drafting a franchise player

[Chaplin]

Funny how it worked for Cleveland and San Antonio who we always take as our role model right?

And when did we ever give Earl Clark consistent minutes. He played 10 minutes one game than didnt play the next 10 games how is that consistent.

Earl Clark right now is in the rotation on a better team than us.

The last 3 games he always played 15-21 minutes and put up 10/3, 8/6 and 10/7.

Seriously man, how can you say we tried to give him consistent minutes? In over a season Earl Clark only got 10 or more minutes ONE TIME as a rookie in back to back games (18 and 13) and early this season he had a streak of 3 games (13/15/10) over all we played him more than 10 minutes just 15 times, more than 20 minutes 2 times and one was his very first NBA game and more than 21 minutes NEVER.

He was our only young player, a lottery pick and we never gave him minutes that is why I keep going on about him. That is what SUCKS about this team even if we wanted to tank we could not do it because we have not even one prospect that we could develop with playing time.

He played almost every minute in summer league and he wasn't even the best player on our team! Why would you give minutes to someone like that? Oh I forgot, you're only concerned with tanking. In that case, we should have played him.

 

[slinslin]

Oh Dragic didn't light it up in summer league either and sucked terribly as a rookie but we played him.

I'd just like to know the logic behind that drafting a player in the lottery and then never playing him until you throw him into a trade as a worthless money filler.

 

[Chaplin]

Oh Dragic didn't light it up in summer league either and sucked terribly as a rookie but we played him.

I'd just like to know the logic behind that drafting a player in the lottery and then never playing him until you throw him into a trade as a worthless money filler.

You're talking as if we don't already have 20 wings on the team. And make no mistake, Clark is a 6'10" wing.

 

[slinslin]

And that is not the managements fault to acquire so many wing players?

It is just plain stupid, they have no clue or consistency in what they are doing.

 

[Chaplin]

And that is not the managements fault to acquire so many wing players?

It is just plain stupid, they have no clue or consistency in what they are doing.

And yet, you have blind faith that they will make good draft picks, top 10 or no.

 

[slinslin]

The higher they draft the lower the chance their incompetence identifies the wrong player since the top 7 is pretty much set before every draft.

And well if you suck at drafting you will never go anywhere, as I pointed out before drafting is esential to success , all good teams are built around the fact that they drafted well. Even when you say that Dallas really did not build through the draft AFTER drating Nowitzki it still all started with a draft pick.

 

[Yuma]

Getting a franchise player other than the draft, the first name that comes to my mind is Lew Alcindor, Kareem Abdul Jabar going to the Lakers. It can be done, but like someone in another post said, it helps to be a big market team to get it done.

Oh and before Kareem, the Lakers got Wilt Chamberlain.

 

[elindholm]

Funny how it worked for Cleveland and San Antonio who we always take as our role model right?

Please explain how it worked for Cleveland. They wound up with one unsuccessful Finals appearance, made the conference finals only one other time, and are now completely wrecked as a franchise. If the whole point is winning titles, Cleveland's tank job was a miserable failure.

As for the Spurs, they already had Robinson, whether they tanked for Duncan is debatable, and they've been the best in the league at plucking gems from late in the draft. We've gone over this a million times before. Come on, slinslin, you're better than this.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

My point is that if we pin all our hopes on the draft, we will become the Clippers. They have great picks every year. They will be good for a while now, until other teams cherry pick their roster and they sink back to futility.

you mean like has happened with the suns? jj - plucked. marion - traded. amare - plucked. we're the new clippers folks.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Please explain how it worked for Cleveland. They wound up with one unsuccessful Finals appearance, made the conference finals only one other time, and are now completely wrecked as a franchise. If the whole point is winning titles, Cleveland's tank job was a miserable failure.

As for the Spurs, they already had Robinson, whether they tanked for Duncan is debatable, and they've been the best in the league at plucking gems from late in the draft. We've gone over this a million times before. Come on, slinslin, you're better than this.

Cleveland got LeBron. Not being able to keep him was separate matter. They were still better off than if they had not gotten him at all. The fact that he was a hometown boy really complicated everything.

San Antonio did tank for Duncan, I think they tanked for Robinson too, but that was before the lottery. But to tank, you have to be REALLY bad AND you have to be really lucky. The ping pong balls have never been kind to the Suns. And even when we got the second pick, we blew it. So many things have to go right for a draft pick, even an early one, to be successful. I just have no confidence in it.

 

[slinslin]

What complicated things is that Cleveland really isn't that attractive place to live and that unique situation in Miami and his buddies.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Getting a franchise player other than the draft, the first name that comes to my mind is Lew Alcindor, Kareem Abdul Jabar going to the Lakers. It can be done, but like someone in another post said, it helps to be a big market team to get it done.

Oh and before Kareem, the Lakers got Wilt Chamberlain.

uh, are you not seeing the pattern?

lakers - wilt
lakers -kareem
lakers - shaq
lakers - kobe (who forced the hornets to trade his draft rights to lakers)

clue - the suns are not the lakers. there was a time when players and FAs loved coming to the suns (barkley, chambers, ainge, manning, tisdale, rex, ac green), but those days are not only long ago . . . but this ownership team is making sure those days never return . . .

 

[slinslin]

I am expecting the worst anyway

We will have the last pick in the lottery (yay), not get in the top 3 of course.

With our first pick we will take a high character guy who lacks NBA potential, Orlandos pick will be sold for 3 Million $ and we won't buy a pick in the 2nd round.

After and during the draft they will feed us stories how they wanted to move up in the lottery but couldn't (doh you could have simply tanked it) and how they didn't have anybody on their board worth the Orlando pick, tried hard to get a pick in the 2nd round but everyone wanted to move up there (at least 5 2nd round picks were sold for cash).

 

[JCSunsfan]

I am expecting the worst anyway

We will have the last pick in the lottery (yay), not get in the top 3 of course.

With our first pick we will take a high character guy who lacks NBA potential, Orlandos pick will be sold for 3 Million $ and we won't buy a pick in the 2nd round.

After and during the draft they will feed us stories how they wanted to move up in the lottery but couldn't (doh you could have simply tanked it) and how they didn't have anybody on their board worth the Orlando pick, tried hard to get a pick in the 2nd round but everyone wanted to move up there (at least 5 2nd round picks were sold for cash).

Well, at least it will be hard for you to be disappointed.

 

[Mainstreet]

It's hard to feel sorry for Cleveland when they could have traded for Amare and likely kept Lebron. I sure hope they are happy signing Antawn Jamison instead. Apparently trading the Suns J.J. Hickson plus a first and Z was just too much to save their franchise. I know it was only a rumor but I think it was on the table.

 

[JCSunsfan]

It's hard to feel sorry for Cleveland when they could have traded for Amare and likely kept Lebron. I sure hope they are happy signing Antawn Jamison instead. Apparently trading the Suns J.J. Hickson plus a first and Z was just too much to save their franchise. I know it was only a rumor but I think it was on the table.

So, when Amare left for NY and LeBron left for Miami, they wouldn't have had Hickson or JJ? It looks like LeBron had been planning the Miami thing since the Olympics, and if LeBron was leaving, I guarantee you Amare would not have hung around.

All speculation of course, but it would have been better for us. But then, we would be sitting here kicking ourselve for having traded Amare rather than trying to keep him.

 

[elindholm]

Cleveland's mistake was in anointing James their savior even before the previous season had ended. When they won the lottery after making it clear they were tanking for him, it (a) made them seem desperate and (b) inflated James's already supersized ego even further. Someone who thinks he's god's gift will do what he can for the desperate as long as he is stuck with them, but he's guaranteed to move on sooner or later.

 

[sunsfan88]

So, when Amare left for NY and LeBron left for Miami, they wouldn't have had Hickson or JJ? It looks like LeBron had been planning the Miami thing since the Olympics, and if LeBron was leaving, I guarantee you Amare would not have hung around.

All speculation of course, but it would have been better for us. But then, we would be sitting here kicking ourselve for having traded Amare rather than trying to keep him.

If Amare was on the Cavs, LeBron would've never left. Same with Amare.

They might have even ended up recruiting Wade to CLE.

 

[AzStevenCal]

It's hard to feel sorry for Cleveland when they could have traded for Amare and likely kept Lebron. I sure hope they are happy signing Antawn Jamison instead. Apparently trading the Suns J.J. Hickson plus a first and Z was just too much to save their franchise. I know it was only a rumor but I think it was on the table.

It was just a rumor as was the story that Lebron preferred Jamison over Amare. We'll never know. IMO, Lebron was leaving no matter what and had been since his first international experience with Wade and Bosh. Wade had played basketball in Miami, there was no way he was ever going to Cleveland.

Steve

 

[AzStevenCal]

Cleveland's mistake was in anointing James their savior even before the previous season had ended. When they won the lottery after making it clear they were tanking for him, it (a) made them seem desperate and (b) inflated James's already supersized ego even further. Someone who thinks he's god's gift will do what he can for the desperate as long as he is stuck with them, but he's guaranteed to move on sooner or later.

I don't buy this at all. James had a well established ego long before draft day and had the Cavs organization done anything short of the butt kissing they did, the divorce would have still happened. It just would have happened sooner and perhaps even more acrimoniously.

Steve

 

[Mainstreet]

If Amare was on the Cavs, LeBron would've never left. Same with Amare.

This is what I believe would have happened. The Suns would have done a sign and trade. Amare was clearly after a max contract even in Cleveland. Also the Cavs would have become a legitimate contender with this combination. Even if Lebron left the Cavs would still have Amare.

 

[AzStevenCal]

This is what I believe would have happened. The Suns would have done a sign and trade. Amare was clearly after a max contract even in Cleveland. Also the Cavs would have become a legitimate contender with this combination. Even if Lebron left the Cavs would still have Amare.

This Cavs team would be just as irrelevant with Amare as they are with Hickson. Cleveland is not an attractive location when it comes to free agents and having Amare on the team wouldn't change that. Also, the stories that Lebron, Wade and Bosh were looking to play together came out long before this offseason. I didn't really believe them but the rumors were circulating for awhile. And as I mentioned, there were also rumors that Lebron preferred Jamison over Amare and if that's true, no way do the Cavs make that trade.

Steve

 

[Mainstreet]

This Cavs team would be just as irrelevant with Amare as they are with Hickson. Cleveland is not an attractive location when it comes to free agents and having Amare on the team wouldn't change that. Also, the stories that Lebron, Wade and Bosh were looking to play together came out long before this offseason. I didn't really believe them but the rumors were circulating for awhile. And as I mentioned, there were also rumors that Lebron preferred Jamison over Amare and if that's true, no way do the Cavs make that trade.

Steve

At the very least, the Cavs would have an All-Star in Amare and a face for their franchise. I still think the Cavs were not smart in trying to keep Lebron by signing Amare. It was a row of the dice but well worth it. Now the Cavs are a franchise without a star and scraping bottom.

 

[JCSunsfan]

At the very least, the Cavs would have an All-Star in Amare and a face for their franchise. I still think the Cavs were not smart in trying to keep Lebron by signing Amare. It was a row of the dice but well worth it. Now the Cavs are a franchise without a star and scraping bottom.

No way would Amare have stayed if LeBron left. He would be forever compared to LeBron unfavorably as the franchise floundered. NY would be the win/win for Amare, he gets paid and gets to be the savior under a coach he knows he gets along with.

 

[Mainstreet]

No way would Amare have stayed if LeBron left. He would be forever compared to LeBron unfavorably as the franchise floundered. NY would be the win/win for Amare, he gets paid and gets to be the savior under a coach he knows he gets along with.

Amare would have been sent to Cleveland in a sign and trade so he would be locked up contractually. As I recall Amare wanted the max contract and he did not put down conditions on where he would go. Besides, Cleveland would have been attractive with Lebron still there.