How about Matt

[RolleRocks]

Warner played the best QB Arizona has ever seen.

Leinart, on the other hand, has done nothing for this team.

Leinart has shown himself to be injury prone and mentally soft. He was simply given the starting job and has now lost it twice with this team.

The decision of whether Kurt Warner comes back to QB the Cardinals is now Kurt's decision and Kurt's decsion alone.

The Cards have left him exposed as a FA.

Warner gets to decide whether he wants to stay in Arizona or move on to take a shot at winning a championship with another team, perhaps with a team like the Vikings.

At this time, I think that Kurt is extremely disappointed in the character of this team. They simply laid down after clinching the NFC West. This team has one of the worst running games I've ever seen and also one of the worst defenses in the NFL. And it also gave up some big special team returns.

In other words, many Cards players lack both character and talent.

Warner has only a couple of good years in him.

Does he want to stay here and hope that this team fixes its glaring weaknesses? Or does he move on to a solid team that could use a Pro-Bowl QB?

And as for Leinart, who really cares?

And who is really getting excited about what he does against second and third stringers?

This team does one thing well--throw the ball. Get rid of Warner and Boldin, and it will do zero things well.

And for those on this board who somehow believe that the money saved on Warner and Boldin will actually be used to solve our many personnel issues, what a hoot!!!

You all obviously haven't been following the Cardinals very long.

 

[Arizona's Finest]

Warner played the best QB Arizona has ever seen.

Leinart, on the other hand, has done nothing for this team.

Leinart has shown himself to be injury prone and mentally soft. He was simply given the starting job and has now lost it twice with this team.

The decision of whether Kurt Warner comes back to QB the Cardinals is now Kurt's decision and Kurt's decsion alone.

The Cards have left him exposed as a FA.

Warner gets to decide whether he wants to stay in Arizona or move on to take a shot at winning a championship with another team, perhaps with a team like the Vikings.

At this time, I think that Kurt is extremely disappointed in the character of this team. They simply laid down after clinching the NFC West. This team has one of the worst running games I've ever seen and also one of the worst defenses in the NFL. And it also gave up some big special team returns.

In other words, many Cards players lack both character and talent.

Warner has only a couple of good years in him.

Does he want to stay here and hope that this team fixes its glaring weaknesses? Or does he move on to a solid team that could use a Pro-Bowl QB?

And as for Leinart, who really cares?

And who is really getting excited about what he does against second and third stringers?

This team does one thing well--throw the ball. Get rid of Warner and Boldin, and it will do zero things well.

And for those on this board who somehow believe that the money saved on Warner and Boldin will actually be used to solve our many personnel issues, what a hoot!!!

You all obviously haven't been following the Cardinals very long.

LOL. If only we knew as much as this clown.

Bow down to the inside information and genius of Rolle ROcks.:notworthy

I have this mental image of you in my head and its not flattering.

So really answer us this? Did Matt Leinart piss in your cheerios? Is this Brynn? Maybe Paris? A bitter ND or UCLA fan?

 

[Arizona's Finest]

Matt looked good yesterday save the one bad throw. He looks smooth, has good presence in the pocket, and the running game looks alot better with him back there. If we are going to kill Matt for staring the guy down on the ALMOST INT then we have to beat up on Kurt who did throw the pick and fumbled the ball.

My point: That kind of stuff is going to happen. Both QB's played well.

And I think we all know where I stand on this issue although like Cheese - I have NO IDEA how the Bidwills are going to handle it and it scares me as they usually do what the POPULAR thought is rather then what really makes sense for the team. Hopefully Wiz steps in on this and gives his input.

 

[RolleRocks]

LOL. If only we knew as much as this clown.

Bow down to the inside information and genius of Rolle ROcks.:notworthy

I have this mental image of you in my head and its not flattering.

So really answer us this? Did Matt Leinart piss in your cheerios? Is this Brynn? Maybe Paris? A bitter ND or UCLA fan?

What did I say that was wrong?

As usual, I'm talking about the team, and Matty's bootlickers are talking about me.

Get a life.

 

[Arizona's Finest]

What did I say that was wrong?

As usual, I'm talking about the team, and Matty's bootlickers are talking about me.

Get a life.

Its your tone, commentary (Matty bootlickers? good one) and the way you talk like you know more then everybody on the board and are incredulous on how we can't see your point of view.

Heres a hint. You and your view point are the minority for a reason. There are a ton of knowledgable people on this board that you could learn alot from.

Shut up and listen for a change.

 

[cardsfanmd]

With his arm strength and dedication, he just doesn't have it in him to be a Montana, but he will be better than good IMO and probably make a PB or 5

 

[moklerman]

I wonder if looking to the future becomes the de facto endorphin for fans of a bad team? I mean, generally speaking when a team doesn't make it to the playoffs very often it becomes habit or even enjoyable this time of year to start thinking about next year. Mock drafts, schedules/opponents, free agents, salary cap, etc. Those are the joys of the perennial bad team's fans.

It seems to me that that may be part of the Warner/Leinart situation. Wanting Leinart to start isn't baseless but right now, this minute, the Cardinals and their fans have a playoff game coming up, the highest rated QB in the NFC, the pro bowl starter and pretty much the best QB the Cardinals have ever had and some can't wait to replace him. How great it will be when Leinart some day leads the team to the playoffs.

Like, the real enjoyment can then begin. I know it's too hard to remove the actual names involved but replacing proven production for someone that is hoped will just be able to consistantly start doesn't seem prudent.

 

[wierwolf]

Matt may be good. But he is just going to wait. Kurt has taken this team on his shoulders to the playoffs... Why replace him.. I don't get it... Matt has to ride the pine until Kurt is done driving the cart in my honest opinion. Then we can see what Matt has learned... Or bring in Tebow to run the wildcat... He can makeup for our lack of running....

 

[nashman]

Think you are missing the point, talking about Matt starting NEXT YEAR not now. KW is what he is getting older and we don't even know if he wants to play next year at this point as well as he doesn't know himself. You know he is contemplating retirement and Boldins injury earlier this year really affected him and his view of wanting to leave the game in one piece as he does have a family and seems to be a family man first and football player second. I see nothing wrong with talking about what this team is going to do in the offseason as it is going to be vital for how this team competes in the future, as fans we want to talk about that.

 

[Arizona's Finest]

Matt may be good. But he is just going to wait. Kurt has taken this team on his shoulders to the playoffs... Why replace him.. I don't get it... Matt has to ride the pine until Kurt is done driving the cart in my honest opinion. Then we can see what Matt has learned... Or bring in Tebow to run the wildcat... He can makeup for our lack of running....

How do I respond to this with out coming across as an ass?

 

[Mulli]

How do I respond to this with out coming across as an ass?

I think I know what you would say....

 

[jstadvl]

Let's end this. Warner IS tired. You can't miss it. His ONLY touch ass was the TD to Fitz for 30-40yds. Do we run with him? YES! BUT, those of you that think LeinART isn't what he's cracked up to be, will be eating Cardinal for a long, long time. This Kid got his collar bone broken, that'sinjury prone? Get off it. He's got touch, he can run, he doesn't fumble. He needs experience. Any of you remember your way to the top of YOUR field?
I am NOT down on Kurt. BUT, if he comes out on down, put the kid in! OH, BTW, I don't lick anyones boots.

 

[D-Dogg]

His ONLY touch ass .

Jake Plummer is way better at that than Kurt Warner....

 

[SoCal Cardfan]

I disagree....his passes came out of his hand quick. I referred to his one pass that hit the hands of the defender and was almost picked. He threw that one in there hard.

Oh they might come out of his hand quick, but they sure don't get to the target quick.

You would be the first person ever to say Matt can throw the ball with more than average mustard on it, at least that I can recall.

Not that I think he can't be a great QB, he needs to use smarts and finesse though, cause Leinart and frozen rope have never been used in the same sentence.

 

[Arizona's Finest]

Oh they might come out of his hand quick, but they sure don't get to the target quick.

You would be the first person ever to say Matt can throw the ball with more than average mustard on it, at least that I can recall.

Not that I think he can't be a great QB, he needs to use smarts and finesse though, cause Leinart and frozen rope have never been used in the same sentence.

From reading your posts I would say your not exactly the best "talent evaluator" to speak on this point (i.e. Marcell Shipp quote from Ed's signature comes to mind) But I'll respond anyway as I am quickly becoming known as "the defender of all that is Matt".

Does he have a Jay Cutler cannon? No. Does he have a Farve arm? No? But as has been seen with both of those QB's this season that might be number 6 or 7 on the list of important traits needed to succeed as a QB in the NFL. He defeinitely has the arm to make all the throws and in terms of physical capabilituies - I compare him the most with Tom Brady (Note: I am NOT saying Matt is or ever will be Tom Brady. Theres obviously a lot more to go with Tom's success then his physical capabailites. But thats what I am comparing. P-H-Y-S-I-C-A-L Capabilities)

When Brady first came into the league he was thought to have a weak arm. Thats why he fell to the 6th round besides being 6-5, playing at a big time program, and having moderate success. AFter a couple years I remember reading how Tom has all of a sudden gained arm stength and now throws frozen ropes everywhere. I can only laugh. Tom's arm looks stronger because he knows the offense and knows where to go with the ball now.

For all Matt's shortcomings this year i defy you to find more then a couple passes where it didn't seem like he had the required arm strength to make the throw. You just can't. He has a MUCH stronger arm then Pennington and look at Chad's numbers for the year - esp on passes 20+ yards. Strong arms are sometimes the biggest detriments to QB's in this league and their development.

Leinarts arm is more then enough. And he is doing a good job in the pocket and at making reads IMO since the Oakland preaseason game.

No doubt I am pulling for Matt because I like him and want the franchise to have a young stud QB. But I can be honest about his capabilities to lead this team. He has NFL level arm strength and has shown me enough to think he can be the guy next year and from what it seems, most of the board agrees.

To me the biggest concern is his ability to stay healthy. Some guys never get injured and some are always injured. As of now I am not sure what category Matt falls into and wheter he can stay on this field.

But from everything I have seen in the NFL and college, to what I have read from coaches and teammates - arm strength is not the issue and is the familiar refrain from the guys who want to bash on him but not really watch the games.

If you going to bash him do it because he is a party boy or can't stay injury free. Those are claims I can't really disagree with as of now.

 

[SoCal Cardfan]

If saying "His lack of zip worries me" makes me a Leinart basher, then I guess I'm a Leinart basher.

 

[Arizona's Finest]

If saying "His lack of zip worries me" makes me a Leinart basher, then I guess I'm a Leinart basher.

Sorry I didn't mean it like that. I thought I had read some previous posts that were along the same lines but if I am jumping to conclusions I apologize. I just have heard since he was drafted he doesn't have the arm strength to succeed in the NFL and as detailed above - I just don't agree.

Maybe I am a tad defensive about the kid

 

[cardsfanmd]

Let's end this. Warner IS tired. You can't miss it. His ONLY touch ass was the TD to Fitz for 30-40yds. Do we run with him? YES! BUT, those of you that think LeinART isn't what he's cracked up to be, will be eating Cardinal for a long, long time. This Kid got his collar bone broken, that'sinjury prone? Get off it. He's got touch, he can run, he doesn't fumble. He needs experience. Any of you remember your way to the top of YOUR field?
I am NOT down on Kurt. BUT, if he comes out on down, put the kid in! OH, BTW, I don't lick anyones boots.

Those three comments made the rest of your post unreadable and the whole thing invalid.

Kurt is probably the most accurate QB in the league and there is ZERO doubt he is more accurate than Matt. Leinart has to loft some passes that Kurt would throw on a rope because his arm strength dictates that. If you wanna call that touch then whatever. Anyone who knows football will tell you that you prefer the pass on the rope because it gets the ball in the reciever's hands quicker, thus giving him more time and room to run after the catch. i would be very interested to see our WRs' YAC#'s with Matt compared to Kurt.

Matt is more mobile than Kurt, but that doesn't mean he can run. He will be the first to tell you that he wants to throw the ball.

Matt fumbles at a higher rate than Kurt last I checked.

I am not an anti-Matt guy btw.

 

[Arizona's Finest]

Those three comments made the rest of your post unreadable and the whole thing invalid.

Kurt is probably the most accurate QB in the league and there is ZERO doubt he is more accurate than Matt. Leinart has to loft some passes that Kurt would throw on a rope because his arm strength dictates that. If you wanna call that touch then whatever. Anyone who knows football will tell you that you prefer the pass on the rope because it gets the ball in the reciever's hands quicker, thus giving him more time and room to run after the catch. i would be very interested to see our WRs' YAC#'s with Matt compared to Kurt.

Matt is more mobile than Kurt, but that doesn't mean he can run. He will be the first to tell you that he wants to throw the ball.

Matt fumbles at a higher rate than Kurt last I checked.

I am not an anti-Matt guy btw.

Agreed except for the fumbles part. I am not sure if the numbers indicate this but I think Kurt Warner is the worst QB in the history of the NFL on holding onto the ball. And thats going back to the St Louis time. Its probably my biggest gripe with him.

There are situations where fumbling the ball is explainable. In the Pats game Matt put the ball on the turf after being blindsided by a blitzing safety. On Sunday Kurt fumbled trying to scoot through the middle of the defense like he was Mike Vick and holding the ball like a loaf of bread.

Not all fumbles are created equal.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

I think it's funny that alot of people base Leinart's ability to be a QB on his beer bong picture. The guy has all the tools. He wasn't handed a starting job and lost it.Whiz said it was very close competition and only went with Warner because of his experience and starting on the road. However, Warner seized the opputunity and played great pretty much the whole year. When,exactly, was Whiz supposed to go with Leinart when Warner was playing at league MVP levels? If Warner is brought back next year, he has to be the starter. You can't sit him after a year like this. The question is do you go with the future in Leinart or try to squeeze one more year out of Warner. Alot will depend on Warner's contract demands. If they are outrageous,go with Leinart. I can see going with Leinart anyway. But you definitely can't have Warner on the team as a backup. That wouldn't make any sense and probably tear the team apart.

 

[Bobcat]

I feel that this has been the "Best year so far in the NFL...!!!" He had a nearly full year of listening and learning from a future Hall of Famer Kurt Warner.

Yes just look how much better Matt is in the Pocket now and how he knows now when to stay or get out of the pocket as the play developers. He has shown me that he really is a team player and not just out for himself. Next year will either prove me right or wrong in my assessment. But I feel that we will win more games with him next season that he would have done this year if he was the starter.

Go get them Cardinals win the First Home Playoff Game in 61 years...!!!


BOBCAT

 

[jstadvl]

Warner's "zip" is for 5 6 yds. and he STILL throws behind the DB. His receivers make him. LeinART is different, look at the two passes to Breaston. Breaston didn't have to spread out, they were on the money. AND, I'll bet YOU money, when it does come to "zip", after some playing time ,the kid shows you, he's got it all. Cutler-coach fired, Farve-coach fired, C'mon, wake up and die right! I didn't want this to be a pissin contest. Does the kid have a ways to go, yea. But don't dare try to use my own words against me. I've studied philosophy also. I'm just saying, the kids got more than we've seen. AND, no one can deny, Kurt looks really weak at times. If he isn't on,put the kid in!

 

[slanidrac16]

What did I say that was wrong?

As usual, I'm talking about the team, and Matty's bootlickers are talking about me.

Get a life.

When you tell guys they"obviously" haven't been following this team very long you are going to get ridiculed. Many posters here have been following this team longer than you have been alive.

Don't talk down to people or you will hear the rath.

 

[IAWarnerFan]

Jake Plummer is way better at that than Kurt Warner....

So Plummer could do one thing better than Warner. Big whoop! Lets get two things straight.
Kurt Warner > Jake Plummer
and
Kurt Warner > Matt Leinart

Our situation is a lot like Green Bay's was last year. Brett Favre left and they missed the playoffs. If Kurt Warner leaves, this team might miss the playoffs next year. JMO Here's hoping he wants to play here for two more years.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

Our situation is a lot like Green Bay's was last year. Brett Favre left and they missed the playoffs. If Kurt Warner leaves, this team might miss the playoffs next year. JMO Here's hoping he wants to play here for two more years.

Rogers had a better year than Favre. Their dropoff in defense is the main reason they are not in the playoffs.