Here's a potential WR2: Lee Evans

Cheesebeef

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Having Heap and decent WRs with Fitz negates a serious need for a true #2 threat.

i think it's premature to say we have decent WRs at this point besides Fitz.

For the longest time Brady had no WRs in NE other than Troy Brown and one TE and they did fine.

Tom Brady is the best QB in the league with one of the best O-lines in all of football. I don't think you can say the same for what the Cardinals have, thus I don't think the comparison is applicable.

The cards surprised everyone and made serious noise in FA to improve the team.

I think we made a serious move in getting Kolb, but that was about the only "serious" noise I saw us make. Colledge was a decent signing but everyone else has HUGE question marks on them. Whether they improved the team remains to be seen IMO.

They will be fine without a #2 WR.
we'll see soon enough.
 

Cheesebeef

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Take your own advise, and TALK FOOTBALL. Instead of complaining that we don't spend available cap space, let's talk about how the team performed last night.

not getting Evans (or any other somewhat legit 2) because we don't want to spend money IS TALKING FOOTBALL. That's what this thread is about and our current salary cap standing is completely pertinent to a discussion about the problems we have at certain positions.
 

crisper57

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We will find an ok speedster WR in cut-downs on the cheap. Hopefully the Fitz contract is done by then so Graves won't have that crutch to lean on anymore.
 

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not getting Evans (or any other somewhat legit 2) because we don't want to spend money IS TALKING FOOTBALL. That's what this thread is about and our current salary cap standing is completely pertinent to a discussion about the problems we have at certain positions.
I am thinking not getting Evans was about not givining up a 4th rounder. I have no problem with that.
 

Cheesebeef

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and if you want to talk football, here you go. Our starting WRs outside of Fitz last night showed next to nothing. There were a couple times that Kolb had a little time and couldn't find any one open... and that was against Oakland's second team D.

I did like that he and Larry had some chemistry and that he found Heap a couple times.

and Steve Williams looked like Steve Williams of last pre-season... which was good... but if history's repeating itself there, then I don't have big hopes for him in the regular season.
 

Cheesebeef

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do you take it as an insult? You can comment on his posts, but he can't comment on yours?

no where did I say he can't comment on my posts. I'm just asking he doesn't insult me while he does. I've done nothing like that to him except ask that he talk football and keep the insults out of it. it's perfectly reasonable to disagree with people's posts without calling them a moron and nauseating mulli.
 

Mitch

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I am thinking not getting Evans was about not givining up a 4th rounder. I have no problem with that.

And having to pay him $4.775M this year and next....coming off a sub par year.
 

Mulli

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no where did I say he can't comment on my posts. I'm just asking he doesn't insult me while he does. I've done nothing like that to him except ask that he talk football and keep the insults out of it. it's perfectly reasonable to disagree with people's posts without calling them a moron and nauseating mulli.
Then I feel bad so many people are being mean to you.
 

Mulli

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And having to pay him $4.775M this year and next....coming off a sub par year.
Right. I would wager that the Cards have a receiver on the roster now besides Fitz that catches more than Evans does this year.
 

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Get over it! The bitching & moaning about the FO & cap space gets nauseating. We signed 51 players in 5 days & we still have complainers. I've been around long enough to know that Michael Bidwill will not operate like his Dad. With the strike looming, last year was an anomaly. Btw, I agree with Joe!

We signed like 9 players not counting our own guys and a bunch of future bus drivers and insurance salesmen. The legitimate players that we signed in free agency were:

Kolb
Deuce
Colledge
King
Bradley
Marshall
and half credit for Heap, who I think is done and will quickly illustrate so

All the other guys are bottom-of-the-roster players who aren't any better or worse than many of the guys still available in free agency. Six and a half quality free agents? That's pretty much the Cards' usual FA haul.

I'm not going to fret about cap space because I EXPECT that extensions are forthcoming not only for Fitz (ideally by the start of the season), but also for Campbell (ideally by November), Keith, and Lutui. If those don't get done then there's going to be a problem.

On Evans--I'm not sure that he excites me any more than Edwards did. They run the same routes, which last night hopefully illustrated is what Fitz is going to be running much of the time. There are plenty of pure speed guys who just aren't very good receivers. Now, the Ravens had much more value on Evans because he's a perfect complement to Boldin. We're still looking for that Boldin-type player to complement Fitz.
 

Cheesebeef

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Then I feel bad so many people are being mean to you.

jesus Mulli... it's just annoying having a lot of people constantly insulting you when you're just trying to give an opinion and talk football.
 

Mulli

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jesus Mulli... it's just annoying having a lot of people constantly insulting you when you're just trying to give an opinion and talk football.
I feel bad for you that they are insulting you all day every day.
 

AsUpRoDiGy

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and half credit for Heap, who I think is done and will quickly illustrate so
Heap is still considered a top 10 TE in the league, IMO. He will be a pivotal part of the offense, and he will be Kolb's safety blanket. If he stays healthy, I can see him being extremely productive. Time will tell...
 

Cheesebeef

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Heap is still considered a top 10 TE in the league, IMO. He will be a pivotal part of the offense, and he will be Kolb's safety blanket. If he stays healthy, I can see him being extremely productive. Time will tell...

not sure I agree with Heap being top 10 anymore. The top ten guys are REAL difference makers on offense. Heap hasn't had a season where he's even had 600 yards since 2007.

Whitten, Vernon Davis, Gates, Cooley, Watson, Winslow, Pettigrew, Marcedes Lewis, Gonzo, Clark, Aaron Hernandez and Gronkoswki are all better (and younger save Gonzo) and guys who are impact players at the positon. At this point, Heap's definitely an upgrade over what we have and an okay- solid TE but he's nowhere close to being able to be a difference maker anymore IMO. Depending on him to be a pivotal part of the offense is problematic. He'd be a really good whip cream and cherry on top of the sundae, but asking him to be a scoop of ice-cream is expecting too much from him at this point in his career.
 
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AsUpRoDiGy

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not sure I agree with Heap being top 10 anymore. The top ten guys are REAL difference makers on offense. Heap hasn't had a season where he's even had 600 yards since 2007.

Whitten, Vernon Davis, Gates, Cooley, Watson, Winslow, Pettigrew, Marcedes Lewis, Gonzo, Clark, Aaron Hernandez and Gronkoswki are all better (and younger save Gonzo) and guys who are impact players at the positon. At this point, Heap's definitely an upgrade over what we have and an okay- solid TE but he's nowhere close to being able to be a difference maker anymore IMO. Depending on him to be a pivotal part of the offense is problematic. He'd be a really good whip cream and cherry on top of the sundae, but asking him to be a scoop of ice-cream is expecting too much from him at this point in his career.
Those are all very good TE's for sure. The reason why i say pivotal is because Kolb targeted his TE Celek in philly more than his WR's, so he seems to be comfortable with that. Also, Whiz is a TE himself and has always tried to incorporate a receiving TE but hasnt really had one until now, so I kinda expect him to make specific plays for Heap. Depending on his health, I can see Heap getting over 600-700 yards and at least 5 TD's. Pure speculation at this point :)
 

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Heap is still considered a top 10 TE in the league, IMO. He will be a pivotal part of the offense, and he will be Kolb's safety blanket. If he stays healthy, I can see him being extremely productive. Time will tell...

Considered by who? You? Do you think that the Ravens released a Top 10 TE in the NFL without even offering to renegotiate his contract because they're stupid? Todd Heap isn't even the best former Sun Devil tight end playing in the NFL.

1. Vernon Davis
2. Antonio Gates
3. Jermichael Finley
4. Jason Witten
5. Marcedes Lewis
6. Dustin Keller
7. Zach Miller
8. Tony Gonazales
9. Heath Miller
10. Owen Daniels
11. Dallas Clark
12. Jacob Tamme (that's right--Heap probably wouldn't start for the Colts even in 2 TE sets)
13. Brent Celek
14. Greg Olsen
15. Jeremy Shockey (no, he wouldn't start for the Panthers, either)


And that's before going into guys who aren't proven but have way more upside than Heap like Hernandez, Gronkowski, Moeaki, Pettigrew,, Graham and Gresham.

The Baltimore Ravens decided that they were going to totally remake their passing offense, and they didn't want Todd Heap along for the ride. Shouldn't that tell you something about his value around the league?
 

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Heap will be an impact player with the Cardinals. Heap had a good year last year with the Ravens in a much tougher division.
 

Cheesebeef

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Heap will be an impact player with the Cardinals. Heap had a good year last year with the Ravens in a much tougher division.

I'd say he had an average year. 600 yards for a TE is right about the median for the TEs in the league. And that was on an offense with a couple decent WRs, a good O-line and a running game which defenses had to account for.
 

AsUpRoDiGy

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Considered by who? You? Do you think that the Ravens released a Top 10 TE in the NFL without even offering to renegotiate his contract because they're stupid? Todd Heap isn't even the best former Sun Devil tight end playing in the NFL.

1. Vernon Davis
2. Antonio Gates
3. Jermichael Finley
4. Jason Witten
5. Marcedes Lewis
6. Dustin Keller
7. Zach Miller
8. Tony Gonazales
9. Heath Miller
10. Owen Daniels
11. Dallas Clark
12. Jacob Tamme (that's right--Heap probably wouldn't start for the Colts even in 2 TE sets)
13. Brent Celek
14. Greg Olsen
15. Jeremy Shockey (no, he wouldn't start for the Panthers, either)


And that's before going into guys who aren't proven but have way more upside than Heap like Hernandez, Gronkowski, Moeaki, Pettigrew,, Graham and Gresham.

The Baltimore Ravens decided that they were going to totally remake their passing offense, and they didn't want Todd Heap along for the ride. Shouldn't that tell you something about his value around the league?
As the IMO would state lol. I'm an ASU fan, so I'm very keen on Heap and Miller. Heap had multiple offers from several teams, but decided to come back home. Through 2008-2010 Heap is 15th in the league for receiving yards for a TE (http://espn.go.com/blog/nfcwest/post/_/id/42584/49ers-davis-i-have-to-outwork-those-guys) and he wasnt 100% healthy during that time either. Is he in his prime anymore? No. Can he be productive still? yes, the stats dont lie.
 

Cheesebeef

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As the IMO would state lol. I'm an ASU fan, so I'm very keen on Heap and Miller. Heap had multiple offers from several teams, but decided to come back home. Through 2008-2010 Heap is 15th in the league for receiving yards for a TE (http://espn.go.com/blog/nfcwest/post/_/id/42584/49ers-davis-i-have-to-outwork-those-guys) and he wasnt 100% healthy during that time either. Is he in his prime anymore? No. Can he be productive still? yes, the stats dont lie.

if the stats don't lie and you posted that Heap was in the top 15 for TE, do you still figure he's a top 10 TE? He may be productive, but I don't know how much of an impact he'll make... especially for a team that i believe needs another impact maker on offense.
 
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