Is Gerald Green the most athletic player in Suns history?

[sunsfan88]

No. Not remotely close. Marion, Amare pre-injury, Kevin Johnson and especially:

How is it "not remotely close"??

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[Catlover]

Each player had different attributes. KJ was speed. Amare a combo of speed but more of an explosiveness. Green is a leaper. Marion had that second leap pogo stick (but don't forget how fast he could get down the floor. He would rebound, make an outlet pass, and then beat Steve to the other end for the layup). I do not think Dumas is in the same class with these guys.

Now Connie Hawkins is a different story. It was a different era so he did not TRY to use his athleticism as much as Green does. The think I remember about the Hawk was his huge hands. I have never seen anyone palm the ball the way he did. He would fake one-handed passes. He also moved so smoothly and effortlessly.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cp3UXNVqR9E

I love the pass at the 1:55 mark.

I saw Connie play when he was in the NBA but I was still a Celtics fan at the time (circa 1970). All I really remember was that he looked a little slower and a little less engaged than I remembered from his Globetrotter days but I don't think any of us in the 60 and under crowd really got to see him in his prime. Consider that he should have been in the NBA eight years earlier once he was blackballed from college. He was unjustly tied into a scandal that he couldn't possibly have been a part of (he was a non-eligible freshman when the point shaving occurred) and the NBA refused to even look at the facts.

It was only when it became obvious that they were going to lose the lawsuit filed by Hawkins that they reached an agreement to let him play for an expansion team. Walter Kennedy didn't want an NBA team in Phoenix and he didn't want Hawkins in the NBA, it was a match made in heaven as far as he was concerned. Connie would withdraw his lawsuit and in return he'd be sentenced to basketball purgatory, playing for an expansion team in a backwards state. I would have loved to have seen him when he was a starry-eyed superstar in the making instead of the embittered and occasionally unfocused version that played for the Suns.

 

[sunsfan88]

Does Shannon Brown get a honorable mention?

 

[Ronin]

Does Shannon Brown get a honorable mention?

What about Cedrick Ceballos?

 

[Phrazbit]

Its not remotely close because the question was about athleticism, not just who can throw down a windmill dunk and has a good vert. Dudes like Amare, Hawkins and especially Larry Nance could not only jump out the building but were freakishly strong and fast, especially for their sizes. Green's an "athletic" one trick pony. Nance would jump with his head over the rim and block a guys shot out of the building. Amare might have been the most athletic 6'10" player ever. And if you want to go down the lane of size shouldnt matter, then I would argue that Green is not even the most athletic player on this team, as Bledsoe is a muscle bound freak with fantastic leaping ability and faster than 99% of the league.

Green is an elite athlelte, its true, but the idea that he will go down as one of the most gifted athletes not just in the history of this team, but of the LEAGUE, is absolutely laughable.

And you act as though Green is the only guy who has to worry about hitting his head on the rim?

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Nance was a freak.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Its not remotely close because the question was about athleticism, not just who can throw down a windmill dunk and has a good vert. Dudes like Amare, Hawkins and especially Larry Nance could not only jump out the building but were freakishly strong and fast, especially for their sizes. Green's an "athletic" one trick pony. Nance would jump with his head over the rim and block a guys shot out of the building. Amare might have been the most athletic 6'10" player ever. And if you want to go down the lane of size shouldnt matter, then I would argue that Green is not even the most athletic player on this team, as Bledsoe is a muscle bound freak with fantastic leaping ability and faster than 99% of the league.

Green is an elite athlelte, its true, but the idea that he will go down as one of the most gifted athletes not just in the history of this team, but of the LEAGUE, is absolutely laughable.

And you act as though Green is the only guy who has to worry about hitting his head on the rim?

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Nance was a freak.

well, according to slin's uber-scientific measure of "his head isn't near the rim" athleticism, I guess the picture above definitely proves he has no clue what he's talking about Larry Nance.

still reeling at the Dumas athleticism = Markieff Morris. Not only does Morris not have near the leaping ability/power/grace that Dumas had, he's at least 2 inches taller and is listed as 3 inches taller. I'd love to see that highlight reel where Markieff takes anyone off the dribble, reverse dunks with power in traffic/is a constant alley-oop machine, springs up like Dumas. that comment just shows how little slin ever really watched the Suns back in the day.

 

[Zobaczcie suki]

There is one name that is being left out of this discussion, quite undeservedly so I might add: Bayard Forrest. Dude was a freak.

 

[Kel Varnsen]

No. Not remotely close. Marion, Amare pre-injury, Kevin Johnson and especially:

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Wikipedia says he played at 205 pounds. He must have had, like, 2% body fat. Geez.

 

[Catlover]

There is one name that is being left out of this discussion, quite undeservedly so I might add: Bayard Forrest. Dude was a freak.

We've had too many of those kind of freaks. Big and doofy.

 

[Kel Varnsen]

I love that picture...especially the guy getting frisky with the giant woman in the crowd and the photographer that was staring with his mouth open instead of taking a picture.

That is a great picture. It's almost like he is standing still, while the rest of the world is sinking. LOL.

 

[PDXChris]

well, according to slin's uber-scientific measure of "his head isn't near the rim" athleticism, I guess the picture above definitely proves he has no clue what he's talking about Larry Nance.

still reeling at the Dumas athleticism = Markieff Morris. I'd love to see that highlight reel where Markieff takes anyone off the dribble, reverse dunks with power in traffic/is a constant alley-oop machine, springs up like Dumas. that comment just shows how little slin ever really watched the Suns back in the day.

It's not in HD, so it must be smoke and mirrors.

 

[Kel Varnsen]

Each player had different attributes. KJ was speed. Amare a combo of speed but more of an explosiveness. Green is a leaper. Marion had that second leap pogo stick (but don't forget how fast he could get down the floor. He would rebound, make an outlet pass, and then beat Steve to the other end for the layup). I do not think Dumas is in the same class with these guys.

Now Connie Hawkins is a different story. It was a different era so he did not TRY to use his athleticism as much as Green does. The think I remember about the Hawk was his huge hands. I have never seen anyone palm the ball the way he did. He would fake one-handed passes. He also moved so smoothly and effortlessly.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cp3UXNVqR9E
I love the pass at the 1:55 mark.

There is this one too.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nlxsi80tTWs

It is not just palming, but holding the ball while changing direction with it. It takes such hand size and strength. I do not know of any player that does this today.

Good finds! Those were fun to watch.

The lockers at 1:42 of the first video are funny, too.

 

[Zobaczcie suki]

We've had too many of those kind of freaks. Big and doofy.

OK then, I offer Joel Kramer, and that's my final offer. But if that doesn't work, how about Jeff Cook?

 

[Mainstreet]

There is one name that is being left out of this discussion, quite undeservedly so I might add: Bayard Forrest. Dude was a freak.

How can you mention Bayard Forest without mentioning Horacio Llamas. They both played at Grand Canyon University with all due respect.

 

[sunsfan88]

What about Cedrick Ceballos?

Sure. Hakim Warrick can get some consideration as well.

 

[Zobaczcie suki]

How can you mention Bayard Forest without mentioning Horacio Llamas. They both played at Grand Canyon University with all due respect.

I will see your Llamas, and raise you a Kyle Macy and a Mike Bratz. Now, we are talking some serious athletic ability here.

 

[JustinD]

can I throw Antonio McDyess' name into this conversation ?

 

[BC867]

OK then, I offer Joel Kramer.

For a basketball player, Joel Kramer was a great accountant. All 6'7"-203 of him. Especially when he had to endure the Curse of Coach John MacLeod when he played him at Center.

 

[Jay Cardinal]

Great discussion. I am glad someone mentioned Ced Ceballos. That being said my vote is on Gerald Green. Guy has an amazing vertical leap.

KJ was an awesome jumper too. He also had a jumpshot where he could float and shoot the ball on his way down. Very unique. Here is his famous dunk on Hakeem:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ifx_gRF-ouU

 

[Mainstreet]

can I throw Antonio McDyess' name into this conversation ?

Yes, but I think he should be erased from Suns history.

 

[Catlover]

Yes, but I think he should be erased from Suns history.

Twice!

 

[devilalum]

Are we just talking about vertical? Vertical is definitely part of the equation but IMO there is more to being the most "athletic" player in Suns history.

Marion and Nance were both kind of stiff. The kind of players that get the ball stripped in traffic. Both great players and definitely better than Green but not fluid.

Speed is part of the equation too. KJ was lightning fast and quick. He could explode down the lane. In 92 I went to the Suns open practice along with 13,000 of my closest friends. The players scrimmaged and started really getting into it. I remember KJ shot down the middle of the lane and dunked over Mark West. He was higher than the dunk on Hakeem.

 

[Phrazbit]

McDyess was also a freak. Didnt have Amare's touch and hands but was just as quick and explosive, also a much better rebounder and defender. Too bad he was back stabbing bastard. Also too bad (for him) that knee injuries robbed him of what could have been an amazing career.

 

[Finito]

Anyone remember a young Micheal Finley? Holy crap

 

[Catlover]

Anyone remember a young Micheal Finley? Holy crap

Nowhere near the level most of the players talked about here. He fits in with the Cedric and Shannon crowd, not with The Hawk, Marion, Amar'e, Dumas, Green group.