Who are your most selfish/unselfish NBA stars?

[elindholm]

Twice.

edit: check that. Farmar started over Smush in last year's series.

Yes, but the Lakers did not "almost beat" the Suns last year, so Bryant's heroics did not happen twice.

In my opinion a selfish player is one who takes a shot when he is not the best option or refuses to shoot when he is the best option, because of some misguided desire to be seen as "unselfish." For example, I regard Diaw's passivity as a form of selfishness, because he is putting himself before the team. Kidd also has a selfish streak in my book, for the same reason.

Really everyone on the floor should have one goal in mind, and that's to get the best shot for their team. If the best shot happens to be yours, you are correct to take it, and if it's yours 40 times a game, you are correct to take it 40 times a game.

The question of who scores the most points is infantile and I really doubt most NBA players think that way. Maybe a few do, but most can't, because they never would have made it to this level. On the other hand, there are lots of players who have such a high opinion of themselves that they always think they are the best option. Arenas would fit this category. He shoots all the time because he honestly believes that it's the best approach for his team. He's wrong, but that's a problem of arrogance, not selfishness. I'd put Iverson in that category too.

The greatest display of selfishness I've seen this year was Jamaal Tinsley down the stretch in the Pacers-Suns game. He shot over and over and bricked every one. The Suns could have lost that game had he been willing to let anyone else shoot.

Calling Bryant selfish for his high FGA is silly, because he has historically been his team's best option, particularly in the past. However, he was definitely selfish when he tanked the second half of Game 7 against the Suns two years ago.

I regard Hill as the least selfish player on the Suns. He virtually always makes the correct decision, whether it's for him to shoot or not. Nash gets a little selfish sometimes trying to make brilliant plays or getting caught up in personal battles with opposing PGs. Barbosa's tunnel vision makes him appear selfish, but in his case it's probably just a lack of skill. When he's hurt, Bell sometimes selfishly passes up shots that the team needs him to take. But overall the Suns are a pretty unselfish bunch. Stoudemire does show some selfishness, but it's a fair price to pay.

 

[ActingWild]

Yes, but the Lakers did not "almost beat" the Suns last year, so Bryant's heroics did not happen twice.

In my opinion a selfish player is one who takes a shot when he is not the best option or refuses to shoot when he is the best option, because of some misguided desire to be seen as "unselfish." For example, I regard Diaw's passivity as a form of selfishness, because he is putting himself before the team. Kidd also has a selfish streak in my book, for the same reason.

Really everyone on the floor should have one goal in mind, and that's to get the best shot for their team. If the best shot happens to be yours, you are correct to take it, and if it's yours 40 times a game, you are correct to take it 40 times a game.

The question of who scores the most points is infantile and I really doubt most NBA players think that way. Maybe a few do, but most can't, because they never would have made it to this level. On the other hand, there are lots of players who have such a high opinion of themselves that they always think they are the best option. Arenas would fit this category. He shoots all the time because he honestly believes that it's the best approach for his team. He's wrong, but that's a problem of arrogance, not selfishness. I'd put Iverson in that category too.

The greatest display of selfishness I've seen this year was Jamaal Tinsley down the stretch in the Pacers-Suns game. He shot over and over and bricked every one. The Suns could have lost that game had he been willing to let anyone else shoot.

Calling Bryant selfish for his high FGA is silly, because he has historically been his team's best option, particularly in the past. However, he was definitely selfish when he tanked the second half of Game 7 against the Suns two years ago.

I regard Hill as the least selfish player on the Suns. He virtually always makes the correct decision, whether it's for him to shoot or not. Nash gets a little selfish sometimes trying to make brilliant plays or getting caught up in personal battles with opposing PGs. Barbosa's tunnel vision makes him appear selfish, but in his case it's probably just a lack of skill. When he's hurt, Bell sometimes selfishly passes up shots that the team needs him to take. But overall the Suns are a pretty unselfish bunch. Stoudemire does show some selfishness, but it's a fair price to pay.

Good assessment.

 

[Joe L]

I have to say then, that you either haven't watched Kobe play this year, or you are a little biased against him. Kobe has been the catylist for the success of his team mates, and has done a great job of getting the ball to the open guy this year. In years past, I think Kobe got labeled as Selfish because he had no one to pass to. Watch the Toronto Game where he scored 80+ points. He had like 16 at the half, watch the game, he's passing the entire time, and everyone on the team is throwing up bricks. Finally, he took over and won the game. After the game, he gets branded a ball hog. Really not fair. When he does start passing to his team mates and they keep missing, he gets branded as tanking on purpose.. how's he supposed to win here? If he gets 10 assists a game, he's not aggressive enough, if he gets less, he's a ball hog. Many great players have been called ball hogs, cause it's something they do when they have to. Great players take over games when they have to, and Kobe is no different. Perhaps Amare is simply doing the same.

I stand by my opinion though that Kobe is an unselfish player. Thank you for at least being able to discuss things civilly, there are others here that could learn a thing for two from you.

Hey Darth, I agree that this year Kobe has changed his ways and I am at the point of not calling him selfish but for most of his career...he was.
Last year he had most of the same guys that are on the team now and it looks like he finally figured out he can't do it by himself. From what I saw, the guys looked scared to shoot for fear of retribution from Kobe. It wasn't until Phil Jackson told Kobe to get the team involved that things started to click. Look at them now? Same guys aside from Gasol ...what changed? They were playing great before Gasol but I think it was humility from him that made this possible.
In all Honesty, I think the Lakers would be just as great without him. If it was up to Kobe and trading Bynum, where would they be now? The guy he wanted traded has had the biggest impact on this team. the inside presence of Bynum early in the season made it possible for the team to pass. It is the passing and playing as a team that has made it work. It isn't Kobe's passing that is doing that...it is the team feeling comfortable to pass to other players that are now comfortable shooting the ball. Kobe's ego was shot by Buss early in the season and I bet the booing early on helped him get his head straight...good for him.

 

[Darth Llama]

All that being said, if there were a "most dominant offensive player in the league award", he'd get my vote, because he is THAT talented. However, the question wasn't who's the most talented player, it's most selfish and unselfish and I happen to think Kobe IS selfish...you disagree and apparently think that's a personal attack on you.

I took this..

This is like a black hole calling the kettle black.

As calling me a hypocrite because I named Amare. If I misread that, then I owe you an apology. I have no problem with you, I respect your opinion. If I over reacted then I apologize. You have as much right to your view as I do, I just would have preferred you attacked my view and not me, that's all. It's all good bud.

Hey Darth, I agree that this year Kobe has changed his ways and I am at the point of not calling him selfish but for most of his career...he was.
Last year he had most of the same guys that are on the team now and it looks like he finally figured out he can't do it by himself. From what I saw, the guys looked scared to shoot for fear of retribution from Kobe. It wasn't until Phil Jackson told Kobe to get the team involved that things started to click. Look at them now? Same guys aside from Gasol ...what changed? They were playing great before Gasol but I think it was humility from him that made this possible.
In all Honesty, I think the Lakers would be just as great without him. If it was up to Kobe and trading Bynum, where would they be now? The guy he wanted traded has had the biggest impact on this team. the inside presence of Bynum early in the season made it possible for the team to pass. It is the passing and playing as a team that has made it work. It isn't Kobe's passing that is doing that...it is the team feeling comfortable to pass to other players that are now comfortable shooting the ball. Kobe's ego was shot by Buss early in the season and I bet the booing early on helped him get his head straight...good for him.

I hear ya Joe, but again, I respectfully disagree. Even without Gasol, there isn't a real comparison between this years team and last years. Removing Smush Parker and putting in Derek Fisher was a huge boost by itself. Adding Ariza was also a good move, even though he's not exactly lights out on offense. The big difference that helped Kobe is the emergence of Bynum. It gave the Lakers another legit threat that teams had to deal with. That free'd up some of these other guys that last year weren't making the shots. They have less pressure on them now because instead of taking someone like Luke Walton and asking him to be a 3rd option, you're now asking him to be 5th. Sasha also really elevated his game, as has Ronny Turiaf. Guys on this team that didn't have the experience they needed are now more confident and able to step up. Kobe DID try to pass to those guys last year, in fact if you remember, about mid season, Kobe was questioned as to rather or not he was passing too much. He was dishing and the Lakers were losing. Kobe has been called both Selfish and too "pass happy" all in the same year.

I understand why Kobe would be thought of as Selfish. When the last minutes of the fourth quarter in a close game come around, he's definitely selfish. The ball is going through him, and no one can change that. For the rest of the game though, Kobe isn't always like that. Again, my opinion, yes, I'm defending my pick, but that's how I feel. I understand the view the other way.

 

[TJ]

Lammy is hell bent on trashing Amare evey chance he gets, he is a troll. If Amare was a Laker Llamy certainly wouldn't put him in the unselfish category.

As for Kobe, I do recall him shutting it down in Game 7 against the Suns 3 years ago. HOW UNSELFISH.
I also recall Kobe asking for a trade at the begining of the season. HOW UNSELFISH.
If that is the definiton of unselfish then well Llammy has rewritten the book of logic.

Maybe Amare has a one track mind on offense, how do we know that isn't by design? Because Lammy, a Laker fan wants Amare to pass? Oh ok.

Certainly IMO Kobe has proven to be far more selfish than Amare as a teammate and that's not including the fact he is selfish as a human being too.

Amare just likes to pad stats, Kobe has a track record of being selfish, yeah he is a good player who can pass every once in a while but to label him as unselfish, give me a break.

I agree....Kobe doesnt make anyone on his team better. He showed his lack of leadership skills last offseason by berating their young center and whining to the media that he needs to be traded. Either he's selfish, or he's a brat, or both

 

[French Fries]

this season?

selfish - wade and iverson (you can throw in barbosa too)
unselfish - boris diaw (to a fault), brad miller, shane battier

 

[Joe L]

I took this..



As calling me a hypocrite because I named Amare. If I misread that, then I owe you an apology. I have no problem with you, I respect your opinion. If I over reacted then I apologize. You have as much right to your view as I do, I just would have preferred you attacked my view and not me, that's all. It's all good bud.



I hear ya Joe, but again, I respectfully disagree. Even without Gasol, there isn't a real comparison between this years team and last years. Removing Smush Parker and putting in Derek Fisher was a huge boost by itself. Adding Ariza was also a good move, even though he's not exactly lights out on offense. The big difference that helped Kobe is the emergence of Bynum. It gave the Lakers another legit threat that teams had to deal with. That free'd up some of these other guys that last year weren't making the shots. They have less pressure on them now because instead of taking someone like Luke Walton and asking him to be a 3rd option, you're now asking him to be 5th. Sasha also really elevated his game, as has Ronny Turiaf. Guys on this team that didn't have the experience they needed are now more confident and able to step up. Kobe DID try to pass to those guys last year, in fact if you remember, about mid season, Kobe was questioned as to rather or not he was passing too much. He was dishing and the Lakers were losing. Kobe has been called both Selfish and too "pass happy" all in the same year.

I understand why Kobe would be thought of as Selfish. When the last minutes of the fourth quarter in a close game come around, he's definitely selfish. The ball is going through him, and no one can change that. For the rest of the game though, Kobe isn't always like that. Again, my opinion, yes, I'm defending my pick, but that's how I feel. I understand the view the other way.

...I agreed with you by the way. I don't really consider him selfish...now. In fact his passing skills this year are amazing to say the least. I told you they would be great before the season started. Watch out for the second unit...they are deadly. Aside from Turiaf, sasha, and Farmer, I think the glue of the team is Odom. The guy does everything. Happy for you team's success.

 

[Assface]

I don't think Kobe is selfish. He might be the most insecure player in the league but he wants to win more than anything. The reason he leads the league in scoring is because he's had crap players around him.

Amare is extremely driven which may sometimes be confused for selfish.

I think the most selfish guys are players like Boozer, Marion and JJ who would rather be the man on a bad team than be a lesser option on a winning team.

 

[D-Dogg]

I don't think Kobe is selfish. He might be the most insecure player in the league but he wants to win more than anything. The reason he leads the league in scoring is because he's had crap players around him.

Amare is extremely driven which may sometimes be confused for selfish.

I think the most selfish guys are players like Boozer, Marion and JJ who would rather be the man on a bad team than be a lesser option on a winning team.

QFTMFT

 

[Phade]

lol @ amare being selfish because of his shot selection.. he has like 5th best shooting % in the league..

and kobe being unselfish i think i saw a game the other day where anytime odom would get the ball he wouldn't think twice about passing it cause kobe was shooting every time he touched it..

kobe is def one of the most selfish in the league.. him, gilbert, wade..

 

[Phade]

Lammy is hell bent on trashing Amare evey chance he gets, he is a troll. If Amare was a Laker Llamy certainly wouldn't put him in the unselfish category.

As for Kobe, I do recall him shutting it down in Game 7 against the Suns 3 years ago. HOW UNSELFISH.
I also recall Kobe asking for a trade at the begining of the season. HOW UNSELFISH.
If that is the definiton of unselfish then well Llammy has rewritten the book of logic.

Maybe Amare has a one track mind on offense, how do we know that isn't by design? Because Lammy, a Laker fan wants Amare to pass? Oh ok.

Certainly IMO Kobe has proven to be far more selfish than Amare as a teammate and that's not including the fact he is selfish as a human being too.

Amare just likes to pad stats, Kobe has a track record of being selfish, yeah he is a good player who can pass every once in a while but to label him as unselfish, give me a break.

good post..

 

[Ishta]

Most selfish~ Shaq,AI,Kobe,Wade,Lebron
Most Unselfish~ Tim Duncan, Tracy McGrady,Kevin Garnett,Baron Davis

 

[Bufalay]

Pat Riley is selfish

 

[nowagimp]

We can all define selfishness or unselfishness as we want, then any player could be either. In an effort to be objective, I will define it as getting the best percentage shot, especially if it involves giving up your own shot that may not be quite as good a shot. Typically if the player leads his team in assists, the Assist to shots taken ratio is pretty good indicator of an unselfish player. Unselfish players typically shoot a higher percentage then their temm FG%. Players that shoot lower than their team FG% are likely shooting too much and not passing enough. Also when do the turnovers occur? If they occur on an attempt to get another guy a shot, not so bad. If they occur when going one on three, thats bad.


Unselfish:

steve Nash by a comfortable margin, THE most unselfish player in the NBA. He looks to get other players going more than anyone else.

KG: no doubt the most unselfish big man, and an excellent passer.

Lamar Odom: easily the most unselfish player on the lakers, its not even close. When the ball gets stuck, its not because of lamar. If his outside shot wasnt so inconsistent, he would lead the lakers in assists by a wide margin. Teams try to make him shoot as a strategy, reducing his effectiveness.

Chris Paul: shoots when opposing defenses make him shoot, by backing off him, otherwise he's a dime machine.

Jose Calderon: look at the dimes, the number of shots taken, he's incredibly efficient.

Tim Duncan: knows the power to being a team player, bigtime.

Jason Kidd: this guy lives to pass, anyone with him not on their list must be watching another game.



Selfish:

AI: no explanation necessary, he's better than he used to be though.

Melo: "what is an assist exactly?"

DWade: this year he is a black hole, of course, look at his team, perhaps the worst supporting cast of any NBA star for the last 10 years.

K Durrant: are you kidding, this guy should be called "jack up in a box"!


On the kobe/amare distortions:

Kobe: Those of you calling Kobe "most unselfish", well he's #2 in the NBA in shots/game, thats laughable, "most unselfish". I will say he has gotten better tahn in the past. He used to be one of the top "most selfish", not anymore. That laker fans dont even know that Lamar Odom is more unselfish, thats even funnier than calling kobe "most unselfish". No less than 5 laker rotation players have a lower A/TO ratio than kobe.

Amare: takes 15 shots a game and makes 58%, one of the most efficient players in the NBA. Him taking less shots means the suns shooting % falls, and they lose more games. If amare was making 46%(suns shoot 50%), then he would be hurting the team. If he was a better passer in situations, it would help alot, but he certainly is not one of the "most selfish" compared to the above guys. If laker fans want to bash amare stoudemire, take a poll on "on ball post defenders", he might make that list.





















amare: not one of the top selfish players, but often takes a shot when another player has a better one.