Is Kingsbury a good coach for Murray?

[Arz101]

Kliff doesn't play QB anymore.

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Hey you know what I mean. Call plays to throw the ball downfield more

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[SoonerLou]

5 weeks ago

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[SoonerLou]

8/8

Kliff doesn't incorporate run action much to get those down field throws either (I acknowledge, like with the previous post, some of it lack of Oline/lack of speed on the outside)

True play action passes helps get those one on one opportunities. There's a reason the Eagles struggle to throw down the field with their lack of speed. There is also a reason teams commit to doing more run action to set up down field throws.

I'm to the point where I only trust the "scheme" when its not no huddle (Could be a Kyler issue as he bombed out at A&M when he had sketchy play calling/scheme. Could be a Kliff issue as he's truly elite playing QB dependent). We don't have the athletes to make a plays. Those short routes Kliff would call a Tech would be 50 yarders in college is not common thing in the NFL.

I'd test out more Kyler under center to set up more pure play action/run action stuff.

Basically our Big 12 stuff can get sniffed out quick vs. elite coordinators.

That way Kyler/Kliff can get some under center work to end the season. Then figure out next season how to balance pro style and the tempo offense (which is great) better.

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

For Kyler Murray? No.

For Bill Murray? No

For Anne Murray? No.

You forgot Eddie. Oh wait...........he played baseball lol. Best switch hitter of all time imo.

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

He’s going to have to adjust to more traditional formations and play calling. I still think when you have a suspect o-line you need to adjust to help them out.

whether it’s two te sets( which seemed to work) or more two back sets something that gives Murray time to utilize his arm strength and accuracy.

Too many times Murray is feeling pressure within two seconds. It doesn’t give him any time to locate second or third receivers.

Well said. He has a strong accurate arm if he gets protection. I'm like you on the 12 personnel, why did we stop using that as much? Clay & Williams can both catch the ball & there's so many things you can do out of it. Pinch block (on Justin Murray's side) then release, slow drag release down the line, just like the TD reception to Williams against the Falcons. Or just release & run down the seam behind the LB's. Hopefully KK rediscovers this in the offseason? I also hope we resign Clay?

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

There is no way around KK getting another season. This isn't Wilks all over again. We were in all games until the very end outside of 2 games where we got whacked. Considering it's the first season with this offense and our defense being a total train wreck, it's not very surprising.

Decision-making by KK was bad in some close games. Yesterday it was more on KM than on KK. We held held the Steelers in check just enough to pull off a win, yet KM whiffed on a couple TD opportunities.

What I like from KK is his ability to adapt. We came out with the I Formation yesterday. He started to use TE-heavy sets when we struggled early on. We just don't have any game gamebreaking playmakers on offense. Larry is a complementary WR at this stage, Kirk will never be a true #1, DJ fell off a cliff, our TEs are a joke and don't scare anybody.

The defense is a whole different story. Need all help we can get in the offseason. If Chandler Jones or Hicks went down, we could hardly compete with a strong CFB programme. Lack of defense is mostly on Keim though, nothing KK can do about this. Hence while I don't like him, VJ hasn't been dealt fair cards.

Why do you think our TE's are a complete joke? They catch almost everything thrown their way. Love the way coach KK started using the TE's early on, can't understand why we went away from that? Yes, VJ hasn't had much to work with, I'll give you that, but he still can't get the defense to communicate or cover a TE, he needs to go imo. His defenses have been criticized everywhere he's been, & he's had studs playing for him, especially in Denver. We got lucky the Steelers TE got hurt Sunday & they didn't have a backup. KK has made mistakes this yr, but as you said, he's willing to adapt, the defense is our problem. The offense has put us in enough situations to win this yr, only to be let down by the defense. Missed tackles & ST's cost us as much Sunday as KM did. More often than not it's the defense costing us. It has to be fixed.

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

the oline is terrible man. Murray has crap for deep throws because he is always under duress. I do not get why people keep saying the line is playing well. There was a few game streak of good play on the oline, since then it has been mediocre at best.

They looked good against the 3 team's we beat, even looked decent to good against the 49ers both games. Since then........you're right, looked terrible. Aaron Donald walked around Pugh the whole game, as did whoever lined up against Justin Murray on Sunday. I know Donald is hard to block but there's no excuse for not even getting a body on him. KM needs more protection. Our OL & DL's need more help, question is...........? Which line will the FO prioritize in the offseason? On one hand, our QBOTF needs protection in order to show his arm talent. On the other hand, our DL can't get pressure on the opposing QB, therefore backup QB's even light us up. What gives? Time will tell. We have enough cap space next season & should be able to sign & draft enough help for both lines. Having said that, SK is running the show so you never know what we'll get?

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

I haven't had time to go through the All-22, but it seems to me from watching the games that Murray is running into a lot of pressure and making things harder on himself. It wasn't Kingsbury's scheme that caused Murray to throw the ball directly to T.J. Watt.

you're right, it wasn't the scheme, he was afraid to get hit again imo. He could've ran for the first down with ease, would've been hit hard if he tried to score, looked like he could've possibly made it in running though? The DB's were 3/4 of the way deep in the end zone.

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

Larry Fitzgerald was wide open, but it's Kingsbury's fault that Murry overthrew him?

What a world you must live in.

That was all on KM, best I can remember, he wasn't even pressured on that throw, just simply overthrew Larry. In fact I know he wasn't, I now remember saying to myself "wow, he was wide open & no one in his face to force that overthrow". Still early enough in the game at that point, the pressure shouldn't have been in his head yet.

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

Kliff doesn't incorporate run action much to get those down field throws either (I acknowledge, like with the previous post, some of it lack of Oline/lack of speed on the outside)

True play action passes helps get those one on one opportunities. There's a reason the Eagles struggle to throw down the field with their lack of speed. There is also a reason teams commit to doing more run action to set up down field throws.

I'm to the point where I only trust the "scheme" when its no huddle (Could be a Kyler issue as he bombed out at A&M when he had sketchy play calling/scheme. Could be a Kliff issue as he's truly elite playing QB dependent). We don't have the athletes to make a plays. Those short routes Kliff would call a Tech would be 50 yarders in college is not common thing in the NFL.

I'd test out more Kyler under center to set up more pure play action/run action stuff.

Basically our Big 12 stuff can get sniffed out quick vs. elite coordinators.

That way Kyler/Kliff can get some under center work to end the season. Then figure out next season how to balance pro style and the tempo offense (which is great) better.

KK is much smarter than some give him credit for on this board. Imo, he will be hell bent in the offseason to figure out what works, what didn't & study other teams plays that definitely work. Then redesign the playbook somewhat. He's already shown he is willing to adapt. Just having KM play under center & using TE's this season a little was surprising to me.

 

[SoonerLou]

KK is much smarter than some give him credit for on this board. Imo, he will be hell bent in the offseason to figure out what works, what didn't & study other teams plays that definitely work. Then redesign the playbook somewhat. He's already shown he is willing to adapt. Just having KM play under center & using TE's this season a little was surprising to me.

I think KK is smart enough to figure it out.

My problem is people aren't willing to admit that most of the season Kliff didn't know what he didn't know. He's learning on the fly and I believe doing the best he can.

When things get tight, what is our calling card?

He started the season out (after outrageously not using his offense in preseason) in 10 personnel way too much. He showed he doesn't have pride and adjusted. Which is a great thing.

He's still not use to calling plays that aren't college style....and not even great college style like at OU.

In fairness to him we don't have the run game to make things easier on the QB. So right now he's hoping like hell Kyler can have the answers. When Kyler doesn't it looks really bad.

Just as Trent Dilfer said it would.

 

[phillycard]

What would you point to to validate that? Yes, we're 5th in penalties, but we're 8th in penalty yardage. That's not great, but I don't see things like, say the punter missing the signal on a fake punt.

It's more the eye test than anything. I'm often times rewinding a play and lamenting stupid ish that occurs. Poor defensive schemes, players out of position, still no accounting for the TE's (which rightfully VJ should shoulder some blame). Wasted timeouts, etc. There was no excuse to come off of a bye and play the way we did to the Rams. That falls on the head coach IMO.

 

[phillycard]

KK is much smarter than some give him credit for on this board. Imo, he will be hell bent in the offseason to figure out what works, what didn't & study other teams plays that definitely work. Then redesign the playbook somewhat. He's already shown he is willing to adapt. Just having KM play under center & using TE's this season a little was surprising to me.

Here's hoping, because I truly want to like the guy. I really do.