Do Suns have one of the least brightest present/future in the West?

Mainstreet

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If the Suns had prime Hakeem on this team this season, would they win the championship?

Or Kareem?

Actually this is a good question because I am uncertain about Hornacek as head coach. His tenacity with playing two PGs gives me pause. The upcoming season should answer some questions.
 

Errntknght

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If the Suns had prime Hakeem on this team this season, would they win the championship?

I think the answer is 'no' whether you meant this next season or this past season. And even Hornacek would play Hakeem in the 4th Q! Jeez, I don't think he's much a coach but he isn't dim enough to sit Hakeem in prime time.
 

chickenhead

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was just going to post that. We couldn't even get Pau or Bosh to give us a whiff, Love according to reports wanted no part of being here, and the major superduper stars... yeah, right.

Dragic wasn't any kind of draw for this team. Most very good, but not great players are like that.

I agree. I think a FA is probably looking at a centerpiece that will either make his job easier or extend his career. I really like Dragic, but he's not Nash in that regard (no one is), he's not Chris Paul, and obviously he's not a force up front or a defensive anchor. Bledsoe "could" be a bigger draw after this coming season, but he's going to have to prove it.

But even so, pinning this on the players too much is to deflect prime responsibility from the organization.
 

Mainstreet

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Dwyane Wade for $20m anybody?

My first reaction was absolutely, postively no. However, if Wade could stay healthy, the Suns could buy a star for credibility. He could then play beside Bledsoe or Knight whichever the Suns keep and actually fit. Then Suns could then trade Bledsoe or Knight for picks. I'd love to have another pick to go big in this draft. Of course the hiccup, could Wade stay healthy and could the Suns find the money? Anyway, it's just a brainstorm.
 

ASUCHRIS

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My first reaction was absolutely, postively no. However, if Wade could stay healthy, the Suns could buy a star for credibility. He could then play beside Bledsoe or Knight whichever the Suns keep and actually fit. Then Suns could then trade Bledsoe or Knight for picks. I'd love to have another pick to go big in this draft. Of course the hiccup, could Wade stay healthy and could the Suns find the money? Anyway, it's just a brainstorm.

Seems like a crazy idea, and with his health issues/costs, doesn't seem like it would ever happen.

That said, if you could move Bled/Knight for some picks or a decent young big man, maybe it's not the worst idea ever? (we're really grasping at straws here)
 

Mainstreet

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Seems like a crazy idea, and with his health issues/costs, doesn't seem like it would ever happen.

That said, if you could move Bled/Knight for some picks or a decent young big man, maybe it's not the worst idea ever? (we're really grasping at straws here)

Like I said, it was a brainstorm on my part. I do think Bledsoe or Knight could get the Suns some draft picks or be used in a trade for a big man. Wade would give the Suns some instant credibility and star power.
 

Covert Rain

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Like I said, it was a brainstorm on my part. I do think Bledsoe or Knight could get the Suns some draft picks or be used in a trade for a big man. Wade would give the Suns some instant credibility and star power.

As much as I like Wade I hate that the Suns always go after guys on the back-end of their careers. It's sort of our "thing". This window would definitely be very short and would only work if we could shore up the front court. It's not necessarily a bad idea but definitely a familiar one.
 

ASUCHRIS

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Like I said, it was a brainstorm on my part. I do think Bledsoe or Knight could get the Suns some draft picks or be used in a trade for a big man. Wade would give the Suns some instant credibility and star power.

Hey, not criticizing - considering our current plight, there are very few options that shouldn't at least be considered.
 

Mainstreet

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As much as I like Wade I hate that the Suns always go after guys on the back-end of their careers. It's sort of our "thing". This window would definitely be very short and would only work if we could shore up the front court. It's not necessarily a bad idea but definitely a familiar one.

The player that immediately comes to mind is Steve Nash. If so, sign me up. :)
 

Mainstreet

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Hey, not criticizing - considering our current plight, there are very few options that shouldn't at least be considered.

I understand. Maybe the Suns medical staff could extend Wade's career. When the Suns went fishing for an older player with medical concerns, it worked out quite well in Steve Nash.
 

elindholm

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I understand. Maybe the Suns medical staff could extend Wade's career. When the Suns went fishing for an older player with medical concerns, it worked out quite well in Steve Nash.

Don't forget Grant Hill too.
 

Absolute Zero

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Actually this is a good question because I am uncertain about Hornacek as head coach. His tenacity with playing two PGs gives me pause. The upcoming season should answer some questions.

Wait a sec, you have a problem with Hornacek and his system? Huh, I must have missed that.

:sarcasm:


:)
 

GatorAZ

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You need at least two stars to win a championship. The 04' Pistons got some luck running into a dysfunctional Laker team and the Mavs ran into a dysfunctional Lebron. Those are two exceptions.

In last year's finals I still considered Duncan a star and Leonard too. They were two of the best 2-way players in the league. We aren't getting Aldridge, Love, Durant or Davis so the future does not look bright to answer your question. Just keep drafting well and hope Len, Warren and Bledsoe/Knight take the next step.
 

Errntknght

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Just think, if the trainers could work some magic on Wade, he might just be enough to convince Hornacek that its alright to play a real SG. Wade is a fairly good playmaker - as good or better than Horny was when he played with Stockton.
 

GatorAZ

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Just think, if the trainers could work some magic on Wade, he might just be enough to convince Hornacek that its alright to play a real SG. Wade is a fairly good playmaker - as good or better than Horny was when he played with Stockton.

McD won't overpay for a declining vet.
 

Covert Rain

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The player that immediately comes to mind is Steve Nash. If so, sign me up. :)

No doubt the Suns medical staff did great with Hill, Nash and even Shaq for that matter. He would have been way done before if not for the Suns staff. I am just saying that it's becoming their thing. I just wish we could get some of these guys in their younger prime years so we could be the team letting these guys go after a great run.
 
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sunsfan88

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The Suns started a full-scale rebuild at the same time as the Sixers, but they’ve made so many unpredictable turns that it sometimes appears as if they have no guiding process at all.

Suns owner Robert Sarver admits he’s an impatient sort, but he embraced a rebuild when he empowered GM Ryan McDonough to gut the wretched post–Steve Nash roster ahead of the 2013-14 season. That team nearly blitzed to the playoffs, and the Suns have been prisoners to that shocking success ever since. They’ve veered off the rebuild path, and reached in a half-dozen different directions for missing pieces in an attempt to quickly turn themselves into contenders.

They met with LeBron James’s camp a year ago, and after James held the league hostage for two weeks, the Suns dealt for Isaiah Thomas — tripling down on a point guard experiment that already included Eric Bledsoe and Goran Dragic. When Dragic soured on his role, the Suns dealt him to Miami in exchange for two first-round picks — a killer return for a player on an expiring contract who wanted out, and a classic rebuild move. Phoenix at that moment had the trade chips to compete with anyone for the next disgruntled superstar.

And then, boom, the Suns traded two of their best chips — Thomas and a lightly protected pick from the Lakers — and didn’t have much other than Knight to show for it. Phoenix had dealt two guards, dangled its most enticing bait, and somehow come away with yet another point guard — and no big men to fill out a thin frontcourt.

Four months later, they came out of nowhere to sign Tyson Chandler, opened up cap space with a salary dump in Detroit, and emerged as San Antonio’s only real competition for LaMarcus Aldridge. Aldridge chose the Spurs, and the Suns are now left with Chandler — a 32-year-old center at least seven years older than the rest of the team’s core, and a seven-foot barrier to Alex Len getting the minutes he needs.

So, umm, what the heck are the Suns doing?

“It has been a roller coaster for sure,” McDonough says, chuckling.

“I am not a real patient person,” Sarver says. “You don’t have the kind of success that allows you to buy an NBA team by being a patient person in business. But it’s just a personality trait, and you try not to make decisions based on that.”

Phoenix wagered that the Lakers would upgrade enough this summer to shove that pick toward the bottom of the lottery, but it appears to have lost that part of the bet. They could have waited to pursue Knight in free agency, though prying away restricted free agents is usually a loser’s game. Still: Knight now makes about double Thomas’s salary, raising the possibility that Phoenix effectively traded one point guard and one draft pick for a worse asset at point guard they might have signed anyway and a worse draft pick — the Cleveland first-rounder Phoenix received from Boston in exchange for Thomas.

Phoenix showed it is willing to ditch the whole ‘stay young’ thing, chasing two 30-plus starters the moment free agency opened.

Phoenix swung and mostly missed. They’ll swing again. “One of these years,” McDonough says, “we hope we can win one of these.”

That may never happen. That is the danger of relying on cap space. Good news: The Suns aren’t just relying on cap space. They have a boatload of young players, and the 2018 and 2021 first-rounders coming from Miami loom as both interesting trade chips and key building blocks for the next era of Suns basketball. Those picks could decline in value if Pat Riley’s beachfront pitch seduces another star, raising the possibility that Phoenix will lag behind at least Boston and Philly in the race to build a trade package for the next available star.

Philly’s owners know this, which is why they trust a process they can shape more than “normal” teams like Phoenix will ever be able to shape free agency or the trade market. But you can only do that if the owners let you.

http://grantland.com/the-triangle/a...-philly-plot-different-courses-to-contention/
Really good read. Zach Lowe is one of the most well respected writers out there and this basically a comparison of the Suns and 76ers rebuilding strategies.

Lowe doesn't say either one is better than the other, just points out the differences and how they have gone since both teams started the rebuild with a new GM at the same time two years ago.

I didn't want to post the whole article since its not allowed but I'd definitely recommend clicking the link and reading the whole thing.
 

Phrazbit

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There is a ton of praise in that article for what the Suns have done the last two years... but you wouldn't know it based on reading what you cut out and highlighted... you can be such a troll.
 

Chaz

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The only real problem I had with the Lowe article is that he conflates the Thomas and Knight trade but considers the Dragic trade separate.
They are all separate. Sure he can question the Knight deal and giving up the Lakers pick but don't confuse things by saying that they traded Thomas and a pick for Knight and a pick. They dumped Thomas for a pick.

He also seems to indicate that Thomas is a more valuable piece than Knight. I can't say I agree on straight up value, not to mention that Knight is probably a better fit with the Suns.

I don't see the huge upside for the Sixers. With all the losses what do they have to show for it? A couple of front court prospects? He is talking it could take 5-7 years? Good for them that they are profitable but wow. That seems like a recipe for classic Clippers level of horrible for 20 years.
 

JCSunsfan

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Part of the Suns future is Bogdan. The Eurostash practice is one that NBA teams should use more often, especially with second rounders. I just saw this:

David ‘Dubi’ Pick: I’m told if Bogdan Bogdanovic has another monster season – named recent European Rising Star – he’ll join Phoenix Suns for 2016/2017. – via Twitter IAmDPick
 

Mainstreet

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Part of the Suns future is Bogdan. The Eurostash practice is one that NBA teams should use more often, especially with second rounders. I just saw this:

David ‘Dubi’ Pick: I’m told if Bogdan Bogdanovic has another monster season – named recent European Rising Star – he’ll join Phoenix Suns for 2016/2017. – via Twitter IAmDPick

The Suns could be really good at SG with Weems, Booker and Bogdan.
 

JCSunsfan

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The Suns could be really good at SG with Weems, Booker and Bogdan.

Would that mean that the pg's would be Bledsoe and Knight? One backing up the other?

I like our bench this year. There is alot of real long term potential.
 

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There is a ton of praise in that article for what the Suns have done the last two years... but you wouldn't know it based on reading what you cut out and highlighted... you can be such a troll.


While not disagreeing entirely with your view on sf88, the points he highlights in the article should not be forgotten - management have a ton of question marks hanging over their heads.

(With apologies for repeating those outlined in the article):

- How little do they know about the importance of team chemistry, as evidenced by the recruitment of a 3rd starting-calibre point guard, Thomas, that appeared to kill it.
- In view of the above, did we manage to alienate and subsequently trade our best asset in Dragic?
- If Dragic was our best asset, should they have given more consideration to retaining Frye who, when on the floor, made Dragic's advanced stats soar, or at least bring in a better floor spacer than Tolliver?
- Are we going to regret the Lakers pick offload?
- Surely Thomas was worth more than a late first founder?
- Did we have to trade the high PER / low salary Thomas in the first place?
- Is the 2 starting point guards theory a bust?

These are not trivial questions.


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