Where are all the pro shaq fans and marion bashers now?

[goldseraph]

I don't get people saying we 'proved' our makeup and style of play couldn't win it all. Does everyone forget we very well could have toppled the Spurs last year if we didn't get Sterned? The main problem I saw was the bad energy on the team this year, and for that reason I was ok moving Marion. Getting a decrepit, overpaid Shaq was NOT the answer though. Hell I'd rather take my chances with young prospects, draft picks, and an expiring contract.

 

[pokerface]

I don't get people saying we 'proved' our makeup and style of play couldn't win it all. Does everyone forget we very well could have toppled the Spurs last year if we didn't get Sterned? The main problem I saw was the bad energy on the team this year, and for that reason I was ok moving Marion. Getting a decrepit, overpaid Shaq was NOT the answer though. Hell I'd rather take my chances with young prospects, draft picks, and an expiring contract.

What I don't get is how people talk about "last year" like somehow it relates to this year...it doesn't


The west is far tougher this year. Plus the Suns (with Marion) looked weaker. Yeah they were on top of the west but that was only by having a weak schedule and beating up on eastern teams.

 

[OldDirtMcGirt]

That is my point I am fine with moving Marion. I just don't like what we got and how bleak our future looks.

Well, the only upside for our future is that Shaq and Nash's contracts come off the books when LeBron is a free agent.

 

[BC867]

And, once again, it's not just a question of having Shaq, but using him properly, as well.

Every time the Coach moves Amare or Diaw back to Center, it's pre-Shaq, except Marion is now Diaw.

If Mike D'Antoni is not going to make a commitment to this change, how can you call it a change? It's the Twilight Zone.

I just don't believe the Suns' spin that D'Antoni was all for the trade and Kerr was doubtful.

Didja notice that when an opposing Center fouls out, D'Antoni can't get Shaq out fast enough.

Same old crap. Try to keep up with the opponent, rather than making them keep up with you.

 

[MiamiHeat]

using shaq properly means morphing into a half-court team and completely losing the suns identity and becoming a brand new team with new philosophy during the middle of a season and with a team of players that were built for run N gun philosophy.

if you remember when the trade was made, everyone said "if shaq can mold HIMSELF into the suns, then it might have a chance to work"...... if you would have told everyone, "the suns style is now gone if shaq goes to PHX, and the whole team will have to mold to shaq instead of the other way around" the entire world would be laughing at the trade and wondering what the hell is wrong with kerr. you just dont do that mid-season with a team that is not ready to play slow halfcourt

 

[Chaplin]

using shaq properly means morphing into a half-court team and completely losing the suns identity and becoming a brand new team with new philosophy during the middle of a season and with a team of players that were built for run N gun philosophy.

if you remember when the trade was made, everyone said "if shaq can mold HIMSELF into the suns, then it might have a chance to work"...... if you would have told everyone, "the suns style is now gone if shaq goes to PHX, and the whole team will have to mold to shaq instead of the other way around" the entire world would be laughing at the trade and wondering what the hell is wrong with kerr. you just dont do that mid-season with a team that is not ready to play slow halfcourt

Since you know very little about the Suns, they score what--18 points on fast breaks per game? Where do you think the other 100 come from?

The Suns play a fast open style, true, but to say this is only a running team is wrong, just plain wrong. Their problem isn't Shaq, it's executing plays that accommodate the presence of a center like Shaq. He makes the structure of the team much different, there's no doubt about that. But you and all the other non-Suns fans who think they know everything about the team are just wrong in almost every facet of the team. Regardless of how much you use your limited "Shaq knowledge" as proof of your genius.

 

[cly2tw]

With Marion we were only giving up 103 ppg. We also had a large positive point differential of +6.

Now we are at a -6 point differential with Shaq starting. That is an 11 point swing.

Do people really believe we are going to find a 12 point improvement between offense and defense in the time we have remaining? I just don't see it.

With Marion we haven't been able to win a title, and we wouldn't this season either, had we not traded him away. My signature of the offseason was speaking the truth!

At least we now have a chance with Shaq in the lineup, as long as DA and Nash swallow their pride and commit to relying on grinding-it-out instead of outrunning-them as the more fundamental principle of our game plan.

Do it, DA-Nash!

 

[passenger]

Shaq is done,period.This was a horrible trade.I was actually so surprised to see some/most Suns fans here was happy after the trade.Surprised because anyone who has been following NBA last 8 years would see the fall down of Shaq year by year.Maybe because of his "past",his "rings",people still expect from him..But Shaq is much slower now,not enough mobility,lots of turnovers a game for a center,he was injured several times and gets injured often,I will be surprised if he plays 2/3 rd of the games in his Suns career.Some see him as messiah or something "He brought a ring to Heat,he'll do the same for us",he helped Miami in early years but Wade made them champion.Suns needed more athletic type of center and a good PG backup,a good shooter forward.Shaq doesn't fit Suns' style,he's clogging Nash,Barbosa.

When we criticized the trade,we got insulted,we were called trolls,etc,not knowing a jog about basketball,after each loss "it's just one game!" responses.We are 3-5 since the trade,and believe me if Kerr has made this trade last summer,now we were right behind Sacramento.

I agree with some posts,trading Marion is not the problem,getting an old,slow center and paying him huge money is.

 

[cly2tw]

And, once again, it's not just a question of having Shaq, but using him properly, as well.

Every time the Coach moves Amare or Diaw back to Center, it's pre-Shaq, except Marion is now Diaw.

If Mike D'Antoni is not going to make a commitment to this change, how can you call it a change? It's the Twilight Zone.

I just don't believe the Suns' spin that D'Antoni was all for the trade and Kerr was doubtful.

Didja notice that when an opposing Center fouls out, D'Antoni can't get Shaq out fast enough.

Same old crap. Try to keep up with the opponent, rather than making them keep up with you.

As I put it in my other thread, it's just nostalgie of clinging to the glorious past with the running-them-outta-gym style. He neglects the fact that a partial run is not the same thing like running relentlessly whole game long to tire off the opponents making them do more mistakes then we do. We shall switch to Spurs' style of selective/opportunistic runs, while getting our defense better focused with fresher legs from a deeper used bench.

Shaq's conditioning has been improving visibly from game to game, making him harder to contain in the paint with each game. With him touching the ball on lowpost, everything seems a lot smoother for us.

 

[MiamiHeat]

Regardless of how much you use your limited "Shaq knowledge" as proof of your genius.

tantamount to a personal attack!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! lol. you need to relax charlie, your frustration is with the PHX SUNS. you want them to do well. don't take it out on me charlie.

maybe D'Antoni refusing to change anything is proof that this trade was not OK'd by him?

 

[Chaplin]

tantamount to a personal attack!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! lol. you need to relax charlie, your frustration is with the PHX SUNS. you want them to do well. don't take it out on me charlie.

maybe D'Antoni refusing to change anything is proof that this trade was not OK'd by him?

Hmm, twice in one post. I've been here for years and while a lot of people have had cause to hate me at one point or another, nobody has ever used "charlie" as an insult. So congratulations for coming up with something nobody else has used. Glad to see you're enjoying your stay at a Phoenix Suns message board.

 

[MiamiHeat]

stop changing the issue and talk about the suns. you just don't want to deal with differing opinions.....

Sir Charles Spencer Chaplin, Jr., KBE (16 April 1889 – 25 December 1977), better known as Charlie Chaplin, was an Academy Award-winning English comedy actor. Chaplin became one of the most famous actors as well as a notable director, composer and musician in the early to mid Hollywood cinema era. He is considered to have been one of the finest mimes and clowns ever caught on film and has greatly influenced performers in this field.

 

[elindholm]

Hell I'd rather take my chances with young prospects, draft picks, and an expiring contract.

I'm not sure whether you mean the Suns could have gotten that for Marion in a trade -- they couldn't have -- or whether they should have kept their own expiring contract (Thomas) and draft picks, which was financially prohibitive.

Given Sarver's hard stance on the payroll and Marion's very limited trade value, the Suns probably did the best they could.

 

[MiamiHeat]

what's done is done. it just makes me think D'Antoni is on the way out.

there is still time left to fix the team

 

[az1965]

The trade was and is terrible. We were taken to the cleaners like every trade that Steve Kerr has bungled. For as overpaid as Marion was (probably 4-5 million), Shaq is twice as much for twice as long.

We are the only team that trades away large expiring contracts and has to toss in draft picks, but then takes on stupid long term contracts and gets nothing in return.

It was a bad trade. The team might improve some after current struggles but it was still a bad trade.

 

[green machine]

It was a bad trade. The team might improve some after current struggles but it was still a bad trade.

I don't think the team is any worse now then they were pre-trade, just now the schedule got tougher and the results are showing.

It isn't like the Suns were dominating the league before the trade. I would venture to say that if the Suns record against the top West teams was good then the trade wouldn't have been made.

I do think that this current team has a much higher ceiling then it did pre-trade, but whether they reach it or not is anyone's guess.

 

[MiamiHeat]

i disagree. i think the trade was a bad trade for PHX, but a great trade for Miami

what exactly do you envision for PHX with shaq? run N gun with shaq ? halfcourt Suns?


how do you see this working, exactly?

 

[doomsday]

Shaq is Shady

Shaq's big body has brought plenty of shade in Arizona and the Sun is no longer shining as bright. Suns fans will now find out for themselves that Shaq is not the big warm guy ESPN made him to be when comparing him to Kobe. Shaq was the problem in LA, Shaq was the problem in Miami and Shaq will slowly but surely, inject his venom into the Suns team.

 

[pokerface]

i disagree. i think the trade was a bad trade for PHX, but a great trade for Miami

what exactly do you envision for PHX with shaq? run N gun with shaq ? halfcourt Suns?


how do you see this working, exactly?

Shaq has done a good job of starting the fastbreak with the outlet pass after the rebound. His passes are pretty much money with good range. So in that respect he fits right in with the Suns. Of course he's not keeping up with the team like Marion did but playoffs slow down the game.


One cant say who got the better end of this deal. The Suns knew what they were getting into when they went for it. Yeah its a radical trade on their part but in some ways they almost had to do it.

 

[MiamiHeat]

I understand he is doing that part.

I just want to know what do SUNS fans envision with the SUNS + Shaq? What type of game?

 

[cly2tw]

Shaq's big body has brought plenty of shade in Arizona and the Sun is no longer shining as bright. Suns fans will now find out for themselves that Shaq is not the big warm guy ESPN made him to be when comparing him to Kobe. Shaq was the problem in LA, Shaq was the problem in Miami and Shaq will slowly but surely, inject his venom into the Suns team.

If his problem in Miami and Lakers was to win championships for them, we Suns fans would love to have that problem as well.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

i disagree. i think the trade was a bad trade for PHX, but a great trade for Miami

what exactly do you envision for PHX with shaq? run N gun with shaq ? halfcourt Suns?


how do you see this working, exactly?

Yeah, what were we thinking, trying to build a stronger playoff team.

How's Marion and Banks working out for you guys?

Wait, you mean you're not tearing up the NBA?

 

[Trophytown]

Shaq has done a good job of starting the fastbreak with the outlet pass after the rebound. His passes are pretty much money with good range. So in that respect he fits right in with the Suns. Of course he's not keeping up with the team like Marion did but playoffs slow down the game.


One cant say who got the better end of this deal. The Suns knew what they were getting into when they went for it. Yeah its a radical trade on their part but in some ways they almost had to do it.

They didnt HAVE to do the deal for SHAQ. They likely couldve made other deals. Perhaps they waited too long until some key pieces like Gasol, had already been moved. You'll never know.

Making any trade, especially blockbuster deals involve risk. I still believe this deal for Shaq was in direct response to what LA did. But i do think it was a move made in haste and not carefully thought out in a basketball sense. Folks around the country thought this trade was a bad move when it was in the news being discussed.

 

[Trophytown]

Yeah, what were we thinking, trying to build a stronger playoff team.

How's Marion and Banks working out for you guys?

Wait, you mean you're not tearing up the NBA?

Dont scream too loud man...........both teams could be in the lottery before this is all over with.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Dont scream too loud man...........both teams could be in the lottery before this is all over with.

I didn't know I was screaming....... It is an absolute certainty that Miami will be there.