Free Agent Centers

[George O'Brien]

The free agent market for centers is not all that impressive this summer. The better guys will get more money than they are worth, but that seems to be par for the course.

The best big men are Sheed Wallace and K-Mart but they will be expensive and wouldn't really fit. The rest are either flawed or going to be too expensive for what they will offer.

Okur is likely to remain in Detroit and is more of an offensive player than defender.

Dampier - Having a great year, but has a history of being injury prone and not known as a hard worker.

Kurt Thomas - Player option at $5.9 million. Mostly an out of position PF at 6'9" 235 but can play center. Very productive: scores 11.3 ppg and rebounds 9 rpg. Should be pretty expensive.

Camby - Having a great year but really, really injury prone. Probably too light to defend against bigger centers. Best bet is that he stays in Denver unless they go for another center.

Ostertag - Having pretty good year. Way too slow to be a good fit with the Suns. Best guess is that he stays in Utah unless they make a run at someline Dampier.

Foyle - May be a low cost replacement for White, but has never played high minutes and has not played hardly at all this season. High injury risk.

Mihm - Backup player so far during his career. 18.6 minutes per game on the Celtics. Foul prone.

Swift - Too small to be a major factor (6'9 230). Has only averaged 19.8 minutes per game this season in spite of good numbers. He is scheduled to be a RFA with a qualifying offer of $5.9 million.

Gadzuric - Defensive oriented backup center type. May be useful if White goes, but only a stop gap.

Dale Davis - Defensive oriented center. 6'11" and 252, but is 35 and his stats have been going down. Decent stop gap but only if he is really cheap.

Divac - Long time second tier player who at 36 is getting old. Has discussed retirement, although the Serbian connection might bring him in for one year if he did not have to play too many minutes.

Keon Clark - Injured the entire season. Once was a decent backup type center, but numbers declined in Sacramento before going to Utah.

I'm using HoopsHype for my list of players, so some of these guys may have already signed extensions that have not been announced officially. I may be missing a few total projects and am ignoring hopeless cases like Fizer.


__________________

 

[SunsTzu]

Divac - Long time second tier player who at 36 is getting old. Has discussed retirement, although the Serbian connection might bring him in for one year if he did not have to play too many minutes.

I'd like to get Divac, and hope that Zarko and Vujanic would be enough to lure him here. He is an intelligent player who'd fit with D'Antoni's offense and be able to help out some of the guys transitioning from europe to NBA. Also he'd be on a short contract and will allow us to develop Lampe, and maybe a pick if we go for a center prospect.

 

[Errntknght]

I like Divac for a year or two - as I said a couple of times before he'd be a great coach for Lampe. And maybe some of his wilyness would rub off on the whole team - whose basketball IQ often seems to rival that of a basketball.

 

[Joe Mama]

IMO some of you are putting way too much stock in that "Serbian connection". I think there's virtually no chance of Divac playing in Phoenix next year. If he's going to play anywhere is going to be for a chance at a championship.

Joe Mama

 

[Dr. Dumas]

Joe, what makes you think that the Suns will not have a chance of contending in 2 years?

What if-
Euro pg comes over in the summer and is as good as everyone is saying. (Euro pg & Barbosa as backup).

JJ & CJ continue to get better in the off season.

Suns spend some of there money on a descent player (Kobe).

Vlade signs a 2 year deal (Jake, White, Vlade).

I'm not saying that this team will be enough to win a championship, but there is certainly a chance. Along with a chance, Vlade gets to continue his backup center role as well as mentor the euro pg.

 

[slinslin]

The only guy who is really interessting to me is Camby.

Divac maybe but he is old, I don't want him if he can't play 20-30 minutes every night in a high paced game.
Ewing, Olajuwon, Mutombo...Divac could be the next flop.

 

[Joe Mama]

Originally posted by Dr. Dumas
Joe, what makes you think that the Suns will not have a chance of contending in 2 years?

What if-
Euro pg comes over in the summer and is as good as everyone is saying. (Euro pg & Barbosa as backup).

JJ & CJ continue to get better in the off season.

Suns spend some of there money on a descent player (Kobe).

Vlade signs a 2 year deal (Jake, White, Vlade).

I'm not saying that this team will be enough to win a championship, but there is certainly a chance. Along with a chance, Vlade gets to continue his backup center role as well as mentor the euro pg.

If you are suggesting that Divac would sign in 2005 after a very strong Phoenix Suns run next year I would say it's at least a possibility. However nobody is likely to expect the Phoenix Suns to even make the playoffs next season, so Divac will not sign here. In other words I don't think he is going to sign with any team that doesn't look like a serious championship contender.

So slin, how much would you be willing to throw at Marcus Camby assuming he stays healthy the rest of this season? Keep in mind that many of us are probably going to judge your sanity by your response.

Joe Mama

 

[scotsman13]

Originally posted by Dr. Dumas
Suns spend some of there money on a descent player (Kobe).

if the suns sign kobe then they have wasted a bunch of money on a player that wont bring anything more then jj does. he isnt a winner (when shaq has been out the lakers have always fallen). he wants to control the ball at all times and plays the same position as jj (shooting guard). the more that i watch the suns this year the more i believe that what this team needs is time.

marion
amare
jj
barbosa
milos
jake
white
eisley
zarko
lampe
casey

that is 11 players who will eat up the big part of the time at all positions. and while i would love to free up some more money by moving eisley to the bobcats that would only bring the team down to 10 player with 2 draft picks bring us back to 12 under contract. then you bring in a good role player like harvey and you have 13 players under contact. about the only spot that we could use a good player at is center. if and i do mean if we can get something out of lampe or we draft a big man in the draft (center not some power forward) then every spot on the court is filled with good player who should be given time to develop and play together and start the season off with coach d's system.

 

[PhxGametime]

I prefer Stromile Swift over Camby - he might be undersized but can back-up 4 position as well and I just watched Lampe's performance against Indiana and was impressed.

 

[slinslin]

I like Swift also, he'd be a perfect backup for Amare and at the 5 as well. Before we had Amare I said several times that he is the guy we should look at.
He is as athletic as Amare, strong, can really run the floor, finish, block shots he would fit in very well just like Camby.

If we can't get Kobe but have cleared the necessary cap space 13-14M$ or sign and trade for Kobe like Marion and White, I would offer Camby a contract starting at 6M$, Swift at 5M$ slightly above the MLE.

Vujanic with what is left or needed. Though we should be just enough over the cap to get the MLE next season.


Camby/Voshkul/Lampe
Amare/Swift
Marion/Zarko
Johnson/Jacobsen/Vujanic
Telfair(draft)/Barbosa

Plus another 1-2 draft picks that might be used to trade Eisley or other trade.


So a nice scenario would be to trade Marion, White, New York's pick to the Lakers for resigned Kobe.
Then sign Camby, Swift.
Or Eisley instead of White.

Camby/Voshkul/Lampe
Amare/Swift
Johnson/Zarko
Kobe/Jacobsen/Vujanic
Telfair/Barbosa

Money tied up but no bad contracts, youth, talent, athleticism, star power, shooters, shot-blockers and some euro elements.

 

[elindholm]

Foyle - May be a low cost replacement for White, but has never played high minutes and has not played hardly at all this season. High injury risk.

I still think Foyle is an appealing option if he could be had for roughly MLE money. He hasn't been healthy this year, but overall I don't think it's accurate to call him a "high injury risk." In the previous five seasons he missed about eight games per year on average, and 90% "attendance" is really quite good for a center. He had been getting about 22 minutes per game for the Warriors and, at least last season, was often the preferred choice to Dampier in crunch time. And hey, if you want a shot-blocker, look no further -- from 2000 to 2003, he was among the league leaders in spite of his limited minutes.

One clear advantage of Foyle over Swift, in my opinion, is that Foyle's head seems to be screwed on a good several turns tighter. He is motivated, intelligent, and has some perspective on the world.

Assuming he looks healthy for the rest of this season, Foyle is my top choice on that list, particularly considering how much everyone is likely to cost.

 

[slinslin]

Foyle would hardly be an improvement over White in my opinion.

He has no offense really and is short so I would much rather have Swift because he fits in the game plan and is younger and healthier.

Foyle will cost almost as much as Swift because many teams with the MLE will offer their full MLE to free agent centers. But most of them can be had for a little over the MLE because few teams have enough capspace to match your offer.

Swift also has the huge advantage over Foyle that he can play 4 and 5. So it isn't tough getting him into the game while Foyle really can't play 4.

Swift 20mpg 10ppg 5.5rpg 1.8bpg 49%FG
24 years old

Based on last season since he has been injured this season
Foyle 22mpg 5.5ppg 6rpg 2.5bpg 54%FG of course only on high percentage shots since he is averaging so little points.
Will turn 29 in march already.

 

[George O'Brien]

Swift

I am puzzled at what is happening in Memphis. Swift is getting only 19.8 minutes per game while Outlaw is getting 17.5 minutes, Wright is getting 26 minutes, Battier is getting 23.8 minutes, and Posey is getting 28.4 minutes. Even Big Jake is getting 10.3 minutes. Considering that Swift will be a RFA with a qualifying offer of $5.99 million, it looks like they may be phasing him out.

I would not be shocked if Memphis traded him before the deadline.

 

[Chaplin]

Originally posted by scotsman13
if the suns sign kobe then they have wasted a bunch of money on a player that wont bring anything more then jj does. he isnt a winner (when shaq has been out the lakers have always fallen). he wants to control the ball at all times and plays the same position as jj (shooting guard). the more that i watch the suns this year the more i believe that what this team needs is time.

That's a laugh.

 

[slinslin]

Re: Swift

Originally posted by George O'Brien
I am puzzled at what is happening in Memphis. Swift is getting only 19.8 minutes per game while Outlaw is getting 17.5 minutes, Wright is getting 26 minutes, Battier is getting 23.8 minutes, and Posey is getting 28.4 minutes. Even Big Jake is getting 10.3 minutes. Considering that Swift will be a RFA with a qualifying offer of $5.99 million, it looks like they may be phasing him out.

I would not be shocked if Memphis traded him before the deadline.

Posey and Battier play a totally different position. Outlaw also plays some 3.

Swift minutes are also down because he missed some games and the Grizzlies are a pretty deep team.

His production is excellent however.

 

[slinslin]

Going for Kobe is a risk because it is a long shot to sign him and you would have to go big in the draft basically because if you do sign Kobe you won't have money left.

Sign and trade for Kobe is unlikely but would be perfect.

Going for big men like Camby and Swift is pretty safe because they would be easier to get and if you get only one of them you still have money to fill another need.

And this team right now looks like they could be very good with a good big man and depth and draft.

 

[Chaplin]

Originally posted by slinslin
Going for Kobe is a risk because it is a long shot to sign him and you would have to go big in the draft basically because if you do sign Kobe you won't have money left.

Sign and trade for Kobe is unlikely but would be perfect.

Going for big men like Camby and Swift is pretty safe because they would be easier to get and if you get only one of them you still have money to fill another need.

And this team right now looks like they could be very good with a good big man and depth and draft.

"Going" for Camby is anything but safe.

 

[slinslin]

It is save because you have a very good shot at signing him. When you plan on Kobe but only have a 30% shot at him you are screwed.

Signing big men is generally a good thing to do because they are better trade bait as most teams look for size.

 

[Chaplin]

Originally posted by slinslin
It is save because you have a very good shot at signing him. When you plan on Kobe but only have a 30% shot at him you are screwed.

Signing big men is generally a good thing to do because they are better trade bait as most teams look for size.

Not if they're on the injured list. And no matter how well he's playing now, the odds of Camby landing on the IL are still very high.

No thanks.

 

[George O'Brien]

Re: Re: Swift

Originally posted by slinslin
Posey and Battier play a totally different position. Outlaw also plays some 3.

Swift minutes are also down because he missed some games and the Grizzlies are a pretty deep team.

His production is excellent however.

Since the stats are "per game", missing games does not pull down stats.

Clearly the fact that Gasol gets the main minutes at PF hurts Swift, but I'm still surprised that other backups are getting more minutes. I have to wonder if he has been having problems on defense because his stats suggest he should be playing more.

 

[SirStefan32]

I would't touch Camby with a ten foot pole. We can have a guy on the injured list for less money.

Divac will not sign with Poenix. Sure Zarko and especially Milos are his buddies, but he is probably retiring, and if he decides to play another season or two, it's going to be in Sacramento.

Foyle may be the best option available, though he really seems to be a slightly improved Jahidi White.

Stefan

 

[slinslin]

You guys are hilarious if you would rather have Foyle than Camby even if Camby stays healthy for the rest of the season.
Foyle has yet to play some real minutes this season.

Camby is so much better than Foyle on defense and especially on offense. Foyle is a dud on offense.

Camby is the MVP of the Nuggets in my opinion. He makes a huge difference defensively with his athleticism and size.

 

[Chaplin]

Originally posted by SirStefan32

Foyle may be the best option available, though he really seems to be a slightly improved Jahidi White.

Stefan

Foyle would be an interesting option, but I can't imagine him asking for anything less than ridiculous money, money we hopefully would not pay.

I'd rather stand pat, use the draft, and not spend if that was the alternative to getting Kobe Bryant.

 

[sunsfn]

The suns need a center first, then a p. f. .............Foyle is a center, he is also taller than White and is apx. 6' 10". What he does better than white is block shots. He is a monster in the middle like White is and they are probably about even when it comes to offense, except Foyle does have better hands.

Swift would be fine to get because he can "back up" center and play p. f.. I do not think he is a starting center at all, a good back-up there but not a starter there. He is very athletic and can play a fast game.
The problem with him is that he is a restricted free agent, He will also more than likely be traded before the deadline and whoever trades for him will probably be ready to re-sign him next year.

I also like Gadzurik and think he will be a very good player in this league soon.

I read on one of the sports sites, that Vlade says if he plays another year it may be in Europe so his children can live there for a year to see the country and where he grew up. He said it may be the only way they could understand his country and he wants to give them that opportunity.

 

[Chaplin]

The problem is that Swift might be the only guy that will command a semi-reasonable contract, but even that will probably be too generous. If we're going to get a center, then get a center--don't get a PF who can stand-in for center.

The problem is that there aren't any centers left, and the ones that would be effective for us are either too injury-prone or unavailable.