Duh'mare

[Chris_Sanders]

Amare is "great"... Offensively... However, true great players don't get called for a charge at the point in the game and the place on the floor Amare did... True great players don't grab 3 boards in a HUGE playoof game... True great players don't allow their team to take a 24 second penalty with only 30-something seconds left in the game...

Well here I will defend Amare:

I believe the charge was a great play by the guy our owner deemed expendable. It is up to you where you put the blame or credit. I can see both players getting credit/blame but really the onus ultimately lies at Sarver's feet.

I can't defend 3 defensive rebounds. He did have 4 offensive rebounds to his credit. Again he seems more focused on the offensive side of the ball.

The 24 second violation is Nash's fault.

 

[Cheesebeef]

The 24 second violation is Nash's fault.

agreed. can't lay that one at Amare's feet.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

there was a hand right in Nash's face when he hit that shot. Amare never even made an attempt to move when Finley hit his with Barbs deep trailing. Everyone at my house and the announcers pointed out Amare's defense or lack thereof on that play.

If it was Amare then we are probably asking more than he could give. While he is an explosive jumper, his lateral quickness makes him a bad defender off of screens.

That's part of why he gets so many blocks. He can't finish the switch so the guard gets by him and he is forced to block the shot from behind.

 

[Bayless2Budinger]

Out of 44 potential defensive rebounds (all defensive plus Spurs offensive) Amare grabbed 3. Coincidently he played 45 minutes so he averaged 1 defensive rebound per 15 minutes. The only other player on either team who was worse was Bruce Bowen.

That is 6% of potential defensive rebounds grabbed. I watched the same game you did and I saw a consistent lack of effort on Amare's part in denying post position and in pursuing loose balls.

Even by your own account, you score Amare with a 50% or 60%. That's a fail everywhere else but apparently in the playoffs.

Your whole post is invalid especially the 6% you came up with considering he wasnt on the court for every potential rebound. You also have to factor in team rebounds when the ball goes out of bounds. 5 or 6 is average too me.7 or 8 is good 9 or 10 is great.

I dont know why you are bringing up stats anyways considering I already told you numbers arent everything. There are too many variables to factor in.

 

[Cheesebeef]

If it was Amare then we are probably asking more than he could give. While he is an explosive jumper, his lateral quickness makes his a bad defender off of screens.

That's part of why he gets so many blocks. He can't finish the switch so the guard gets by him and he is forced to block the shot from behind.

but he didn't even move. He was just hanging back doing nothing, guarding no one. I blame DA for not being a coach who stresses defense and Amare for just being a space cadet. He looked like he was growing roots on that play.

 

[82CardsGrad]

Well here I will defend Amare:

I believe the charge was a great play by the guy our owner deemed expendable. It is up to you where you put the blame or credit. I can see both players getting credit/blame but really the onus ultimately lies at Sarver's feet.

I can't defend 3 defensive rebounds. He did have 4 offensive rebounds to his credit. Again he seems more focused on the offensive side of the ball.

The 24 second violation is Nash's fault.

Chris, if you get the chance, watch that play again.... While Thomas is a master at drawing charges, he literally didn't move one inch on this play... Amare caught the ball and immediately drive directly into Thomas... My grandmother could've drew that charge... Amare should have recognized where Thomas was, made the read, pulled up for a WIDE OPEN 15 foot jumper, and ICED the game!!! That's what a truly great player would've done...

 

[82CardsGrad]

agreed. can't lay that one at Amare's feet.

Amare was on the court... He should have made sure his team knew where they were with regard to the time... Nash is to blame as well of course... However, Amare shares in the blame...

 

[Bayless2Budinger]

Does anyone have a link to the play by play of the game?

 

[WildBB]

Chris, if you get the chance, watch that play again.... While Thomas is a master at drawing charges, he literally didn't move one inch on this play... Amare caught the ball and immediately drive directly into Thomas... My grandmother could've drew that charge... Amare should have recognized where Thomas was, made the read, pulled up for a WIDE OPEN 15 foot jumper, and ICED the game!!! That's what a truly great player would've done...

His Bball IQ slipped a dozen notches that game. SA is ready to take charges on him that's for certain.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Amare was on the court... He should have made sure his team knew where they were with regard to the time... Nash is to blame as well of course... However, Amare shares in the blame...

Nash dribbled the ball for 21 second of clock. Lion's share of the blame goes on the guy that makes it impossible for anyone to even try and get a shot off.

 

[Bayless2Budinger]

Amare was on the court... He should have made sure his team knew where they were with regard to the time... Nash is to blame as well of course... However, Amare shares in the blame...

Is this some sort of a joke?

 

[Cheesebeef]

Is this some sort of a joke?

even I gotta lay off Amare on that one.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Your whole post is invalid especially the 6% you came up with considering he wasnt on the court for every potential rebound. 5 or 6 is average too me.7 or 8 is good 9 or 10 is great.

I dont know why you are bringing up stats anyways considering I already told you numbers arent everything. There are too many variables to factor in.

Well that is easy to fix. There were 58 total minutes. Amare played 45 of them. So he played 78% of the game. That means Amare was on the floor for approximately 34 potential rebounds.

That gives him 8.8% of the potential rebounds. You got me there.

Again I will reiterate that he averaged 1 defensive rebound per 15 minutes played. Only 1 player on either team surpassed that dubious distinction and that was Bruce Bowen, who guarded our PG all night.

 

[82CardsGrad]

Nash dribbled the ball for 21 second of clock. Lion's share of the blame goes on the guy that makes it impossible for anyone to even try and get a shot off.

Sorry... But Amare has to step up and be THE leader... All great big men do this at some point in their career... Amare can't continue to rely on Nash to be THE guy... Yes, Nash held the ball too long, but during that time, what was Amare doing? What was he saying?? Was he trying to set picks or get open? Was he SCREAMING to Nash to dish the ball somewhere as time was running down??

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Chris, if you get the chance, watch that play again.... While Thomas is a master at drawing charges, he literally didn't move one inch on this play... Amare caught the ball and immediately drive directly into Thomas... My grandmother could've drew that charge... Amare should have recognized where Thomas was, made the read, pulled up for a WIDE OPEN 15 foot jumper, and ICED the game!!! That's what a truly great player would've done...

I watched the replay more than I wanted to cruising the beach bars tonight. Thomas moved into place about 2 steps before Amare got there.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Sorry... But Amare has to step up and be THE leader... All great big men do this at some point in their career... Amare can't continue to rely on Nash to be THE guy... Yes, Nash held the ball too long, but during that time, what was Amare doing? What was he saying?? Was he trying to set picks or get open? Was he SCREAMING to Nash to dish the ball somewhere as time was running down??

it doesn't matter if Nash is running around like a chicken with his head cut off. come on man, you gotta cut the guy a little slack. that was Nash's and DA bad 100%.

 

[Bayless2Budinger]

Well that is easy to fix. There were 58 total minutes. Amare played 45 of them. So he played 78% of the game. That means Amare was on the floor for approximately 34 potential rebounds.

That gives him 8.8% of the potential rebounds. You got me there.

Again I will reiterate that he averaged 1 defensive rebound per 15 minutes played. Only 1 player on either team surpassed that dubious distinction and that was Bruce Bowen, who guarded our PG all night.

Let me guess. Math wasnt your major.

Just find me the play by play and I will give you the real numbers instead of assuming how many rebounding opportunities he had. Lets also not fault him for other Suns getting rebounds. I will look most at how many offensive rebounds the Spurs got with/without him in the game.

 

[82CardsGrad]

I watched the replay more than I wanted to cruising the beach bars tonight. Thomas moved into place about 2 steps before Amare got there.

I can GUARANTEE you that any other good to great big man would not have gotten called for that foul... Amare made the wrong decision at yet another crucial time of the game... He has the pull up-J. He was WIDE OPEN. The game was all his to ice... And he blew it... again...

 

[Bayless2Budinger]

Sorry... But Amare has to step up and be THE leader... All great big men do this at some point in their career... Amare can't continue to rely on Nash to be THE guy... Yes, Nash held the ball too long, but during that time, what was Amare doing? What was he saying?? Was he trying to set picks or get open? Was he SCREAMING to Nash to dish the ball somewhere as time was running down??

I'm pretty sure Amare set a couple picks for Nash during that play.

*But they werent good picks, if Amare was the real leader he would have just grabbed the ball from Nash and created for himself. When will Amare finally step up to the plate*

 

[82CardsGrad]

it doesn't matter if Nash is running around like a chicken with his head cut off. come on man, you gotta cut the guy a little slack. that was Nash's and DA bad 100%.

Nash royally f'ed up! No doubt about it... But c'mon... Is Amare a leader on this team or not? If Manu was doing that, do you not think that Duncan would not have found some way to either get open, spring Manu free, call time out, or otherwise prevent a 24 second violation??
Amare HAS to step up! He's got to become the singular leader on this team. He had his chances today to do just that, and man did he fail...

 

[Cheesebeef]

I can GUARANTEE you that any other good to great big man would not have gotten called for that foul... Amare made the wrong decision at yet another crucial time of the game... He has the pull up-J. He was WIDE OPEN. The game was all his to ice... And he blew it... again...

to be fair, Duncan was stupid and got called for what should have been a HUGE charge on a fast break with Nash just waiting for him near the end of the game.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Nash royally f'ed up! No doubt about it... But c'mon... Is Amare a leader on this team or not? If Manu was doing that, do you not think that Duncan would not have found some way to either get open, spring Manu free, call time out, or otherwise prevent a 24 second violation??
Amare HAS to step up! He's got to become the singular leader on this team. He had his chances today to do just that, and man did he fail...

I agree he had chances, but that wasn't one of them IMO.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

I can GUARANTEE you that any other good to great big man would not have gotten called for that foul... Amare made the wrong decision at yet another crucial time of the game... He has the pull up-J. He was WIDE OPEN. The game was all his to ice... And he blew it... again...

You can't guarantee that Nor can I guarantee you are wrong. We can only debate the likely and unlikely.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

People wondered why Amare wasn't a team captain until this year. Maybe now we are seeing why. He still has a lot of room to grow, which is amazing considering where he is on the offensive end.

 

[Cheesebeef]

i want to go to bed. come on ambien!