and Nash.

 

[spurs81]

There's a reason the Spurs haven't won two straight titles yet: Their hunger is inconsistent. I wouldn't go engraving their names on the 2008 trophy just yet. I don't know whether the Suns will have what it takes to knock them off, but probably someone will.

Are you kidding me?

The reasons they haven't won back to back titles yet are rather simple:

1. Derek Fisher hit a miracle shot with .4 seconds left on the clock

2. Manu made a stupid foul on Dirk last year when the WCF were essentially won.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Are you kidding me?

The reasons they haven't won back to back titles yet are rather simple:

1. Derek Fisher hit a miracle shot with .4 seconds left on the clock

2. Manu made a stupid foul on Dirk last year when the WCF were essentially won.

1. Fisher's miracle shot was only needed because of Duncan's miracle shot a second earlier. Now, considering that you have two miracle shots cancelling each other out, it's safe to say the best team won, especially considering the ass-whipping the Lakers put on the Spurs in Game 6 of that series.

2. The Spurs were beat long before that point, considering the only reason that series even went 7 games was because the Mavs played shorthanded in Game 6 and then the refs let the Spurs just maul the hell out of the Mavs in their second half comeback in Game 7 ater they were down 20.

but yeah, it was two shots - IN THE FREAKING 2ND ROUND. Way to show a complete lack of understanding about your own team dolt.