Cousins prefer the Vikes?

daves

Keepin' it real!
Supporting Member
Joined
Nov 2, 2003
Posts
3,526
Reaction score
7,209
Location
Orange County, CA
OP
OP
G

GimmedaBall

Hall of Famer
Joined
Dec 2, 2013
Posts
1,626
Reaction score
1,110
All the more reason we need to hold onto our draft picks this year. The belly of the roster needs to be filled with young, cheap guys, not overpaid free agents.

Even if you hold on to every single player taken in the next draft there will be plenty of holes to fill on the roster via FA and one-year prove it deals.

If you flush out the roster with a few dozen undrafted rooks and preseason rookie cuts from other teams, Cards will perform like a preseason game after the vets have left the field.

We do need to get younger as a roster but it will be a few years of churning the roster before we come close to having 'the belly of the roster' filled with young cheap guys.
 

Solar7

Go Suns
Joined
May 18, 2002
Posts
11,172
Reaction score
12,108
Location
Las Vegas, NV
Even if you hold on to every single player taken in the next draft there will be plenty of holes to fill on the roster via FA and one-year prove it deals.

If you flush out the roster with a few dozen undrafted rooks and preseason rookie cuts from other teams, Cards will perform like a preseason game after the vets have left the field.

We do need to get younger as a roster but it will be a few years of churning the roster before we come close to having 'the belly of the roster' filled with young cheap guys.

I'm not saying that they need to be rookies or in their second year, but you should have a fair amount of contributors coming from the draft. Especially when you only have 15 guys under contract. I'm sure that will change as we go through the offseason, but counting on players who were either cast off from other teams, or in their second contract, isn't financially feasible.
 

Gandhi

Hall of Famer
Joined
Feb 17, 2007
Posts
2,018
Reaction score
2,863
Location
Denmark
what success have the Ravens or the Colts had since the paid those guys in the past few years?... its all about ego...every player wants a contract that says he is the best in the league. but teams that show sustained success do not give out those contracts.
Brady works cheap...yes his wife makes money, but the truth is, he has made lots of money too and the guy likes to win...so he plays below market value so the team can add better players.

Last season was the first time Aaron Rodgers cap hit actually hit $20mil... big ben has only gone over 20mil once as well....
some of it is cap magic...the structure of the contract is important... but some of it is that some players do not allow their ego to get in the way of the team winning.

its not all on the players I'm sure... I mean honestly, if a GM approached me with a $30mil a year contract with 70 mil guaranteed,...I would sign it too. I think some GM's do that as a show of confidence... but they are screwing the team in the process.... because LBers and DT's like to get paid too and now that GM is gonna have to hard line the negotiations for those guys.....and suddenly you have no defense.

I think most teams have a chart basically...showing how much they will invest in each position.There stars will get the bulk of that and the other guys split whats left... so if say you have 28mil slotted for the QB position...if you then spend that entire 28mil on a single guy,...all of your backups have to be league minimum guys or rookies....otherwise it affects how competitive you can be at other positions

Well, in 2005 through 2009 Brady’s contract gave his team one of the four biggest cap hits in the entire league in four of those years, and in the fifth he ranked number eight in that category. That contract was his second extension, but in reality it was an upgrade on his previous deal that he only had for two years. However, it meant that he got two signing bonusses, and with each of them he apparently were willing to give the team a huge cap hit. I only bring this up to show that he too was looking out for himself first and foremost before he became the superstar he is now, and by the way, before he got married. Now, you are obviously correct that the situation has change in the latter part of his career. I don’t know why. Maybe it’s because of his wife, maybe it’s because of his many endorsement deals, or maybe it’s because he still makes millions of dollars and have decided that he wants to win above everything else. There’s even a theory out there that the team owner, and Brady’s close friend, Robert Kraft has promised to compensate Brady heavily when his career is over in return for Brady lowering his contract demands now. Whatever the reason might be, I know that he has had multiple contracts since 2010, either because of real contract extensions or because of restructured contracts. Each time there is a signing bonus with the contract, and that gives the player a lot of money in the hand right now, and the team some salary cap relief (that is the basic reasons for restructuring contracts). The result is that everyone got happy, and even though you are right that Tom Brady could have demanded more money throughout his career, I can guarantee you that he does not work cheap relatively to all quarterbacks and he has not given up on a single penny of what is his according to the contracts.

You also mention Aaron Rodgers and Ben Roethlisberger. Both have contracts running through 2019, and you are right that their contracts haven’t given the teams a huge cap hit the last couple of years. That said, both contract is backloaded, meaning that those players are owed a huge amount of money by their team, and there is absolutely no doubt that they will collect all of it. I don’t know how they will do it, and those teams might be able to find a way around the salary cap-ramifications, but usually it is not in a team’s interest to backload contracts that much.

Another point I would like to make is that Aaron Rodgers last got a contract extension in 2013 while Roethlisberger got his current deal in 2015. Much has changed since then. Both players could be up for contract extensions this offseason which could either give the teams more salary cap relief now and even bigger expenses later, or it could kind of even out the payout and thus affect the level of players on the teams in the coming years.

My overall point with this post is to say that, like I wrote in the post you quote, the salary cap is fairly easy to manipulate. You can pretty much structure it any way you want. This makes it possible to put together contracts in ways so that you control how it will affect your salary cap. It takes two parties to make it work, and there are advantages and disadvantages for both parties no matter how the contracts are constructed, and that’s probably why we don’t see every team do it the same way.

As a conclusion, I think the most important thing to know on this specific topic is that the salary cap is nothing more than a tool that, while you can’t ignore it, you can put together any way you want without making your most important players sacrifice anything.
 

oaken1

Stone Cold
Supporting Member
Banned from P+R
Joined
Mar 13, 2004
Posts
18,174
Reaction score
16,250
Location
Modesto, California
Well, in 2005 through 2009 Brady’s contract gave his team one of the four biggest cap hits in the entire league in four of those years, and in the fifth he ranked number eight in that category. That contract was his second extension, but in reality it was an upgrade on his previous deal that he only had for two years. However, it meant that he got two signing bonusses, and with each of them he apparently were willing to give the team a huge cap hit. I only bring this up to show that he too was looking out for himself first and foremost before he became the superstar he is now, and by the way, before he got married. Now, you are obviously correct that the situation has change in the latter part of his career. I don’t know why. Maybe it’s because of his wife, maybe it’s because of his many endorsement deals, or maybe it’s because he still makes millions of dollars and have decided that he wants to win above everything else. There’s even a theory out there that the team owner, and Brady’s close friend, Robert Kraft has promised to compensate Brady heavily when his career is over in return for Brady lowering his contract demands now. Whatever the reason might be, I know that he has had multiple contracts since 2010, either because of real contract extensions or because of restructured contracts. Each time there is a signing bonus with the contract, and that gives the player a lot of money in the hand right now, and the team some salary cap relief (that is the basic reasons for restructuring contracts). The result is that everyone got happy, and even though you are right that Tom Brady could have demanded more money throughout his career, I can guarantee you that he does not work cheap relatively to all quarterbacks and he has not given up on a single penny of what is his according to the contracts.

You also mention Aaron Rodgers and Ben Roethlisberger. Both have contracts running through 2019, and you are right that their contracts haven’t given the teams a huge cap hit the last couple of years. That said, both contract is backloaded, meaning that those players are owed a huge amount of money by their team, and there is absolutely no doubt that they will collect all of it. I don’t know how they will do it, and those teams might be able to find a way around the salary cap-ramifications, but usually it is not in a team’s interest to backload contracts that much.

Another point I would like to make is that Aaron Rodgers last got a contract extension in 2013 while Roethlisberger got his current deal in 2015. Much has changed since then. Both players could be up for contract extensions this offseason which could either give the teams more salary cap relief now and even bigger expenses later, or it could kind of even out the payout and thus affect the level of players on the teams in the coming years.

My overall point with this post is to say that, like I wrote in the post you quote, the salary cap is fairly easy to manipulate. You can pretty much structure it any way you want. This makes it possible to put together contracts in ways so that you control how it will affect your salary cap. It takes two parties to make it work, and there are advantages and disadvantages for both parties no matter how the contracts are constructed, and that’s probably why we don’t see every team do it the same way.

As a conclusion, I think the most important thing to know on this specific topic is that the salary cap is nothing more than a tool that, while you can’t ignore it, you can put together any way you want without making your most important players sacrifice anything.

right. I agree. if a team is cap flexible at a particular time they can frontload a signing bonus rather than spread it out,..etc.... but time has shown us many teams do not have mathematical wizards running their cap,lol...thus..."cap hell"
for the most part the Cards have managed to stay in fairly decent cap position over the past 7 or 8 years.... not like the snail days
 

Gandhi

Hall of Famer
Joined
Feb 17, 2007
Posts
2,018
Reaction score
2,863
Location
Denmark
right. I agree. if a team is cap flexible at a particular time they can frontload a signing bonus rather than spread it out,..etc.... but time has shown us many teams do not have mathematical wizards running their cap,lol...thus..."cap hell"
for the most part the Cards have managed to stay in fairly decent cap position over the past 7 or 8 years.... not like the snail days

That's right, Oaken. As I am sure you know, it’s because Steve Keim hired cap- and contract genius Mike Disner when Keim was promoted to general manager. Disner has a long history of working with numbers and the salary cap, including four years working on the NFL Management Council. While working at the league office, Disner was an integral part of the negotiations with the current labor deal, among other things because he was a part of the team constructing the rookie wage scale as well as creating a structure of the salary cap and thus ensure reconciliation between the owners and the players. He also developed analytics tools to help teams maneuver within the rules of the salary cap.
 

Latest posts

Staff online

Members online

Forum statistics

Threads
553,589
Posts
5,408,553
Members
6,319
Latest member
route66
Top