I'll repeat it again-Start Josh McCown, but still draft Roth or Eli.

[Lomax to Green 84]

Draft talk is great and maybe the Cards really are sold on McCown. Lets say they do pass on a chance to get a franchise level quarterback and go in another direction.

So what happens the first time McCown throws 4 interceptions? Any chance that this kid will be under incredible scrutiny?

I have been a fan for 28 years and have seen the gaffes and blunders this organization has committed. I have seen the Anthony Bell's and the Kelly Stouffer's and the Clyde Duncan's. In my opinion if this organization and new coaching staff decides that 3 starts and 3 decent performances is enough to pass on a franchise level quarterback then they are making the biggest mistake in the history of this mistake ridden franchise.

What then is the solution:

1. Start McCown from the first mini camp just as the Bengals did with Kitna.

2. Draft Roth or Manning and let the rookie sit for the year.

3.If McCown fails miserably then you look extremely smart for taking the rookie, the rookie comes in and isn't under extreme pressure to win right away.

4. If McCown is successful you have an enviable "problem" on your hands-2 extremely talented players who play the most important position on the field and tons on trade leverage.

5. McCown signed a 3 year deal back in 2002. If he is successful then you either tender him the highest tender offer for a restricted free agent and then have him sign or you get a 1st and a 3rd if someone else opts to sign him to an offer sheet.


I am of the opinion that consistent winners are made by constantly looking to the future and putting your people in the best position to be successful. San Francisco didn't hesitate to take Steve Young off Tampa's shoulders even though they knew that they still had Montana for another 7-8 years. We may get the very best out of Josh McCown if we draft the rookie quarterback and take the pressure off McCown to be the "franchise QB". History teaches us to learn from our mistakes. Jake Plummer started 9 games in 1997 and had the entire league buzzing about him being the next big thing. However, if you throw out the 70 yarder to Sanders, the 4 touchdowns against Washington, and the miraculous comeback against Atlanta you still had an extremely flawed quarterback who took way too many sacks, who zeroed in on a single reciever, and who didn't have a grasp of reading defenses.

Take out the last 6 minutes of the Minnesota game and in Josh McCown you have a talented, fast, strong armed guy who is also extemely flawed. He panics, turns his back on the defense (fatal flaw), holds the ball way, way, way too long, and is streaky accurate but can also be Kent Graham type inaccurate (check out the 2nd and 3rd quarter of the Vikings game if you want proof).

I am as guilty as the rest of you are. I just want a winner and would love for Josh McCown to be the guy to take us there. However, history shows that we must never make the Jake Plummer mistake again. Plummer started 9 games when the season was already decided/expectations and pressure were minimal and he wowed us with his athleticsim. Then came 1998/1999/2000/2001/2002 a huge contract, gigantic expectations and tons of disappointment.

For mine and for you and for Josh McCown's sake lets not risk making that same mistake again.

 

[LVCARDFREAK]

Originally posted by Holian
I am as guilty as the rest of you are. I just want a winner and would love for Josh McCown to be the guy to take us there. However, history shows that we must never make the Jake Plummer mistake again. Plummer started 9 games when the season was already decided/expectations and pressure were minimal and he wowed us with his athleticsim. Then came 1998/1999/2000/2001/2002 a huge contract, gigantic expectations and tons of disappointment.

For mine and for you and for Josh McCown's sake lets not risk making that same mistake again.

Great post!

It is certainly different taking a 3-10 team and leading them with no expectations then being named the starter!

 

[kerouac9]

Great post. I agree. Thankfully, neither guy is going to be there, and the Cards can safely draft Sean Taylor, the Michael Vick of defense.

 

[TJAM]

I agree...........Josh showed some flashes, but looked overwhelmed, like the game was happening in super fast mode. he has not had enough game time for him to get comfortable and let the game slow.

Take the best player available ...........if that is a future franchise QB.......so be it.................Look at the Rams having had 3 franchise QB in the last 4 years ......Trent Dilfer goes down........Warner steps in........Warner gets hurt............in steps Buecher. Bottom Line- they get to the playoffs, superbowl games etc. You can not have to good or too many good QB

 

[LVCARDFREAK]

Originally posted by kerouac9
Great post. I agree. Thankfully, neither guy is going to be there, and the Cards can safely draft Sean Taylor, the Michael Vick of defense.

Oh dear lord, the horse stopped breathing weeks ago. Quit beating it already!

 

[kerouac9]

Originally posted by TJAM
Take the best player available ...........if that is a future franchise QB.......so be it.................Look at the Rams having had 3 franchise QB in the last 4 years ......Trent Dilfer goes down........Warner steps in........Warner gets hurt............in steps Buecher. Bottom Line- they get to the playoffs, superbowl games etc. You can not have to good or too many good QB

What are you talking about? Trent Green was the QB who got hurt in 1999 for the Rams. He never took a regular-season snap with the team as a starter. Warner was a street free agent, and I think that Marc Bulger was, too. Warner and Bulger are only average NFL talents, IMO. The wideouts and system made them look good, and both have been exposed.

 

[Rats]

Originally posted by kerouac9
What are you talking about? Trent Green was the QB who got hurt in 1999 for the Rams. He never took a regular-season snap with the team as a starter. Warner was a street free agent, and I think that Marc Bulger was, too. Warner and Bulger are only average NFL talents, IMO. The wideouts and system made them look good, and both have been exposed.

I agree on Bulger but Warner did it several years in a row. Injuries and inept coaching have ate away his emense abilities. He can QB my team any time.

 

[spanky1]

Holian,

You make a strong case and present your point well. I just think that we have an opportunity to use our#3 as serious trade down money and address a number of needs. There is real value at CB and WR in this years draft.....best depth ever type quality and we can set ourselves up well with multiple picks in the early rounds if we can structure a clever trade.

I tend to forget the options about tendering McCown if he turns out to be a winner and the bonanza of picks that would come our way as a result. As Section11 has pointed out, look what the Bledsoe trade has done in terms of setting New England up for the last few years with multiple high picks in each of the early rounds (this year alone is astounding....7 picks in the 1st three rounds).

Having said this......I'm still in the "pass on Eli and BenR." camp. Call me crazy, call me stupid......that is just how I feel!

 

[slanidrac16]

SMOKE AND MIRRORS!!!

We really don't know what DG has in mind. He HAS to show support for McCown because we very well made need him in the near future.
I'm starting to think we may just go out and get a guy like Brunell or Warner, which doesn't rule out the possibility of drafting Manning or Big Ben IF, and I say IF they are still there at #3 when we pick.
Suppose both QB's are gone. Then, we take Larry Fitzgerald. Having a guy like Brunell would give us a greater opportunity at winning next year. Having Fitz and AQ to throw to would be electrofying.

 

[blindseyed]

It is certainly different taking a 3-10 team and leading them with no expectations then being named the starter!

That's a really good point. Kind of the words I was looking for when speaking about McCown being the starter. I hope he does great if he keeps the starting job but you're right, it will be a whole new ball game when the games mean something

 

[BradMannTX]

FINALLY, someone said it...fewer clients...I love you man.

Really, I totally agree with Holian. From day one, this has "the Jake-Mistake" written all over it. We became excited over the play of an exciting QB after years of the vanilla-boys. Blake was vanilla, McCown steps in and resurects the Cardiac Cards Part Troix. Everybody is happy and McCown is annointed the starter...problem is, we don't have "next week" to change our minds. We're sitting here with months to chew on the victory. I think it is a bad, bad deal to get excited about Josh. Everyone of you know it in your heart of hearts, too.

 

[vikesfan]

Here is the problem with this scenario. If you draft Eli or Ben and they bust. You wasted a #3 pick and wih a team with essentially 1 good player on it. You really cannot afford to waste such high picks. You will get a bona fide starter with #3 if you take Fitz or Taylor or Gallery.

You take Ben or Eli what will happen. They won't play or if they do play they likely won't play well. If McCown does well. What will you get for Ben or Eli in a year. You won't get much. REMEMBER you used a first round #3 pick on the player so what would you get for that for unproven QBs.

I do understand what you are saying maybe McCown will bust. If you don't have faith in McCown and you think Ben or Eli won't fine take them but what if they are as good as McCown or slightly worse then McCown you have wasted a first round #3 pick.


Look at this team's holes:
OT CB DE DT LB RB #2 WR etc etc etc
You have 1 great player and a few good players (TE FS G). That is it! Rathen then getting insurance policies with #3 picks add another great player. Add Fitz or Gallery or Taylor.


This move is an insurance policy move. If McCown fails MAYBE Ben/Eli won't it's still a crapshot. What if they both fail? At least McCown cost you only a 3rd round pick.

Plus remember the DG system doesn't require a great QB. Why not add another great offensive player or defensive player to team instead of an insurance policy that might cost more then you get back.

 

[BuckeyeCardinal]

Re: SMOKE AND MIRRORS!!!

Originally posted by slanidrac16
We really don't know what DG has in mind. He HAS to show support for McCown because we very well made need him in the near future.
I'm starting to think we may just go out and get a guy like Brunell or Warner, which doesn't rule out the possibility of drafting Manning or Big Ben IF, and I say IF they are still there at #3 when we pick.
Suppose both QB's are gone. Then, we take Larry Fitzgerald. Having a guy like Brunell would give us a greater opportunity at winning next year. Having Fitz and AQ to throw to would be electrofying.

Well said.

This is a win/win situation for us.

Brunel and McCown and/or Eli Roethlisberger would be great.

Even Brunel and McCown and even Parsons (or somebody) and Fitz would be great.

We can't lose in this year's draft.

Didn't I say that last year about Suggs...a can't miss pick for us?

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

Well,we should've drafted Leftwich last year(is that horse dead yet?).My point is that if Green thinks Mccown has just a s good an upside as those 2 rookie QB's then it would be essentially a wasted pick.If Josh has more potential then why have to groom 2 young QB's which would ****** the growth of at least one of them.Plus you'll be paying big money to the backup and that will put pressure on the coachng to play him to make him earn his money.I agree that,if Ben or Manning,have much higher ceilings then you take one.But Green keeps saying Josh can be a star.If he truly thinks that,then Sean,Larry,or Roy should egt ready for an early call.