Cardinals | Cutting Kolb can save a lot of $$ - Rotoworld opinion

[gmabel830]

Even if I agreed that we were winning in spite of Skelton (which I don't), it's a heck of a lot better than losing with Kolb. The records speak for themselves.

I really view the W-L records of our QBs this year like I view the W-L records of starting pitchers in MLB. Ian Kennedy went 21-4 this past season and Tim Lincecum went 13-14. However, Lincecum had a slightly lower ERA, allowed a slightly lower batting average, and had more strikeouts than Kennedy. If everything else were totally equal, it wouldn't be a tough argument to say that Lincecum would be a better option to pitch you one must win game over Kennedy, even though Lincecum couldn't even win 50% of his decisions and Kennedy won 84% of his decisions.

Similarly, Kolb has thrown for more yards, more yards per attempt, thrown at a higher completion percentage, thrown more TDs, thrown less INTs, and has a higher QB rating than Skelton. I've been growing more and more impressed with Skelton over the past two weeks (especially in the SF game), but I don't think it's an illogical argument that all other things being equal, Kolb gives us a better chance to win in a must win game over the Bengals next week. I'm not saying either guy is the long term answer (because jury is still out on both) or that Kolb has not met high expectations and Skelton has probably exceeded minimal expectations (both are true), but only looking at W-L records without considering the entire context of how those W-L records were accumulated just doesn't prove the point to me.

 

[Dayman]

Kolb will end up getting paid around $1 million for every TD pass he throws this year. While I know the injuries aren't his fault or anything, the fact remains that his production hasn't come close to justifying his contract. How much more do you pay a guy who hasn't played more than five games in a row in his five year career?

The concussions make the issue even more complicated. As others have stated numerous times, the more concussions you suffer, the worse they get. Kolb's sensitivity to light and sound at yesterday's game aren't a great sign for him in this area. Again, it's not his fault, but we don't want to see this turn into another Jahvid Best situation.

Not that any of this really matters. The FO gave up a ton for Kolb. I don't see any way they'll cut him loose after one season.

 

[desertdawg]

The defense was a mess when Kolb started out, and far as that pitiful record goes the whole team earned those losses, coaches included. Now Kolb has been gimpy since the team got it together. I'm rolling with whoever Whiz throws in there, Kolb, Skelton, Breaston, Bartsmel, whoever but I hope we can have a healthy Kolb for the last to games. Some of those, that don't even want to see how a healthy Kolb does a couple games in a row (with this new team and a little time under his belt), are so hater-rating right now I don't even have the time, glad the Cards see things differently. I like me some Skelton and I am confident when he is in there, pretty much scores a TD after throwing each interception (almost as weird as that stat thread karma), and I've seen him go clutchmode a few times, not bad at all, but what evs, go Cardinals.

 

[Chopper0080]

Maybe, but would you rather win in spite of your $11 million quarterback, or in spite of your $800,000 quarterback? How many games does Kolb have to lose before he loses the faith of his teammates. Weren't you the guy hammering on "credibility" when it comes to Horton's hire? What credibility does Kolb bring at this point other than the fact that his backups have outperformed him two jobs in a row?

I don't think that either guy is the answer at the quarterback position for the Cards for the long term, but if Kolb is on the roster you're forced to play him. If Skelton's competing with two other guys, then you can play the best one.

If Kolb got cut March 1, who picks him up and makes him their presumptive starter? Maybe Jacksonville? He'd compete with Matt Moore and a draft pick in Miami.

We paid a 2nd round pick and DRC and $21 million guaranteed for a slightly better Colt McCoy.

My point wasn't to compare Skelton and Kolb, it was to point out that our QB play OVERALL has been mediocre at best. However, with that thought in mind, we have been able to win 7 games this season with that situation in place. Why would we want to decrease our depth at the QB position overall, just because we have a cheap alternative as a backup? I would rather eat that money and have depth at QB, address our other weaknesses, and see what an offseason + another season can do for our young QB's. Cutting Kolb makes no sense.

 

[kerouac9]

My point wasn't to compare Skelton and Kolb, it was to point out that our QB play OVERALL has been mediocre at best. However, with that thought in mind, we have been able to win 7 games this season with that situation in place. Why would we want to decrease our depth at the QB position overall, just because we have a cheap alternative as a backup? I would rather eat that money and have depth at QB, address our other weaknesses, and see what an offseason + another season can do for our young QB's. Cutting Kolb makes no sense.

Aren't you the guy agitating for drafting Nick Foles in the third round? What's the difference between that and keeping Kolb. I've explained to you already how you can't develop 2 much less 3 QBs in the NFL anymore.

 

[nashman]

It's really as simple as Skelton has exceeded very low expectations while getting fantastic defensive play. Kevin Kolb has not exceeded very high expectations while getting horrific defensive play and yet played as good as Skelton in quite a few of our losses that I would argue could have been easy wins if the defense was playing at even an acceptable level. So in summary people can love them some Skelton and the guy has some positives but in all honesty Kolb could have won many games as well with the quality defense Skelton has been getting. It's very difficult to judge right now but kolbs' concussion issue is concerning. But simply stating Kolb and or th trade is a failure is complete crap we have to give it time and give him time in our system to prove what he can or can't do IMO. I have no issue with a qb competition in training camp and the best man wins but think that needs to be done strictly in the offseason.

 

[AsUpRoDiGy]

2-6 with him, 5-1 without him. He's got 'winner' written all over him....

 

[juza76]

It's really as simple as Skelton has exceeded very low expectations while getting fantastic defensive play. Kevin Kolb has not exceeded very high expectations while getting horrific defensive play and yet played as good as Skelton in quite a few of our losses that I would argue could have been easy wins if the defense was playing at even an acceptable level. So in summary people can love them some Skelton and the guy has some positives but in all honesty Kolb could have won many games as well with the quality defense Skelton has been getting. It's very difficult to judge right now but kolbs' concussion issue is concerning. But simply stating Kolb and or th trade is a failure is complete crap we have to give it time and give him time in our system to prove what he can or can't do IMO. I have no issue with a qb competition in training camp and the best man wins but think that needs to be done strictly in the offseason.

dont forget kolb has played poor even agaisnt very bad teams.his looser skills are showed by his bad 4th quarter performance..a 4 year veteran should do something better....then is too soft and i think teammates knows that..he has a weak leadership like leinhart...i dont see him being a qbof here..

 

[juza76]

2-6 with him, 5-1 without him. He's got 'winner' written all over him....

5 -11 in his career as a starter....skelton 7-3...kolb played for a very good team like eagles...and know theirr sistem too...so stop about saying he need more time to know the offense and schemes...he is just looser

 

[nashman]

Learn to write coherently if you want to be taken seriously geesh. For the record i guess Kolb is a looser, haha what a joke.

 

[Paso Fino]

I'm sure people watching on TV saw that Kolb had ear plugs. I saw a tweet that said Wiz said that Kolb was having trouble with lights and loud sound. If he was that way yesterday, how can he start next Saturday?

 

[AsUpRoDiGy]

I'm sure people watching on TV saw that Kolb had ear plugs. I saw a tweet that said Wiz said that Kolb was having trouble with lights and loud sound. If he was that way yesterday, how can he start next Saturday?

He's gotta Man-Up. Easier said than done for Corn Kolb

 

[Evil Ash]

He's gotta Man-Up. Easier said than done for Corn Kolb

Man up is not something that you say with somebody with a head injury. There is a reason that the NFL is being EXTREMELY cautious when it comes to head injuries. Some people on this board need to get a clue

See how he's doing on Wed. If he's not ready to go by then, then you go with Skelton. You don't have to make a decision until then

 

[AsUpRoDiGy]

Man up is not something that you say with somebody with a head injury. There is a reason that the NFL is being EXTREMELY cautious when it comes to head injuries. Some people on this board need to get a clue

See how he's doing on Wed. If he's not ready to go by then, then you go with Skelton. You don't have to make a decision until then

'Man-Up' has to do with Kolb in general, not just his injury. Everything he does exemplifies fear; Running backwards, Not stepping up in the pocket, folding when the game is on the line, falling down before the rusher even makes contact, etc...Skelton, at least, never shows signs of being scared or intimidated, and he stands there when the pocket is collapsing while still keeping his eyes down the field. So yes, Kolb does need to Man-Up, otherwise he'll always be mediocre.

 

[Shane]

'Man-Up' has to do with Kolb in general, not just his injury. Everything he does exemplifies fear; Running backwards, Not stepping up in the pocket, folding when the game is on the line, falling down before the rusher even makes contact, etc...Skelton, at least, never shows signs of being scared or intimidated, and he stands there when the pocket is collapsing while still keeping his eyes down the field. So yes, Kolb does need to Man-Up, otherwise he'll always be mediocre.

Actually he was manned up and standing stong in the pocket. Got about 3 of these in the first 2 games. Cant say I blame him!

You must be registered for see images attach

 

[Arizona's Finest]

Premature Evacuation.

It's like Nashman said earlier. Defense sucked first 7 games. Kolb wasn't good enough to overcome = 1-6

Defense (and really ST's) starts playing at All World level + Kolb gets hurt, and serviceable play all of a sudden becomes enough to win. I don't know how much more obviou it can get when Kolb had exactly one game with this essentially brand new team around him and went 1-0 against arguably the best team they played during this streak ( the Cowboys are much mire talented then the 9ers but SF is better coached) so I don't know how much more evididence there needs to be that Skeleton isn't anything special - just right guy right time.

I will say Kolb may very well be too fragile and you don't want to pay that kind of money for a guy who can't play 16 games. I know your supposed to go easy on guys with head injuries but Jesus Christ get out there and play already. If I'm Kolb my entire career is on the line, and your having to drug me to keep me off the field.

I still think with a full offseason he would be a good player, but I'm having serious doubts that hes tough enough to stay on the field for 16 games.

Still like someone else said, cutting him unless you have a guy whose coming in and keeping Skeleton where he belongs - as a backup - that would be a stupid stupid mistake.

Cue K9 with another Aaron Rodgers reference in 5 4 3 2.....

 

[Shane]

'Man-Up' has to do with Kolb in general, not just his injury. Everything he does exemplifies fear; Running backwards, Not stepping up in the pocket, folding when the game is on the line, falling down before the rusher even makes contact, etc...Skelton, at least, never shows signs of being scared or intimidated, and he stands there when the pocket is collapsing while still keeping his eyes down the field. So yes, Kolb does need to Man-Up, otherwise he'll always be mediocre.

Actually he was manned up and standing stong in the pocket. Got about 3 of these in the first 2 games. Cant say I blame him!

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I mean who wouldn't be gun shy?

 

[Evil Ash]

Premature Evacuation.

It's like Nashman said earlier. Defense sucked first 7 games. Kolb wasn't good enough to overcome = 1-6

Defense (and really ST's) starts playing at All World level + Kolb gets hurt, and serviceable play all of a sudden becomes enough to win. I don't know how much more obviou it can get when Kolb had exactly one game with this essentially brand new team around him and went 1-0 against arguably the best team they played during this streak ( the Cowboys are much mire talented then the 9ers but SF is better coached) so I don't know how much more evididence there needs to be that Skeleton isn't anything special - just right guy right time.

I will say Kolb may very well be too fragile and you don't want to pay that kind of money for a guy who can't play 16 games. I know your supposed to go easy on guys with head injuries but Jesus Christ get out there and play already. If I'm Kolb my entire career is on the line, and your having to drug me to keep me off the field.

I still think with a full offseason he would be a good player, but I'm having serious doubts that hes tough enough to stay on the field for 16 games.

Still like someone else said, cutting him unless you have a guy whose coming in and keeping Skeleton where he belongs - as a backup - that would be a stupid stupid mistake.

Cue K9 with another Aaron Rodgers reference in 5 4 3 2.....

The NFL has taken it out of the players hands and it is in the hands of neurologists and trainers. If you show signs of a concussion or after-effects you don't play. For example Colt McCoy during practice last week was sent home. They aren't goofing around with this kind of thing anymore.

I'm sure Kolb wants to play but its up to professionals to give him medical clearance.

 

[AsUpRoDiGy]

I mean who wouldn't be gun shy?

Just about every other QB in the NFL. Obviously it's a well known fact that every QB will take a big hit at some point. What seperates the good from the bad is who can shake it off, and get back to business, or those who will always have the thought linger in the back of their mind. Kolb isn't the 1st QB to get a concussion, or take a big hit, but he doesn't stay poised in the pocket, and always scrambles as if he's waiting for something that isn't there. Good QB's remain poised, Kolb, does not.

 

[Shane]

Just about every other QB in the NFL. Obviously it's a well known fact that every QB will take a big hit at some point. What seperates the good from the bad is who can shake it off, and get back to business, or those who will always have the thought linger in the back of their mind. Kolb isn't the 1st QB to get a concussion, or take a big hit, but he doesn't stay poised in the pocket, and always scrambles as if he's waiting for something that isn't there. Good QB's remain poised, Kolb, does not.

Never seen many QB's take as big a hits as he did in that two game span. It was unreal to be honest.

 

[Brian in Mesa]

Defense sucked first 7 games.

Yeah, remember how Seattle went off on us at their place for 13 points? How embarrassing was that?

Unless the offensive line suddenly began playing All-World when Skelton stepped in - who cares about the defense when Kolb was playing? (IMHO the defense kept those games close enough for us to win even as they were adjusting to a new system)

We're not just talking wins and losses when comparing the QB's - we're talking about pocket presence. Skelton as a 2nd year player is more comfortable and reacts better to rushers than Kolb.

Hopefully Kolb has been watching and learning from Skelton during his time off...

 

[Stout]

I really view the W-L records of our QBs this year like I view the W-L records of starting pitchers in MLB. Ian Kennedy went 21-4 this past season and Tim Lincecum went 13-14. However, Lincecum had a slightly lower ERA, allowed a slightly lower batting average, and had more strikeouts than Kennedy. If everything else were totally equal, it wouldn't be a tough argument to say that Lincecum would be a better option to pitch you one must win game over Kennedy, even though Lincecum couldn't even win 50% of his decisions and Kennedy won 84% of his decisions.

Similarly, Kolb has thrown for more yards, more yards per attempt, thrown at a higher completion percentage, thrown more TDs, thrown less INTs, and has a higher QB rating than Skelton. I've been growing more and more impressed with Skelton over the past two weeks (especially in the SF game), but I don't think it's an illogical argument that all other things being equal, Kolb gives us a better chance to win in a must win game over the Bengals next week. I'm not saying either guy is the long term answer (because jury is still out on both) or that Kolb has not met high expectations and Skelton has probably exceeded minimal expectations (both are true), but only looking at W-L records without considering the entire context of how those W-L records were accumulated just doesn't prove the point to me.

Comparing starting pitchers in MLB to NFL QBs is just absolutely and completely irrelevant. I'm sorry, but in no way are they similar.

I am definitely a Kolb pessimist, but unless we sign a solid vet, we'd be nuts to just cut him. We still need some depth, after all.

 

[Arizona's Finest]

The NFL has taken it out of the players hands and it is in the hands of neurologists and trainers. If you show signs of a concussion or after-effects you don't play. For example Colt McCoy during practice last week was sent home. They aren't goofing around with this kind of thing anymore.

I'm sure Kolb wants to play but its up to professionals to give him medical clearance.

I get it. I guess I'm just frustrated that we are destined AGAIN to go into the off season with uncertainty under center.

I'm happy we are winning of course but I would take 6-10 with our definite QBOF on roster then 9-7 and back to the drawing board AGAIN.

 

[AsUpRoDiGy]

Never seen many QB's take as big a hits as he did in that two game span. It was unreal to be honest.

I definitely understand. New team, not used to "the system", very questionable O-Line play. Fact still remains, you can't win in this league if you're constantly looking over your shoulder, or feeling pressure that isn't there. At some point, he will have to step up and show some confidence, otherwise he will never last. Did you see the Dumervil hit on Brady yesterday, he got absolutely pancaked. Brady got right back up and lead the team to a late 4th quarter TD right after that, true sign of a winner. Kolb would've been out for months if he took that hit, just saying...

 

[Evil Ash]

I get it. I guess I'm just frustrated that we are destined AGAIN to go into the off season with uncertainty under center.

I'm happy we are winning of course but I would take 6-10 with our definite QBOF on roster then 9-7 and back to the drawing board AGAIN.

I understand to a point but this board can be very unrealistic at the QB position. They want a young QBOTF who doesn't have to develop at all, will not struggle in reading an NFL defense, doesn't turn the ball over, etc.

Those players just don't exist. Hell Peyton Manning "the surest QB pick ever" had more INTs than TDs his first year.

There's a reason that the NFL is doing everything in its power to protect good QBs - there aren't many of them left.