2011 Draft Thread

[JCSunsfan]

Yes they did, Orlando even tried him at PG sometimes.

He wasn't clear cut PG prospect but many thought he could make the transition. Just like some people thought that of Westbrook and others called them insane.

Redick averaged 27/2.6 in his senior season playing off the ball mostly, Fredette is putting up 27/4. Statistically similiar though Redick was on a much better team. Hard to say how Redick would have fared on a team as the lone star.

I see a lot of similiarities between Fredette and Redick as prospects.

And honestly even if Fredette was the next Steve Nash, I think I'd rather have the next Chris Paul so to say.

4.3 assists for Fredette. Funny how we all tend to round things to our argument. I think the big difference in my mind between Fredette and Redick is that Fredette is actually playing pg right now. He is bringing the ball up and running the offense. Redick never did that.

We'll see.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Because 1) We aren't going to get the #9 pick, and 2) We aren't going to luck into an Amare-type player. If you think we will, you're set up for massive disappointment.

We really haven't drafted well since Perc died.

 

[AzStevenCal]

no one in their right mind thought this. please show me ANY evidence of the above.

I'm sure there must have been at least one person that thought Redick could play the point. Personally though, I'm with you. I think just suggesting he could play point guard brings into question a person's sanity. I certainly never heard a scout or NBA expert suggest he could make the transition. Unlike Redick, Nash and to a lesser extent, Fredette, have both shown NBA level talents beyond simply catching and shooting the basketball.

Steve

 

[Chaplin]

Oh since "know-it-all" Chaplin says so it's a lock then.

No, I'm just realistic, which of course you never are.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Yes they did, Orlando even tried him at PG sometimes.

He wasn't clear cut PG prospect but many thought he could make the transition. Just like some people thought that of Westbrook and others called them insane.

Redick averaged 27/2.6 in his senior season playing off the ball mostly, Fredette is putting up 27/4. Statistically similiar though Redick was on a much better team. Hard to say how Redick would have fared on a team as the lone star.

I see a lot of similiarities between Fredette and Redick as prospects.

And honestly even if Fredette was the next Steve Nash, I think I'd rather have the next Chris Paul so to say.

That's about the only thing you've said recently that I agree with. The main reason I'd agree with it though is Paul came out ready to excel whereas it took Nash several years to become the player he is today. If I had to choose between each player in their best year though it would be a tough call but I'd probably take Nash.

As for Redick and Fredette being similar players, not hardly. Fredette can handle the ball under pressure AND he can create for himself. I'm not convinced that he can create for others the way Nash can but he's not a one trick pony like Redick is. I think it would be insane though to waste a high pick on an undersized guard who may or may not be able to make the transition to the point. You don't get rich making decisions like that even though he has an outside chance to be special.

Steve

 

[Russ Smith]

I'd be surprised if Burks didn't go top 10. I think Kemba will make it to the teens because of his size. I'd rather go big though with Perry Jones, Kanter, Sullinger or even the Georgia kid. I haven't seen the 2 big Lithuanians play but their names keep popping up. I wouldn't mind taking Derrick Williams either. If we could pick him up in the second round I wouldn't mind taking a flyer on the BYU kid either. He'll probably bust but man can that kid shoot.

Steve

Perry Jones really has me unsure, he's an athletic kid he can really get off the floor and run the floor but he's incredibly weak right now, just gets knocked off course so easily. He's not a good shooter yet, basically his game right now is block shots and dunk. He was compared to Garnett some but right now I don't see the comparison, KG had a lot more game at the same age, very good passer and much better player.

Upside for Jones is obviously there but I may be jaded by watching how bad it's been for Brandan Wright in the NBA just being tossed around(and injured). And Wright is buffed compard to Jones right now.

 

[Chaplin]

We really haven't drafted well since Perc died.

Yeah, that could be reason #3. In our team history, isn't it convenient that he brings up only Amare--probably our best pick in our history considering where it occured. Can't forget about our history of terrible picks.

 

[Chaplin]

That's about the only thing you've said recently that I agree with. The main reason I'd agree with it though is Paul came out ready to excel whereas it took Nash several years to become the player he is today. If I had to choose between each player in their best year though it would be a tough call but I'd probably take Nash.

Sure, and I'd like the next Kobe Bryant and Dwight Howard, but we're not going to get that, are we? But what do I know, I'm just a "know it all" according to slinslin, lol.

 

[jagu]

+1 for Chaplin / -1 for Slinslin

 

[AzStevenCal]

Perry Jones really has me unsure, he's an athletic kid he can really get off the floor and run the floor but he's incredibly weak right now, just gets knocked off course so easily. He's not a good shooter yet, basically his game right now is block shots and dunk. He was compared to Garnett some but right now I don't see the comparison, KG had a lot more game at the same age, very good passer and much better player.

Upside for Jones is obviously there but I may be jaded by watching how bad it's been for Brandan Wright in the NBA just being tossed around(and injured). And Wright is buffed compard to Jones right now.

His frame reminds me more of Durant than Garnett but he doesn't really show the killer instinct either of those guys did at the same age. Still, he has enough talent and athleticism to bring each of those guys to mind. It doesn't really matter for us though as we'd have to miss the playoffs and hit it big in the Lottery to have a chance at him. I'd certainly take a gamble on the kid though if I had the chance.

Steve

 

[jagu]

His frame reminds me more of Durant than Garnett but he doesn't really show the killer instinct either of those guys did at the same age. Still, he has enough talent and athleticism to bring each of those guys to mind. It doesn't really matter for us though as we'd have to miss the playoffs and hit it big in the Lottery to have a chance at him. I'd certainly take a gamble on the kid though if I had the chance.

Steve

Earl "cough" Clark.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Earl "cough" Clark.

With at least one incredibly important difference. I've never liked Clark's chances in the NBA because of what's between the ears. The guy still doesn't understand the difference between a good shot and a horrible shot.

He'll shoot a heavily guarded fade-away jumper from 20 feet with 17 seconds left on the shot clock and then turn around and pass out of a 12 footer when he's being single covered by a midget as the clock runs out. You can't teach stupid, you either have it or you don't and he has it.

Steve

 

[Cheesebeef]

I'm sure there must have been at least one person that thought Redick could play the point. Personally though, I'm with you. I think just suggesting he could play point guard brings into question a person's sanity. I certainly never heard a scout or NBA expert suggest he could make the transition. Unlike Redick, Nash and to a lesser extent, Fredette, have both shown NBA level talents beyond simply catching and shooting the basketball.

Steve

seriously, stating that people in the NBA thought Reddick would play the point is almost as absurd as saying Blake Griffin is over-rated... oh... wait...

 

[Cheesebeef]

Yes they did, Orlando even tried him at PG sometimes.

He wasn't clear cut PG prospect but many thought he could make the transition. Just like some people thought that of Westbrook and others called them insane.

can you show ANY evidence of this ridiculous nonsense your spouting? He wasn't "clear cut PG prospect"?! He wasn't a PG prospect at all.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Yeah, that could be reason #3. In our team history, isn't it convenient that he brings up only Amare--probably our best pick in our history considering where it occured. Can't forget about our history of terrible picks.

not to mention, at the but end of the lotto, you're not likely to find a franchise player because high schoolers are out of the draft now. Guys with THAT much potential actually show it for a year in college which makes them high picks, whereas a Kobe, Amare, Bynum, O'Neal, McGrady could be potential franchise guys because they were high schoolers. that ain't the case anymore.

 

[Russ Smith]

His frame reminds me more of Durant than Garnett but he doesn't really show the killer instinct either of those guys did at the same age. Still, he has enough talent and athleticism to bring each of those guys to mind. It doesn't really matter for us though as we'd have to miss the playoffs and hit it big in the Lottery to have a chance at him. I'd certainly take a gamble on the kid though if I had the chance.

Steve

Yeah but Durant could shoot when he got to Texas, Jones really can't. He's 1-8 on 3's this year, 64% from the line. His form doesn't look horrible but you could just look at Durant and see he could shoot. Durant always reminded me of a bigger George Gervin which is what he's become IMHO.

I think Jones is much better than say John Henson(similar size and build) but I'm just not yet convinced he can do much if he can't dunk and in the NBA at his size he's going to have a hard time getting near the rim.

I also look at Derrick Favors this year who's a lot stronger than Jones and comparably sized and similarly athletic and I think Jones isn't as good as Favors was as a freshman.

We'll see if I was a college coach I'd love to have Jones, as an NBA coach I'm concerned I'd pay him a lot of money and by the time he's ready to contribute he's playing somewhere else.

 

[Russ Smith]

not to mention, at the but end of the lotto, you're not likely to find a franchise player because high schoolers are out of the draft now. Guys with THAT much potential actually show it for a year in college which makes them high picks, whereas a Kobe, Amare, Bynum, O'Neal, McGrady could be potential franchise guys because they were high schoolers. that ain't the case anymore.

Yep if you're lucky you get a kid like Jrue Holiday who just tanked the 2nd half of his freshman year at UCLA and then worked really hard and is a much better NBA player than he was college. But he's still not a franchise player, potentially very good yes, franchise no.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Yeah but Durant could shoot when he got to Texas, Jones really can't. He's 1-8 on 3's this year, 64% from the line. His form doesn't look horrible but you could just look at Durant and see he could shoot. Durant always reminded me of a bigger George Gervin which is what he's become IMHO.

I think Jones is much better than say John Henson(similar size and build) but I'm just not yet convinced he can do much if he can't dunk and in the NBA at his size he's going to have a hard time getting near the rim.

I also look at Derrick Favors this year who's a lot stronger than Jones and comparably sized and similarly athletic and I think Jones isn't as good as Favors was as a freshman.

We'll see if I was a college coach I'd love to have Jones, as an NBA coach I'm concerned I'd pay him a lot of money and by the time he's ready to contribute he's playing somewhere else.

I'm not trying to say that Jones is Durant revisited. He's nowhere near as developed as a player at this stage. However, I don't think the comparison to Favors really matters in that Jones probably projects as a wing player. He has a skill set similar to Tracy McGrady but his shot blocking tends to get people thinking of him as a PF.

He does looks about 15 to 20 pounds heavier now than he did in Vegas so maybe he'll fill out and move to the inside but right now, he'd get eaten alive in the NBA if he had to play down low. Really, the center on the Baylor girls team probably has a better chance to make it in the NBA at the PF spot in the near future. Anyway, Jones does come with the "bust" risk but it's hard to find a college player with a greater possible up-side than this guy.

Steve

 

[jagu]

Yeah but Durant could shoot when he got to Texas, Jones really can't. He's 1-8 on 3's this year, 64% from the line. His form doesn't look horrible but you could just look at Durant and see he could shoot. Durant always reminded me of a bigger George Gervin which is what he's become IMHO.

I think Jones is much better than say John Henson(similar size and build) but I'm just not yet convinced he can do much if he can't dunk and in the NBA at his size he's going to have a hard time getting near the rim.

I also look at Derrick Favors this year who's a lot stronger than Jones and comparably sized and similarly athletic and I think Jones isn't as good as Favors was as a freshman.

We'll see if I was a college coach I'd love to have Jones, as an NBA coach I'm concerned I'd pay him a lot of money and by the time he's ready to contribute he's playing somewhere else.

I'm not high on Jones, I do think he can be a player similar to Lamar Odom but I don't think he will become as good as Odom is in the NBA now. Time will tell.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I'm not high on Jones, I do think he can be a player similar to Lamar Odom but I don't think he will become as good as Odom is in the NBA now. Time will tell.

He isn't a can't miss prospect like Durant or Blake Griffin. He has incredible potential but as I mentioned, he's also a huge risk to bust. Most years, he'd go near the middle of the lottery (7th, 8th, 9th etc) but this is one of those drafts that has a lot of pretty good players but not much in the way of guaranteed superstar. Jones has the talent and the athleticism to perhaps reach that stature and will almost definitely go in the top 3 because of it.

I don't think he becomes a poor man's Odom. If it clicks upstairs, he'll be great and if not you'll probably not hear much about him after his rookie contract.

Steve

 

[leclerc]

Oliver Miller reroll

How about picking up C Joshua Smith from UCLA as our Oliver Miller take 2?

http://www.uclabruins.com/sports/m-baskbl/mtt/smith_joshua00.html

Wiiiide body, sort of long arms (I think?), soft touch and decent footwork. LOL it would be sweet! Where do we find a Dumas (without the habit)?

I'd rather have 3 centers (especially with Lopez's recent back injury) and also 3 PG's than 1 center, 1 PG and a bunch of wings.


Looks like Kemba Walker is slipping down the charts recently. I hope we take him. No harm playing both him and Dragic together in the backcourt.

 

[slinslin]

Harrison Barnes is a potential franchise player that could maybe be on the board in the later lottery since he has been under the radar for the first part of the college season.

He began the season as the projected #1 pick and did not meet the expectations because of how Roy Williams used him but recently he came into his own..

26/6 and 25/6 the last 2 games and he could potentially play SG in the NBA at 6'8-6'9.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Harrison Barnes is a potential franchise player that could maybe be on the board in the later lottery since he has been under the radar for the first part of the college season.

He began the season as the projected #1 pick and did not meet the expectations because of how Roy Williams used him but recently he came into his own..

26/6 and 25/6 the last 2 games and he could potentially play SG in the NBA at 6'8-6'9.

This is probably the kind of player we ought to be looking at.

 

[Irish]

I don't get why we are talking about Perry Jones, who Draft Express sees going 4th. If we are just jawing, why not talk about Jared Sullinger of Ohio State.

Ohio State's clear-cut go-to guy, and has been ridiculously efficient in doing so. Averaging 24.4 points per-40 minutes pace-adjusted, shooting 62% from 2-point range, getting to the free throw at an outstanding rate, and coming off a 40-point outing last week, Sullinger has been everything he was billed as coming into college and then some thus far.

We've been writing about Sullinger for the better part of three years now, and much of what we said about him back then continues to ring true today.

The biggest change we've seen from Sullinger over the years revolves around his body, as he's slimmed down considerably from when we first saw him. He still hasn't reached his maximum physical potential, but the strides he's made are very encouraging and show that he's willing to put the time in and make the sacrifices needed.

While Sullinger continued to show more and more perimeter skills every time we saw him in high school, he's been primarily an inside threat for Ohio State this season. This makes sense from both an individual and team standpoint, as he's flashing a highly coveted skill from an NBA perspective—a polished back to the basket game—and has proven to be downright unstoppable for college defenders. This is a big reason why his team hasn't missed a beat from last season despite the loss of last year's 2nd overall pick, Evan Turner.

40% of Sullinger's offense comes in post-up situations according to Synergy Sports Technology, and he ranks amongst the most efficient back to the basket players in the NCAA, scoring on over 50% of his field goal attempts when creating his own shot inside and getting fouled on nearly a quarter of his possessions.

The biggest key to Sullinger's dominance has been the opposition's inability to keep him outside of the paint. While he's lost a good deal of weight, he's still retained all of the strength in his lower body that makes him so difficult to handle one on one. With his terrific base and low center of gravity, Sullinger is constantly working to establish better post-position down low. Tough and extremely aggressive, he's not afraid to simply put his ass into a defender and go to work until he gets to where he wants to on the floor.

Once there, he has incredibly soft hands to catch pretty much anything thrown his way and an unbelievable awareness for where he is on the court relative to his teammates and opponents. Patient and confident, he has extremely polished footwork and excellent body control, showing a wide array of spins and counter-moves that help him create even higher percentage shots. With his feathery touch and ability to shoot with either hand, he doesn't miss very often despite the fact that he's rarely getting his shot off over the top of the defense. When the double-team inevitably comes, he's extremely quick to recognize rotations and does a very good job of finding open teammates spotting up on the wing.

With his excellent motor and insatiable hunger to score, Sullinger doesn't relent for even a minute when he's on the court, putting a tremendous amount of pressure on the opposition to alter their game-plan to stop him, fouling out entire frontcourts, and getting his team into the bonus early and often.

Sullinger's hands are never more impressive than when watching him operate on the offensive glass. With his wide frame, solid length (7-1 ½ wingspan), excellent fundamentals boxing out and terrific timing anticipating where loose balls will end up, Sullinger already has a major advantage over opponents. The fact that he has magnets for hands make him a Kevin Love-like force of a rebounder at the college level, though, ranking him #1 by a wide margin amongst freshmen in this category, and 7th overall on a per-minute basis. Even though he gets his shot blocked a decent amount, he's got such great instincts that he's often able to follow up and get himself a good look after quickly snagging the loose ball.

From DraftExpress.com http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Jared-Sullinger-5029/#ixzz1DjfRsqQx
http://www.draftexpress.com ​

There isn't a chance in the world that the Suns could draft him, but he'd be a great addition. ​

 

[AzStevenCal]

I don't get why we are talking about Perry Jones, who Draft Express sees going 4th. If we are just jawing, why not talk about Jared Sullinger of Ohio State?

There isn't a chance in the world that the Suns could draft him, but he'd be a great addition.

We talked about Perry Jones because IF we miss the playoffs there's still a chance we could hit it big in the lottery. Also, there's still a chance we could move up in the draft via trade. And finally, we talked about him because Draft Express is just offering an opinion and they miss as often as not so why not talk about him.

We've also talked about Sullinger. I've mentioned him several times and slin has also brought him up. He's an incredible talent and he'd probably be my first choice if we hit it big in the lottery. He's physical and he dominates on both sides of the ball.

Steve