Drew Brees/Kurt Warner MVP race???

[Mulli]

The main competitor is Farve.

After losses to the Broncos and 9ers, Farve is not going to win it.

As it stands now anyway.

 

[Cheesebeef]

The main competitor is Farve.

two weeks ago I'd have said you were right, but Favre's fallen on hard times the last couple weeks and his alarming number of turnovers and complete falling on his face performances when things really seemed to be clicking for the Jets puts him out of it. my opinion anyway.

 

[moklerman]

I'd put Turner, Peterson and Peyton ahead of both Brees and Warner at this point.

Turner I could see but Peterson and Peyton have way too much support around them with mediocre results to show for it. Warner should have better stat's than all the QB's and he'll have done it for the Cardinals. It's a slap in the face to the Card's but the reality is that doing something really good while doing it for the Cardinals is going to add a +1 in the difficulty column. Add a +1 to the QB bias in MVP voting and Warner may be sitting pretty at the end of the year.

 

[RolleRocks]

Warner's biggest problem in winnning the MVP is demonstrated clearly on this thread.

There are many people in the Cardinal camp (Front Office and Fans, not the Coaches) that don't really want to see him win the NFL MVP.

It complicates the development of their preferred QB.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Warner's biggest problem in winnning the MVP is demonstrated clearly on this thread.

There are many people in the Cardinal camp (Front Office and Fans, not the Coaches) that don't really want to see him win the NFL MVP.

It complicates the development of their preferred QB.

most of those fans who "don't want Warner" to win the MVP were saying he was the odds on favorite 5 weeks ago. Things change in 5 weeks though when the level of play starts to lower.

or is Peter King, Don Banks, Bill Simmons, etc. etc. all Warner haters also as they've basically said the same thing?

 

[Spielman]

Warner's biggest problem in winnning the MVP is demonstrated clearly on this thread.

There are many people in the Cardinal camp (Front Office and Fans, not the Coaches) that don't really want to see him win the NFL MVP.

It complicates the development of their preferred QB.

Nah. His biggest problem is that he hasn't played that great the last few weeks.

I do think some folks have overstated how bad he's been, for whatever reason. But he hasn't played like an MVP since the last 49er game.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Nah. His biggest problem is that he hasn't played that great the last few weeks.

I do think some folks have overstated how bad he's been, for whatever reason. But he hasn't played like an MVP since the last 49er game.

THANK YOU!

I'm probably one of the "haters" on the board and I don't think Kurt's been bad lately. He's just been okay the last 4 weeks.

 

[moklerman]

But he hasn't played like an MVP since the last 49er game.

The problem is, his mistakes are being magnified by a big dropoff in his receivers performances. Yesterday is a good example. A nice 20 yard screen pass is negated and puts the offense in a long situation. Breaston can't get his feet in on a well thrown deep ball to the end zone. JJ drops a well thrown ball on third down. That's 100 yards and a TD right off of Warner's statline. Warner threw passes that the receivers have made all year and they didn't count.

Add those to his statline and he replicates what he did vs. StL the first time. Warner has made a couple of bad throws against 2 good defenses and 1 bad one. His receivers have been dealing with struggles much more in the last 3 games. 10 drops and 2+ fumbles from the receiving corps. When 80% of the offense comes from the passing game the receivers have show up too.

 

[Totally_Red]

THANK YOU!

I'm probably one of the "haters" on the board and I don't think Kurt's been bad lately. He's just been okay the last 4 weeks.

Exactly! He hasn't been terrible, just not MVP-level. It's really wide-open this year. If Kurt and the Cardinal offense get hot the next three games, he's got a decent shot IMO. The Philly game hurt more than anything. That was just a horrible outing for the whole team. But when you see how the Giants lost Sunday with their offense really managing just seven points until garbage time, you realize just how tough that Philly defense can be, 'specially in the hostile weather of December.

 

[IAWarnerFan]

I really don't want to join this discussion, but I thought I'd just throw this out there. Kurt Warner for President in 2012?

 

[Cheesebeef]

The problem is, his mistakes are being magnified by a big dropoff in his receivers performances. Yesterday is a good example. A nice 20 yard screen pass is negated and puts the offense in a long situation.

this happens to every QB.

Breaston can't get his feet in on a well thrown deep ball to the end zone.

this play is EXACTLY why Warner's not been at the MVP level. That wasn't a well thrown ball. Breaston had 7 yards on that CB and was wide open. A well thrown ball doesn't lead a WR who's wide open by a good 7 yards towards the edge of the sideline where he's have to make a GREAT play to catch the ball, maintain control and barely be able to drag his feet in bounds. That play was on Warner AND Breaston. Saying Breaston was at fault for not making a GREAT play on what should have been a walk in the endzone TD is exactly what we're talking about as far as Kurt not playing the way he did earlier in the year.

Warner also completely overthrew Pope who was wide open for what would have been a 50 yard TD. Another example where MVP Kurt earlier in the year hits that play but was not close.

JJ drops a well thrown ball on third down.

that was a bad drop. they happen in football games, just like Larry who makes great leaping catches and Boldin who turns 4 yard gains into 20.

Add those to his statline and he replicates what he did vs. StL the first time.

well, would the statline be the same if we take away a Warner's TD and 60 yards since we got both of those on a complete fluke of a play where Warner threw what should have been an INT but it bounced our way for a TD? or do only the plays that hurt Warner's stats count as those that can play the "only if" game with?

Or how about we take away all the bombs that Larry just simply goes up and wrestles away from people? Or the RACs for Boldin?

It's all part of the game. Drops, overthrows, fumbles, fumbles that should be turnovers and aren't, TDs, picks, picks that should be picks and aren't. But, hey keep spinning away. Warner can do no wrong and if he does, it's always someone else's fault more.

 

[CardLogic]

this happens to every QB.



this play is EXACTLY why Warner's not been at the MVP level. That wasn't a well thrown ball. Breaston had 7 yards on that CB and was wide open. A well thrown ball doesn't lead a WR who's wide open by a good 7 yards towards the edge of the sideline where he's have to make a GREAT play to catch the ball, maintain control and barely be able to drag his feet in bounds. That play was on Warner AND Breaston. Saying Breaston was at fault for not making a GREAT play on what should have been a walk in the endzone TD is exactly what we're talking about as far as Kurt not playing the way he did earlier in the year.

Warner also completely overthrew Pope who was wide open for what would have been a 50 yard TD. Another example where MVP Kurt earlier in the year hits that play but was not close.



that was a bad drop. they happen in football games, just like Larry who makes great leaping catches and Boldin who turns 4 yard gains into 20.



well, would the statline be the same if we take away a Warner's TD and 60 yards since we got both of those on a complete fluke of a play where Warner threw what should have been an INT but it bounced our way for a TD? or do only the plays that hurt Warner's stats count as those that can play the "only if" game with?

Or how about we take away all the bombs that Larry just simply goes up and wrestles away from people? Or the RACs for Boldin?

It's all part of the game. Drops, overthrows, fumbles, fumbles that should be turnovers and aren't, TDs, picks, picks that should be picks and aren't. But, hey keep spinning away. Warner can do no wrong and if he does, it's always someone else's fault more.

You're really enjoying this, aren't you, cheese?

Just so there is no confusion... I agree! Yet at the same time, I think it will be great if Warner DOES win the MVP!

 

[Spielman]

THANK YOU!

I'm probably one of the "haters" on the board and I don't think Kurt's been bad lately. He's just been okay the last 4 weeks.

People are generally good at putting people into black and white good vs. evil categories. You get one guy saying Warner's playing "like a ****** on acid" and then everybody who says he's not playing like a god gets tossed into the same category as that guy. Or the other way around.

I just want them to beat the Vikings, dammit.

 

[Totally_Red]

You're really enjoying this, aren't you, cheese?

Just so there is no confusion... I agree! Yet at the same time, I think it will be great if Warner DOES win the MVP of the Super Bowl!

ftfy

 

[Cheesebeef]

You're really enjoying this, aren't you, cheese?

Just so there is no confusion... I agree! Yet at the same time, I think it will be great if Warner DOES win the MVP!

me too! that means we'll probably have run the table and he will have put up sick stats! I'm all for that! 11-5 with a head of steam (or at least 10-6 with us resting most of the starters in the last game) going into the playoffs? that would be awesome.

 

[Cheesebeef]

People are generally good at putting people into black and white good vs. evil categories. You get one guy saying Warner's playing "like a ****** on acid" and then everybody who says he's not playing like a god gets tossed into the same category as that guy. Or the other way around.

yeah, i guess that's just the nature of message boards. Getting into shades of grey just leads people to say "I'm not sure what the answer is" and most people just can't do that. And that's not just on message boards, that's life in general. Hell, just look at our political system in this country as proof of that!

I just want them to beat the Vikings, dammit.

agreed.

 

[IAWarnerFan]

me too! that means we'll probably have run the table and he will have put up sick stats! I'm all for that! 11-5 with a head of steam (or at least 10-6 with us resting most of the starters in the last game) going into the playoffs? that would be awesome.

Agreed, that sure would be great! It would mean other players have stepped up and played at their best as well tho.