Wilfork

[General Chaos]

This guy showed me nothing last night. At his size he should have dominated that game. I watched him on almost every play and he got very little penetration at all. Most the time the guard would just keep him in front of him. Everyone will be pumped that he blew up the RB. All I saw was the guard miss his block completely and vince run straight.

I watched him with great anticipation last night, and was not impressed. For some of you to mention him as a possibility at #3 is a joke. He is just a big body on a stacked defense. So I say lets go elsewhere with the pick!

 

[Mr.Dibbs]

Originally posted by General Chaos
This guy showed me nothing last night. At his size he should have dominated that game. I watched him on almost every play and he got very little penetration at all. Most the time the guard would just keep him in front of him. Everyone will be pumped that he blew up the RB. All I saw was the guard miss his block completely and vince run straight.

I watched him with great anticipation last night, and was not impressed. For some of you to mention him as a possibility at #3 is a joke. He is just a big body on a stacked defense. So I say lets go elsewhere with the pick!

How many times have you seen him play?

 

[Russ Smith]

Originally posted by General Chaos
This guy showed me nothing last night. At his size he should have dominated that game. I watched him on almost every play and he got very little penetration at all. Most the time the guard would just keep him in front of him. Everyone will be pumped that he blew up the RB. All I saw was the guard miss his block completely and vince run straight.

I watched him with great anticipation last night, and was not impressed. For some of you to mention him as a possibility at #3 is a joke. He is just a big body on a stacked defense. So I say lets go elsewhere with the pick!

He's really good but he's inconsistent and has had huge weight issues in college. Last night he was doubled pretty much the whole game, that's the kind of player we could use, someone who draws so much attention he makes it easier on others. I would be very leery of taking him at #3 because of the weight issue but if we were to move down I would absolutely take him in the top 10. And if he has good workouts conceivably even at 3. I do think his potential is much higher than Tommie Harris, he just has to show he can stay in shape.

he's an absolute freak of an athletic specimen he's a shotput/discus guy in track and really quick and freakishly strong.
In shape he's very comparable to a young, healthy Eric Swann, but he hasn't been in shape enough.

Wally seems to think I dislike Wilfork, don't, I just wish he kept his weight in better check if he did he'd be an absolute monster.

 

[General Chaos]

I've watched him play a few games each season. He was a monster as an underclassmen. IMO to draft a DT that high he would have to change the entire game. I just ahven't seen that much growth in him this season. At the college level he should be much more dominant.

 

[CaptTurbo]

You mean you fell asleep when he ran through a guard and ate the RB as he got the handoff?

I was surprised the RB even got up.

 

[General Chaos]

Originally posted by swd1974
You mean you fell asleep when he ran through a guard and ate the RB as he got the handoff?

I was surprised the RB even got up.

Actually the guard turned the wrong direction, and only got one hand on Vince WillFat. So to answer your queston, No!

 

[Russ Smith]

Originally posted by General Chaos
I've watched him play a few games each season. He was a monster as an underclassmen. IMO to draft a DT that high he would have to change the entire game. I just ahven't seen that much growth in him this season. At the college level he should be much more dominant.

The reason is pretty obvious IMHO. Last year he was a backup DT in a rotation where they had Joseph, McDougal and others on the DL. This year while they still have enormous talent and they still rotated DL's, he played a lot more. AS a part time guy his lack of conditioning was less of a factor, this year he played more and would frequently get too tired to play, you can see it there's certain plays he just seems to stand there and lean on the OL.

IF he gets in shape we're talking perennial Pro Bowl DT without question, but he's got to get in shape.

 

[Shuesters2]

Wilfolk,

He looks like a younger Keith Traylor, ok but not great. Harris of Oklahoma has more upside. It doesn't make any difference anyway... George Boone is still with the Cards ( I think) and will draft a kicker with the third pick.

Shuesters.

 

[john h]

Manning looked good today and did not hurt his chance at #1.

 

[PACardsFan]

Re: Re: Wilfork

Originally posted by Russ Smith
He's really good but he's inconsistent and has had huge weight issues in college. Last night he was doubled pretty much the whole game, that's the kind of player we could use, someone who draws so much attention he makes it easier on others. I would be very leery of taking him at #3 because of the weight issue but if we were to move down I would absolutely take him in the top 10. And if he has good workouts conceivably even at 3. I do think his potential is much higher than Tommie Harris, he just has to show he can stay in shape.

he's an absolute freak of an athletic specimen he's a shotput/discus guy in track and really quick and freakishly strong.
In shape he's very comparable to a young, healthy Eric Swann, but he hasn't been in shape enough.

Wally seems to think I dislike Wilfork, don't, I just wish he kept his weight in better check if he did he'd be an absolute monster.

Russ,
You can't be serious comparing this guy to Swann. Swann had it all before the injuries. He simply dominated - was equally adept at stuffing the run & penetrating the pocket. I'm a Syracuse fan & watched plenty of Big East football over the years. Wilfork is TERRIBLY out of shape & we'd be crazy to draft this guy AT ALL! He reminds me of Gerald Warren of the Browns (BUST!!). People have callled him a Baby Sapp. He doesn't have the leadership of Sapp nor the MOTOR. This guy has big time BUST potential. I wouldn't touch him unless he fell to the 2nd round.

 

[LVCARDFREAK]

Originally posted by Shuesters2
Wilfolk,

He looks like a younger Keith Traylor, ok but not great. Harris of Oklahoma has more upside. It doesn't make any difference anyway... George Boone is still with the Cards ( I think) and will draft a kicker with the third pick.

Shuesters.

I dont see that happening, but historically teams do not draft DT's that early. DE's? yes, DT's no.

The reason is that as important as a DT is to a team a lot of mediocore guys can be 'coached' into being dominant DT's. What you are looking for is a space eater type who has some athleticism!

 

[Southpaw]

Originally posted by General Chaos
This guy showed me nothing last night. At his size he should have dominated that game. I watched him on almost every play and he got very little penetration at all. Most the time the guard would just keep him in front of him. Everyone will be pumped that he blew up the RB. All I saw was the guard miss his block completely and vince run straight.

I watched him with great anticipation last night, and was not impressed. For some of you to mention him as a possibility at #3 is a joke. He is just a big body on a stacked defense. So I say lets go elsewhere with the pick!

Anyone who saw the game like you did needs help. What the hell were you watching/ The guy was #75. He had on an orange jersey and white pants. He had 2 and 3 blockers attached to himlike Ramora fish on a shark. I guess stats lie, but Fla State had a grand total of 206 yards for the game. They average 450 per game for the year. Wilfork ( 7 tackles 4 hurries ), Vilma, Williams and Taylor led the team with tackles. The LBs make the tackles because the O line is so busy trying to keep Wilfork and company off of the QB and RBs that they can't go upfield and block them. Dude, you are blind and don't have a clue for line play. I imagine you think Fla State sucks and Miami and Wilfork just barely beat a suck team.

P.S/ Chris Rix was 6-19 for 96 yards. Wilfork must suck. Huh? But then I think you had an agenda going into the game and that clouded your judgement.

P.S.S. I will get the last laugh here, when he goes top 5, has a great rookie year and this board will be full of messages about how the Cards blew it when they had a chance to draft him and didn't.

P.S.S.S. The only conclusion I can come to from some posters is jealously. U of Miami competes for the National Championship year after year, wins 5 of them and does it by cheating and with smoke and mirrors. Right now Miami has 60 + players in the pros, so they do a pretty damn good job of fooling the Pro Football GMs and coaches.

 

[Southpaw]

Re: Re: Wilfork

Originally posted by Russ Smith
He's really good but he's inconsistent and has had huge weight issues in college. Last night he was doubled pretty much the whole game, that's the kind of player we could use, someone who draws so much attention he makes it easier on others. I would be very leery of taking him at #3 because of the weight issue but if we were to move down I would absolutely take him in the top 10. And if he has good workouts conceivably even at 3. I do think his potential is much higher than Tommie Harris, he just has to show he can stay in shape.

he's an absolute freak of an athletic specimen he's a shotput/discus guy in track and really quick and freakishly strong.
In shape he's very comparable to a young, healthy Eric Swann, but he hasn't been in shape enough.

Wally seems to think I dislike Wilfork, don't, I just wish he kept his weight in better check if he did he'd be an absolute monster.

I know you like Wilfork but you seem to be hedging your bet when you bring up weight and inconsistency. I can't think of a DT who is worth a crap in the NFL and weighs less than 325. That is what Wilfork weighs. This is a guy who came to Miami at 377 pounds 3 years ago. He has lost over 50 pounds and has gotten immensely stronger and faster. I'm sure he could go on the Atkins diet and make some people happier. It takes a helluva lot more stamina and energy to take on 2-3 O lineman on every play than running unabated to the QB. The guy deserves some plays off. Him playing every play is analogous to a RB running the ball 60 times a game. Not gonna happen.

 

[Southpaw]

Originally posted by General Chaos
Actually the guard turned the wrong direction, and only got one hand on Vince WillFat. So to answer your queston, No!

Now I know you are blind or prejudiced. ABC highlighted and analyzed that play 3 times. Willfork got off the snap so quickly that he split the 2 lineman who were still coming out of their stance, yet somehow you think it was a bogus play. Guys who get paid big bucks to analyze plays labelled that play as great, yet you think it was just a fat man waddling past statues and stumbling into a clumsy RB for a 5 yard loss. Time for you to find another subject. Your credibility factor is in free fall.

 

[red desert]

Re: Re: Wilfork

Originally posted by wallyburger
Anyone who saw the game like you did needs help. What the hell were you watching/ The guy was #75. He had on an orange jersey and white pants. He had 2 and 3 blockers attached to himlike Ramora fish on a shark. I guess stats lie, but Fla State had a grand total of 206 yards for the game. They average 450 per game for the year. Wilfork ( 7 tackles 4 hurries ), Vilma, Williams and Taylor led the team with tackles. The LBs make the tackles because the O line is so busy trying to keep Wilfork and company off of the QB and RBs that they can't go upfield and block them. Dude, you are blind and don't have a clue for line play. I imagine you think Fla State sucks and Miami and Wilfork just barely beat a suck team.

P.S/ Chris Rix was 6-19 for 96 yards. Wilfork must suck. Huh? But then I think you had an agenda going into the game and that clouded your judgement.

P.S.S. I will get the last laugh here, when he goes top 5, has a great rookie year and this board will be full of messages about how the Cards blew it when they had a chance to draft him and didn't.

P.S.S.S. The only conclusion I can come to from some posters is jealously. U of Miami competes for the National Championship year after year, wins 5 of them and does it by cheating and with smoke and mirrors. Right now Miami has 60 + players in the pros, so they do a pretty damn good job of fooling the Pro Football GMs and coaches.

The guy is a monster. I'd be fine if we took him with the number three pick. It would sure take some heat off of Bryant.

 

[Southpaw]

Re: Re: Re: Wilfork

Originally posted by PACardsFan
Russ,
You can't be serious comparing this guy to Swann. Swann had it all before the injuries. He simply dominated - was equally adept at stuffing the run & penetrating the pocket. I'm a Syracuse fan & watched plenty of Big East football over the years. Wilfork is TERRIBLY out of shape & we'd be crazy to draft this guy AT ALL! He reminds me of Gerald Warren of the Browns (BUST!!). People have callled him a Baby Sapp. He doesn't have the leadership of Sapp nor the MOTOR. This guy has big time BUST potential. I wouldn't touch him unless he fell to the 2nd round.

Sounds like Big East jealousy to me. Yup. Syracuse had a grand total of 206 yards offense against Miami this year. 107 rushing through, around and over Wilfork and company. How lonely is it in the Big Least now that Miami, Va. Tech and BC are gone. Syracuse should finally dominate that conference now that the Big Boys are gone. Rutgers, Connecticut, Louisville et al.
And you still have Pasqualone ?

P.S. Sapps motor runs on questionable fuel.

 

[JeffGollin]

First of all, note Wallyburger's city of origin (Ft. Lauderdale). This makes him more familiar with Cane players but his objectivity has to be subject to scrutiny.

With regard to comparing Wilfork to Tommy Harris - to me the "job description" for a DT the Cardinals need is: "Someone big enough and strong enough to dominate in the inside and not get pushed around."

Wilfork has the raw physical talent, but the big question has to be about his motor - i.e. will he play hard enough on every down so as not to get pushed around 50 - 75% of the time. I've seen Wilfork follow one sensational play with one where he looks like just one more big fat guy. If we could know in advance that his position coach or HC could wave a magic wand so that he'd play like a banshee on every play, I'd snatch him up in a minute. But so far he's far from a sure thing.

I'd like to see more of Harris, but view him more as a Wendell Bryant type. These guys are quicker and can eat up folks in the backfield but are more prone to being pushed around, because they lack size and dominating strength. (i.e. if Harris and Bryant are similar, why spend a top pick on a clone of Wendell when we already have Wendell?) So to me, the interesting comparison would be between Harris and Bryant rather than Harris and Wilfork.

 

[Southpaw]

Originally posted by JeffGollin
First of all, note Wallyburger's city of origin (Ft. Lauderdale). This makes him more familiar with Cane players but his objectivity has to be subject to scrutiny.

With regard to comparing Wilfork to Tommy Harris - to me the "job description" for a DT the Cardinals need is: "Someone big enough and strong enough to dominate in the inside and not get pushed around."

Wilfork has the raw physical talent, but the big question has to be about his motor - i.e. will he play hard enough on every down so as not to get pushed around 50 - 75% of the time. I've seen Wilfork follow one sensational play with one where he looks like just one more big fat guy. If we could know in advance that his position coach or HC could wave a magic wand so that he'd play like a banshee on every play, I'd snatch him up in a minute. But so far he's far from a sure thing.

I'd like to see more of Harris, but view him more as a Wendell Bryant type. These guys are quicker and can eat up folks in the backfield but are more prone to being pushed around, because they lack size and dominating strength. (i.e. if Harris and Bryant are similar, why spend a top pick on a clone of Wendell when we already have Wendell?) So to me, the interesting comparison would be between Harris and Bryant rather than Harris and Wilfork.

You are absolutely correct , sir. I am biased. But that ain't a bad thing. I have insight. Neither you, I or anyone else on this forum will have 1 darn thing to say about who the Cards pick. I have seen every Cane game since 1965. The Canes have had some stinkers and some gems. He is a gem. I just want to know what the Cards saw in Bryant, Wadsworth and some of the other clunkers. Everyone has chinks in their armor. His upside is huge. At least he wouldn't have Joe Greene to mess him up.

P.S. I will be interested to see how the Harris does against a real team in the Sugar Bowl.

 

[red desert]

Originally posted by wallyburger
At least he wouldn't have Joe Greene to mess him up.

Amen to that.

 

[Northern Card]

Originally posted by wallyburger
You are absolutely correct , sir. I am biased. But that ain't a bad thing. I have insight. Neither you, I or anyone else on this forum will have 1 darn thing to say about who the Cards pick. I have seen every Cane game since 1965. The Canes have had some stinkers and some gems. He is a gem. I just want to know what the Cards saw in Bryant, Wadsworth and some of the other clunkers. Everyone has chinks in their armor. His upside is huge. At least he wouldn't have Joe Greene to mess him up.

P.S. I will be interested to see how the Harris does against a real team in the Sugar Bowl.

you mean - What the whole league saw in Wadsworth!!!

Everyone was hot on this guy...

 

[Southpaw]

Originally posted by Northern Card
you mean - What the whole league saw in Wadsworth!!!

Everyone was hot on this guy...

If you say so. I don't remember that .
Catch this quote from 1998.

" As the Phoenix Cardinals first pick and number three pick overall in the 1998 NFL Draft, Andre Wadsworth has solidified himself as the most prolific Seminole to be drafted in the history of Florida State Football.

As a former walk-on weighing 215 pounds, Wadsworth had transformed his body into a rock-solid 280lb pass-rushing machine. With his brute strength(500lb. Bench press, 600lb. Squat) and his cat-like quickness, Andre will be reaking some more havic this up-coming season.

Like friend and former college roomate Peter Boulware, Wadsworth too strength trained with Strength & Conditioning Coordinator Russell Barbarino 4-days per week, together with a well-balanced speed, plyometric, agility and nutrition training program."

Sounds freaky to me. Can you spell " juice"?

 

[ajcardfan]

Originally posted by wallyburger
If you say so. I don't remember that .

He's not pulling it out of someplace where the sun doesn't shine. Ron Wolf was quoted as saying he would've traded all his draft choices that year for Wadsworth. Kiper had him rated as the number one player in the draft, ahead of Manning and Leaf.

We've never drafted a surer thing than Wadsworth, and it still turned out to be a complete disaster.

 

[artp]

I have seen Wilfork quite a few times over the last few years. While I don't think anyone can question his first round ability, I do not think he is worth the third overall pick. If not a QB, the #3 pick has to develop into a star. Wilfork has too many question marks to be #3.

 

[Northern Card]

Originally posted by wallyburger
If you say so. I don't remember that .
Catch this quote from 1998.

" As the Phoenix Cardinals first pick and number three pick overall in the 1998 NFL Draft, Andre Wadsworth has solidified himself as the most prolific Seminole to be drafted in the history of Florida State Football.

As a former walk-on weighing 215 pounds, Wadsworth had transformed his body into a rock-solid 280lb pass-rushing machine. With his brute strength(500lb. Bench press, 600lb. Squat) and his cat-like quickness, Andre will be reaking some more havic this up-coming season.

Like friend and former college roomate Peter Boulware, Wadsworth too strength trained with Strength & Conditioning Coordinator Russell Barbarino 4-days per week, together with a well-balanced speed, plyometric, agility and nutrition training program."

Sounds freaky to me. Can you spell " juice"?

I couldn't spell "juice" until you helped me... thanks. To return the favour: Can you spell "multiple knee surgeries"?

 

[Krangodnzr]

Originally posted by wallyburger


Sounds freaky to me. Can you spell " juice"?

Why is it that anytime someone is outrageously strong, they are accused of "juicing"? Wadsworth wasn't that "type" of guy.