Heroes and Goats (Abbreviated)

[Chopper0080]

Mekhi Becton - rookie
Austin Jackson - rookie
Jonah Williams - effectively a rookie
Jedrick Wills - rookie
Cam Robinson - Yes
Garrett Bolles - At best same level, but Bolles has allowed no sacks and only 2 penalties this year. So probably not.
Kolton Miller - Miller is massively improved. 0 sacks allowed and only 2 pens so far.
Sam Tevi - Yes
Andrew Thomas - rookie
Andre Dillard - Effectively a rookie, barely played
Geron Christian Sr. - First starts
Riley Reiff - Same level at best - 0 penalties, 0 sacks this year
Donovan Smith - Same level

So lets discount the rookies, most of which are starting and are waaaaay better than Hump was at he same stage. Even Geron Christian is better than Hump in his 2nd year so far. So these aren't like for like comparisons.

Of those guys you listed I think it's fair to say at the very least most fans based on age and what they have shown so far would take Becton, Williams, Wills and Dillard (excluding injury problems) in a swap for Hump. Guys already well above where Hump was at the same stage and not far off him now.

What you have left from Hump's peers are. Cam Robinson, Sam Tevi and Donovan Smith that are definitely no better than Hump. Reiff and Bolles are debatable but lets be generous and say the same level.

So easily a bottom 3rd vet tackle at least. Might just push him out if you want to use absolutes and count rookies in their 5th games.

I love this..the argument has now morphed to not consider rookies or near rookies. Do we offset those by considering players who are near retired and/or injured? If you have to move the goal posts this much to try and make your argument, it probably means the argument is a stretch.

Bolles...gets his 5th year option declined, the Broncos get their starting QB injured and their backup beat up against the Jets, and you are out here saying he is the same as The Captain who got an extension, and kept his QB clean against that same Jets defense. You are really reaching.

 

[BritCard]

I love this..the argument has now morphed to not consider rookies or near rookies. Do we offset those by considering players who are near retired and/or injured? If you have to move the goal posts this much to try and make your argument, it probably means the argument is a stretch.

Bolles...gets his 5th year option declined, the Broncos get their starting QB injured and their backup beat up against the Jets, and you are out here saying he is the same as The Captain who got an extension, and kept his QB clean against that same Jets defense. You are really reaching.

Your using several rookies and first year starters to prop up his position and I'm the one moving the goalposts?

Ok, let's make it easy.

He's a bottom 5 vet left tackle in the league. Vet being anyone with more than 2 years starting in this definition.

Is he better than our previous garbage? Yes
Can you reply on him against the league best rushers? No
Does he often make some mind boggling whiffs? Yup
Is he replaceable? Absolutely.

But were stuck with him now, for at least 3 more years.

 

[TheCardFan]

Here is your wonderful LT vs a rookie. I would take any of the top 4 first round LT's vs Humphries and his salary.

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[DVontel]

lol Hump is damn near one of the least of our problems


The fact he’s still getting talked about heavy like this is hilarious

 

[WisconsinCard]

Here is your wonderful LT vs a rookie. I would take any of the top 4 first round LT's vs Humphries and his salary.

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If you're expecting perfection, you're going to have to go watch women's gymnastics...

 

[BritCard]

If you're expecting perfection, you're going to have to go watch women's gymnastics...

I expect not being put on your face by a 2nd round rookie playing his 40th snap in the league

 

[WisconsinCard]

I expect not being put on your face by a 2nd round rookie playing his 40th snap in the league

It happens to everyone at some point. As the old saying goes, they get paid to play too. I can pick out one play in a season of an all pro LT where he looks like a buffoon. It looks to me he miss stepped and trip over his own feet in that clip anyway. Keep looking you'll find more. Hump is not a problem some are trying to make it.

 

[BritCard]

It happens to everyone at some point. As the old saying goes, they get paid to play too. I can pick out one play in a season of an all pro LT where he looks like a buffoon. It looks to me he miss stepped and trip over his own feet in that clip anyway. Keep looking you'll find more. Hump is not a problem some are trying to make it.

He's not necessarily a problem but this O line can never be great while the most important member of it is a bottom 3rd player. No matter what we do elsewhere. It's that simple.

Our O line has been trash for, well ever. I while ago I checked PFF ranking since they started in 2006. Whatever you think of PFF their O line ranking are usually pretty spot on.

They have us outside the bottom 10 twice in that time if I recall. And in the past 5 years we have been bottom two 5 times.

We have battered wife syndrome. We think because they aren't drinking so much and only whoop us once every 3 days they are a lot better.

Let's see on Monday. Smith has one of the best sack and pressure rates in the league. If we see a bunch of quick passes against the worst deep defense in the league it's because they don't trust the O line.

 

[WisconsinCard]

You think hes bottom third, I do not. He's getting better every year, so time will tell.

 

[AZfaninMN]

He's not necessarily a problem but this O line can never be great while the most important member of it is a bottom 3rd player. No matter what we do elsewhere. It's that simple.

Our O line has been trash for, well ever. I while ago I checked PFF ranking since they started in 2006. Whatever you think of PFF their O line ranking are usually pretty spot on.

They have us outside the bottom 10 twice in that time if I recall. And in the past 5 years we have been bottom two 5 times.

We have battered wife syndrome. We think because they aren't drinking so much and only whoop us once every 3 days they are a lot better.

Let's see on Monday. Smith has one of the best sack and pressure rates in the league. If we see a bunch of quick passes against the worst deep defense in the league it's because they don't trust the O line.

You like PFF, but won’t acknowledge that hump was the highest rated offensive player last week vs the jets. You say he’s a bottom 3rd LT, then name the 24 better than him? If you really want to convince us of your argument then you need more than 1 play of the 337 we’ve ran this year.

 

[BritCard]

You like PFF, but won’t acknowledge that hump was the highest rated offensive player last week vs the jets. You say he’s a bottom 3rd LT, then name the 24 better than him? If you really want to convince us of your argument then you need more than 1 play of the 337 we’ve ran this year.

If Hump could play the garbage jets pass rush each week I'm sure he'd grade out great most of the time.

Everyone except Cam Robinson, Sam Levi and Donavan Smith. Just behind Bolles, Reiff. Excluding rookies or first year starters.

Kolton Miller would be in there but he's really improved this year. No sacks, handled Frank Clark last week. So not sure where he sits yet.

I don't want to go over this forever. Its just my opinion. You have yours.

 

[cardncubfan]

Maybe Mitch wasn't so bad after all.

 

[BritCard]

Maybe Mitch wasn't so bad after all.

Look. I gave my opinion. If others want to question it and argue the point then that's their perogative and I'm going to answer them.

That's why it's called a discussion forum.

 

[AZfaninMN]

If Hump could play the garbage jets pass rush each week I'm sure he'd grade out great most of the time.

Everyone except Cam Robinson, Sam Levi and Donavan Smith. Just behind Bolles, Reiff. Excluding rookies or first year starters.

Kolton Miller would be in there but he's really improved this year. No sacks, handled Frank Clark last week. So not sure where he sits yet.

I don't want to go over this forever. Its just my opinion. You have yours.

Behind Bolles and Reiff?!?!? Have you watched these guys play or just going off PFF? Riley Reiff is a laughing stock here in MN according to everyone here in the state. He was so bad at LT that they were going to move him to guard and play a guy who hasn’t played LT since high school to replace him. Luckily for him he plays on the worst Oline in football so he finds himself back at LT.

You can’t exclude first year starters or rookies! If they were better, they’d be higher than him in your rankings. Quinton Nelson was All-Pro his first year, but that doesn’t count because he was a Rookie and we can’t compare them to vets.

Hump is only 26 and I think it takes a while to be great at the tackle position. For example Andrew Whitworth didn’t make a pro bowl until he was 31 and now at the age of 38 is considered one of the best playing.

 

[BritCard]

Behind Bolles and Reiff?!?!? Have you watched these guys play or just going off PFF? Riley Reiff is a laughing stock here in MN according to everyone here in the state. He was so bad at LT that they were going to move him to guard and play a guy who hasn’t played LT since high school to replace him. Luckily for him he plays on the worst Oline in football so he finds himself back at LT.

You can’t exclude first year starters or rookies! If they were better, they’d be higher than him in your rankings. Quinton Nelson was All-Pro his first year, but that doesn’t count because he was a Rookie and we can’t compare them to vets.

Hump is only 26 and I think it takes a while to be great at the tackle position. For example Andrew Whitworth didn’t make a pro bowl until he was 31 and now at the age of 38 is considered one of the best playing.

Not sure what Hump might do in several years matters now. Especially with his knees.

And yes, Reiff had several years better than Hump has ever had. I don't think you realise how other fans see Hump round the league. Ain't nobody saying "Damn DJ Humphries gonna be tough on Sunday".

I'm done with this now. It's tiresome.

 

[AZfaninMN]

Not sure what Hump might do in several years matters now. Especially with his knees.

And yes, Reiff had several years better than Hump has ever had. I don't think you realise how other fans see Hump round the league. Ain't nobody saying "Damn DJ Humphries gonna be tough on Sunday".

I'm done with this now. It's tiresome.

What Reiff did in the past has nothing to do about anything to what he is now. I only brought up his future because compared to many top 10 LTs, he’s much much younger. His knees are fine and he hasn’t missed a game in the last 2 seasons and only 1 snap in total. I’m sure we’ll have this same discussion next week in a different thread...

 

[cardncubfan]

Look. I gave my opinion. If others want to question it and argue the point then that's their perogative and I'm going to answer them.

That's why it's called a discussion forum.

Huh?

 

[Chopper0080]

Isaiah Wynn of the Pats moved from LT to LG...move The Captain up another spot.

 

[WisconsinCard]

I know what you are saying, but they aren't the same thing.

No, you can't say this defense is good just because they stomped a super garbage Jets offense. The D is still an unknown quantity.

Yes, you can criticize Hump based on his performance because he has a long history of such performances. He's a known quantity.

Good on Hump for his performance vs the Jets. He he can line up against Bryce Huff and Jordan Jenkins all year he'll be elite. Let's see how he does vs Aldon Smith.

I rest my case.

 

[AZfaninMN]

I rest my case.

Don’t let facts get in the way of his opinion

 

[Finito]

Did Aldon Smith even play? Lol

 

[RON_IN_OC]

Did Aldon Smith even play? Lol

Not only Smith, but when the game was early on, announcers slobbered over Demarcus Lawrence, too.


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[Finito]

Not only Smith, but when the game was early on, announcers slobbered over Demarcus Lawrence, too.


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Ooooooh that’s right they did, didn’t they

 

[GuernseyCard]

Not sure what Hump might do in several years matters now. Especially with his knees.

And yes, Reiff had several years better than Hump has ever had. I don't think you realise how other fans see Hump round the league. Ain't nobody saying "Damn DJ Humphries gonna be tough on Sunday".

I'm done with this now. It's tiresome.

I don't think you know!