AYTON TRADED!

[ASUCHRIS]

Allen's "dirty" play would be pretty ordinary in the 80's and 90's.

He'd be pulling stone cold stunners and chairs from the crowd in that era.

 

[ajcardfan]

Ayton was clearly overvalued by Suns fans. Ultimately he never had more value than he was the potential #1 pick right before the draft. It's been trending south since.

I don't believe in Nurkic to play most of the season. I don't believe in Durant to play most of the season. I don't believe in Beal to play most of the season.

I would rather have the team get younger around Booker, not older. We aren't winning a title this year or next, and then what?

 

[Phrazbit]

Allen's "dirty" play would be pretty ordinary in the 80's and 90's.

No, no way. I can remember the guys viewed as "dirty" back then and he is just as bad or worse.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Not sure I'd agree with that -- both Nurk and Eubanks are stronger than DA.

They start three bigs in that lineup. We wouldn’t start two (I don’t count Durant as a typical “big”).

 

[Absolute Zero]

Ayton was clearly overvalued by Suns fans. ...

 

[Pokinmik]

Last year we beat denver if we have a roster of shooters that can hit wide open 3s. That is with Ayton playing like he’s 5’9” and sitting out. The gravity that book and KD created was insane, our players bricked wide open looks every game except for the one shamet game. Adding in Allen and little with our other free agent snipers and we are loaded around the 3pt line.

Getting a serviceable and competent big in nurkic and two more shooters might be what this team needs. Most of the monster teams of the past 20 years in the nba are 2-3 stars surrounded by a plethora of shooters.

 

[Folster]

No, no way. I can remember the guys viewed as "dirty" back then and he is just as bad or worse.

Is he worse than Laimbeer? Malone? Even Barkley has a longer highlight reel of dirty plays.

 

[Raindog]

In 7 games head to head:

Averages
Player	Points	Rebounds	Assists	Steals	Blocks
Deandre Ayton	17.9	7.4	1.6	0.6	0.7
Jusuf Nurkic	13.0	11.4	2.3	0.9	0.6

Kind of what I remembered. Ayton scoring but getting killed on the boards. Portland went 5-2 against us in those 7 games.

Games Played Between Deandre Ayton and Jusuf Nurkic

This is the detail of NBA games in which Deandre Ayton and Jusuf Nurkic played against each other, including head-to-head record, stats average, game highs and game-by-game data both in the Regular Season and Playoffs.

www.landofbasketball.com

Of course, another way to look at that is Nurkic's stats were better because he was playing against a half-assing Ayton. It's a six of vs. half dozen of kind of situation.

Again, I can understand the Suns wanting to move on from Ayton. I'm just very disappointed they couldn't (or didn't try to) get anything better than Nurkic and a bunch of less than inspiring throw-ins. I'm not convinced anyone we got in that trade adds any real on-court value. Maybe more trade flexibility down the line, but nothing that helps a championship run in the imminent future.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I would agree with you - if we didn't have another guy named KD who could keep 2 of the 3 on the court most of the time.

What’s more dangerous? 2 on the court or 3? This allows more court time for all 3 at once.

 

[Chaplin]

They start three bigs in that lineup. We wouldn’t start two (I don’t count Durant as a typical “big”).

You consider Middleton a "big"? I would consider him a big just like I'd consider KD a big.

 

[Folster]

You consider Middleton a "big"? I would consider him a big just like I'd consider KD a big.

Middleton is a wing.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I’ll love him.

You are going to love him. I’m going to hate myself for likely eventually loving also. Unless I can’t get past wanting punch him in his punchable face.

 

[Proximo]

Just that the Suns needed to get deeper and they did that. They think Nurkic is fine as a big

I disagree with that.

First off all the guys we signed to minimum deals have comparable or better stats to Little and Johnson - and we already had 6+ of those type of players.

It can be argued Allen is a bit better than them, and maybe he is - but not much. There is very little difference between him and Gordon.

Perhaps we are better prepared now if we lose 3 guys to injury - but personally I really don't care about that.
I only care about our playoff rotation, and if our main guys are hurt we aren't winning the title anyway.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Of course, another way to look at that is Nurkic's stats were better because he was playing against a half-assing Ayton. It's a six of vs. half dozen of kind of situation.

Again, I can understand the Suns wanting to move on from Ayton. I'm just very disappointed they couldn't (or didn't try to) get anything better than Nurkic and a bunch of less than inspiring throw-ins. I'm not convinced anyone we got in that trade adds any real on-court value. Maybe more trade flexibility down the line, but nothing that helps a championship run in the imminent future.

I believe the post I responded to was how did they do against each other head to head or something like that. Wasn’t meant to be any kind of statement just the stats.

 

[AzStevenCal]

My prediction is the Suns will be playing a lot of small ball

Hopefully that was the plan once they decided to look for an Ayton trade rather than as a result of this move.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

You consider Middleton a "big"? I would consider him a big just like I'd consider KD a big.

Did I not see the pic clearly? I thought they showed Giannis, Lopez and crazy eyes as their staring frontcourt with middleton in the backcourt with dame.

 

[Proximo]

I don't believe in Nurkic to play most of the season. I don't believe in Durant to play most of the season. I don't believe in Beal to play most of the season.

I would rather have the team get younger around Booker, not older. We aren't winning a title this year or next, and then what?

Well if you are right and they all get hurt, then yes we are screwed and aren't winning the title.

However they can be hurt during the season - who cares, we just have to limp into the playoffs and be healthy at that point.

 

[dscher]

Yup.

Discounting Allen as a solid rotation piece makes no sense to me. We know have 5 legit playmakers and another great three point shooter.

He’s actually the piece I’m happiest about with the trade. I expect Nurkic to be on and off injured all year. A

Nurk will likely be an all star being around kd and book...and I haven't watched what much of nurk. But, dude can rebound.

 

[Phrazbit]

Nurk will likely be an all star being around kd and book...and I haven't watched what much of nurk. But, dude can rebound.

Ayton gets more boards than Nurk.

 

[dscher]

So, he was undervalued? Lol. I don't like the guy, but I'd say it was somewhere in the middle...but largely by his own doing. Guy was a sandbag.

 

[Goldfield]

Ayton was one of the main reasons we were two wins away from a title. He certainly wasn't the reason we lost the series vs. the Bucks.

At the time, he DID provide championship level play - the past couple of seasons have been undoubtedly disappointing but to say he could never provide that? Too far.

The Ayton on that finals run is not the same player he was. He was great at times then. That player doesn’t exist. Ayton has always thought he was Dominayton. He has never worked hard to be great. He thinks he already is.

 

[dscher]

Ayton gets more boards than Nurk.

Contested rebounds is what counts IMO. Ayton was trash in the department.

 

[elindholm]

Ayton gets more boards than Nurk.

Because Ayton plays more minutes. Nurkic has the slight edge in per-minute or per-possession rebounding.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Allen's "dirty" play would be pretty ordinary in the 80's and 90's.

I disagree. Yes they were routinely far more physical than Grayson is today but the type of dirty is different IMO. If they made a movie about dirty play in the 80's and 90's they'd cast Dave Bautista or Brad Pitt or Liam Neesom to play the role. If they made it about Grayson, they'd look more for a Marjoe Gortner, Bruce Dern or Eric Roberts clone.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Because Ayton plays more minutes. Nurkic has the slight edge in per-minute or per-possession rebounding.

And head-to-head is a better indicator for me. Who beats who when fighting for a rebound. Those numbers greatly skew in favor of nurkic in their 7 games.