JJ Arrington=Thomas Jones

[Grand Canon]

Does anyone else think that these two are similar in size, speed, strength, fumbling and just about a mirror image of each other...??? It seriuosly worries me.

 

[joeshmo]

Does anyone else think that these two are similar in size, speed, strength, fumbling and just about a mirror image of each other...??? It seriuosly worries me.

The kid fumbled twice in his first 2 games playing in the NFL, and all of a sudden he has fumblitis.

 

[TheCardFan]

Nope...I have watched both and I don't see it. I am not going to say anything long term but JJ fires ahead and keeps digging to make anything. Jones tip toed, was tackled by shoestrings, and was very hesitant at the line.

JJ will have much more production than Jones did in AZ and don't forget about Shipp...he is a gamer.

 

[Scott MS]

Wow, can we just wait for a few games that really count? How about trying a run to the right also?

Kid's a rookie. At least he's starting. Only other guys starting from the last draft are Rolle and Brown. The rest are backups.

 

[nidan]

No worries on that front.

Jones problem wasn't size, speed strength fuimbles. It was dancing around on the LOS for two laong. He hesitated before hitting a hole, no sign of that in JJ

 

[Grand Canon]

Shipp will start week 3

I have been a fan since 88- seen many back come and go- I just see Arrington as a TJ type player- and fumbling was a problem for JJ in college as well - its not a new thing.. do some research if you are going to respond.

 

[Russ Smith]

Thomas Jones fumbled 15 times in his first 5 NFL seasons, lost 8. Essentially 2 1/2 seasons worth of carries not great but he's not exactly a fumbling machine. For comparison sake Barber has fumbled 9 times in a season 3 times in his career and another year had 8. ANd two of those 9 years they lost 6 of the fumbles.

But Barber has generally played on good teams, and Jones generally on bad teams so the perception is wildly different. Tiki is the better player but Jones is better than people give him credit for.

 

[Denny Green Fan]

Give the kid time before you compare him to Thomas 2 step Jones Grand Canon

 

[40yearfan]

No worries on that front.

Jones problem wasn't size, speed strength fuimbles. It was dancing around on the LOS for two laong. He hesitated before hitting a hole, no sign of that in JJ

Agreed 100%. It used to just kill me watching him dance around behind the line of scrimmage and going sideways instead of forward. Jones was the most frustrating RB the Cards ever had. All that potential and no heart.

 

[joeshmo]

do some research if you are going to respond.

Sounds as if someone needs to take his own advice. I did do my research and you are still wrong.

JJ Fumbled 2 times his senior after touching the ball 310 times.

http://calbears.collegesports.com/sports/m-footbl/stats/2004-2005/indgbg.html#IGBG.FMB

JJ Fumbled 4 times his Junior year touching the ball 128 Times which isnt great but all you got to do is take a look at his senior year.

Yep fumbling was a real problem for him in college.

 

[DevonCardsFan]

Does anyone else think that these two are similar in size, speed, strength, fumbling and just about a mirror image of each other...??? It seriuosly worries me.

He reminds me more of a possible Leeland McElroy then Jones

 

[Wild Card]

Agreed 100%. It used to just kill me watching him dance around behind the line of scrimmage and going sideways instead of forward. Jones was the most frustrating RB the Cards ever had. All that potential and no heart.

40Yr:

It's a shame that Thomas Jones couldn't have played for the Cardinals at the same level that he did last year for a bad Chicago team (rushing 240-948, 4.0 ypc, 7 TDs; receiving 56-427, 7.6 ypc). Led the Bears in rushing and total yards from scrimmage (1,375) with some of the worst QB play in the league. Not a marquee back, perhaps, but not bad.

One of the biggest differences I've seen so far in the Dennis Green era is that Green's high-round draft choices fit his scheme and are properly utilized once they get here. We've hopefully seen the last of prize Cards rookies who have to go elsewhere to be successful.

WC

 

[CardNots]

40Yr:

It's a shame that Thomas Jones couldn't have played for the Cardinals at the same level that he did last year for a bad Chicago team (rushing 240-948, 4.0 ypc, 7 TDs; receiving 56-427, 7.6 ypc). Led the Bears in rushing and total yards from scrimmage (1,375) with some of the worst QB play in the league. Not a marquee back, perhaps, but not bad.

One of the biggest differences I've seen so far in the Dennis Green era is that Green's high-round draft choices fit his scheme and are properly utilized once they get here. We've hopefully seen the last of prize Cards rookies who have to go elsewhere to be successful.

WC

Don't forget Chicago has a much better offensive line for Thomas. He danced around so much here because he had no holes to run through. I'm not a Jones fan, but he not a bad back for a decent OL.

 

[Crazy Canuck]

I have been a fan since 88- seen many back come and go- I just see Arrington as a TJ type player- and fumbling was a problem for JJ in college as well - its not a new thing.. do some research if you are going to respond.

We're waiting on your research, buddy...

 

[Russ Smith]

I have been a fan since 88- seen many back come and go- I just see Arrington as a TJ type player- and fumbling was a problem for JJ in college as well - its not a new thing.. do some research if you are going to respond.

JJ Arrington fumbled twice last year while gaining 2000+ yards, once against UCLA and once against Stanford, Cal lost both fumbles.

In 2003 he fumbled 4 times and lost 3, 3 fumbles in the first 6 games, 1 the rest of the year(not lost).

So in 385 college carries and 37 receptions, or 422 times handling the ball while at Cal, he had 6 fumbles and lost 5.

For comparison sake Ronnie Brown, Cadillac Williams, and Cedric Benson all had more fumbles than Arrington. Brown handled the ball about 30 times more than Arrington, had 10 fumbles in his career, and the same scouting people that said Arrington had fumble problems early in his career said Brown was excellent at ball security.

Williams fumbled quite a bit, it's one of his known problems, and Benson was fairly notorious for it. Both have smaller hands and pro scouts were concerned about it with both guys. Benson and Williams carried the ball a lot more than JJ or Brown but both fumbled at a higher rate in college than JJ did.

 

[Russ Smith]

Sounds as if someone needs to take his own advice. I did do my research and you are still wrong.

JJ Fumbled 2 times his senior after touching the ball 310 times.

http://calbears.collegesports.com/sports/m-footbl/stats/2004-2005/indgbg.html#IGBG.FMB

JJ Fumbled 4 times his Junior year touching the ball 128 Times which isnt great but all you got to do is take a look at his senior year.

Yep fumbling was a real problem for him in college.

Fumble stats are really hard to find in college huh Joe? I found the same link for Arrington but I had to look all over the place for Benson, Brown and Williams and eventually just looked at scouting reports that said Brown had 10 fumbles in his career and cited his much lower rate of fumbles than Williams as Benson as a big advantage he had over them.

If anybody can find a reliable source of fumbles for any of the 3 kindly correct that information if it's not true.

I think the JJ had a fumbling problem stuff either came from JC, or someone wrote it in a scouting report and it just got copied over and over.

I swear if you're on one of those sites you could write "Arrington only has 3 fingers on his right hand, 2 of them thumbs" as a joke, and in a week it would be all over the web.

 

[joeshmo]

Fumble stats are really hard to find in college huh Joe? I found the same link for Arrington but I had to look all over the place for Benson, Brown and Williams and eventually just looked at scouting reports that said Brown had 10 fumbles in his career and cited his much lower rate of fumbles than Williams as Benson as a big advantage he had over them.

Just go to the teams web sites. Go to the archived sections and look for stats. Teams own web sites are the best place to go for college stats, for most of your typical stats. Defensive stats are even broken down to assists, FF, TFL, FR, ect.

They are really accurate and not biased at all either, most have another company do it for them which is why you will see the same stats layout for most Div 1A teams stats sites.

 

[Russ Smith]

Just go to the teams web sites. Go to the archived sections and look for stats.

They are really accurate and not biased at all either, most have another company do it for them which is why you will see the same stats layout for most Div 1A teams stats sites.

Been there did that, Auburn's site doesn't have fumbles that I could find. Texas didn't either. I had a hard time finding it with Cal to begin with so maybe I'll look again.

thanks

 

[Zeno]

I think the JJ had a fumbling problem stuff either came from JC, or someone wrote it in a scouting report and it just got copied over and over.

Sort of like all those that are questioning his durability. I understand he'll get hit harder in the NFL but every rookie can say that, yet there is no evidence in his past pointing to issues with injuries.

I am cautiously optimistic about Arrington. I think he can succeed but I do think he will need his OL to perform for him, he probably isn't the type of back who can create on his own.

How people are willing to write him off after a preseason is just plain silly. Look at Kevin Jones some Lions fans were writing him off just a month in to last year and look how long it took him to get it and become a successful NFL back, not every RB can just appear and be ready right off the bat. Give him time and be patient, giving up on him now is entirely premature.

 

[joeshmo]

Been there did that, Auburn's site doesn't have fumbles that I could find. Texas didn't either. I had a hard time finding it with Cal to begin with so maybe I'll look again.

thanks

Yeah some dont have it. And some are really hard to navigate to find the stats that you want.

 

[Russ Smith]

Much better although I can't find 2002-03 or 2001-02.

Williams fumbled 7 times lost 5 in his junior and senior year, Brown 3 times lost 1. Brown handled the ball less than Arrington, Williams more.

Either the 10 fumbles in career for Brown stat is wrong or he fumbled a lot his first 2 years?

 

[Grand Canon]

Fumbling

He fumbled the ball 18 times and only lost that many times- thats a lot in 2 years!!!!!!!

 

[Russ Smith]

Sort of like all those that are questioning his durability. I understand he'll get hit harder in the NFL but every rookie can say that, yet there is no evidence in his past pointing to issues with injuries.

I am cautiously optimistic about Arrington. I think he can succeed but I do think he will need his OL to perform for him, he probably isn't the type of back who can create on his own.

How people are willing to write him off after a preseason is just plain silly. Look at Kevin Jones some Lions fans were writing him off just a month in to last year and look how long it took him to get it and become a successful NFL back, not every RB can just appear and be ready right off the bat. Give him time and be patient, giving up on him now is entirely premature.

I love JJ, I don' think he'll ever be one of the best RB's in the NFL good, but I think he'll be a very good NFL RB and a perfect fit for Green's style of offense.

I've been saying it since we picked him he's not a superstar but he'll be a very good player or I'll be shocked. I understand the doubt, I watched the kid for 2 years at Cal and he's one of those kids that you watch and you think "he's not that good" but week after week he keeps getting yards and making plays and you start to appreciate that it's not luck.

The problem he had last year is I truly believe his backup, Marshawn Lynch, is one of the 2-3 best RB prospects in college along with maybe Adrian Peterson and DeAngelo Williams. So people saw what Lynch did (8.8 YPC) as a backup and just assumed JJ's stats were easy, put anybody back there and they look that good.

I really wonder are Dolphin, Bear and Buc fans doubting their rookie RB's or is this just a Cardinal fan thing?

 

[Russ Smith]

He fumbled the ball 18 times and only lost that many times- thats a lot in 2 years!!!!!!!

No that's wrong, look at the source joe cited for you he fumbled 6 times in 2 years and lost 5. He clearly needs to work on recovering fumbles because most RB's don't lose 80% of their fumbles.

Please give us a source for your 18 fumbles to disprove the official stats Joe and I both looked up.

 

[kerouac9]

I really wonder are Dolphin, Bear and Buc fans doubting their rookie RB's or is this just a Cardinal fan thing?

I don't think that Bear, Dolphin, or Buc fans were in love with their previous starters like AZ fan is crosseyed in love with Marcel Shipp.