Cousins prefer the Vikes?

[Gandhi]

Isn't that the catch-22 to that premise though? If a team goes out and spends draft picks and big FA money on a QB, how are they going to surround him with good players?

I get what you are saying, Mokler, and it could be a catch-22, but to me, it won’t necessarily be that.

One option to get around it would be to have a good team in place before signing the quarterback. I understand that the Cardinals have obvious holes in different positions, but I also think they have some of the best players in the NFL at other positions. Namely cornerback with Patrick Peterson, edge rusher with Chandler Jones and runningback with David Johnson. Two of those are considered premium positions. Then there are other potential playmakers like Markus Golden, Tyrann Mathieu and Larry Fitzgerald, and maybe even D. J. Humphries. I think they could make it work.

Then you can also draft well, as you mention. I have been very surprised with how little importance rookies has actually had to the most successful teams this season since rookies have been a somewhat decisive factor in the last couple of years. Going back to the Vikings and Eagles they have only had few of their rookies as big contributors. The Vikings have had third round pick center Pat Elflein as an important part of their offensive line and inside linebacker Ben Gedeon was a reliable player as well, but other than that they had nearly no contribution from rookies. The Eagles did get solid production from their first rounder, edge rusher Derek Barnett, as a rotational player on the defensive line but none other from their draft class did much of anything this season. Now, some rookies might have been very good on their special teams. I will admit that I don’t know that. By the way, I have excluded the Jaguars and the Patriots for various reasons. The Jaguars because they have had high draft picks in several years and thus have been able to select the biggest talents to surround quarterback Blake Bortles with. However, three of their rookies made huge contribution to their success this year. The Patriots is excluded because I think they are almost a two-man-show with Tom Brady and Rob Gronkowski. None of their rookies did anything on the field this year anyway.

You also mention the money, and you are definitely right that the salary cap is very important to the teams’ success. That said, it is fairly easy to manipulate the salary cap, and the Cardinals have cap guru Mike Disner to do just that. Because of this, and in the most extreme scenario, a team could without problems sign all the three, five or seven most expensive free agents. Now, teams don’t want to do that because it becomes an almost insurmountable problem down the road, but the point is that the salary cap is a dynamic tool that allow teams to not let contracts have such a huge effect on their options as we fear as fans. The Cardinals would without a doubt be able to sign Kirk Cousins and at least one other rather expensive free agent. Keep in mind as well that it’s not that farfetched to think they will cut several of the players on their roster with the biggest contracts such as Mike Iupati, Jared Veldheer, Tyrann Mathieu, and of course Carson Palmer has retired, and thus free up some cap space.

My overall point is that there are in fact multiple ways that the Cardinals could sign or trade for a good veteran quarterback this offseason and realistically expect to be highly competitive next season.

 

[Chopper0080]

the lack of AZ mentioned as a possible suitor actually worries me. Everyone knows we are the team in direst need of a QB... there should be rumors galore about Cousins and the Cardinals.. but there aint... when you combine that with MB and SK's penchant for secrets??

Cardinals are high on the vegas betting odds, so we are in play. In terms of Cousins, if Minnesota wants him, they will get him. They offer more than most teams. If Jacksonville wants him, they probably get him as well.

I believe we match up well in terms of situations with Denver. We both have more talent on the defense, poor offensive lines, and some weapons on offense to work with.

Cleveland can offer the most coin.

The Jets have the most high profile market for his brand.

 

[Shane]

Cousins to a team that has 3 legitimate starting QB's?

Why the hell not? lol.

No they don’t 2 of 3 are unrestricted FAs

 

[Arz101]

Cousins is maximizing his money making skill. What is the beef here?

 

[oaken1]

Cardinals are high on the vegas betting odds, so we are in play. In terms of Cousins, if Minnesota wants him, they will get him. They offer more than most teams. If Jacksonville wants him, they probably get him as well.

I believe we match up well in terms of situations with Denver. We both have more talent on the defense, poor offensive lines, and some weapons on offense to work with.

Cleveland can offer the most coin.

The Jets have the most high profile market for his brand.

I agree. Buffalo could end up in the discussion as well. Denver has John Elway pitching for them and IMO that carries some weight with a QB.

IMO, if he was truthful in his assertion that winning is most important then Minnesota would have to be considered the front runner. They have a legit top 5 defense and just made a serious playoff run with a career nobody at QB... he would have to think he could take that team all the way....unless he thinks it was all shurmer?

something to consider... the dude is from basically North Chicago...

Green Bay, Chicago, Indy, Cleveland and Detroit all would put the guy close enough that he could drive home and see his momma on an off day. Some guys get successful and want their family and friends to be a part of that so maybe being close to "home" is something he is thinking about. Pittsburgh is also only an 8 hour drive from his hometown.... Ben has a similar cap structure to honey badger this year with the $5mil roster bonus due on march 18th.... but Pittsburgh is 5mil over the cap this year so trading Ben and signing Kirk would take some magic
The Detroit Lions however have a brand new coach. Even though they were in different divisions, purely geographical proximity would suggest Patricia should be fairly familiar with Cousins... there are rumors the Lions may want to trade Stafford and his huge contract,... and they also have $44mil in cap space. From Detroit its only a five hour drive home to mommas apple pie.. the contract would basically be a direct replacement since Cousins will get similar money.

all purely speculation. But the guy has tons of options depending on how he is actually thinking on it... many in the business seam to think Denver is a foregone conclusion... but I dont think he is plug and play in denver... Cousins alone will not take them to the top.

If Detroit were smart, they would trade off stafford to cleveland for one of those top picks and a second... then sign cousins and get him some help with their two first round picks.

 

[TRW]

I think Minnesota will re-sign Teddy and maybe franchise Keenum if they can't come to an agreement. The HC loves Teddy and I think he still believes he's "their guy".

Jacksonville already committed to Bortles, or pretty much did.

Miami could move on from Tannehill and try to go for Cousins.

If Cousins wants the most cash, he goes to Cleveland.

If he wants a chance to win it all he goes to Denver.

 

[WisconsinCard]

there are rumors the Lions may want to trade Stafford and his huge contract,... and they also have $44mil in cap space. From Detroit its only a five hour drive home to mommas apple pie.. the contract would basically be a direct replacement since Cousins will get similar money.

I can give you almost 50 million reasons why it won't happen this year, and 30 million reasons why it won't happen next year either. Detroit would have a dead cap hit of that much over the next two years and wouldn't be able to field a respectable team. They made that contract they'll have to live with it.

 

[LoyaltyisaCurse]

Niners just gave JimmyG almost 28 mil per year. Is Cousins worth that?

 

[AsUpRoDiGy]

Niners just gave JimmyG almost 28 mil per year. Is Cousins worth that?

Cousins will want more than that. Easily.

 

[juza76]

Cousins will want more than that. Easily.

Do u think they will satisfy his request?

 

[Solar7]

Cousins will want more than that. Easily.

I was listening to NFL Radio earlier this week and one of their ex-GMs (name is escaping me) had a pretty decent point. Cousins isn't going to be able to individually set the market, the market's going to have to set itself for him. That perhaps teams will fail to compete for him at the level that is needed for him to make that kind of money. He was pretty insistent Cousins wouldn't break $30m per.

Clearly there's a while until this is resolved entirely, but I do wonder if he'll find less suitors willing to play ball at that number and will have to come down from it. I truly don't believe it's all about the money for Kirk either.

 

[Chopper0080]

Do u think they will satisfy his request?

I don't believe Cousins will get more than Jimmy.

 

[AsUpRoDiGy]

I don't believe Cousins will get more than Jimmy.

How's that possible? Cousins has better numbers in literally every category. His agent has so much ammunition now for a monster contract...there's no way they settle for what Jimmy G received.

 

[LoyaltyisaCurse]

$74 Mill guaranteed.

 

[Arz101]

$74 Mill guaranteed.

That's it? That is kinda, hmmm, cheap. no?

 

[Chopper0080]

How's that possible? Cousins has better numbers in literally every category. His agent has so much ammunition now for a monster contract...there's no way they settle for what Jimmy G received.

SF was going to have to put the franchise tag on Jimmy if they wanted him to stay. That elevates the money on the deal. He is also 26 years old. Which means you a paying him for future increases in production. He can sell that he is getting better. His stick is also higher than Cousins because no one around the NFL is saying that he is overrated.

Cousins is being let go by the Redskins for Alex Smith. That hurts his leverage. He is also 29. He has capped his production level in terms of negotiations. Also, unless the Browns drop the 28 mil per year, no one really has the money to offer him the type of deal that SF offered Jimmy. And with the Browns, the former GM of Washington was just added to their front office, and he is the guy who said there is nothing special about Cousins. Denver, Arizona, and Minnesota also have several high dollar players that they want to keep around in order to help Cousins.

 

[juza76]

How's that possible? Cousins has better numbers in literally every category. His agent has so much ammunition now for a monster contract...there's no way they settle for what Jimmy G received.

How many wins cousins put in the table
He put good numbers but in the end of the day he didnt bring his team at the next level
Garappolo in a short span as soon as he got the starting job he lead his mediocre team to 6 win in a row

 

[AsUpRoDiGy]

SF was going to have to put the franchise tag on Jimmy if they wanted him to stay. That elevates the money on the deal. He is also 26 years old. Which means you a paying him for future increases in production. He can sell that he is getting better. His stick is also higher than Cousins because no one around the NFL is saying that he is overrated.

Cousins is being let go by the Redskins for Alex Smith. That hurts his leverage. He is also 29. He has capped his production level in terms of negotiations. Also, unless the Browns drop the 28 mil per year, no one really has the money to offer him the type of deal that SF offered Jimmy. And with the Browns, the former GM of Washington was just added to their front office, and he is the guy who said there is nothing special about Cousins. Denver, Arizona, and Minnesota also have several high dollar players that they want to keep around in order to help Cousins.

Cousins is hitting the free market though, where teams will be bidding for him, at a time when many teams are QB hungry. Cousins will undoubtedly get more money than Jimmy G, and then Aaron Rodgers + Matt Ryan will use what Cousins gets as leverage to receive even more. Everyone is reporting that Cousins will now command $30M per year on the open market...when before it probably would've been around the $27-$28M range.

 

[cardncubfan]

How many wins cousins put in the table
He put good numbers but in the end of the day he didnt bring his team at the next level
Garappolo in a short span as soon as he got the starting job he lead his mediocre team to 6 win in a row

They also went from averaging 17 points a game to 28. But that might have something to do with their opponents when JG played. I haven't looked at their schedule.

 

[daves]

SF was going to have to put the franchise tag on Jimmy if they wanted him to stay. That elevates the money on the deal.

I don't think this is relevant. Both players would be free agents if not tagged. If anything, the 49ers had much more leverage to tag Garroppolo, whereas the Redskins presumably will NOT tag Cousins, allowing him to freely seek whatever team will offer him the highest salary.

He is also 26 years old.

Comparing each player on a 5-year deal, Cousins' age won't be a factor. If we were comparing the players' value on 10-year deals, then indeed Cousins' age would work against him... but in the time frame for NFL deals to be signed and GMs to make or break their careers with a decision like this, age isn't really a factor.

Which means you a paying him for future increases in production. He can sell that he is getting better.

Sure, but the flip side of this is that Garroppolo doesn't have much of a sample size to prove his durability or ability to continue performing at a high level vs. tougher competition, once other teams have more film on him in the 49er offense. Cousins' body of work probably counts for just as much as, if not more than, Garroppolo's theoretical potential to get even better.

His stick is also higher than Cousins because no one around the NFL is saying that he is overrated.

Well if a team is convinced that Cousins is overrated or that Garroppolo has the potential to be better in the future than Cousins is now, then indeed that team won't pay as much for Cousins. But you're claiming that NO TEAM will pay more for Cousins than what Garroppolo got, which i still think is unlikely.

Cousins is being let go by the Redskins for Alex Smith. That hurts his leverage.

Come on now. Smith is the fallback plan for the Redskins, who blew their chance to sign Cousins long-term, and had to "let go" because they couldn't afford to tag him again and he no longer wants to play there long term. He's not being "let go" for performance-based reasons.

He is also 29. He has capped his production level in terms of negotiations. Also, unless the Browns drop the 28 mil per year, no one really has the money to offer him the type of deal that SF offered Jimmy. And with the Browns, the former GM of Washington was just added to their front office, and he is the guy who said there is nothing special about Cousins. Denver, Arizona, and Minnesota also have several high dollar players that they want to keep around in order to help Cousins.

Well, i guess we shall see!

...dave

 

[Chopper0080]

Cousins is hitting the free market though, where teams will be bidding for him, at a time when many teams are QB hungry. Cousins will undoubtedly get more money than Jimmy G, and then Aaron Rodgers + Matt Ryan will use what Cousins gets as leverage to receive even more. Everyone is reporting that Cousins will now command $30M per year on the open market...when before it probably would've been around the $27-$28M range.

A bidding war caps out at players perceived ability levels. None of the teams bidding on Cousins actually believes that he will be a top 5 QB in the NFL. That keeps the top end of the bidding down, and below the Jmmy GQ range. The 49ers believe they just signed the best QB in football in a couple of years.

 

[Chopper0080]

I don't think this is relevant. Both players would be free agents if not tagged. If anything, the 49ers had much more leverage to tag Garroppolo, whereas the Redskins presumably will NOT tag Cousins, allowing him to freely seek whatever team will offer him the highest salary.



Comparing each player on a 5-year deal, Cousins' age won't be a factor. If we were comparing the players' value on 10-year deals, then indeed Cousins' age would work against him... but in the time frame for NFL deals to be signed and GMs to make or break their careers with a decision like this, age isn't really a factor.



Sure, but the flip side of this is that Garroppolo doesn't have much of a sample size to prove his durability or ability to continue performing at a high level vs. tougher competition, once other teams have more film on him in the 49er offense. Cousins' body of work probably counts for just as much as, if not more than, Garroppolo's theoretical potential to get even better.



Well if a team is convinced that Cousins is overrated or that Garroppolo has the potential to be better in the future than Cousins is now, then indeed that team won't pay as much for Cousins. But you're claiming that NO TEAM will pay more for Cousins than what Garroppolo got, which i still think is unlikely.



Come on now. Smith is the fallback plan for the Redskins, who blew their chance to sign Cousins long-term, and had to "let go" because they couldn't afford to tag him again and he no longer wants to play there long term. He's not being "let go" for performance-based reasons.



Well, i guess we shall see!

...dave

1-Jimmy is getting on ton of money up front, because that is what would have happened if they franchised his and signed him next year. That is why his contract is front loaded.

2-Jimmy will turn 27 the first year of his deal and Cousins will turn 30. 30 is a big number when it comes to contracts. Cousins will be 35 at the end of his deal...Jimmy 32. Again, that is a big difference in terms of contracts.

3-QBs are about projection as much as sample size. Jimmy is believed to be a difference maker, despite his limited history. Cousins is doubted despite his impressive passing stats.

4-Yes, no team believes that Cousins will be a better QB than Jimmy. That is why Cousins will be paid less.

5-The Redskins are selling that Alex Smith brings more to their team than Cousins, and people in the media buy it. Rumors are that Belichick regrets having to keep Brady over Jimmy, and people are in the media buy it. Two very opposite viewpoints in terms of value.

 

[Gandhi]

Report that Cousins prefers signing with the Vikes if money is comparable.

At the least, he knows how to up the bidding for teams desperate for a QB.

I talked to a huge Vikings-fan yesterday, and he did not expect the Vikings to be big spenders in free agency. The reason is that they might need to use a lot of money to lock up some key pieces on their team, including offensive guard Joe Berger, offensive guard Nick Easton, offensive line swiss knife Jeremiah Sirles, defensive tackle Tom Johnson, linebacker Emmanuel Lamur and cornerback Terence Newman. Then there is the quarterback-situation where Sam Bradford, Teddy Bridgewater and Case Keenum all have expiring contracts, and some tough decision for the Vikings to make. You could also factor in that the players from their great draft class in 2015, cornerback Trae Waynes, linebacker Eric Kendricks, defensive end Danielle Hunter and wide receiver Stefon Diggs all scheduled to hit the open market after next season, so the Vikings might want to secure some of them for the long run. On top of that, linebacker Anthony Barr is beginning to talk about a long-term contract extension with his current deal running out after next season.

The Vikings are in great shape with their salary cap, and they could easily afford an expensive veteran quarterback, but at least according to my friend, they are more likely to use the money to lock up their own players.

 

[NJCardFan]

the lack of AZ mentioned as a possible suitor actually worries me. Everyone knows we are the team in direst need of a QB... there should be rumors galore about Cousins and the Cardinals.. but there aint... when you combine that with MB and SK's penchant for secrets??

I'm glad that the Cards don't want to overpay for this slightly above average QB. If you're going to sling money, at least get a sure thing and Cousins ain't it. I'd rather take a flier on Bradford or Bridgewater and draft a QBOTF.

 

[sportznutt]

Cousins to the Vikings makes them Super Bowl contenders.