Why is everyone afraid of Atlanta?

[Cheesebeef]

but don't let that get in the way of your Cardinal hatred.

was this really necessary? we're talking football and you get personal for some reason - but hey, you're running out of excuses, so why not get personal and try and derail the conversation? Good attempt, but a failed one, nonetheless.

Player for player, I'm talking 8 deep, I would take our D-Line over those two. Also, you can't factor in the injuries on their D-Lines if a player is hurt, he's not going to play so he doesn't factor in to how good a unit is.

now can you tell me WHY you're talking 8 deep on THIS TEAM? What have those eight deep contributed THIS year or last year (besides Berry who we all acknowledge WAS a stud for us the last two years) and what makes them better than the other teams I've mentioned? You said you could keep going, but I've yet to see where you've actually said WHY they're better.

And as far as I can't factor injuries on their D-line if a player is hurt - let me ask you this - just how do you gage depth? I would gage it as someone being able to come in and make plays/keep the status quo going if a player DOES GET HURT - so how does showing that some of these teams have suffered injuries and yet there's been no drop-off not count when talking about depth? That's EXACTLY the evidence of depth.

 

[vinnymac]

i will make a statement here. the falcons have looked a whole lot better as a team than the cardinals have. i don't see them making a lot of mistakes. last night game is just one game. every team has a melt down game like that. as far as mental preparedness, the falcons have the edge over the cardinals. the cardinals havn't shown that they can stop a top notch pass rush or the blitz. the falcons are going to look at that seahawks game and lick their chops. their linbackers are just as good as the seahawks. their defensive line is way better than the seahawks. the cardinals are going to have their hands full on this one.

berry does need to step up. he has been silent all season long. he suppose to be the defensive leader on the cardinals defense. it is time to show it. he needs to have a big game againist gandy and try to keep contament on vick. the last time the cardinals played the falcons they did a great job againist vick. that has been 2 season ago. it is time for the cardinals to live up to expectation this sunday afternoon. the whole damn team needs to get their head out of their ass and start playing like they know how to.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I can keep going if you'd like.

sure, can you tell me how our D-line unit is better than Jax, Seattle, and Chicago as well. Afterall, I believe it was your statement at the beginning of the season that we had THE deepst defensive-line unit in the entire league - Jax and Atlanta were just twoof the teams I brought up at the time, I also brought up Carolina and Indy, both of which have been somewhat dissappointing and it's arguable at this point whether they're better than us or not (see what I did there, it's called admitting you might be wrong - it CAN be done) but apparently you're sticking by your statement, so keep going. How is our D-line deeper than the Bears, Seahawks and Jax? Afterall, they are according to you the deepest in the league.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

Spouting off stats is not a real indicator of who has the better overall line. I think the LB's have as much to do with runs stats as the DL.Pittsburgh isn't considered to have a great DL but i think they have a pretty long streak of not allowing a 100 yard back.With sacks, alot of it depends on how blitz's were called and so forth.Stats are a guide but not the end all of who has a better DL. To me, Jax has the best starting DL.It's silly to argue who has the better depth because it almost impossible to tell who does.The key is that the Cards seem to have alot of DL who can get in there and play which bodes well for their depth whereas alot of teams don't have that.

 

[Cheesebeef]

The key is that the Cards seem to have alot of DL who can get in there and play which bodes well for their depth whereas alot of teams don't have that.

and again, I ask what this statement is based on? I've yet to see an answer. All I've seen is basically the argument that the Cardinals have a lot of good depth because... I say so.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

and again, I ask what this statement is based on? I've yet to see an answer. All I've seen is basically the argument that the Cardinals have a lot of good depth because... I say so.

because I say so should be good enough .

 

[Cheesebeef]

because I say so should be good enough .

touche! can't argue with that!

 

[JeffGollin]

I just broke down Atlanta. I agree that (under the right circumstances) they can be had.

But the scariest thing I discovered is that - after you account for Warrick Dunn and his 101 running yards per game - it turns out the Mike Vick is averaging 77 yards per game.

In other words, the opposing QB this week is even-with or outgaining Edge on the ground.

Ouch!

 

[kerouac9]

Doesn't that just mean that our starters probably aren't that much better than our otherwise marginal backups? The difference between Marcus Stroud and John Henderson and whomever is behind them is huge, but that doesn't mean that their backups don't suck more than Gabe Watson and Jonathan Lewis.

The silence around the NFL at the waiving of Langston Moore is pretty damning in regards to the "value" of our backup DTs.

In regards to the question:

Why is Everyone Afraid of Atlanta?

Are you ready? I hope you slept well last night, because this is going to keep you up until Sunday:

Calvin Pace v. Alge Crumpler.

Even Matt Ware v. Michael Jenkins or Roddy White should be bad enough. And that's if they forget to move Ashlie Lelie to the other side of the defense like the Rams did with Torry Holt. Don't humor yourselves, Cardinal fans, Antrel Rolle isn't anywhere near as good right now as Mike McKenzie.

People think that we can contain Michael Vick (at least until it counts) because we did two years ago with totally different personnel (and an effective Bertand Berry). How many new starters do we have on this defense since that time? Not to mention that Bert Berry couldn't do anything against an Orlando Pace that was playing on one leg.

 

[Rivercard]

Even Matt Ware v. Michael Jenkins or Roddy White should be bad enough.

Hopefully no Ware this weekend. Green will be back.

 

[ajcardfan]

Calvin Pace v. Alge Crumpler.

Even Matt Ware v. Michael Jenkins or Roddy White should be bad enough. And that's if they forget to move Ashlie Lelie to the other side of the defense like the Rams did with Torry Holt. Don't humor yourselves, Cardinal fans, Antrel Rolle isn't anywhere near as good right now as Mike McKenzie.

The good news on that is that it'll be Vick throwing to them. I like Vick as a football player almost as much as you do. But, their passing game doesn't worry me in the least.

 

[BigDavis75]

I gave us credit for playing Jackson well, Gore still ran for over 5.4 yards per carry and was getting shut down by the Eagles last week to the tune of 3.3 yard per carry - to call him EXCELLENT is an incredible stretch - and Alexander had his best game of the season against us - and if you haven't noticed, he's been AWFUL this season, as has the entire running game for Seattle - except against us of course where they ran for 150.




it was just as our woeful performance allowing 150 yard to Seattle who can't get untracked against anyone else. So, I see where we matched Atlanta's poor performance last night, but I havent seen the abslute shut down thhat Atlanta had in the other two games.

Atlanta has really gotten the benefit of the schedule. They played against Williams of the Bucs who had hurt his back and tryed playing hurt (he still ran for a TD) and Dashaun Foster who stinks, and was playing without his left tackle. When they finally went up against a real running game they got killed.



ah, and who was it that our vaunted pass rushers went up against the Niners? Oh yeah, they were MISSING two starters on the O-line- what['s the excuse there? Where was our vaunted depth when Berry was out?

The 9ers are easily one of the best O-Lines I've seen this season in run blocking and they have good depth, Berry should have taken advantage of the conditions but unfortunately he didn't. What's Patrick Kerney's excuse for his 1 tackle so far this season?



And funny enough, you have yet to mention anything about Jacksonville or the Saints, or the Bears and really have shown NOTHING on the Cardinals side in the way ofany evidence whatsoever that actually shows a tangible REASON why you continue to boast us being 8-deep.

I already said I would take our ends over those of Jacksonville and I would take Smith over any depth player they have (Meyer sp? is pretty good though). Don't forget they played the Colts who have very very little rushing game to speak of, you may have not forgotten it but you certainly neglectded to mention it. As far as the Bears, their 4 starters are much better than ours, they have one of the top 3 or 4 DTs in the league and have amazing ends. I don't think that Chicago was in your original question though. Again, I would take our depth over Chicago's though.

Are you going to move on to showing me why Jacksonville is worse than us at this point also, even though they have more sacks, have shown the abilityto deal with injuries and have shut the run down much better than us?

I'm waiting.

Cbus made a very good point with the LBs factoring in on the run D. Peterson and Daryl Smith are two excellent LBs, we have no one comparable at this point in time, that affects the run D. Our D-Line effectively dealt with injuries last year, you know when we lost two starters for the year and our other two played hurt for a time each.

 

[BullheadCardFan]

Are you ready? I hope you slept well last night, because this is going to keep you up until Sunday:

Calvin Pace v. Alge Crumpler

That matchup does bother me ... Even though Crumpler had a big drop against the Saints he does have the potential to make big plays ..

 

[Cheesebeef]

Cbus made a very good point with the LBs factoring in on the run D. Peterson and Daryl Smith are two excellent LBs, we have no one comparable at this point in time, that affects the run D. Our D-Line effectively dealt with injuries last year, you know when we lost two starters for the year and our other two played hurt for a time each.

good lord - forget it. People who can't admit they are wrong and still yet to show any kind of actual reason why THEIR SIDE of the argument is right besides "I'd take our ends over anyone else (for no reason given) and Antonio Smith (for no reason given)" is like arguing with people about the existence of God. If you won't provide any actual data for your side of the argument except "because I said so" then that says it all to me.

 

[CardLogic]

Calvin Pace v. Alge Crumpler.

Even Matt Ware v. Michael Jenkins or Roddy White should be bad enough.

More likely:

Karlos Dansby v. Alge Crumpler - that evens things out a bit better. No doubt Crumpler will catch a few though.

and Eric Green starting at CB not Matt Ware; also possibly Macklin not Ware in backup

 

[Russ Smith]

The good news on that is that it'll be Vick throwing to them. I like Vick as a football player almost as much as you do. But, their passing game doesn't worry me in the least.

yep if they're going to beat us make it be with the pass. If you try to play them even they're just going to run the ball down your throat, might as well sell out to the run and MAKE Vick throw the ball.

Watching Monday it continues to amaze me that Vick has STILL not learned any touch on the ball? I know there were some big drops in the game but the guy just throws the ball too hard, I'm sure that's why they drop some balls he simply throws the ball too hot to handle sometimes.

 

[D-Dogg]

I'm not afraid of Atlanta, at all. Overrated QB who is a throwing running back, good defensive backs and one of my favorite defensive backs in the league, good defense, decent team.

I'm also not afraid that they will be "pissed." If anyone should be pissed, it should be the Cards. The Falcons should be emtionally drained, spent and tired, on short rest and with less time to prepare for us.

 

[BigDavis75]

good lord - forget it. People who can't admit they are wrong and still yet to show any kind of actual reason why THEIR SIDE of the argument is right besides "I'd take our ends over anyone else (for no reason given) and Antonio Smith (for no reason given)" is like arguing with people about the existence of God. If you won't provide any actual data for your side of the argument except "because I said so" then that says it all to me.

I never said I would take our ends over "anyone else," I said I would take them over Jax's. I think its fairly obvious that our ends are better, does there really have to be stats in that instance? I'm not trying to sound condescending but, do you watch every Card's game? Last year Antonio Smith filled in and he played very well, his play should be evidence enough that he is a good player, I can't beat you over the head with sack stats because he is not a pass rusher. It's the same situation with Chike, last year he played very well but didn't put up godly stats, watching the games and seeing how players perform is much more important than stats, you don't really seem to understand that.

 

[Duckjake]

I never said I would take our ends over "anyone else," I said I would take them over Jax's. I think its fairly obvious that our ends are better, does there really have to be stats in that instance? I'm not trying to sound condescending but, do you watch every Card's game? Last year Antonio Smith filled in and he played very well

Antonio Smith was playing DT against the Rams on obvious passing downs. In another scheme Okeafor,Smith,Clancy,LMoore,Berry were the Dline. The Steven Jackson line so to speak.

I believe that Smith is now in the DT rotation and that is why the Cards cut Moore, who was basically the same type player as Clancy, and picked up Cooper for depth at DE.

Just a hunch but I'd bet we see more of Antonio at DT against Atlanta to get more speed on the field because of Vick and Warrick Dunn.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I never said I would take our ends over "anyone else," I said I would take them over Jax's. I think its fairly obvious that our ends are better, does there really have to be stats in that instance? I'm not trying to sound condescending but, do you watch every Card's game? Last year Antonio Smith filled in and he played very well, his play should be evidence enough that he is a good player, I can't beat you over the head with sack stats because he is not a pass rusher. It's the same situation with Chike, last year he played very well but didn't put up godly stats, watching the games and seeing how players perform is much more important than stats, you don't really seem to understand that.

Do I watch every game? That's a joke - it's the fact that while watching every game AND the fact that there are ZERO stats to back up your point is what makes me continue to scrtrach my head at the notion that somehow we have the deepest 8 man line in the league. You know what I've seen the last two years? Teams run the ball down our throat and since Berry went down last season, the absolute absence of pressure on the quarterback.

Wouldn't you think that with all the "playing very well" that there would be SOME stats to back your claims up? I mean SOMETHING that you could actually hang your hat on besides "I say so" which is what you continue to do.

As far as our ends versus Jax - again, what this year shows that our ends are better? Is it the lack of pressure they put on the QB? They're glowing tackle numbers? What is it exactly besides "I sxay so" leacds you to this conclusion?

 

[Cheesebeef]

I think its fairly obvious that our ends are better, does there really have to be stats in that instance?

I'd say when something's FAIRLY OBVIOUS, logic dictates that there would be a huge discrepency in numbers between our DE and theirs and that tangible evidence would be at least be somewhat apparent to back up that obviousness - don't you?

 

[Cheesebeef]

something just occurred to me and I wanted to try and continue this debate without getting personal - even though you've already gotten there citing my apparent "hatred for the team" and "asking me if I actually watch all the games" - and I figured maybe something is getting lost in translation between the two of us.

Before the season started, I believe you made the claim that you'd take our 8 man line over anyone else's in the league. Do you STILL hold on to that belief that you'd take our defensive line unit AS A WHOLE against anyone else's in the league?

 

[Pariah]

I don't know if I'd take our line over ATL's, but it's an interesting thing when you have a runner like Vick at QB--penetration may be a BAD thing. If we just play a game that contains Vick--a game that doesn't flush him out of the pocket, we might be better off.

 

[kerouac9]

Finally, our inability to attack the quarterback in the pocket becomes a good thing!

 

[Big T]

Why be afraid of Atlanta?

If you've got half a brain, you should be.
They very well might be a better all around functioning team.