Who will win the west?

[Covert Rain]

Of corse the media took the soft comment out of context. He didn't call them soft for past playoff failures...or even soft in general. He called their play in that game soft. then he proceeded to explain it because they got out-rebounded and out played physically.

from there, if you want to look at the past at least they have made it to the finals and have won a lot of playoff games.... better than a lot of other teams not named lakers or spurs in the west over the last decade. you can call them choke artists for not winning a championship and that's fine even fair. I can take the glasses off from time to time. It is frustrating, but it is much better than what they were in the 90's.

I'm just trying to defend the great things that they have done over the years. especially dirk. he is a legendary player that gets overlooked. last night I heard a great stat. in situations to win or tie a game in the last min he and kobe lead the league over the last 3 years. and dirk has a better %. yet dirk is not known for that nationally. he gets bypassed and a lot of people say he chokes.

and by the way. no butler won't be ready to play. but having him suit up after that injury will be huge lift for them. he is a huge leader in that locker room. if he can come into a game just for a min it will mean more emotionally than anything else. but who knows.

I call B.S. Dirk is not overlooked. He has been mentioned by every analayst in every national televised games as one of the leagues best. I have read tons of columns stating the same thing over and over.

It's like anything else, you want more recognition don't shrink when it counts and most of all win titles. With 1 conference title and only 3 division titles since he was drafted. Dirk has also been paired with the likes of Kidd, Nash and always seems to be surrounded with talent. Yes the Mavs have almost universally been recognized over the years and an underachieving team.

Dirk has all the recognition he deserves.

 

[Lorenzo]

I call B.S. Dirk is not overlooked. He has been mentioned by every analayst in every national televised games as one of the leagues best. I have read tons of columns stating the same thing over and over.

It's like anything else, you want more recognition don't shrink when it counts and most of all win titles. With 1 conference title and only 3 division titles since he was drafted. Dirk has also been paired with the likes of Kidd, Nash and always seems to be surrounded with talent. Yes the Mavs have almost universally been recognized over the years and an underachieving team.

Dirk has all the recognition he deserves.

he doesn't get recognized for being a closer. that's all I meant. he is the best closer in the game aside from kobe. and the stats prove it, yet people call him a choke? Or other names come up first before him(names of guys who also have not won titles) of being better scorers or closers. so it is fair to say that he is a choke if you play the title card, but I choose not to look at it that way. agree to disagree. neither of us are wrong IMO.

he is a league mvp and multiple all star. when they play on tv, people give him credit. but when people talk about the best scorers in the game nationally he isn't mentioned as much as he deserves to be IMO.

nash and kidd..yes dirk is fortunate there. but when dirk and nash played together they had no depth. kidd is no where near the level that nash was at when he and dirk played together, but overall the mavs are much deeper now and dirk has also elevated his game much moreso than what it was when steve was a mav. so while dirk has a great supporting cast overall, like kobe and other star players on elite teams, he doesn't play next to another superstar player. how many rings did the great kobe win after shaq left and before gasol arrived? how many playoff series did they win in that time? how does steve nash look now that amare is gone? a shell of himself I would say.

kidd is not what he once was, but is still very good. like you say it is what it is.

 

[Covert Rain]

he doesn't get recognized for being a closer. that's all I meant. he is the best closer in the game aside from kobe. and the stats prove it, yet people call him a choke? Or other names come up first before him(names of guys who also have not won titles) of being better scorers or closers. so it is fair to say that he is a choke if you play the title card, but I choose not to look at it that way. agree to disagree. neither of us are wrong IMO.

I think you have a persecution complex when it comes to Dirk. Closing out regular season games and not being able to do it in the playoffs is two different things and you know it.

The Mavs over and over again have underachieved in relation to their talent level in the playoffs. Dirk has not delivered at the end of some pretty big playoff games. That is why Dirk and the Mavs are considered choke artists.

he is a league mvp and multiple all star. when they play on tv, people give him credit. but when people talk about the best scorers in the game nationally he isn't mentioned as much as he deserves to be IMO.

Then you should open your ears. Dirk has been in that conversation almost every year and one of things they always mention is his scoring. I think your making an issue where there is none.

how does steve nash look now that amare is gone? a shell of himself I would say.

Then you don't know what your talking about. Steve has posted some of the best numbers of his career that rival his MVP seasons.

In relation to his playoff performances and team success Dirk has gotten all the recognition he deserves.

 

[Lorenzo]

I think you have a persecution complex when it comes to Dirk. Closing out regular season games and not being able to do it in the playoffs is two different things and you know it.

The Mavs over and over again have underachieved in relation to their talent level in the playoffs. Dirk has not delivered at the end of some pretty big playoff games. That is why Dirk and the Mavs are considered choke artists.



Then you should open your ears. Dirk has been in that conversation almost every year and one of things they always mention is his scoring. I think your making an issue where there is none.



Then you don't know what your talking about. Steve has posted some of the best numbers of his career that rival his MVP seasons.

In relation to his playoff performances and team success Dirk has gotten all the recognition he deserves.

My fault about steve you are right. I wrongfully looked at his record after amare left. not fair, because he is still the best offensive PG in the league. from that same token amare put up great numbers with the knicks, but wasn't much above .500 before that trade.

and at the end of the day you might be right. maybe I am making more of this. the last time I lived in dallas steve nash was still a maverick. so I don't know what the hometown fans are saying compared to the national media. It might just be because dirk is not as marketable as lebron/melo/durant to name a few so he doesn't get a lot of hype like those guys do. That might be it. I thought tim duncan went through the same situation when most people would tell you that he is the greatest PF of all time, yet no one would talk about him if the spurs wern't playing on tv.

I agree about the mavs underachieving in the playoffs. I disagree that dirk has underachieved in the playoffs with the exception of the golden state series in which i feel he did. I also remember golden state double teaming him for much of that series and the mavericks just folded in the wind. it was bad.

In most of the other series when they lost they were overmatched and dirk did his part. his playoff career numbers are elevated compared to his regular season numbers as well. he has had some monster playoff games as well. some of his best games have been in the playoffs. he averaged 35 against denver in a series that they lost while his personal life was in crisis as well. denver was just flat out better than dallas. same can be broken down when they lost to the hornets, spurs last year, etc.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Well the lakers did lead most of the game after the 1st quarter, but it never was a blowout. It stayed between 5-10 points and the mavs had a few occasions where they could of pulled even, but they uncharacteristically missed shots.

uncharacteristically missed shots in a big game? uh, no. they very much CHARACTERISTICALLY missed shots, at home, in a huge game. that's exactly what I'm talking about.

We will see. the mavs go to LA again this year. they blew them out in LA last year in a game.

they blew them out in the second game of the season when players are barely even paying attention to the league... plus Gasol wasn't even playing. That's pretty much proof positive of what we already know. the Mavs are great winning games that don't really mean jack squat.

Over the last two years kobe went from loving to kill dallas to not scoring as much vs. dallas so if you are going to credit LA for their play you have to credit dallas for their defense too.

they can do whatever they want to Kobe, but it doesn't matter if the end result is the same and much more often that not, that end result is a big fat L.

In fact kobe told his team before the game yesterday that dallas can beat them in a 7 game series.

who cares what Kobe thinks? Kobe thought his team should have traded Bynum for Jason Kidd or gone out and gotten Baron Davis. I can guarantee you, Phil Jackson doesn't fear the Mavs.

I think dallas is their worst matchup in the west and he knows it. I think in spite of the loss dallas proved it yesterday in a low scoring physical game.

uh, losing a critical game... at home... where Kobe doesn't even play 12 minutes of the second half because he's injured proves one thing only... that even less that full strength, on the road, when the chips are down, the Lakers can still outclass the Mavs.

Remember, dallas blew them out in a game earlier in the year when they shot the ball better.

I'll remember that if you remember that Bynum wasn't healthy yet and it was in the first half of the season, where the Mavs typically play very well and the Lakers historically putz around.

Last night dallas shot only 40% which is well below average for them and they were still in the game at the end. now give credit to the lakers sound defense. but dallas missed a lot of wide open shots and some layups. dallas matched their physical play and rebounding. Dallas just lacked scoring. players like chandler, terry, barea, beaubois, needed to step their game up offensively. obviously dallas has no answer for the lakers size at the 2 position. dallas plays undersized there. but they have to score to make up for it. if terry is missing shots like that they might be better playing brewer or stevenson to match the lakers length overall.

they have matched the physical defensive play of chicago, boston, LA, SA, Mia, and Orlando. So come playoff time I wouldn't simply write them off. they can beat those teams.

they can probably beat most of those teams, but they have no shot of beating the Lakers.

 

[mojorizen7]

he doesn't get recognized for being a closer. that's all I meant.

I understand your context,and you're right. However, the true definition of term "closer" IMO is a player who continually elevates his team beyond the regular season glory.

how does steve nash look now that amare is gone? a shell of himself I would say.

That has little to do with Amare's absence. The Suns still have guys who can fascilitate Nash's strengths.
Nash is just aging.

 

[BC867]

Nash is just aging.

Exactly!

Age + the most MPG on the team = fatigue.

Age + fatigue = injuries as the season wears on.

Injuries to a Point Guard = playoff disappointment.

 

[Cheesebeef]

so, during the Mavs really hot streak since Dirk got back healthy, they pretty much beat up on the dregs/average teams in the league, while losing pretty much every close game they played against the better teams (lost to Chicago by 5, no by 1, LA by 5, Portland by 3, Memphis by 1, denver by 1) save for one good win against Boston. 1-6 against good teams in close games since late January... how are they not soft/choke artists again? if this is the best Mavs team you've ever seen, you must have been in a coma during the year they went to the Finals.

this is nothing more than a second round shellacking at the hands of the Lakers... possibly even another first round bust depending on what seed they end up with in the first round.

 

[jagu]

I predict a Memphis Grizzlies vs. Indiana Pacers finals.

 

[BC867]

I predict a Memphis Grizzlies vs. Indiana Pacers finals.

With TV coverage on Cable channel 1548.

Maybe they'll show a commercial with Blake Griffin jumping over the spare tire of a Kia.

 

[Magnus]

With TV coverage on Cable channel 1548.

Maybe they'll show a commercial with Blake Griffin jumping over the spare tire of a Kia.

Better yet, he will dunk the spare tire. Showing that Kia's don't need spare tires cause they are awesome like that.

 

[Lorenzo]

so, during the Mavs really hot streak since Dirk got back healthy, they pretty much beat up on the dregs/average teams in the league, while losing pretty much every close game they played against the better teams (lost to Chicago by 5, no by 1, LA by 5, Portland by 3, Memphis by 1, denver by 1) save for one good win against Boston. 1-6 against good teams in close games since late January... how are they not soft/choke artists again? if this is the best Mavs team you've ever seen, you must have been in a coma during the year they went to the Finals.

this is nothing more than a second round shellacking at the hands of the Lakers... possibly even another first round bust depending on what seed they end up with in the first round.

Well I was in mexico on vacation, but I did watch the phoenix and miami series from there when dallas made the finals. that mavericks team was as talented, but they were not nearly as expereinced and their big men were not nearly as talented. it's hard to believe that josh howard was the 2nd to best player on that team and devin harris was bearly sniffing mins for the first time in real games. what's become of all those guys now without a dirk on their team? only one left is terry. this dallas team is better overall, unfortunately there are no phoenix suns(minus amare which was huge) waiting around for them in the western conference finals if they do manage to upset LA. this year there are more elite teams compared to then.

as far as the now? they beat boston twice, beat LA, Beat Miami twice, lost to chicago twice in close games, beat SA. those are the best teams in the league....none of the others have much of a chance in a 7 game series. they beat those teams when they were on hot streaks as well.

Injuries are a part of the game so if LA was injured I'm not going to discount the victory and I'm not going to make excuses for dallas for losing either. dallas has not been 100% all year long and have lost players for long stretches and are still in the mix of the elite.
so they are 1-1 against LA. you can't just spin it one direction and expect me to buy what you are selling.

I think in a 7 game series you and I both know that there aren't very many people throwing money at memphis, denver, or any of the teams not named LA/SA to beat dallas. so if they lose at the buzzer to those teams I'm not going to panic....now if they were getting blown out by those teams that would be different.

my biggest problem with dallas right now is that they are getting too reliant on their offense. earlier in the year they wern't scoring nearly as much and they were battling physically. since they have made moves and got guys back from injury they have started to score a lot more. and they aren't playing as physical(defense/rebounding) as they were earlier in the year. I like what I saw against LA they just needed to score the bball a little more in key stretches.

as far as the second round match vs the lakers? I still contend that dallas is the only team that can beat LA in the west. they seem to matchup well. I'm not predicting dallas to win...just saying they have a real shot. If they lose I will be back here either way to say you were right.

 

[Lorenzo]

I understand your context,and you're right. However, the true definition of term "closer" IMO is a player who continually elevates his team beyond the regular season glory.
That has little to do with Amare's absence. The Suns still have guys who can fascilitate Nash's strengths.
Nash is just aging.

and dirk has elevated his game in the playoffs. I understand that he has no ring. but he has closed many games in the playoffs in his career. again his playoff numbers are better than his regular season numbers. he has killed many teams in the playoffs. the biggest problem for dirk is that the one year they made the finals they lost and he will be forever judged by that series unless he wins a title. it really doesn't matter what he does in any other game. he will be doubted until he wins it all(fair or not). i think he plays better when the game is on the line. at least that's what i've seen over the last 5 to 6 years of his career when nash left.

 

[Covert Rain]

and dirk has elevated his game in the playoffs. I understand that he has no ring. but he has closed many games in the playoffs in his career. again his playoff numbers are better than his regular season numbers. he has killed many teams in the playoffs. the biggest problem for dirk is that the one year they made the finals they lost and he will be forever judged by that series unless he wins a title. it really doesn't matter what he does in any other game. he will be doubted until he wins it all(fair or not). i think he plays better when the game is on the line. at least that's what i've seen over the last 5 to 6 years of his career when nash left.

Looking at Dirks overall stats in the playoffs doesn't prove your point. I watch every game in the playoffs and I distinctly remember Dirk putting up big numbers in several games that fading down the stretch or missing key shots down the stretch.

I stand by my assessment that Dirk has not been clutch in the playoffs.

 

[Lorenzo]

Looking at Dirks overall stats in the playoffs doesn't prove your point. I watch every game in the playoffs and I distinctly remember Dirk putting up big numbers in several games that fading down the stretch or missing key shots down the stretch.

I stand by my assessment that Dirk has not been clutch in the playoffs.

he has played a lot of playoff games for 10 years it seems. i've seen plenty of games where he has missed...i've seen plenty of games where he has made. his numbers go up in the playoffs. that is a measure of him elevating his game.

he's done it when you've watched him play the suns. he's missed and made. he's had a 50 point game and probably had a 15 point game. he's hit a last second shot in a game he didn't even play that well...he's missed a last second shot when steve nash made his. he's won a series he's lost a series. like you say it is what it is. until he whens a ring people can knock him for that.

 

[Lorenzo]

uncharacteristically missed shots in a big game? uh, no. they very much CHARACTERISTICALLY missed shots, at home, in a huge game. that's exactly what I'm talking about.



who cares what Kobe thinks? Kobe thought his team should have traded Bynum for Jason Kidd or gone out and gotten Baron Davis. I can guarantee you, Phil Jackson doesn't fear the Mavs.

they have hit those same shots against all of the other teams in the league. 40% is below the team average...and the only reason they shot that high was because dirk and marion were the only players that shot at a high percentage. so if you exclude them the other mavericks probably shot in the 20's which is very uncharacteristic for them this season. they have hit plenty of huge shots against big teams this year.

who cares what kobe thinks? plenty of people do. apparantly the lakers do because they kept him when shaq and kobe were feuding....and shaq was still mvp caliber then. it may have taken time, but they gave into his demands and got gasol(another superstar player which is all I think he was asking for in the first place) when he said he needed help and have won 2 rings since then. he is the best player in the league and probably one of the smartest guys on the court. if he says the mavericks can beat them I am going to believe him before I listen to other people. I don't think phil fears the mavs, but I know they have his attention. he called that game a must win and said he didn't want to play a game 7 in dallas. what does that mean? well i'm gonna take it for face value. he made random comments about dallas when they lost caron butler to injury so they must have been on his radar. but no he probably doesn't fear them. why would he?

 

[Cheesebeef]

as far as the now? they beat boston twice, beat LA, Beat Miami twice, lost to chicago twice in close games, beat SA. those are the best teams in the league....none of the others have much of a chance in a 7 game series. they beat those teams when they were on hot streaks as well.

Injuries are a part of the game so if LA was injured I'm not going to discount the victory and I'm not going to make excuses for dallas for losing either. dallas has not been 100% all year long and have lost players for long stretches and are still in the mix of the elite.
so they are 1-1 against LA. you can't just spin it one direction and expect me to buy what you are selling.

I think in a 7 game series you and I both know that there aren't very many people throwing money at memphis, denver, or any of the teams not named LA/SA to beat dallas.

uh, i said Dallas could probably play with most everyone else, but they have zero shot of beating the Lakers. they aren't big enough/mentally tough enough/talented enough.

that's not a dig at Dallas. i don't think anyone can beat the Lakers. Maybe the Celtics but i think they gave up their advantage when they decided to depend on Shaq's health over Perkins.

but you can't deny that the Mavs, for years have been the Lakers bitch. Everyone pretty much has and i expect them to get their asses handed to them in 5 or 6 games should they meet in the playoffs.

as far as the second round match vs the lakers? I still contend that dallas is the only team that can beat LA in the west. they seem to matchup well. I'm not predicting dallas to win...just saying they have a real shot.

man, i just don't see what you're seeing. dallas's big advantage against every team is having Dirk wreaking havoc because of how skilled he is... problem is... Odom plays Dirk tough. He's got the size/length and athleticism to play Dirk just as well on the perimeter as he does on the block. on top of that, the Mavs have pretty much zero advantage at PG which is the position that KILLS the Lakers the most and their bigs aren't nearly as skilled as the Lakers. i see them as an easy 5 game series... maybe 6.

Personally, i think with a healthy Perkins, the Thunder are a MUCH tougher matchup for LA. They actually have the PG who will destroy at that match-up AND they have the size/athleticism to bang and run with them.

 

[Lorenzo]

uh, i said Dallas could probably play with most everyone else, but they have zero shot of beating the Lakers. they aren't big enough/mentally tough enough/talented enough.

that's not a dig at Dallas. i don't think anyone can beat the Lakers. Maybe the Celtics but i think they gave up their advantage when they decided to depend on Shaq's health over Perkins.

but you can't deny that the Mavs, for years have been the Lakers bitch. Everyone pretty much has and i expect them to get their asses handed to them in 5 or 6 games should they meet in the playoffs.



man, i just don't see what you're seeing. dallas's big advantage against every team is having Dirk wreaking havoc because of how skilled he is... problem is... Odom plays Dirk tough. He's got the size/length and athleticism to play Dirk just as well on the perimeter as he does on the block. on top of that, the Mavs have pretty much zero advantage at PG which is the position that KILLS the Lakers the most and their bigs aren't nearly as skilled as the Lakers. i see them as an easy 5 game series... maybe 6.

Personally, i think with a healthy Perkins, the Thunder are a MUCH tougher matchup for LA. They actually have the PG who will destroy at that match-up AND they have the size/athleticism to bang and run with them.

that may be so about the thunder. the lakers struggled with them last year. dallas has never played LA in a series. I don't think odom can handle dirk. dirk was shooting the ball in his grill in that game and despite a slow start still shot at like 50% and had a great second half. dallas has to exploit that matchup more because dirk was killing all three of their BIG guys in that game. in fact he can get them in foul trouble and get to the FT line at will if he attacks the basket. you are right about the guards. that is where dallas is a wild card. they give up size because they don't have an offensive skilled 2 guard that matches LA's size. they will either have to outscore the lakers with shooting and giving up defense or play a bigger 2 and give up offense. that to me is their worst problem vs LA. But dirk, chandler, and haywood can at least stand up vs gasol, odom and bynum. lakers still have the edge though.

 

[Lorenzo]

uh, i said Dallas could probably play with most everyone else, but they have zero shot of beating the Lakers. they aren't big enough/mentally tough enough/talented enough.

that's not a dig at Dallas. i don't think anyone can beat the Lakers. Maybe the Celtics but i think they gave up their advantage when they decided to depend on Shaq's health over Perkins.

but you can't deny that the Mavs, for years have been the Lakers bitch. Everyone pretty much has and i expect them to get their asses handed to them in 5 or 6 games should they meet in the playoffs.



man, i just don't see what you're seeing. dallas's big advantage against every team is having Dirk wreaking havoc because of how skilled he is... problem is... Odom plays Dirk tough. He's got the size/length and athleticism to play Dirk just as well on the perimeter as he does on the block. on top of that, the Mavs have pretty much zero advantage at PG which is the position that KILLS the Lakers the most and their bigs aren't nearly as skilled as the Lakers. i see them as an easy 5 game series... maybe 6.

Personally, i think with a healthy Perkins, the Thunder are a MUCH tougher matchup for LA. They actually have the PG who will destroy at that match-up AND they have the size/athleticism to bang and run with them.

case in point. at the end of the game dallas had a chance to come back. they needed a stop. they had kidd and terry in the backcourt. marion was guarding kobe. marion defended kobe's shot, but artest punked kidd for the rebound and put it back. that is the problem with playing terry at the 2 for dallas vs. LA. a decent sized 2 guard could at least box out artest, but kidd is too small to guard a 3.

 

[Cheesebeef]

they have hit those same shots against all of the other teams in the league. 40% is below the team average...and the only reason they shot that high was because dirk and marion were the only players that shot at a high percentage. so if you exclude them the other mavericks probably shot in the 20's which is very uncharacteristic for them this season. they have hit plenty of huge shots against big teams this year.

who cares what kobe thinks? plenty of people do. apparantly the lakers do because they kept him when shaq and kobe were feuding....and shaq was still mvp caliber then. it may have taken time, but they gave into his demands and got gasol(another superstar player which is all I think he was asking for in the first place) when he said he needed help and have won 2 rings since then. he is the best player in the league and probably one of the smartest guys on the court. if he says the mavericks can beat them I am going to believe him before I listen to other people. I don't think phil fears the mavs, but I know they have his attention. he called that game a must win and said he didn't want to play a game 7 in dallas. what does that mean? well i'm gonna take it for face value. he made random comments about dallas when they lost caron butler to injury so they must have been on his radar. but no he probably doesn't fear them. why would he?

believe whatever you want. do you think Kobe's going to say we can beat them no matter where we play and give bulletin board material? or phil's going to do the same. you've as much admitted they're the smartest player/coach in the game. saying anything other than what they said would be flat out stupid. they spoke in platitudes. you're buying them because you have to. i understand that.

but i live in LA, i read LA papers, i watch their games. no one's afraid of the Mavs here because a) the Mavs have never really threatened the Lakers since the Lakers got good again and b) the Mavs have been habitual choke artists in the playoffs, losing in the first round 3 of the last 4 years as a higher seed.

 

[Lorenzo]

believe whatever you want. do you think Kobe's going to say we can beat them no matter where we play and give bulletin board material? or phil's going to do the same. you've as much admitted they're the smartest player/coach in the game. saying anything other than what they said would be flat out stupid. they spoke in platitudes. you're buying them because you have to. i understand that.

but i live in LA, i read LA papers, i watch their games. no one's afraid of the Mavs here because a) the Mavs have never really threatened the Lakers since the Lakers got good again and b) the Mavs have been habitual choke artists in the playoffs, losing in the first round 3 of the last 4 years as a higher seed.

true...i wouldn't fear them either if I'm looking at history. If I were a lakers fan I would be all over them like I was all over the cowboys in the 90's when I thought they could never lose. that's what happens when you are not just a champion, but are a dynasty. you get the benefit of every doubt. and I still say they are the favorite until they lose in the playoffs.

all i'm saying is this is a new year and dallas has never played LA in the playoffs. that and this dallas team is a lot different than previous ones.

I'm sure LA didn't fear detroit before they lost that series or boston before they lost that one. but they can be beaten. they can't win every single year. at some point they will lose. not saying it's going to be this year and it will be vs. dallas. just saying I think dallas is their biggest threat. OKC is still a young team, but they are a threat too. SA will have their hands full and could be upset as well if they meet the thunder in round 2. the blazers are an outside threat as well lately.

 

[Cheesebeef]

that may be so about the thunder. the lakers struggled with them last year. dallas has never played LA in a series. I don't think odom can handle dirk. dirk was shooting the ball in his grill in that game and despite a slow start still shot at like 50% and had a great second half. dallas has to exploit that matchup more because dirk was killing all three of their BIG guys in that game. in fact he can get them in foul trouble and get to the FT line at will if he attacks the basket. you are right about the guards. that is where dallas is a wild card. they give up size because they don't have an offensive skilled 2 guard that matches LA's size. they will either have to outscore the lakers with shooting and giving up defense or play a bigger 2 and give up offense. that to me is their worst problem vs LA. But dirk, chandler, and haywood can at least stand up vs gasol, odom and bynum. lakers still have the edge though.

in the last 3 years, since the Lakers got huge with their size, Dirk has shot 41% against them. in the last three years against the rest of the league, he's shot 49%. numbers and wins and losses over that stretch don't lie dude. bottom line, Odom plays Dirk better than almost anyone else in the game and the fact that if he gets past odom, there's another athletic 7 footer waiting for him. and yeah, in the second half Dirk was lighting odom up and then the game got really tight, and as Dirk does in spots, he disappeared and let others take the biggest shots.

and no... Dirk, Chandler and Haywood CAN'T stand up to that front line. just as a player, Dirk is better than odom, no doubt, but like I said, odom gives him fits. and ain't no comparison between Gasol (all-NBA) and Bynum (a monster who looks healthy and is a force on offense and D and one dimensional guys like Chandler and Haywood.

 

[Cheesebeef]

true...i wouldn't fear them either if I'm looking at history. If I were a lakers fan I would be all over them like I was all over the cowboys in the 90's when I thought they could never lose.

yeah, thing is I'm NOT a laker fan. I LOATHE them. i'm a suns fan who loathe them even more than the Spurs who I hated more than any team i could remember since the Showtime lakers.

all i'm saying is this is a new year and dallas has never played LA in the playoffs. that and this dallas team is a lot different than previous ones.

just saying... this is said seemingly EVERY YEAR about the Mavs and more often than not, they choke, embarassingly so. the only time they've won in the first round in the last four years was against the Spurs without Ginobli, right? and then they got embarassed by the Nuggets in the first round.

I'm sure LA didn't fear detroit before they lost that series or boston before they lost that one. but they can be beaten. they can't win every single year. at some point they will lose. not saying it's going to be this year and it will be vs. dallas. just saying I think dallas is their biggest threat. OKC is still a young team, but they are a threat too. SA will have their hands full and could be upset as well if they meet the thunder in round 2. the blazers are an outside threat as well lately.

the lakers will tear apart the spurs as well.

 

[Lorenzo]

yeah, thing is I'm NOT a laker fan. I LOATHE them. i'm a suns fan who loathe them even more than the Spurs who I hated more than any team i could remember since the Showtime lakers.



just saying... this is said seemingly EVERY YEAR about the Mavs and more often than not, they choke, embarassingly so. the only time they've won in the first round in the last four years was against the Spurs without Ginobli, right? and then they got embarassed by the Nuggets in the first round.



the lakers will tear apart the spurs as well.

yeah I know you aren't a lakers fan. i was just responding to your quote that said LA(the city).

 

[Lorenzo]

in the last 3 years, since the Lakers got huge with their size, Dirk has shot 41% against them. in the last three years against the rest of the league, he's shot 49%. numbers and wins and losses over that stretch don't lie dude. bottom line, Odom plays Dirk better than almost anyone else in the game and the fact that if he gets past odom, there's another athletic 7 footer waiting for him. and yeah, in the second half Dirk was lighting odom up and then the game got really tight, and as Dirk does in spots, he disappeared and let others take the biggest shots.

and no... Dirk, Chandler and Haywood CAN'T stand up to that front line. just as a player, Dirk is better than odom, no doubt, but like I said, odom gives him fits. and ain't no comparison between Gasol (all-NBA) and Bynum (a monster who looks healthy and is a force on offense and D and one dimensional guys like Chandler and Haywood.

well dirk didn't necessarily disappear the guy got most of his points in the second half when odom was guarding him with a body...other guys had wide open shots that they missed all game long. even dirk missed wide open shots in the first quarter that he normally makes. I don't care how athletic you are. no one in the league can guard dirk's jump shot. and most if not all big men can't keep him from driving past them. I don't think odom is as bad off compared to other big guys because he can move with dirk.

really they hit shots down the stretch they were coming from behind. the one that I recall that missed was terry's open runner that just didn't drop.