Is something up with Warner...

[red desert]

It's probably nothing, but I just want to ask the question to see if anyone else has noticed this.

In the last three games they've shown Kurt warming up just before the game and something just seems out of place with the guy. In his eyes, he looks unsure, or dare I say even scared. I hadn't noticed this before the Giants game. This "unsure" look seems to coincide with our renewed focus on getting the running game going. And in the last three games he's not been quite as sharp as he was earlier in the year. Maybe its just that the Giants and Eagles are better teams. Maybe it's just that the hits are starting to take a toll. And maybe its just that when the game plan doesn't call for him to sling it all over the field at all times he gets uncomfortable. I don't know.

Anyone else notice this?

 

[Arizona's Finest]

Prepare for avalanche of responses

 

[IAWarnerFan]

Honestly, I think the pressure of no running game may be getting to him a little and very well may be wearing him down. Needless to say, with no running game there's a ton of pressure on him that wouldn't usually be there. The Cardinals must address this in the offseason.

 

[Mitch]

Hey Red Desert...congrats, good friend, we're NFC West Champs!!!

Here's my take...first of all, when was the last year Warner started a whole season?

At this point of the season, he is sore and a little mentally drained.

But then again, he went out versus the Rams and orchestrated the two prettiest opening drives I think we've ever seen a Cardinal offense deliver.

Seriously, were there ever two more perfect drives...from the play calling to the precision?

After that, if you noticed Todd Haley called off all the imagination and reverted back to the stupid delayed handoff plays in a feeble attempt to further generate a running game. Haley's been real good, but one thing he hasn't figured out yet is that both Edge and Hightower need running starts to be effective in order to build up acceleration and the ability to hit the hole. The delayed handoffs to them are just plain stupid and haven't worked all year for the very same reason.

Warner's one bad mistake of the day came in a series where TWO delayed handoffs back to back were called and the Cardinals faced a third and long.

You have to understand that a large part of Warner's greatness as a QB is he's greedy. He wants to put up gaudy numbers every time he hits the field. And on that play he wanted deperately to keep the drive going so he forced a ball into coverage.

Hopw about the delayed handoff on third and ten near midfield in the second half to piss away a drive? That's on the coaches.

Just the same Warner goes 16/22 for 226 yards in the first half, and some of the fans here seem to focus strictly on the one mistake. Unreal.

So, in summary, Warner's fine, Red Desert.

It's the coaches who keep trying to force a square peg in a round hole and the unappreciative fans who still insist on dwelling on the negatives that's the real issue...kind of like the parents of a child who earns all A's and one D, and all they talk about with their child is the D.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Honestly, I think the pressure of no running game may be getting to him a little and very well may be wearing him down. Needless to say, with no running game there's a ton of pressure on him that wouldn't usually be there. The Cardinals must address this in the offseason.

with what money? and once they address that, how do they address what you usually refer to as a terrible defense?

 

[82CardsGrad]

with what money? and once they address that, how do they address what you usually refer to as a terrible defense?

Yup... This is why I continue to say that next season is iffy and I would not at all be surprised to see this team slide back... Dansby and Q need to be dealt with in some way...
We need more depth across the entire defense.
We need a true threat at RB in the worst way!
And somehow, we need to find a way to re-sign Warner...

I really can't see how all of this will get done. But - man do I hope Graves and Company surprise me!!!

 

[dogpoo32]

Yup... This is why I continue to say that next season is iffy and I would not at all be surprised to see this team slide back... Dansby and Q need to be dealt with in some way...
We need more depth across the entire defense.
We need a true threat at RB in the worst way!
And somehow, we need to find a way to re-sign Warner...

I really can't see how all of this will get done. But - man do I hope Graves and Company surprise me!!!

Agree with all but re-signing Warner. There, makes the list a little easier to deal with. Dansby is as good as gone too.

 

[IAWarnerFan]

with what money? and once they address that, how do they address what you usually refer to as a terrible defense?

Ok, I know you like to drill me on this area. How about this for an answer. Do it the same way the Rams did it. Is that suitable?

 

[Cheesebeef]

Yup... This is why I continue to say that next season is iffy and I would not at all be surprised to see this team slide back... Dansby and Q need to be dealt with in some way...
We need more depth across the entire defense.
We need a true threat at RB in the worst way!
And somehow, we need to find a way to re-sign Warner...

I really can't see how all of this will get done. But - man do I hope Graves and Company surprise me!!!

me neither. I really hope we don't see a 1999 redo 10 years later but the seeds were sowed for what could be a rough off-season last off-season (2007 with the way we handled Dansby/Big/#5 pick). That's why I'm just enjoying this season for all it's worth.

 

[Spielman]

Ok, I know you like to drill me on this area. How about this for an answer. Do it the same way the Rams did it. Is that suitable?

Er... trade for Aeneas Williams?

I dunno how applicable the Rams 2000-2001 defensive changes are to the Cardinals' situation. The Rams had huge areas of the defense that were so terrible ANYTHING would have been better, and had spare parts of value to cash in for people to fill those holes.

Different situation.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Ok, I know you like to drill me on this area. How about this for an answer. Do it the same way the Rams did it. Is that suitable?

how can we do it the way the Rams did it without a time machine? When they re-signed Warner after the Super Bowl, the team already had the great running back, HOF o-linemen/solid O-line, #3 ranked defense. What you're asking us to do is do what the Rams did with Warner AND add all those things that the Rams had already done throughout the years. And you're asking us to make that kind of commitment to a guy who's 37, has been injury prone and has had an uneven career.

Now, again, if money weren't an issue, I'd have no problem bringing Warner back, but since we don't play and live in fantasy land, there's no Doc Brown, 1.21 gigowats of electricity and a flying Delorean lying around that can put us in the same position as the Rams back then.

 

[IAWarnerFan]

how can we do it the way the Rams did it without a time machine? When they re-signed Warner after the Super Bowl, the team already had the great running back, HOF o-linemen/solid O-line, #3 ranked defense. What you're asking us to do is do what the Rams did with Warner AND add all those things that the Rams had already done throughout the years. And you're asking us to make that kind of commitment to a guy who's 37, has been injury prone and has had an uneven career.

Now, again, if money weren't an issue, I'd have no problem bringing Warner back, but since we don't play and live in fantasy land, there's no Doc Brown, 1.21 gigowats of electricity and a flying Delorean lying around that can put us in the same position as the Rams back then.

That'd be a good thing to do with any QB at the helm. Why don't you just face the fact that you just hate Warner? Don't trust him, because he's getting older. That doesn't mean he can't play for 3 more years and happily retire. No matter who the QB is changes need to be made. I can see there's no getting through to you, I shouldn't even be trying.
We should be celebrating, yet we are still agruing.

 

[Cheesebeef]

That'd be a good thing to do with any QB at the helm.

right, but you can't do that if you're paying huge money to a QB. It's a great plan and it the plan of any team in the league but the salary cap doesn't let...

Why don't you just face the fact that you just hate Warner?

because I don't. How many times do I have to say I'd like to have Warner back for a 4-5 million dollar deal? How many times during the first half of the season say he's playing MVP football? Those aren't the words of hate. good god man. Even going so far to say I distrust Warner in the future doesn't mean I hate him. I just don't know if the risk is worth the reward.

Don't trust him, because he's getting older

why do you always simplify these things? I don't trust him because a) he really old for a QB b) he's injury prone c) he's had an up and down career and d) I'm seeing signs in the last 4 games that leads me to believe he's going to continue having an up and down career.

That doesn't mean he can't play for 3 more years and happily retire.

he himself has said he's only gonna play for 2 more years. And he might be able to do that. I'm just not sure if the risk will be worth the reward.

No matter who the QB is changes need to be made.

I agree. But it'll be harder to make wide-spread changes (which is what you're (and I) advocating with a new RB, new O-linemen and improved defensive players) with a handful of guys choking the salary cap.

 

[ajcardfan]

Are you kidding me? We clinch the division and the board is dominated the next day by pointless arguments about Warner and topped off by this "Dr. Phil" stuff???

Maybe we just don't know what to talk about when we are successful?

 

[IAWarnerFan]

right, but you can't do that if you're paying huge money to a QB. It's a great plan and it the plan of any team in the league but the salary cap doesn't let...



because I don't. How many times do I have to say I'd like to have Warner back for a 4-5 million dollar deal? How many times during the first half of the season say he's playing MVP football? Those aren't the words of hate.



why do you always simplify these things? I don't trust him because a) he really old for a QB b) he's injury prone c) he's had an up and down career and d) I'm seeing signs in the last 4 games that leads me to believe he's going to continue having an up and down career.



he himself has said he's only gonna play for 2 more years. And he might be able to do that. I'm just not sure if the risk will be worth the reward.



I agree. But it'll be harder to make wide-spread changes (which is what you're (and I) advocating with a new RB, new O-linemen and improved defensive players) with a handful of guys choking the salary cap.

Ultimately it sounds like we're almost on the same page then. There's a lot of work to be done if KW is going to be starter for next year. It's going to be very difficult to work things so the team can be better while keeping Warner as the starter, but not impossible. Right now I feel a lot safer going down that road than the dump Warner in favor of ML road.

 

[Spielman]

Why don't you just face the fact that you just hate Warner?

Dude, he pretty clearly doesn't hate Warner. Saying that isn't doing any good for anybody.

 

[IAWarnerFan]

Dude, he pretty clearly doesn't hate Warner. Saying that isn't doing any good for anybody.

I know, I'm just a bit frustrated with all of this.

 

[Spielman]

It's probably nothing, but I just want to ask the question to see if anyone else has noticed this.

In the last three games they've shown Kurt warming up just before the game and something just seems out of place with the guy. In his eyes, he looks unsure, or dare I say even scared. I hadn't noticed this before the Giants game.

No. I hadn't noticed this.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Dude, he pretty clearly doesn't hate Warner. Saying that isn't doing any good for anybody.

gracias! you and I usually go back and forth a little on Warner but I always respect your opinion and ability not to bring any kind of personality stuff into the mix.

 

[JC_AZ]

I agree with RD... KW has not looked as sharp the last two games at all, and seems to be lacking a little of the confidence he had going earlier in the season. Without KW, this Championship would NEVER have been close, but the last couple of games have looked different for KW IMHO

 

[IAWarnerFan]

I agree with RD... KW has not looked as sharp the last two games at all, and seems to be lacking a little of the confidence he had going earlier in the season. Without KW, this Championship would NEVER have been close, but the last couple of games have looked different for KW IMHO

Agreed and I also agree with the reasons stated in this thread for it.

 

[IAWarnerFan]

gracias! you and I usually go back and forth a little on Warner but I always respect your opinion and ability not to bring any kind of personality stuff into the mix.

Sorry about doing that.

 

[Spielman]

gracias! you and I usually go back and forth a little on Warner but I always respect your opinion and ability not to bring any kind of personality stuff into the mix.

Ditto. I've tried to stay out of your way for awhile now because things went back and forth a little too much, but I always think your posts are worthwhile even when I disagree.

 

[lobo]

Unreal.


Little more need be said about (fill in the blank).........

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Today Coach Whis stated that Leinart was taking more snaps with the first team.

Then later he mentioned how he wanted to give a game off to some of his older vets who were fighting off some bumps and bruises.

My guess is that Whis is planning on Leinart playing in Seattle unless the game is super significant.